Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Share
    avatar
    jhelb
    Junior Lieutenant
    Junior Lieutenant

    Posts : 424
    Points : 490
    Join date : 2015-04-04
    Location : Previously: Belarus Currently: A Small Island No One Cares About

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  jhelb on Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:00 pm

    The Russian government has decided to work on development of an accelerated flow carbon dioxide based laser to hit missiles and aerial equipment. The plan is to equip the latest airplanes with these laser guns. russia russia

    The latest version of the Il-76MD-90A airplane from the Ulyansk Aviastar factory will be armed with a military laser weapon. The Beriev Aircraft Company on September 14 published information on government orders on their site, saying the testing-design phase had been completed for “ergonomic provision for the development of the A-60SE airplane”.

    This indicates that research and development work on laser weapons is going ahead full steam.

    The Ministry of Defence in 2012 had announced that Russia had begun work on an aviation based laser gun to be installed on the A-60 aircraft system. The system is designed to destroy enemy airplanes, satellites and ballistic missiles.

    At Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin’s initiative, the Foundation for Prospective Research was set up that autumn to finance the new project, which used Soviet-era advances in its R&D.

    The Soviet Union had actively worked on lasers for new types of weapons. During the Soviet period the codename A60 referred to an aviation-based laser system. It was aimed at developing countermeasures against enemy spy satellites and missiles.

    The starting point of the renewed program to develop laser weapons was the A60 special aviation system which was developed in the mid-1970s at the Beriev Aircraft Company. The Il-76MD transport airplane was the base. As part of the work, two flying laboratories were created: the 1A and 1A2.

    The А-60 was the peak of the Soviet laser program. The first flight with an onboard laser happened in 1983 and, by 1984, it had hit its first aerial target. The 1A aircraft was lost in a fire at the start of the 1990s. However, the 1A2 flying laboratory, having received specialized equipment in 2005, was named ‘Sokol Eshelon’ (Falcon-Echelon) and began flight tests again. This aircraft hit a hypothetical target in 2009 at a height of 1500 kilometers above the earth.

    The renewal and active progress of work to develop a military laser is a logical and timely step, said Alexander Kuzovlev, Associate Professor at the National Research Nuclear University (MIFI) in an interview. Laser weapons have many advantages, like practically unlimited range and high precision fire. It can be concealed and its use can surprise an enemy. Lasers, however, depend on atmospheric conditions. If there are heavy clouds, high humidity or rain, then the laser will be much less effective than in dry conditions. Also, use of a laser weapon requires advanced targeting and locking technologies on the laser itself.

    Despite the fact that Russia is intensively carrying out work in this area, it is too soon to talk about an aircraft based laser weapons system that will be accepted into service to destroy missiles and airplanes, said Kuzovlev. thumbsup thumbsup

    http://in.rbth.com/economics/defence/2015/10/06/back-to-the-future-with-laser-guns_480157
    avatar
    Big_Gazza
    Senior Lieutenant
    Senior Lieutenant

    Posts : 621
    Points : 643
    Join date : 2014-08-25
    Location : Melbourne, Australia

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  Big_Gazza on Thu Oct 08, 2015 11:30 am

    All this talk of lasers tends to ignore fundamental physics, such as the theoretical minimum divergence relationship, where beam spread is proportional to beam wavelength and inversely proportional to initial beam radius. I did a few calcs and found some interesting results:

    For an IR laser with wavelength = 808 nm and a beam diameter of 10 cm, the divergence is 10.3 mm/km. Firing a beam at a target 200km distance, the beam at target will be 216 cm across, and the effective power density will drop by factor of 466. Increase the initial beam diameter to 100 cm and the divergence drops to 1.03 mm/km, beam at target is 121 cm across, and power dilution factor is only 1.45.

    These are theoretical minimums, so in practice the actual beam divergence will be greater, and atmospheric effects causing beam scattering or absorption will result in further losses.

    I tried punching in publically available data for the 80s era MIRACL from the US (~14cm beam diameter, 3.8 micron deuterium fluoride IR laser) and its performance looks un-inspiring. In the above scenario, beam divergence is a whopping 34.6 mm/km, beam diameter at target is no better than 7.06 meters and power dilution factor is 2540. Against a 0.5 m2 target and at full power (1MW for 70 secs) MIRACL could focus no more than 12kW (and in practise it would be very much less once atmospheric losses are taken into account). While this could result in damage to an aircraft (if the targetting system could manage to hold the beam in place against defensive maneuvers) it would be next to useless against ballistic missile warheads (which are equipped with heavy ablative shielding to protect against the heat generated from atmospheric re-entry).

    Anyhows, this isn't meant as a comprehensive assessment, but puts a few figures up for indicative purposes.

    [Repost from many moons ago...]
    avatar
    flamming_python
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 3196
    Points : 3312
    Join date : 2012-01-30

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  flamming_python on Sat Oct 10, 2015 2:39 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    chinggis wrote:Hello all!
    Sometime I read somewhere on directed energy Weapons that use microwave radiation instead of laser (light). Can anyone tell me more about that, or this is SF?

    Lasers use light ("light amplification by stimulated emission of radiation")

    There are laser-like devices that use microwave radiation instead of light. They are called Masers ( "microwave amplification by stimulated emission of radiation")

    Same thing, different particles...


    Particles are identical in both cases.

    Same thing, but on a different wave Cool
    avatar
    George1
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 9991
    Points : 10481
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  George1 on Tue Dec 22, 2015 2:45 pm

    Is this an "EM weapon"??

    Russia’s Rostec Corporation is to unveil a super-high frequency weapon capable of taking down all kinds of drones, missiles and other high precision weapons. The presentation will be made at the Army-2015 military expo.

    The Mosow Radio Engineering Institute has developed a super-high frequency (SHF) ‘cannon’. It’s designed to knock out aircraft, drones, guided missiles and any airborne high precision weapons using electronics.

    The cannon creates an air-exclusion zone within a reported radius of over 10 kilometers around the defended object or installation, though the system’s exact characteristics are classified.

    https://www.rt.com/news/267187-shf-cannon-russia-drones/


    Last edited by George1 on Mon May 01, 2017 4:55 pm; edited 1 time in total


    _________________
    "There's no smoke without fire.", Georgy Zhukov

    avatar
    magnumcromagnon
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 4503
    Points : 4684
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed Dec 23, 2015 1:08 am

    George1 wrote:Is this an "EM weapon"??

    Russia’s Rostec Corporation is to unveil a super-high frequency weapon capable of taking down all kinds of drones, missiles and other high precision weapons. The presentation will be made at the Army-2015 military expo.

    The Mosow Radio Engineering Institute has developed a super-high frequency (SHF) ‘cannon’. It’s designed to knock out aircraft, drones, guided missiles and any airborne high precision weapons using electronics.

    The cannon creates an air-exclusion zone within a reported radius of over 10 kilometers around the defended object or installation, though the system’s exact characteristics are classified.

    https://www.rt.com/news/267187-shf-cannon-russia-drones/

    Probably a MASER, similar systems were displayed a decade ago.

    andalusia
    Corporal
    Corporal

    Posts : 95
    Points : 141
    Join date : 2013-10-01

    Laser are a game changer?

    Post  andalusia on Fri May 13, 2016 11:42 am

    Should Russia be concerned about the US developing lasers and putting them on aircraft? Are the Russians investing in laser technology?http://www.vocativ.com/316949/laser-weapon-airplane/

    victor1985
    Captain
    Captain

    Posts : 755
    Points : 800
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  victor1985 on Fri May 13, 2016 9:10 pm

    a laser. it's easy to escape. i told once how.... you have a skin made of the rare element glass put on the missile and under a mirror exacly like those in the laser. and since the rare element resist to high temperature they can be used exacly the same at pak fa

    Teshub
    Private
    Private

    Posts : 33
    Points : 36
    Join date : 2015-02-16

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  Teshub on Sat May 14, 2016 11:27 pm

    andalusia wrote:Should Russia be concerned about the US developing lasers and putting them on aircraft? Are the Russians investing in laser technology?http://www.vocativ.com/316949/laser-weapon-airplane/
    Not at the moment. Airborne laser weapons suffer from four major handicaps:

    1) Stability. To achieve burn-through of the target, the laser needs to shine continuously at the same point. Assuming it is firing at a 'dumb' target such as a drone or missile, air turbulence will make the firing platform quiver constantly in three dimensions making pinpoint targeting very tough, assuming the beam projector has exceptionally precise (and rapid skewing) tracking.  A piloted plane would probably go into evasive manoeuvres as soon as it detected the laser beam, making burn-through far more difficult.

    2) Air quality. Water vapour significantly atrophies the energy in a laser beam. Whilst high altitude flight above 10k metres is relatively clear of pollutants and vapour, all it would do is push the theatre of operations (at least during the approach phase) back below or within cloud level.

    3) Range of engagement. A laser whilst capable of heating/cutting at short distances, cannot hope to match the reach of a long or even medium range missile. Even clear air still atrophies beam energy and collimation spreads quickly over range.

    4) Heat dissipation. Lasers are very inefficient energy-wise. Most of the power supplied to a laser system ends up as waste heat. Now aboard a naval vessel, you can dump this excess heat straight into the sea as water is an excellent heat sink. A plane however can only rely on air flow which is far worse at absorbing heat, especially at high altitudes where the atmosphere is thinner. Also bear in mind that modern fighter jets are already straining their cooling systems just running their radars.

    Those are the main difficulties. Others are the need to integrate a lot of heavy capacitors from which the energy for the laser pulse is stored, additional electrical generation from the engines guzzling fuel, partial mirroring if wavelength of the laser is known plus ablative layers which can 'foul' the beam before contact, speeding up AAM missiles to reduce closing time, the limited power output of the weapon due to poor energy generation of the hosting airframe, and so on.

    All in all they are not really a threat when mounted on planes, at least not against other planes. Possibly against AAM until designers incorporate laser detection and in-flight jinking/spinning to increase its lifespan to reach its target, or if the laser is only intended to burn out optical sensors. Even then, a simple aerial tactic might be to simply fire off two missiles to swamp the laser defence.

    Laser systems aboard ships are a different matter, as vessels have far greater power generation, greater firing stability and easy access to water cooling.
    avatar
    max steel
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 2998
    Points : 3030
    Join date : 2015-02-12
    Location : South Pole

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  max steel on Sun May 15, 2016 1:31 am

    Laser systems aboard ships are limited in range. US Navy experimented lasers by destroying a target .
    avatar
    Big_Gazza
    Senior Lieutenant
    Senior Lieutenant

    Posts : 621
    Points : 643
    Join date : 2014-08-25
    Location : Melbourne, Australia

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  Big_Gazza on Sun May 15, 2016 4:49 pm

    Teshub wrote:
    andalusia wrote:Should Russia be concerned about the US developing lasers and putting them on aircraft? Are the Russians investing in laser technology?http://www.vocativ.com/316949/laser-weapon-airplane/
    Not at the moment. Airborne laser weapons suffer from four major handicaps:

    1) Stability. To achieve burn-through of the target, the laser needs to shine continuously at the same point. Assuming it is firing at a 'dumb' target such as a drone or missile, air turbulence will make the firing platform quiver constantly in three dimensions making pinpoint targeting very tough, assuming the beam projector has exceptionally precise (and rapid skewing) tracking.  A piloted plane would probably go into evasive manoeuvres as soon as it detected the laser beam, making burn-through far more difficult.

    2) Air quality. Water vapour significantly atrophies the energy in a laser beam. Whilst high altitude flight above 10k metres is relatively clear of pollutants and vapour, all it would do is push the theatre of operations (at least during the approach phase) back below or within cloud level.

    3) Range of engagement. A laser whilst capable of heating/cutting at short distances, cannot hope to match the reach of a long or even medium range missile. Even clear air still atrophies beam energy and collimation spreads quickly over range.

    4) Heat dissipation. Lasers are very inefficient energy-wise. Most of the power supplied to a laser system ends up as waste heat. Now aboard a naval vessel, you can dump this excess heat straight into the sea as water is an excellent heat sink. A plane however can only rely on air flow which is far worse at absorbing heat, especially at high altitudes where the atmosphere is thinner. Also bear in mind that modern fighter jets are already straining their cooling systems just running their radars.

    Those are the main difficulties. Others are the need to integrate a lot of heavy capacitors from which the energy for the laser pulse is stored, additional electrical generation from the engines guzzling fuel, partial mirroring if wavelength of the laser is known plus ablative layers which can 'foul' the beam before contact, speeding up AAM missiles to reduce closing time, the limited power output of the weapon due to poor energy generation of the hosting airframe, and so on.

    All in all they are not really a threat when mounted on planes, at least not against other planes. Possibly against AAM until designers incorporate laser detection and in-flight jinking/spinning to increase its lifespan to reach its target, or if the laser is only intended to burn out optical sensors. Even then, a simple aerial tactic might be to simply fire off two missiles to swamp the laser defence.

    Laser systems aboard ships are a different matter, as vessels have far greater power generation, greater firing stability and easy access to water cooling.

    It only get worse if you try to use lasers to kill incoming hypersonic weapons. A missile flying at mach 6-7 at low altitudes is going to require some serious thermal shielding to cope with heating from air friction, and that shielding will further degrade a lasers performance by increasing the energy needed to achieve a burn-thru. More energy required + shorter time available for engagement + tracking difficulties = an inefficient system to defeat hypersonics
    avatar
    gaurav
    Master Sergeant
    Master Sergeant

    Posts : 314
    Points : 314
    Join date : 2013-02-19
    Age : 37
    Location : Blr

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  gaurav on Sun May 15, 2016 8:53 pm

    Russian ground based lasers destroy U.S Satellite.

    Satellite explodes :response to debaltseve crisis



    satellite explodes : response to Turkish fighter jet incident

    It took less than 10 hours after the SU-24 was brought down by Turkish jet to track and destroy this satellite.

    Russians do have ground based ASAT lasers . We dont know what kind of lasers destroyed this satellites. Surely the targeting and the destruction of satellite was done by Russian ASAT lasers.
    The second satellite a less powerful laser pulse was used because indications are this laser attack generated less debrie in the orbit. A more sophisticated laser
    for that matter.
    avatar
    GarryB
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 16007
    Points : 16662
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  GarryB on Mon May 16, 2016 11:34 am

    I remember there was a famous video in the 80s or 90s showing a rocket booster being destroyed by a laser... and it was quite impressive until you actually looked properly at what was happening.

    Basically the booster tube was pressure filled with air to simulate it being full of fuel and there were large I beams of steel on top of it held in place with steel cables.

    the laser... which was up very close and concentrated on one point of the booster for some time eventually popped the outer surface and with a large blast of the interior gas escaping the heavy I beams crushed the booster with wire cables flying everywhere... very impressive but a poor example of an effective laser weapon.

    For one thing the Soviets could easily add a small amount of spin to their rockets so the laser will not be able to concentrate on one point for long enough to penetrate through.

    Secondly... and most importantly... to hit a solid or liquid filled booster you need to have your laser right next to the launch site... with incoming warheads the only target is the warhead... which will be covered in an ablative material that resists heat. Ie you are trying to penetrate a heat shield with a weapon that defeats its target with heat.... I call that pissing on your own shoes.

    The Russians are much more sensible and have said publicly that their current experiments are focussed on defeating EO systems on recon aircraft (manned and unmanned) and also on satellites... a much more sensible and practical goal IMHO.

    eventually they will be powerful and effective and cheap enough to use to shoot down aircraft but for the present Missiles already do that effectively enough.

    Invest in them, but don't expect miracles.

    BTW this talk of destroying satellites with lasers is amusing... a laser will concentrate energy on one point on a satellite and can do damage but to actually blow a satellite to bits reminds me how every car in a hollywood movie bursts into a huge fireball when shot... at least in a car there is a tank full of petrol... in a satellite there will be batteries and solar panels... ie nothing that will blow the entire platform into small pieces when hit with lots of heat.

    A laser can be used to disable a satellite and even damage sensors to make them ineffective, but to blow it to bits is just BS.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    Flanky
    Sergeant
    Sergeant

    Posts : 183
    Points : 192
    Join date : 2011-05-02

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  Flanky on Sat May 21, 2016 8:28 pm

    GarryB wrote:I remember there was a famous video in the 80s or 90s showing a rocket booster being destroyed by a laser... and it was quite impressive until you actually looked properly at what was happening.

    Basically the booster tube was pressure filled with air to simulate it being full of fuel and there were large I beams of steel on top of it held in place with steel cables.

    the laser... which was up very close and concentrated on one point of the booster for some time eventually popped the outer surface and with a large blast of the interior gas escaping the heavy I beams crushed the booster with wire cables flying everywhere... very impressive but a poor example of an effective laser weapon.

    For one thing the Soviets could easily add a small amount of spin to their rockets so the laser will not be able to concentrate on one point for long enough to penetrate through.

    Secondly... and most importantly... to hit a solid or liquid filled booster you need to have your laser right next to the launch site... with incoming warheads the only target is the warhead... which will be covered in an ablative material that resists heat. Ie you are trying to penetrate a heat shield with a weapon that defeats its target with heat.... I call that pissing on your own shoes.

    The Russians are much more sensible and have said publicly that their current experiments are focussed on defeating EO systems on recon aircraft (manned and unmanned) and also on satellites... a much more sensible and practical goal IMHO.

    eventually they will be powerful and effective and cheap enough to use to shoot down aircraft but for the present Missiles already do that effectively enough.

    Invest in them, but don't expect miracles.

    BTW this talk of destroying satellites with lasers is amusing... a laser will concentrate energy on one point on a satellite and can do damage but to actually blow a satellite to bits reminds me how every car in a hollywood movie bursts into a huge fireball when shot... at least in a car there is a tank full of petrol... in a satellite there will be batteries and solar panels... ie nothing that will blow the entire platform into small pieces when hit with lots of heat.

    A laser can be used to disable a satellite and even damage sensors to make them ineffective, but to blow it to bits is just BS.

    You can still do that. Satellites contain propellant for manuvering and if you hit the tank... you know what. Or even Batteries... depending on the battery type, its chemistry can do a lot of damage...
    avatar
    GarryB
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 16007
    Points : 16662
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  GarryB on Sun May 22, 2016 7:12 am

    Most of the propulsion is compressed gas... it could be nitrogen, which is totally inert... so even if hit directly there wont be an explosion... just an energetic venting of gas.

    A battery contains volatile materials but at worst you will only again get a blast of material like a jet and any fire would die down rapidly in space.

    To make it explode it needs a very large charge of HE of some type... something they would not bother with as it would seriously reduce the performance of the satellite having a lot of dead weight on board.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    Flanky
    Sergeant
    Sergeant

    Posts : 183
    Points : 192
    Join date : 2011-05-02

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  Flanky on Sun May 22, 2016 5:34 pm

    Well batteries are comparativelly big and heavy on satellites. Because of the temperature i guess a lead acid or some similar chemistry is used in order to store as much charge as possible having very low ambient temperature. Then there is the problem of radiation - which you have to take into account. It could have happened that a direct hit to a battery caused a large chunk of the satellite body to rip of but total disintegration - i would say journalists have exagerated that. Nonetheless it disabled the target quite effectivelly.
    avatar
    GarryB
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 16007
    Points : 16662
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Laser weapons

    Post  GarryB on Mon May 23, 2016 11:26 am

    Batteries really don't like cold temperatures... batteries of all types would not take the cold of space for long without serious insulation and heating systems... which suggests to me good protection from a laser...

    I would agree the journalists exaggerated... that is what they do sadly.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    George1
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 9991
    Points : 10481
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  George1 on Mon May 30, 2016 3:39 pm

    In Russia, plans to launch the most powerful laser system in the world

    MOSCOW, May 30 -. RIA Novosti The first stage of world's most powerful laser system UV-2M launch in Sarov (Nizhniy Novgorod region) in late 2017, told the director of the Russian Federal Nuclear Center - All-Russian Research Institute of Experimental Physics (Sarov) Valentin Kostjukov the forum "Atomexpo 2016".

    According Kostyukova, 95% in Russian laser system technology will be used.

    Laser installation of a new generation of intended for fundamental research in the field of high energy density physics, including - the use of laser fusion in the energy sector. UFL-2M will have a dual purpose, one of which - the war. Experiments in Physics hot dense plasma and high energy density, which take place on this type of installations, can be directed to the creation of thermonuclear weapons. The second direction - energy. Laser fusion can be used for the development of future energy.

    At one of the meetings of the Scientific and Technical Council of the nuclear weapons complex "Rosatom" developers installation noted that the creation of UFL-2M is important for in new energy research, the study of states of matter, experiments for the simulation and design of new types of nuclear weapons.

    https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=3&hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160530/1440663584.html&usg=ALkJrhiV35hHmfLHDsI25c2wv8tC9_UyZA


    _________________
    "There's no smoke without fire.", Georgy Zhukov


    moskit
    Private
    Private

    Posts : 29
    Points : 91
    Join date : 2016-05-19

    Developments taking place in the field of Electromagnetic rail guns in Russia

    Post  moskit on Mon May 30, 2016 5:14 pm

    Long live Russia,

    Dear admins,

    There are lot of fuss about the electromagnetic rail gun that the US developed and tested recently in media. It says sing its truly a game changing weapon and few analogues are there to challenge it> I would like to know how the Russians have done with that technology and what are there achievements in this field. Thank u,


    Last edited by moskit on Tue May 31, 2016 1:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
    avatar
    GarryB
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 16007
    Points : 16662
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  GarryB on Tue May 31, 2016 8:58 am

    There are several limitations of rail guns... a major one being they need fairly significant power supplies to operate, which limits the sort of platforms that can operate them in the foreseable future to being large warships.

    Having said that the Russians are working on their own designs.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    jhelb
    Junior Lieutenant
    Junior Lieutenant

    Posts : 424
    Points : 490
    Join date : 2015-04-04
    Location : Previously: Belarus Currently: A Small Island No One Cares About

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  jhelb on Tue May 31, 2016 4:24 pm

    GarryB wrote:There are several limitations of rail guns... a major one being they need fairly significant power supplies to operate, which limits the sort of platforms that can operate them in the foreseable future to being large warships.

    GarryB wrote:Having said that the Russians are working on their own designs.

    Garry can you provide some more insight on this? What new design are you referring to? I suspect such ships will need to be nuclear powered.
    avatar
    magnumcromagnon
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 4503
    Points : 4684
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Tue May 31, 2016 6:39 pm

    GarryB wrote:There are several limitations of rail guns... a major one being they need fairly significant power supplies to operate, which limits the sort of platforms that can operate them in the foreseable future to being large warships.

    Having said that the Russians are working on their own designs.

    They had rail-less electro-magnetic guns, powered by electro-magneto batteries for about 2 decades now....with that being said the Russian MOD is rather conservative, and would (most of the time) conserve spending (the general trend of the last two decades) and prevent escalation of tensions. It's a card they rather not play until they absolutely had to...which explains why they stuck with the 125 mm caliber over the 152 mm caliber smoothbore MBT gun.
    avatar
    max steel
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 2998
    Points : 3030
    Join date : 2015-02-12
    Location : South Pole

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  max steel on Tue May 31, 2016 9:06 pm

    USS Zumwalt 78 MW powered ship is planning to use Railguns. As for the weapon being "new", they were first made in 1918 - the trick is to keep the barrel from wearing down too quickly with the very fast projectiles - which are also part of the electrical circuit, so it's a materials-science/tolerance problem, not a design problem.

    If the barrel wears down after 10 shots and it won't fire anymore, it's not really a "superweapon". Wink

    Why Navy can't have nice railguns




    America’s New Superweapon Fails to take Russia and China by Surprise
    avatar
    GarryB
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 16007
    Points : 16662
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  GarryB on Wed Jun 01, 2016 12:12 pm

    Garry can you provide some more insight on this? What new design are you referring to? I suspect such ships will need to be nuclear powered.

    AFAIK still secret...

    http://sputniknews.com/military/20160530/1040475728/railgun-russia-us.html


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    GunshipDemocracy
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 1501
    Points : 1539
    Join date : 2015-05-17
    Location : fishin on Stalin´s Strait between Mexico and Canada

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Wed Jul 13, 2016 12:53 am

    Russian scientists first tested the electromagnetic railgun-gun


    MOSCOW, July 12 - RIA Novosti. In Shatura Branch Joint Institute for High Temperatures tested so-called railgun - electromagnetic accelerator that can accelerate matter to the first cosmic speed and output payloads into orbit, "Russian Science" reports.

    "Getting high speeds with great difficulty Our task -. Receiving system with high pressures and to explore with them the Universe The second problem -. Protection against high-speed cosmic bodies that pose a threat to us, including space debris, comets, etc. The next task. - withdrawal of satellites in Earth orbit, "- he told reporters the president of Russian Academy of Sciences Vladimir fort.

    Railgun are special devices that can disperse objects to extremely high speeds by electric and magnetic fields of force. Typically, a set of several parallel conductors, known as rails, through which current is passed ultrahigh strength. If these concerns conductor rail, the Lorentz force will push and disperse it to the ultrahigh speeds reach gunpowder weapons.

    Such devices are now considered the basis for the creation of new weapons systems and output of goods into orbit. For example, the US Navy is seriously working on the creation of guns based on railgun from mid-2000, when the first prototypes of such systems have been demonstrated to be installed on a new generation of destroyers. The development of space and military railgun engaged and Russian scientists.

    According to the Russian Academy of Sciences, Russian scientists were able to reach a speed of 11 kilometers per second during acceleration "bullets" in railgun created them. This speed is enough to overcome the pull of the Earth and reach its orbit, and a little is not enough to enter into an open space

    As the Forts, achieving such speeds require such high currents and energies that all components of the railgun quickly wear out and fail. Now the main task - to find a material that could withstand such loads, and how to protect them from wear and tear. The head of the RAS has promised that soon the institute specialists will prepare and lay out a video in which you will see the "shot" railgun.

    In the speed of 3.2 kilometers has been achieved during demostratsionnogo startup accelerator in the second, that the fort considered a good indicator. According to him, railgun, temporarily released from the system after the first "shot", repaired tonight.

    According to the academician, the development and further study of how these electromagnetic accelerators work will not only derive loads into space and destroy dangerous objects in their approach to the world, but also to reveal the deeper secrets of the universe - that the behavior of the plasma in the space, both born and dying stars. In addition, the study of the behavior of the plasma inside the railgun will help physicists to tame fusion energy, with what scientists today are experiencing great difficulties in the framework of ITER and NIF projects.

    Railgun 3,2km/s? like 10Ma...not bad but whooping 11,2 as objective is real deal.  33Ma.
    With 24Ma suborbital flight US in 30min not to mention satellites. So scaling down nuclear reactors and investing in high temp superconductors pays off Smile




    max steel wrote:RUSSIA DISMANTLES THE MYTH OF THE AMERICAN NAVY’S INVINCIBILITY

    heh nice but I do not believe hypersonic weapons will fly without nukes. 200-.750kt as in Soviet times should be enough take off A/C group form action 2-3 probably down all ships beyond repairs.

    When Us fleet goes ot Russia´s shores there is the Doomsday no time for conventional weapons.
    avatar
    nemrod
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 818
    Points : 1321
    Join date : 2012-09-11

    Russia's Next Military Game Changer: Microwave Weapons?

    Post  nemrod on Thu Jul 14, 2016 10:32 pm


    This weapon is far to be new, during the Soviet Union's era, engineers worked out this kind of weapons. I read that during the 60's first soviet microwave weapons were designed, but at that time too much cumbersome to be embedded into useful weapon. Nowadays this weapon seems to be enough mature. This is the definitely the end of US strategy that in fact never worked. The BVR was never than a myth, it is a myth, and will stay a myth for at least the rest of this century. Microwave weapons will disable all WVR's missiles too, including those are infra-red. It is the end of an era that started during the 60's with pitiable performances of US -as long as soviet- air to air missiles. The Gulf war of 1991 was not brighting too for air to air missiles. Now it is The End. We are back to the real world, world of dogfights, where US are far behind of the others.

    http://nationalinterest.org/feature/russias-next-military-game-changer-microwave-weapons-16946
    http://tass.ru/opinions/interviews/3440871



    Russia's Next Military Game Changer: Microwave Weapons?

    New drones and fighters could fry enemy hardware from a distance.
    Michael Peck
    July 12, 2016

    Russia will arm its sixth-generation combat drones with microwave weapons.

    These weapons, which disable an aircraft’s electronic equipment, already exist today “and can hit targets within a radius of tens of kilometers,” said Vladimir Mikheev, a director of state-owned Russian electronics firm KRET, in an interview with TASS.


    However, Mikheev suggested that microwave weapons can be as dangerous to the user as to the target. While Russia is developing manned and unmanned sixth-generation aircraft, which are predicted to first take flight in 2025, only the unmanned version will be armed with a microwave weapon. “The electromagnetic pulse fired by the microwave weapon is so powerful that it is extremely difficult to protect the pilot from his own weapons,” Mikheev said. “No matter how well we may shield the cabin, this electronic pulse will get through. And as a human is also, to some extent, a ‘device’ operating on the basis of receiving and transmitting electromagnetic signals, such weapons can cause heavy damage to the health of the pilot.”

    “Protection is already in place today: shielding, special goggles and a glass canopy covered with gold plating to reduce radiation. However, it is so far impossible to ensure 100 percent protection.”

    Echoing the same debates in the United States over manned versus unmanned combat aircraft, Mikheev said that only the unmanned version of Russia's sixth-generation aircraft will have “full technical capabilities.” He predicted these drones will be hypersonic, with a speed of Mach 4 to 5, and will be capable of flight through near space (sixty-five thousand to 328,000 feet).

    Mikheev also notes that that fifth-generation aircraft, such as the F-22, F-35 and Russia’s PAK FA, are characterized by supersonic cruising speed and stealth designs. But what will distinguish sixth-generation aircraft from their predecessors is the capability to work with drones. Mikheev offered a vision of Russian drone warfare that sounds much like its American counterpart. Like the United States, Russia is embracing manned-unmanned teaming, where piloted aircraft control packs of drones.

    Also like American defense contractors, Russian companies say price shouldn’t be a barrier to capability. While drones are cheaper than manned aircraft, they will never be cheap. “They will come at a serious price, given that it will be a high-tech weapon—an aircraft combining hypersonic flight speed, low visibility, high security, artificial intelligence (in order to work in a group) and the most modern weapons, including electromagnetic. The sixth-generation arsenal will also include the latest weapon control systems, reconnaissance, electronic warfare, guidance, navigation and Identification Friend or Foe.”

    The U.S. military is also grappling with what a sixth-generation combat aircraft will look like. Long range, stealth and supersonic cruising capabilities are likely to be features, as will be non-kinetic armament such as microwave or other electromagnetic weapons. It is a certainty that the next generation of manned aircraft will only be a component of a larger team, with the pilot the would-be master of a swarm of drones increasingly capable of autonomous flight.

    The ultimate question: Will a sixth-generation aircraft even have a pilot?

    Michael Peck is a contributing writer for the National Interest. He can be found on Twitter and Facebook.



    Sponsored content

    Re: Directed-Energy Weapons | EM, Microwave, Laser, Sonic |

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Fri May 26, 2017 11:20 am