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    Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

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    richsu
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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  richsu on Thu Feb 12, 2015 11:28 am

    GarryB wrote:Hahahahaha... so if all these so called sightings will push Sweden into the arms of NATO, what do Swedes think the Russians are doing in their waters?

    That's what most people ask themselves and thats mainly the reason why most people dont want to join Nato.
    The debate is so one-sided in media as I said before, all the media just write about the "russian threat".

    The threat from Nato seems more imminent, as far as I am concerned. If something were to happen in the east, Nato would just use our country anyway.
    If we joined now, at least it would seem voluntarily lol!


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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  GarryB on Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:01 am

    The problem is that when the nuclear armed tactical missiles start hitting targets if you are part of NATO you become a target for the Russians.

    If you keep neutral they are unlikely to waste warheads on your territory.

    I doubt they would risk invading your country... why would they bother?

    If there is a WWIII the Russians will largely be trying to take out major NATO assets before they can be used against them.

    But if your country wants to add your cities and military sites to Russias target list... don't let me try to change your mind.

    to be honest if WWIII does occur I do hope Russia launches a few missiles at New Zealand... there was lots of talk about very rich Americans buying property here in case there are real problems in the US and the poor rise up against the rich... I don't know why they would think they were safe here... the rich taste good... Twisted Evil


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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Kyo on Fri Feb 20, 2015 8:26 pm

    richsu wrote:
    GarryB wrote:Hahahahaha... so if all these so called sightings will push Sweden into the arms of NATO, what do Swedes think the Russians are doing in their waters?

    That's what most people ask themselves and thats mainly the reason why most people dont want to join Nato.
    The debate is so one-sided in media as I said before, all the media just write about the "russian threat".

    The threat from Nato seems more imminent, as far as I am concerned. If something were to happen in the east, Nato would just use our country anyway.
    If we joined now, at least it would seem voluntarily  lol!

    Swedes have always been one-sided and are easily gullible by MSM. Why do you think the Swedish Academy awarded Nobel Barack with the Peace Prize? What a bunch of BS.
    There's a saying in my country (which rhymes): " Los suecos son chuecos", meaning the swedes are turncoats.


    Last edited by Kyo on Sun Feb 22, 2015 1:06 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:20 am

    Kyo wrote:
    Swedes have always been one-sided and are easily gullible by MDM.
    Melodic Death Metal?? scratch

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Kyo on Sun Feb 22, 2015 1:09 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Kyo wrote:
    Swedes have always been one-sided and are easily gullible by MDM.
    Melodic Death Metal?? scratch
    Just edited it. Typo error. It's MSM: mainstream media.

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sun Feb 22, 2015 3:10 pm

    Kyo wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Kyo wrote:
    Swedes have always been one-sided and are easily gullible by MDM.
    Melodic Death Metal?? scratch
    Just edited it. Typo error. It's MSM: mainstream media.
    I know, but i couldn't resist. Wink

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  richsu on Sat Feb 28, 2015 2:07 pm

    Kyo wrote:
    richsu wrote:
    GarryB wrote:Hahahahaha... so if all these so called sightings will push Sweden into the arms of NATO, what do Swedes think the Russians are doing in their waters?

    That's what most people ask themselves and thats mainly the reason why most people dont want to join Nato.
    The debate is so one-sided in media as I said before, all the media just write about the "russian threat".

    The threat from Nato seems more imminent, as far as I am concerned. If something were to happen in the east, Nato would just use our country anyway.
    If we joined now, at least it would seem voluntarily  lol!

    Swedes have always been one-sided and are easily gullible by MSM. Why do you think the Swedish Academy awarded Nobel Barack with the Peace Prize? What a bunch of BS.
    There's a saying in my country (which rhymes): " Los suecos son chuecos", meaning the swedes are turncoats.
    Swedish academy decides who gets the Nobel peace prize...?

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Werewolf on Sat Feb 28, 2015 2:35 pm

    richsu wrote:
    Kyo wrote:
    richsu wrote:
    GarryB wrote:Hahahahaha... so if all these so called sightings will push Sweden into the arms of NATO, what do Swedes think the Russians are doing in their waters?

    That's what most people ask themselves and thats mainly the reason why most people dont want to join Nato.
    The debate is so one-sided in media as I said before, all the media just write about the "russian threat".

    The threat from Nato seems more imminent, as far as I am concerned. If something were to happen in the east, Nato would just use our country anyway.
    If we joined now, at least it would seem voluntarily  lol!

    Swedes have always been one-sided and are easily gullible by MSM. Why do you think the Swedish Academy awarded Nobel Barack with the Peace Prize? What a bunch of BS.
    There's a saying in my country (which rhymes): " Los suecos son chuecos", meaning the swedes are turncoats.
    Swedish academy decides who gets the Nobel peace prize...?

    Yes, a corrupt shithole of country and gremium decides and gives "Nobel Peace Prize" to Obama, Shimon Perez who is a terrorist in the true sence and Menachim Begin another true zionist terrorist who bombed a hotel and killed dozens of people and he recieved nobel "peace" prize. This prize only shows you who licks the wests ass and those of zionazis.

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  richsu on Sat Feb 28, 2015 2:50 pm

    Werewolf wrote:
    richsu wrote:
    Kyo wrote:
    richsu wrote:
    GarryB wrote:Hahahahaha... so if all these so called sightings will push Sweden into the arms of NATO, what do Swedes think the Russians are doing in their waters?

    That's what most people ask themselves and thats mainly the reason why most people dont want to join Nato.
    The debate is so one-sided in media as I said before, all the media just write about the "russian threat".

    The threat from Nato seems more imminent, as far as I am concerned. If something were to happen in the east, Nato would just use our country anyway.
    If we joined now, at least it would seem voluntarily  lol!

    Swedes have always been one-sided and are easily gullible by MSM. Why do you think the Swedish Academy awarded Nobel Barack with the Peace Prize? What a bunch of BS.
    There's a saying in my country (which rhymes): " Los suecos son chuecos", meaning the swedes are turncoats.
    Swedish academy decides who gets the Nobel peace prize...?

    Yes, a corrupt shithole of country and gremium decides and gives "Nobel Peace Prize" to Obama, Shimon Perez who is a terrorist in the true sence and Menachim Begin another true zionist terrorist who bombed a hotel and killed dozens of people and he recieved nobel "peace" prize. This prize only shows you who licks the wests ass and those of zionazis.
    I think you are mixing up norway with sweden here.
    Norway is the country that gives the Nobel peace prize..

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Werewolf on Sat Feb 28, 2015 3:23 pm

    I did not say anything about norway.

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  richsu on Sat Feb 28, 2015 6:34 pm

    Ok. I understood it as you thought sweden had anything to do with the Nobel peace prize. They dont.

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Kyo on Sat Feb 28, 2015 7:35 pm

    richsu wrote:Ok. I understood it as you thought sweden had anything to do with the Nobel peace prize. They dont.
    After Henry Kissinger and Barack Obama, I suggest the Norwegian Nobel Committee award next Peace Prize to Arseniy Yatsenyuk and Benjamin Netanyahu, jointly. On behalf of that great Norwegian tycoon that was Alfred Nobel.

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  richsu on Sun Mar 01, 2015 10:22 am

    Kyo wrote:
    richsu wrote:Ok. I understood it as you thought sweden had anything to do with the Nobel peace prize. They dont.
    After Henry Kissinger and Barack Obama, I suggest the Norwegian Nobel Committee award next Peace Prize to Arseniy Yatsenyuk and Benjamin Netanyahu, jointly. On behalf of that great Norwegian tycoon that was Alfred Nobel.
    Putin might be a strong candidate also. Wink

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Werewolf on Sun Mar 01, 2015 10:34 am

    richsu wrote:
    Kyo wrote:
    richsu wrote:Ok. I understood it as you thought sweden had anything to do with the Nobel peace prize. They dont.
    After Henry Kissinger and Barack Obama, I suggest the Norwegian Nobel Committee award next Peace Prize to Arseniy Yatsenyuk and Benjamin Netanyahu, jointly. On behalf of that great Norwegian tycoon that was Alfred Nobel.
    Putin might be a strong candidate also. Wink

    Suspect

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Kyo on Sun Mar 01, 2015 2:08 pm

    richsu wrote:
    Kyo wrote:
    richsu wrote:Ok. I understood it as you thought sweden had anything to do with the Nobel peace prize. They dont.
    After Henry Kissinger and Barack Obama, I suggest the Norwegian Nobel Committee award next Peace Prize to Arseniy Yatsenyuk and Benjamin Netanyahu, jointly. On behalf of that great Norwegian tycoon that was Alfred Nobel.
    Putin might be a strong candidate also. Wink

    LMFAO.

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Kyo on Sun Mar 01, 2015 3:57 pm


    Kyo
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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Kyo on Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:03 pm

    Nobel Prize Committee kicks out leader who gave award to Obama

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Werewolf on Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:41 pm

    If they now kick out all the other responsible for giving "Nobel Peace Prize" to Shimon Perez and other terrorists.

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  George1 on Sat Mar 14, 2015 6:22 pm

    NATO Membership Debated in Finnish Elections

    HELSINKI — Finn President Sauli Niinistö has described future NATO membership for the non-aligned Nordic country as an "available option," but insists that any move to join would require a national referendum.

    The commander in chief of Finland's armed forces, Niinistö likened the constitutional process and roadmap needed to apply for NATO membership to that of Finland's formal application to join the European Union in the early 1990s.

    NATO membership has surfaced as a hot topic among political parties and the Finnish electorate as Finland heads to fresh parliamentary elections in mid-April.

    "At this time no party leader is advocating NATO membership but, on the other hand, all are considering the possibility," said Niinistö.

    Finland's deepening defense relationship with Sweden has raised the prospect of a joint leap by the two neighbors into NATO at some stage. However, discussions between the two states on establishing a bilateral defense pact so far have not mentioned support for such a strategy.

    The strengthening long-term relationship between Finland and NATO was aired during talks here between NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg and Finnish Prime Minister Alexander Stubb on March 5.

    The meeting covered significant neighborhood events, including Russia strengthening its military presence in the High North and the Baltic Sea areas; the fallout from the regional instability caused by the Kremlin's actions in Ukraine; NATO's role in enhancing security and stability in the Baltic Sea area; and future cooperation between Finland and NATO.

    "We reaffirmed our commitment to the development of the Finland-NATO partnership cooperation in which we already have a long history behind us. International security and defense policy cooperation is crucial to Finland; it complements our own defense in an important way. NATO partnership offers the best opportunities and concrete added value to the development of our national defense," Stubb said.

    Stoltenberg also held meetings, during the visit to Helsinki, with Finland's Foreign Affairs Minister Erkki Tuomioja and Defense Minister Carl Haglund, as well as representatives of the Finnish legislature's parliamentary Defense and Foreign Affairs committees.

    As evidence of Finland's deepening cooperation with NATO, the armed forces is engaged in a series of crisis management exercises with the alliance and other Partnership for Peace countries. Scheduled to run to March 10, the NATO CMX (Crisis Management Exercise) 2015 weeklong exercises also include contributions from Sweden, Ukraine, Japan and Australia.

    NATO CMX 2015 is centered on a fictitious scenario in which a military conflict erupts between two distant states with consequent humanitarian and maritime security implications.

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  GarryB on Sat Mar 14, 2015 10:26 pm

    What they never talk about is why they feel they need to join NATO...

    Is it because they are scared of Russia?

    How will moving NATO to Russias borders make Russia less of a threat?

    Moving NATO to Russias borders would just make Finland a target and Sweden a target... ironically a self fulfilling prophecy... when we joined NATO Russia became less friendly and more aggressive... boy it is lucky we joined NATO otherwise how much more aggressive and unfriendly would they have been if we didn't have NATO to protect us....  Rolling Eyes

    All I can say is... go ahead and join... if you don't want friendly relations with Russia you might as well show it on your sleeve.

    I am sure Russia will find other countries to trade with that will appreciate the business...

    Of course it was Russia that made them do it by invading Crimea and now invading the Ukraine... next will be Finland and the Baltic states and then one presumes Poland...

    Hope they remember they did this to themselves... but of course it will be Russias fault... Rolling Eyes


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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  George1 on Mon Mar 16, 2015 6:32 pm

    Finns Ready to Spend More on Defense, but Reject NATO Membership – Poll

    More than half of Finns are prepared to spend more on defense, but reject NATO membership even if Sweden joins in, a recent poll indicates.

    The survey, conducted by the Helsingin Sanomat newspaper, showed that a majority of Finns favored spending more on defense.

    A quarter of those polled said they fully backed the idea of an eventual hike, while another one-third partially agreed.

    As to the country’s membership of NATO, 54 percent did not think it was a good idea, even if neighboring Sweden decided to join the Western defense alliance.

    72 percent said if the matter actually came up, it should be put to a nationwide referendum.

    Half of those polled also spoke against building up European defenses, with 38 percent saying they favored the idea – a 15 percent jump from the previous year.

    The TNS Gallup market research company surveyed around 1,000 people in late February.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20150316/1019547903.html#ixzz3UZSC7JL0

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  George1 on Sun Mar 22, 2015 11:04 am

    Entering NATO Would Pose Security Risks for Finland – Finance Minister

    In an interview for Finnish television, Finland's Finance Minister voiced his view that now is not the right time for Finland to join the Western military alliance, Finnish Broadcasting Company YLE reports.

    Finnish Foreign Minister Frustrated Over NATO’s ‘Show of Force’ in Baltic
    In his interview to Finnish television program Ykkösaamu on Saturday, Finnish Finance Minister Antti Rinne noted that now is not the right time for Finland to join NATO.

    "In my opinion, it is absolutely clear that at present, Finland should not apply for NATO membership. My position is that NATO membership would increase the risks to our foreign and security policy." The minister was quick to add however that as an independent country, Finland is capable of taking independent decision-making in security policy based on changing global conditions.

    "We need to maintain good relations with the Nordic countries, especially Sweden. The foreign and security policy of the European Union should be reflected in our policies as well. And of course cooperation with NATO is also important," the minister added.

    Rinne also noted that the recent drop in the Russian economy has negatively affected Finland's own economic prospects.

    Earlier this week, Finnish Foreign Affairs Minister Erkki Tuomioja voiced his frustration over the buildup of NATO military forces in the Baltic, noting that it undermines the security situation in the Baltic.

    Recent polling by Finnish newspaper Helsingin Sanomat also found that 54 percent of Finns believe that joining NATO would be a bad idea, even if Sweden decides to join the alliance. 72 percent noted that if the matter actually came up, it should be put to a nationwide referendum.

    Earlier this year, Finnish civil society activists asked the country's Security Police to investigate whether the Finnish Government acted against the country's constitution in bypassing government and parliament officials by signing the NATO Host Nation agreement, which allows for assistance from NATO forces in emergency situations.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150322/1019844251.html#ixzz3V6iTmv8o

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  George1 on Mon Mar 23, 2015 12:28 pm

    NATO Membership Not an Option - Finnish Defense Minister

    Finland’s Defense Minister Carl Haglund met his Swedish and British counterparts on board a US aircraft carrier Sunday in a sign of growing military cooperation between Helsinki and NATO.

    In an interview for Finnish television, Finland's Finance Minister voiced his view that now is not the right time for Finland to join the Western military alliance, Finnish Broadcasting Company YLE reports. Photo: Finnish Defense Forces armored vehicles in Helsinki, Finland.

    Carl Haglund joined Peter Hultqvist and Michael Fallon for a day at sea aboard the aircraft carrier USS Theodore Roosevelt, which is currently cruising in the English Channel.

    Mr. Haglund, who was accompanied by the head of the Finnish parliament’s defense committee Jussi Niinistö and a group of defense ministry officials, said the visit was all about “normal defense policy cooperation” and had nothing to do with the upcoming elections in his country.

    “We host a regular visit program with our forces afloat in theater to enable distinguished leaders to see the capability of the United States Navy,” said

    Commander of the US Naval Forces Europe-Africa Admiral Mark Ferguson when greeting his guests, adding that Finland was free to decide on its possible membership of NATO.

    Carl Haglund, for his part, mentioned the close military cooperation between the Finnish and US air forces. He said that Finnish pilots were flying the F/A-18 Hornet strike fighter aircraft, dozens of which are normally stationed on board the Theodore Roosevelt.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150323/1019878327.html#ixzz3VCtzQQDX

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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  max steel on Wed Apr 08, 2015 10:39 pm

    Sweden Has A Sub That's So Deadly The US Navy Hired It To Play Bad Guy


    Sweden's submarine force is relatively tiny, just five boats make up the entire inventory, but those five vessels are extremely stealthy and lethal, especially their three Gotland Class diesel-electric submarines. Entering service in the mid 1990s, the 1600 ton displacement Gotland Class was the first operational Air Independent Propulsion (AIP) submarines in the world, which gave them the previously unprecedented operational ability (for non-nuclear submarines at least) to stay submerged for weeks at a time

    The Gotland Class can also act like a traditional diesel-electric submarine and run on its standard diesel engines while surfaced or snorkeling. It can also run on battery power alone, where it can hit speeds up to 20 knots submerged. The capability to patrol silently for weeks on AIP, run un-stealthily on its standard diesel engines, or rocket through the water for shorter periods on silent battery power alone, give the Gotland Class a certain tactical agility that is very hard for the enemy to predict.

    The Gotland Class measures 200 feet in length and are just over 20 feet in width. They are crewed with an incredibly lean compliment of 24 sailors and officers. These submariners are put through exhaustive psychological and physiological testing to make sure they can handle life aboard the small vessel.

    As for weapons, these capable little submarines feature four 533mm torpedo tubes that can fire the time-tested and heavy hitting Bofors Underwater Systems Type 613 torpedoes. The "Torpedo 613" is an incredibly powerful anti surface ship weapon, packing a range of about 12 miles, an engagement speed of 40kts and a massive high-explosive warhead weighing in at nearly about 650lbs. A newer updated multi-role heavy torpedo that can be used against both surface and submarine targets is also carried by the Gotland Class, called the 'Torpedo 2000.' This cutting edge weapon has double the range of the Torpedo 613, although less raw explosive power. Sixteen 533mm class torpedoes can be carried at any given time about the HMS Gotland and her two sisters ships.


    What makes this small and quiet sub even more deadly is her combat management system which is truly state of the art and is said to feature an incredibly user friendly interface. During a single attack, the system can guide multiple torpedoes at once, which can result in more than a mission kill for even very large naval combatants like aircraft carriers, with each torpedo striking in a different section of the hull if ordered to do so.


    The Gotland Class boats then participated in open-ocean exercises in the Atlantic where they trounced much more advanced Spanish, French and US players, including a French nuclear fast attack sub and the American Los Angeles Class SSN, the USS Houston.

    Other exercises soon followed and the little Gotland Class boats continued to be a very lethal force to reckon with. By the mid 2000s, other countries were starting to field or develop AIP capable diesel-electric submarines, including Russia and especially China. Since the US Navy had retired its last diesel-electric (non-AIP) attack submarine in 1990, the USS Blueback (now a local resident here at Oregon's Museum of Science & Industry) there was no indigenous force to practice hunting down diesel-electric subs, yet alone ones with advanced AIP capabilities. Thus the US Navy went to Sweden hat in hand in hopes of leasing one of their ninja-like Gotland Class boats, and its crew, for a year. The Swedish sub would be playing the adversary to America's massive constellation of anti-submarine surface combatants, helicopters, fixed wing aircraft, and especially nuclear submarines. The Swedes granted this request and the Gotland was shipped to San Diego aboard a mobile drydock.

    By mid summer of 2005 the Gotland arrived in San Diego and war games immediately commenced. Apparently the Navy got more than they were bargaining for when it came to finding and engaging the stealthy little sub. The Gotland virtually "sunk" many US nuclear fast attack subs, destoryers, frigates, cruisers and even made it into the 'red zone' beyond the last ring of anti-submarine defenses within a carrier strike group. Although it was rumored she got many simulated shots off on various US super-carriers, one large-scale training exercise in particular with the then brand new USS Ronald Reagan ended with the little sub making multiple attack runs on the super-carrier, before slithering away without ever being detected.

    Seeing as the HMS Gotland can sneak its way through many miles and layers of anti-submarine defenses surrounding a US super-carrier, entering literally the most defended and highly surveyed area in the world, one would think sneaking up on a Russian midget sub would be well within Sweden's stealthy sub's repertoire.

    Then again, maybe they actually have been hard at work over the last six days of the search as they still would have at least another week before they would even have to come up for air. The same can be said for Russia's new AIP submarine designs, the active Lada Class and the upcoming Amur Class. And that is just the problem, not only are AIP boats so hard to detect, but they are also relatively cheap, and will give friendly and enemy states alike a resurgent clandestine subsurface capability.


    With this in mind, I doubt that Sweden's wild goose chase will be the last one of its kind for some time. As this technology spreads we will probably see more and more news about "foreign objects"suspected to be operating closely off friendly shores.


    AND SWEDES WERE BALMING RUSSIA FOR SENDING A BLACK HOLE SUB angry What a Face attack

    http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/sweden-has-a-sub-thats-so-deadly-the-us-navy-hired-it-t-1649695984#



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    Re: Sweden and Finland NATO ambitions:

    Post  Werewolf on Wed Apr 08, 2015 10:40 pm

    So dangerous that the sweden government shit themselfs about non existing russian subs in Swedish waters.

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