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    Poland - US military relations:

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    Russian Patriot

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    Poland, U.S. to sign airbase deal after Obama visit

    Post  Russian Patriot on Sun May 29, 2011 9:38 pm

    Poland, U.S. to sign airbase deal after Obama visit

    RIA Novosti

    15:07 27/05/2011 WARSAW, May 27 (RIA Novosti) - The Polish defense minister confirmed on Friday that Warsaw and Washington would sign a deal on the permanent deployment of a U.S. air detachment in Poland after U.S. President Barack Obama's upcoming visit to the European state.

    Polish media reports have speculated that Obama could announce the transfer of an F-16 squadron from the Aviano base in Italy to the Lask air field in central Poland during his May 27-28 visit to Warsaw.

    "An agreement on the permanent deployment of U.S. Air Force assets in Poland and the periodic rotation of F-16 fighters in the country will be signed after Barack Obama's visit," Defense Minister Bogdan Klich said in an interview with the TOK FM radio.

    The U.S. detachment will service F-16 fighter jets, Hercules transport planes, and land personnel periodically visiting Poland, the minister said.

    Klich expressed hope that the F-16 rotation could start as early as in 2013.

    Meanwhile, Russia warned Poland against hosting U.S. fighter jets, saying it would counter the move.

    http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/news/2011/05/mil-110527-rianovosti02.htm
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    GarryB

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  GarryB on Mon May 30, 2011 3:51 am

    This is why Russia should get every promise in writing.

    It is pretty clear the US politicians have very short memories...

    They want a reset and they want Russia to trust that the ABM system in Europe that NATO doesn't seem to want Russia to be part of is not for use against them... but they wont put that in writing.


    The simple facts of the matter are that several US administrations have made verbal promises that have been broken... NATO will not expand... NATO will not expand eastwards... NATO will not expand into Ex Soviet republics... New NATO members will no have bases for US or other NATO forces permanantly based on their territory...
    Our ABM system is not a threat to Russia and will only have 10 interceptors... The new ABM system in Europe will include Russia and is not going to be used against Russia.


    Well the current US plans seem to involve navy based interceptors which one will assume will include more than 10 interceptors and this basing of US aircraft in Poland breaks several verbal promises made in the past to Russia.

    When can Russia start believing verbal promises?

    I'd say never.

    Pervius

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Pervius on Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:29 am

    Unless Russia triples their military hardware, spreads it out more and gets more proxy nations to counter new US "allies"....Russia's done. They also have insufficient assets in space.

    Russia can't counter the Poland militarization. Did Russia ever counter the Boeing X-37b in space?

    What's that thing doing up there?


    I would have Putin declare on tv he's running for US President, then jokingly say "I don't have a real US birth certificate either".

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    GarryB

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  GarryB on Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:52 am

    Russia can't and wont outspend the US on military equipment.

    What they need to do is spend smarter.

    I agree they need a lot more satellites and their newly created Air and Space Defence branch of their military forces has said as much too.

    Expect to see a dramatic increase in military satellites launched by the Russians over the next few years.

    The easiest way to defeat ABM missiles in Poland is of course Iskander brigades in Kaliningrad. The latest models used by the Russian military have both ballistic missiles able to manouver to evade defence systems and also cruise missile tubes (6 per vehicle) for low flying cruise missiles that would be perfect for defeating ABM systems.

    The INF treaty will be the first casualty of an ABM system in Europe.

    Pervius

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Pervius on Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:49 pm

    Those new X51-A Waverider Scramjet missiles,

    Wouldn't they render any Russian missile batteries worthless? Non-nuclear so they aren't limited by any treaty right?

    F-15E

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    Poland - US military relations:

    Post  F-15E on Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:30 pm

    Poland is adding a standoff cruise missile capability to its air force, signing an agreement to buy the Lockheed Martin AGM-158A Joint Air-to-Surface Standoff Missile (JASSM) on 11 December.

    In addition to the purchase of the missiles, the programme will also include the upgrade of 46 Polish Air Force Lockheed Martin F-16C/D Block 52 Fighting Falcon fighter aircraft to carry the missiles.

    Tomasz Siemoniak, Polish minister of national defence and deputy prime minister, stated during the signing ceremony at the 31 Tactical Air Base at Krzesiny that "never in [Poland's] history have we had such a modern weapon".

    Poland is purchasing the new capability as part of an effort to increase its airborne, naval, and land-based long-range strike assets. This is combined with new defensive missile programmes and is intended to deter hostile actions against Poland. These efforts have been given new impetus by the crisis in Ukraine and concerns about Russia's intentions.

    Following the government-to-government letter of offer and acceptance on 11 December, a contract is expected to be awarded to contractor Lockheed Martin in the first quarter of 2015, a company statement said.

    The agreement to buy the JASSM follows US Congress approval on 2 October of the sale of up to 40 of the stealthy cruise missiles and the F-16 upgrade package.

    According to the Polish Ministry of Defence (MoD), the upgrade process for its F-16s will include the installation of retrofit kits and new software for the aircraft to Mid-Life Update tape M6.5 standard.

    Beginning in 2015 two Polish F-16s will have the new software integrated and will conduct flight-trials in the United States. The remaining 44 aircraft will receive the software upgrade and retrofit kits at Polish air bases from the second half of 2016 onwards, when the country also expects to receive its first batch of missiles.

    When the US Defense Security Co-operation Agency notified the possible sale of the JASSM to Poland on 17 September it estimated the maximum cost of the programme at USD500 million: a figure that Polish sources previously described as "unacceptably high".

    However, Polish deputy defence minister Czeslaw Mroczek, responsible for negotiating the purchase, stated that the price of the contract "was negotiated [for a] long [time], but we received a very good price and the contract includes not only the acquisition of JASSM missiles, but also the development of customised software and training".

    http://www.janes.com/article/46936/poland-agrees-jassm-purchase
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    George1

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  George1 on Sat Mar 07, 2015 2:46 pm

    US Patriot Missile Battery to Arrive in Poland for Drills in March

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20150307/1019174083.html#ixzz3ThuW3Gqm
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    George1

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  George1 on Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:10 pm

    Poland, US to Conduct Joint Drill With Patriot Missiles

    US and Polish military forces will conduct a joint drill later in March involving a US Patriot missile battery and Poland's 3rd Warsaw Air Defense Missile Brigade.

    “We decided to jointly test the possible transfer of the Patriot missiles,” Poland’s Vice Premier and Defense Minister Tomasz Siemoniak told Radio Poland on Tuesday.

    The exercise will be held for several days near Warsaw.

    Some 100 American soldiers handling the Patriot missiles in Germany and 30 vehicles will participate in the exercise on Polish territory held as part of Operation Atlantic Resolve, a series of multinational training and security operations designed to boost Western military presence on NATO eastern flank.

    The Pentagon earlier announced plans to trim down its permanent base in Europe.

    Meanwhile, the US military is stepping up short-term deployments across Europe

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150317/1019611467.html#ixzz3UgBQyB00
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    max steel

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  max steel on Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:59 pm

    Poland orders 1,000 more Spike-LR ATGMs


    Poland has placed a PLN602 million (USD152 million) order for extra Rafael Spike-LR (long-range) anti-tank guided missiles (ATGMs).

    Signed on 17 December, the contract covers the delivery of 1,000 missiles, manufactured under license by ZM Mesko in Poland.

    The first 100 missiles will be delivered to Polish Land Forces in 2017, with 300 following in 2018, 300 in 2019, and the final 300 in 2020.

    No new firing units are included in the order, with all the new missile containers to be equipped with a mounting attachment to allow them to be fitted to the dual launchers used on the Hitfist-30P two-crew turret that arms Poland's modernised Rosomak 8x8 Infantry Fighting Vehicle (IFV).

    The new Spike-LR missiles will also be used on the dual launcher of the new Huta Stalowa Wola (HSW) ZSSW-30 remote-controlled turret currently being tested by the military for the Rosomak and the 'Borsuk' future Polish tracked IFV being developed by HSW. The serial production of the ZSSW-30 turret is planned to start in 2017.

    Poland selected the Spike-LR under a non-competitive process in 2002. A PLN1.49 billion contract followed in December 2003 for 264 launchers and 2,675 missiles for dismounted use by the mechanised, air assault, and air cavalry battalions. Under the original deal, 53% of the missiles were produced by ZM Mesko, including both the precursor and main warheads, launch and flight motors, argon gas titanium pressure tank, solid-fuel, a canister, and partially the servo. While CCD/IIR seeker, gyroscope, battery, and the rest of the servo components are delivered by Rafael ADS. The initial Rafael-built missiles entered Polish service in 2004, with Rafael awarding ZM Mesko a production certificate for the missiles in 2007.
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    max steel

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  max steel on Thu Jan 07, 2016 2:33 pm

    Work on U.S. BMD complex in Poland expected to start in summer

    The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers expects to break ground this summer for a ballistic missile defense facility in Poland.

    The Aegis Ashore BMD complex will be located on Poland's Redzikowa Air Base and when completed in 2018 will complement the Aegis Ashore facility completed last month in Romania.

    The two land facilities, together with Aegis-equipped U.S. warships based in Spain, are to protect European NATO allies and U.S. forces in the region "against growing ballistic-missile threats from the Middle East," the Army said.

    Two contracts will be awarded soon under the program.

    "The first is a $100 million to $200 million contract to build the missile-defense facilities," said Curt Heckelman, chief of USACE Europe District's Missile Defense Branch. "The second is a $25 million to $100 million contract to build the offices, housing and other facilities where U.S. Navy personnel will work and live.

    "We are currently accepting proposals, and this contract is open to all major construction companies."

    About 80 companies attended a pre-proposal conference in Poland last month as part of contract-solicitation process.

    DerWolf

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  DerWolf on Fri Jan 08, 2016 10:58 pm

    US seems in a rush to build missile defence system, in december the system was put into operation in Romania, and in 2018 it will be ready in Poland. Russia is clearly against this system. This will complicate the ralations even more.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  GarryB on Sat Jan 09, 2016 9:11 am

    Complicate?

    Land based SM-3 missiles violates the INF treaty...


    _________________
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    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    DerWolf

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  DerWolf on Sat Jan 09, 2016 10:20 am

    GarryB wrote:Complicate?

    Land based SM-3 missiles violates the INF treaty...
    Russia could break the treaty too now that US broke that. It has all the right to do that.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  GarryB on Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:15 am

    One could argue the US broke the INF treaty years ago with the Predator UCAVs...


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
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    Odin of Ossetia

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Odin of Ossetia on Wed Feb 24, 2016 1:14 am

    max steel wrote:Poland orders 1,000 more Spike-LR ATGMs


    Poland has placed a PLN602 million (USD152 million) order for extra Rafael Spike-LR (long-range) anti-tank guided missiles (ATGMs).

    Signed on 17 December, the contract covers the delivery of 1,000 missiles, manufactured under license by ZM Mesko in Poland.

    The first 100 missiles will be delivered to Polish Land Forces in 2017, with 300 following in 2018, 300 in 2019, and the final 300 in 2020.

    No new firing units are included in the order, with all the new missile containers to be equipped with a mounting attachment to allow them to be fitted to the dual launchers used on the Hitfist-30P two-crew turret that arms Poland's modernised Rosomak 8x8 Infantry Fighting Vehicle (IFV).

    The new Spike-LR missiles will also be used on the dual launcher of the new Huta Stalowa Wola (HSW) ZSSW-30 remote-controlled turret currently being tested by the military for the Rosomak and the 'Borsuk' future Polish tracked IFV being developed by HSW. The serial production of the ZSSW-30 turret is planned to start in 2017.

    Poland selected the Spike-LR under a non-competitive process in 2002. A PLN1.49 billion contract followed in December 2003 for 264 launchers and 2,675 missiles for dismounted use by the mechanised, air assault, and air cavalry battalions. Under the original deal, 53% of the missiles were produced by ZM Mesko, including both the precursor and main warheads, launch and flight motors, argon gas titanium pressure tank, solid-fuel, a canister, and partially the servo. While CCD/IIR seeker, gyroscope, battery, and the rest of the servo components are delivered by Rafael ADS. The initial Rafael-built missiles entered Polish service in 2004, with Rafael awarding ZM Mesko a production certificate for the missiles in 2007.


    I have no idea why have you posted this article here.

    I believe the missiles are Israeli.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Militarov on Sat Apr 23, 2016 11:03 am

    "Bell Helicopter is planning to offer its AH-1Z attack helicopter to Poland for a forthcoming requirement to replace the Mil M-24s operated by the country’s land forces.

    “We can provide the most cost-effective solution and state-of the-art helicopter with unmatched capability for Poland,” says Joel Best, regional director, military business development at the US manufacturer. “We are very interested in co-operation with Poland and in next few months we want to create Zulu Team with companies in the Polish defence sector,” he says.



    Intriguingly, Bell is also touting the UH-1Y utility variant as a back-up plan in case Warsaw’s proposed tri-service order with Airbus Helicopters for 50 H225Ms falls through. “If something happens with the Caracal deal, Bell will be happy to provide an attack and utility combination, with 85% of technical commonality and significant cost saving,” adds Mike Gleason, international military business development at Bell."


    Source: http://defence-blog.com/news/bell-helicopter-offers-ah-1z-and-uh-1y-helicopters-to-poland.html
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sat Apr 23, 2016 11:35 am

    Militarov wrote:"Bell Helicopter is planning to offer its AH-1Z attack helicopter to Poland for a forthcoming requirement to replace the Mil M-24s operated by the country’s land forces.

    “We can provide the most cost-effective solution and state-of the-art helicopter with unmatched capability for Poland,” says Joel Best, regional director, military business development at the US manufacturer. “We are very interested in co-operation with Poland and in next few months we want to create Zulu Team with companies in the Polish defence sector,” he says.



    Intriguingly, Bell is also touting the UH-1Y utility variant as a back-up plan in case Warsaw’s proposed tri-service order with Airbus Helicopters for 50 H225Ms falls through. “If something happens with the Caracal deal, Bell will be happy to provide an attack and utility combination, with 85% of technical commonality and significant cost saving,” adds Mike Gleason, international military business development at Bell."


    Source: http://defence-blog.com/news/bell-helicopter-offers-ah-1z-and-uh-1y-helicopters-to-poland.html

    I don't know what they smoke in Poland, but the Viper is the most costly choice...But I get the Rasha Dasha vibe.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Militarov on Sat Apr 23, 2016 12:57 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:"Bell Helicopter is planning to offer its AH-1Z attack helicopter to Poland for a forthcoming requirement to replace the Mil M-24s operated by the country’s land forces.

    “We can provide the most cost-effective solution and state-of the-art helicopter with unmatched capability for Poland,” says Joel Best, regional director, military business development at the US manufacturer. “We are very interested in co-operation with Poland and in next few months we want to create Zulu Team with companies in the Polish defence sector,” he says.



    Intriguingly, Bell is also touting the UH-1Y utility variant as a back-up plan in case Warsaw’s proposed tri-service order with Airbus Helicopters for 50 H225Ms falls through. “If something happens with the Caracal deal, Bell will be happy to provide an attack and utility combination, with 85% of technical commonality and significant cost saving,” adds Mike Gleason, international military business development at Bell."


    Source: http://defence-blog.com/news/bell-helicopter-offers-ah-1z-and-uh-1y-helicopters-to-poland.html

    I don't know what they smoke in Poland, but the Viper is the most costly choice...But I get the Rasha Dasha vibe.

    Well, would be for start cheaper than AH64E i suppose. But i am not sure on long run as there are not really many 1Zs around, so spares might become a bitch.
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    Grazneyar

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Grazneyar on Sat Apr 23, 2016 1:51 pm

    Has Poland just become a dumping groung for Vietnam era second hand choppers ? They will be on the hook for spares as these will be worn out. I suspect this is the most cost effective solution for US arms industry not the Polish tax payer. Will they get a refit before or will they just get worn out choppers, the US has done this before, dumping scrap Huey's with a South American nation. As for unmatched capability, they couldn't beat rice farmers, are Poland planning on spraying Russia with agent orange ?
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    GarryB

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  GarryB on Sat Apr 23, 2016 2:00 pm

    I quite like the Cobra... but as mentioned it is getting a little old and the latest up to date versions are not that cheap anymore...

    Hey, they have an ABM system they need to defend... of course they should spend money on light attack helos... ???

    Just the old... if you want to be in our club you need to wear our old cast offs... Hinds and Fulcrums out and crappy only worn out Cobras and F-16s in.

    It has nothing to do with the capability or otherwise of the equipment you buy,and everything to do with being inside the United States apron of protection... now you can do no wrong no matter if you burn people at the stake or sell body parts of the people you kidnap and murder... or even if you use artillery on your own population.

    Not only are you no longer condemned for such actions but you can criticise Russia for anything you like with impunity because Uncle Sam has your back right?


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sat Apr 23, 2016 2:18 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:"Bell Helicopter is planning to offer its AH-1Z attack helicopter to Poland for a forthcoming requirement to replace the Mil M-24s operated by the country’s land forces.

    “We can provide the most cost-effective solution and state-of the-art helicopter with unmatched capability for Poland,” says Joel Best, regional director, military business development at the US manufacturer. “We are very interested in co-operation with Poland and in next few months we want to create Zulu Team with companies in the Polish defence sector,” he says.



    Intriguingly, Bell is also touting the UH-1Y utility variant as a back-up plan in case Warsaw’s proposed tri-service order with Airbus Helicopters for 50 H225Ms falls through. “If something happens with the Caracal deal, Bell will be happy to provide an attack and utility combination, with 85% of technical commonality and significant cost saving,” adds Mike Gleason, international military business development at Bell."


    Source: http://defence-blog.com/news/bell-helicopter-offers-ah-1z-and-uh-1y-helicopters-to-poland.html

    I don't know what they smoke in Poland, but the Viper is the most costly choice...But I get the Rasha Dasha vibe.

    Well, would be for start cheaper than AH64E i suppose. But i am not sure on long run as there are not really many 1Zs around, so spares might become a bitch.

    The AH64E doesn't fit in the Polish tender. It was never considered. The Poles wanted ToT for Tigre, they kinda got it, then it went to hell after the pussyfooting between France and Russia and when it appeared that Sikorsky wouldn't have any of that competitive shit. Factually the Viper will be MORE costly than the Tigre because the Poles will not get a spare production line.

    Also the Viper is not exactly a light attack Helicopter, it has twice the weight of the Tiger HAP, has lesser range than even the Tiger HAD and frankly will cost MORE down the years. But hey if Polsha wants to go that way...no problem.
    Hell the AH64E is lighter and has more payload cap than the Viper. But none of my bid'ness.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Militarov on Sat Apr 23, 2016 3:39 pm

    Grazneyar wrote:Has Poland just become a dumping groung for Vietnam era second hand choppers ? They will be on the hook for spares as these will be worn out. I suspect this is the most cost effective solution for US arms industry not the Polish tax payer. Will they get a refit before or will they just get worn out choppers, the US has done this before, dumping scrap Huey's with a South American nation. As for unmatched capability, they couldn't beat rice farmers, are Poland planning on spraying Russia with agent orange ?

    AH-1Z Viper is newly built, but technology from it can be applied to old hulls. Poland wants newly built ones for sure.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Militarov on Sat Apr 23, 2016 3:40 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:"Bell Helicopter is planning to offer its AH-1Z attack helicopter to Poland for a forthcoming requirement to replace the Mil M-24s operated by the country’s land forces.

    “We can provide the most cost-effective solution and state-of the-art helicopter with unmatched capability for Poland,” says Joel Best, regional director, military business development at the US manufacturer. “We are very interested in co-operation with Poland and in next few months we want to create Zulu Team with companies in the Polish defence sector,” he says.



    Intriguingly, Bell is also touting the UH-1Y utility variant as a back-up plan in case Warsaw’s proposed tri-service order with Airbus Helicopters for 50 H225Ms falls through. “If something happens with the Caracal deal, Bell will be happy to provide an attack and utility combination, with 85% of technical commonality and significant cost saving,” adds Mike Gleason, international military business development at Bell."


    Source: http://defence-blog.com/news/bell-helicopter-offers-ah-1z-and-uh-1y-helicopters-to-poland.html

    I don't know what they smoke in Poland, but the Viper is the most costly choice...But I get the Rasha Dasha vibe.

    Well, would be for start cheaper than AH64E i suppose. But i am not sure on long run as there are not really many 1Zs around, so spares might become a bitch.

    The AH64E doesn't fit in the Polish tender. It was never considered. The Poles wanted ToT for Tigre, they kinda got it, then it went to hell after the pussyfooting between France and Russia and when it appeared that Sikorsky wouldn't have any of that competitive shit. Factually the Viper will be MORE costly than the Tigre because the Poles will not  get a spare production line.

    Also the Viper is not exactly a light attack Helicopter, it has twice the weight of the Tiger HAP, has lesser range than even the Tiger HAD and frankly will cost MORE down the years. But hey if Polsha wants to go that way...no problem.
    Hell the AH64E is lighter and has more payload cap than the Viper. But none of my bid'ness.

    Yeah i know it wasnt considered, but it would be better idea than Vipers at this point. Seems that Tiger has many issues these days, Australia and Germany are struggling to keep them flying.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Militarov on Sat Apr 23, 2016 3:42 pm

    GarryB wrote:I quite like the Cobra... but as mentioned it is getting a little old and the latest up to date versions are not that cheap anymore...

    Hey, they have an ABM system they need to defend... of course they should spend money on light attack helos... ???

    Just the old... if you want to be in our club you need to wear our old cast offs... Hinds and Fulcrums out and crappy only worn out Cobras and F-16s in.

    It has nothing to do with the capability or otherwise of the equipment you buy,and everything to do with being inside the United States apron of protection... now you can do no wrong no matter if you burn people at the stake or sell body parts of the people you kidnap and murder... or even if you use artillery on your own population.

    Not only are you no longer condemned for such actions but you can criticise Russia for anything you like with impunity because Uncle Sam has your back right?

    I think Poles will opt for newly built Vipers rather than modernisation of used ones.
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    Werewolf

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    Re: Poland - US military relations:

    Post  Werewolf on Sat Apr 23, 2016 3:50 pm

    You can't modernize old cobras to vipers. The fuselage is widened to fight more avionics, the structure is reinforced to have better protection ballistically aswell deformation in a free fall. They are always newly build.

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