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    Russian Infantry Training

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    sweartome123

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    Re: Russian Infantry Training

    Post  sweartome123 on Thu Oct 29, 2015 4:54 pm

    GarryB wrote:Funny... asking questions and then having a rant before you have heard the answers... sounds a little like the answers don't matter to you?

    BTW bad trigger discipline happens everywhere... do you really want us to post western special forces with fingers on triggers with targets not in sight?


    I'm not ranting. I simply asked two questions and added my thoughts in regards to them.

    "BTW bad trigger discipline happens everywhere... do you really want us to post western special forces with fingers on triggers with targets not in sight?"

    This is irrelevant. I'm talking about gun safety in the Russian military, not anyone else. I don't care what is done or not done in the west.

    It's just bothersome to see such widespread disregard for gun safety at the core of Russia's forces. Gun safety isn't a problem with more elite units like the military police, scouts, and special forces. It's a problem with your standard soldier. With Russia being an increasingly modern and professional military, I just don't understand why poor gun safety is so frequent. Gun safety is a smart measure that helps prevent needless injury or death and therefore needs to taken seriously.
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    Regular

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    Re: Russian Infantry Training

    Post  Regular on Fri Oct 30, 2015 12:18 am

    Trigger discipline is pretty new thing in Russian military.
    Russia is bit lagging regards all the procedures, but I'm not sure if You are aware, but Russian NCO corps are getting bigger, more professional and more demanding. There are more and more videos and pictures of soldiers who follow this discipline. Russian army is still mixed bag when it comes training. AFAIK in some armies You get penalties for unintentional weapon discharge, I hope it is the same in Russian army too Smile Would keep those fingers in place.
    And yeah, look at this, pointing weapon at Your buddy or Your buddies getting into Your cover zone..

    It's not only gun safety, but tactics that needs to be improved. But they will get there, don't You worry.
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    OminousSpudd

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    Re: Russian Infantry Training

    Post  OminousSpudd on Fri Oct 30, 2015 1:33 am

    sweartome123 wrote:
    GarryB wrote:Funny... asking questions and then having a rant before you have heard the answers... sounds a little like the answers don't matter to you?

    BTW bad trigger discipline happens everywhere... do you really want us to post western special forces with fingers on triggers with targets not in sight?


    I'm not ranting. I simply asked two questions and added my thoughts in regards to them.

    "BTW bad trigger discipline happens everywhere... do you really want us to post western special forces with fingers on triggers with targets not in sight?"

    This is irrelevant. I'm talking about gun safety in the Russian military, not anyone else. I don't care what is done or not done in the west.

    It's just bothersome to see such widespread disregard for gun safety at the core of Russia's forces. Gun safety isn't a problem with more elite units like the military police, scouts, and special forces. It's a problem with your standard soldier. With Russia being an increasingly modern and professional military, I just don't understand why poor gun safety is so frequent. Gun safety is a smart measure that helps prevent needless injury or death and therefore needs to taken seriously.

    You certainly have a valid point. I think we tend to jump the gun a bit ourselves around here when critique appears to single out Russia with little regard for its nearest equivalents. Gun safety in most militaries is utterly abysmal and it's only due to safeties themselves that a lot of FF casualties are avoided. That being said, Russian Forces could and are improving steadily as Regular noted.

    Seeing US forces in the field on countless videos with their fingers glued to their triggers is a tad more scary, as these guys are actually in combat, whereas most Russian gun related mishaps occur on the training grounds. The blasè attitude behind American grunts has always been there and always will be from the looks of things, but this should not reflect on the level of discipline in the Russian Army.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Infantry Training

    Post  GarryB on Fri Oct 30, 2015 9:21 am

    I'm not ranting. I simply asked two questions and added my thoughts in regards to them.

    Your thoughts were answers to the questions you asked... why bother asking if you are providing the answers yourself?

    This is irrelevant. I'm talking about gun safety in the Russian military, not anyone else. I don't care what is done or not done in the west.

    Of course... Russia must live up to ideal western standards of practise but for goodness sake don't expect western equivalents to come close to those standards... do you work for the US State Department by any chance.... Smile

    Why is gun safety only important in the Russian military?

    Or in this discussion can we only look at problems for the Russian military in isolation and separate from everything else?

    It's just bothersome to see such widespread disregard for gun safety at the core of Russia's forces. Gun safety isn't a problem with more elite units like the military police, scouts, and special forces. It's a problem with your standard soldier. With Russia being an increasingly modern and professional military, I just don't understand why poor gun safety is so frequent. Gun safety is a smart measure that helps prevent needless injury or death and therefore needs to taken seriously.

    Gun safety needs to be taken more seriously by everyone, but my limited views of documentaries of Western forces in Afghanistan and Iraq it seems that gun safety becomes less of a priority in combat, but then that is common for many traditions... look at western claims of marksmanship.... single shots for everything yet most footage I have seen of US and British troops shows firing in bursts at often unseen targets. So much for accuracy the west prides itself in...

    Lots of important stuff from the manual goes out the window when the shooting starts... and not just Russian manuals.

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    Regular

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    Re: Russian Infantry Training

    Post  Regular on Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:39 am

    Soldiers in Crimea had good trigger discipline, even when their mags where out. Look it up on pictures. Says something about BSF marines. Very professional soldiers, day and night difference from 58th army guys.
    It's not russian army, but look at separatist instructors(I think they are advisors from Russian military so take it as You wish) in DNR,LNR who trained militia firing drills. Trigger discipline, combat movement, sector coverage and etc. Those drills looked more practical than I did in NATO army.
    Look at Motorola and his weapon handling. He has russian military background.
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    Regular

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    Re: Russian Infantry Training

    Post  Regular on Fri Oct 30, 2015 11:09 am

    Lots of important stuff from the manual goes out the window when the shooting starts... and not just Russian manuals
    True, but that's why You drill it into instinct. Vetted guys handle battle stress very well. Videos from Ukraine or Chechnya when guys do everything by the book could be used as an example.
    I personally never seen combat, but got shot at few times. First time after me and my best army friend messed up in movement and we were supressed by our own MG. It pretty much paralyzed me as bullets were wizzing few meters past us to the target groups. Tracers could be seen, but I could't look back, it realy disoriented me. It has nothing to do with courage, You simply don't know how to react.
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    Sanctus Ferri

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    Re: Russian Infantry Training

    Post  Sanctus Ferri on Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:50 am

    does anyone know how many rounds Russian troops fire in training, and what the rifle marksmanship standards are to successfully pass out of training?  (Rounds required to hit, ranges, targets used, time allowed to aim, etc.)

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