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    Russian made Scopes and Optics

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    GarryB
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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  GarryB on Mon Jul 22, 2013 1:38 pm

    This page has the standard day sights I have seen used on Russian military rifles... including the PSO-1 and 1P29 that I have seen mounted on AKs:

    http://www.npzoptics.com/catalog/sights_for_small_arms/


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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  slice! on Sun Sep 01, 2013 5:03 am



    what kind of sight does that ak-12 have???

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Zivo on Sun Sep 01, 2013 1:47 pm

    slice! wrote:

    what kind of sight does that ak-12 have???
    Collimator.

    What's interesting is that it kind of looks like an Elcan, but not quite. If anyone can ID the make and model that would be appreciated. I really hope this isn't a Chinese knock off or something. Neutral

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Mon Sep 02, 2013 4:47 am

    Zivo wrote:

    what kind of sight does that ak-12 have???
    I don't remember the name of the sight, but it's made by Dedal-NV in Russia. Here's a link to their website

    http://nightvision.ru/en/

    It's not exactly a copy of the Elcan, but it's clearly inspired by it.

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  GarryB on Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:00 am

    What's interesting is that it kind of looks like an Elcan, but not quite. If anyone can ID the make and model that would be appreciated. I really hope this isn't a Chinese knock off or something.
    Not likely Chinese knockoff... if it is similar to a western equivalent that is likely because it was designed for the same reasons and the same purposes which often results in similar solutions.

    Having said that the Russians are not stupid and will copy good ideas but only very rarely will they actually copy them exactly as they wont try to pass them off as the original so there is no need to make an exact replica either.

    The Russians will tend to talk about when they are inspired by western designs... the Strike-1 pistol is a good example where they admit they based their design on the Glock and tried to improve upon it.

    In other cases like the DC-3 and Maxim Machine gun they will licence produce a domestic model where they pay for property rights to do so... or as during the cold war they just emulated what they decided was useful without property rights like the Sidewinder missile.

    Of course it is not all one way... it is certainly no accident that the Bradley combat vehicle has the same layout as the BMP-2 and the F-15 has the same layout as the Mig-25.


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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Zivo on Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:27 pm



    The Elcan runs about $2,000, which in my opinion is robbery. That is really expensive even compared to similar high-end products.

    Having said that the Russians are not stupid and will copy good ideas but only very rarely will they actually copy them exactly as they wont try to pass them off as the original so there is no need to make an exact replica either.
    I'm thinking that's the case with this optic.

    The Russians will tend to talk about when they are inspired by western designs... the Strike-1 pistol is a good example where they admit they based their design on the Glock and tried to improve upon it.
    It's better to admit that out of the gate than to be on the receiving end of a Glock... lawsuit. They seem to be going patent crazy lately.


    I just hope the quality is there, and at an affordable price. Russian optics are usually well built. The more of them on the market, the better.

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    what kind of sight does that ak-12 have???

    Post  GarryB on Sun Sep 08, 2013 11:14 am

    http://nightvision.ru/en/catalog/4/item/152

    http://www.npzoptics.com/catalog/day_sights/psu/

    These seem pretty close...

    Note the npz site has a historical section showing existing and previous military sights they made:

    http://www.npzoptics.com/catalog/special_products/

    Down the left side, the sub list of categories... ie sights for small arms:

    http://www.npzoptics.com/catalog/sights_for_small_arms/

    And current night sights:

    http://www.npzoptics.com/catalog/night_sights_1/

    With previous generation sights listed on this page:

    http://www.npzoptics.com/catalog/earlier_issued_production/


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    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Austin on Tue Dec 24, 2013 11:47 am

    Just want to know from GarryB and some one knowledgeble , How much valid is RT 20 points and counter argument by ArmenT in link below

    http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4016&p=1564404#p1564404

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  GarryB on Tue Dec 24, 2013 1:17 pm

    He was an inventive person, but his job was not engineer or inventor... that was something he did with his spare time.

    It was only after hearing that Soviet soldiers needed a good reliable automatic weapon while in hospital AND the injury to his shoulder that gave him spare time that he started serious work on unique weapon development (as opposed to modifications and improvements).

    The submachinegun he designed was rejected because it was no better than the ones in service and was not so cheap to make. Its invention got him attention however because it was well designed... if he had been in a different army his weapon might have been adopted.... but this exposure got him access to better resources and factories etc which made designing easier for him.

    I rather doubt his first rifle was a variant of a Garand... that would be a step backward from existing Soviet rifles like the Tokarev and Simonov rifles of WWII.

    Actually, when the first AK-47s were manufactured, they were only issued to very select troops in the soviet army in 1949.

    On part two your friend is wrong, the Soviets had decided to adopt a battle rifle, an assault rifle, and a LMG... the first generation being the SKS, the AK-47, and the RPD respectively. It was relatively quickly realised that the AK could do the same job the SKS could do and that the SKS was fairly redundant and it was relegated to ceremonial duties like guard duty.

    The AK-47 originally had a sophisticated stamped steel receiver that was cheap and easy to make, but there were problems with durability and the receiver was changed several times. Finally the early 1950s version used a milled receiver (ie cut from a steel block) which is time consuming and more expensive and results in a heavier weapon.

    The AKM didn't enter full production till 1959, the AK (they called it the AK rather than AK-47) did not really have time to be fully introduced into service with every unit, but the low cost production of the AKM meant it entered service much more rapidly, though it replaced older rifles rather than replacing the AK.

    Until the AKM entered full production the AK was the standard assault rifle and was produced to replace all existing rifles... it was not like the An-94.

    OFB was producing an unlicensed version and they happened to show it off in a arms fair in India, where Mikhail Kalashnikov was present as a guest. He bitched a lot about it.

    How odd for him to be upset at a company stealing his intellectual property...

    As noted above, the AK-47 wasn't cheap compared to the SKS, it was the AKM design that was cheap. Incidentally, the price in some African countries is much cheaper than $334 (though they usually aren't Russian origin, but cheaper knock-offs).

    Legitimate rifles and rifles from "other" sources will vary in price dramatically.

    Osama was seen with a short-barrelled AKS-74U Krinkov in most of his video appearances.

    There is no such rifle as a Krinkov... Krinkov isn't even a Russian word. The correct designation is just AKS-74U. And that rifle is still a Kalashnikov rifle... normally seen with a 45 round magazine from an RPK-74 BTW.

    Frankly, I think it is a fairly common modification for many middle eastern rich people.

    Which doesn't make the assertion false.


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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Austin on Tue Dec 24, 2013 1:21 pm

    Thanks Garry

    par far
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    Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  par far on Wed Oct 22, 2014 7:46 pm

    While researching rifles scopes and optics, I have seen that Russian soldiers often are using foreign made scopes and optics. Are Russian made scopes and optics not up to foreign standards? From the videos I have, there are lots of Russian made scopes and optics, how do they compare with Russian made scopes and optics?


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWIW2heu8PA



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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Werewolf on Wed Oct 22, 2014 7:54 pm

    Russian scopes were for long time not in big serial production which made them more expensive due the low produced number, but they are becoming cheaper and cheaper but are on par and offer often a bigger varierity of scopes and sights for different jobs that are sometimes even cheaper than foreign sights.

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  cracker on Thu Oct 23, 2014 1:11 am

    In the army, only russian sights. Police, VV MVD, SOBR, FSB, etc... Yes, they buy commercially, and russian also.

    reflex sights in army: 1p63

    rifle scope, 1P29, 1P78

    night scope, 1PN93

    for sniper weapons, only russian optics, PSO-1, 1P59, PKS-07, etc...

    It's rare to find not russian or belarussian optics, but you can find western ones in army sometimes, mostly on special sniper rifles, and sometimes eotech for spetsnaz, etc.

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  par far on Thu Oct 23, 2014 2:38 am

    by cracker Today at 5:11 pm
    In the army, only russian sights. Police, VV MVD, SOBR, FSB, etc... Yes, they buy commercially, and russian also.

    reflex sights in army: 1p63

    rifle scope, 1P29, 1P78

    night scope, 1PN93

    for sniper weapons, only russian optics, PSO-1, 1P59, PKS-07, etc...

    It's rare to find not russian or belarussian optics, but you can find western ones in army sometimes, mostly on special sniper rifles, and sometimes eotech for spetsnaz, etc.

    How do those scopes and optics compare against standard US optics and scopes.

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  cracker on Thu Oct 23, 2014 3:11 am

    depends, just as good, but heavier and more robust, 1P29 is old now, not as good as ACOG, but it's very robust and still good.

    PSO-1 is fantastic 4x scope, but it's big.

    1P63 is modern reflex tunel scope, it's basically superb, no direct equivalent.

    1PN93 is great night vision device, works on any russian army weapon, RPG-7 included.

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  par far on Thu Oct 23, 2014 4:11 am

    If some is buying rifles from aboard, can they pick, what optics and scopes they like or will it just come with standard?

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  GarryB on Thu Oct 23, 2014 8:19 am

    If some is buying rifles from aboard, can they pick, what optics and scopes they like or will it just come with standard?

    Some weapons come with scopes... like the SVD and RPG and derivitives, but with hunting rifles like Tigr you will likely buy the scope separately.


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    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  cracker on Thu Oct 23, 2014 11:50 pm

    I'm sure the tiger comes with a PSO-1M2

    And, you can buy optics at NPZ or belomo if you like to, but it doesn't come standard with weapons from izhmash if that was the question in a large deal point of view, except sniper rifles of course

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    Russian robotic thermal sight system

    Post  Asf on Sat Dec 06, 2014 5:25 pm



    And here

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sat Dec 06, 2014 6:20 pm

    Asf wrote:

    And here

    Wow, it has a ridiculous amount of capabilities...but unfortunately it'll probably cost at least $10,000 a piece even with the devalued Rouble. However if mass produced then the cost could go down by 2/3rds...but the real question remains, would the Ru ground forces want something like this?

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Asf on Sat Dec 06, 2014 9:56 pm

    Of course it will cost an arm and a leg. But still a great thing)

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Werewolf on Sat Dec 06, 2014 10:16 pm

    Safe the money from sniper training and buy this stuff, it does everything you need to do as a sniper for you, you are just the servant that carries it from point a to b. Smile

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Asf on Sat Dec 06, 2014 10:48 pm

    Snipers don't only shoot.

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  Morpheus Eberhardt on Sat Dec 06, 2014 11:36 pm

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    Asf wrote:

    And here

    Wow, it has a ridiculous amount of capabilities...but unfortunately it'll probably cost at least $10,000 a piece even with the devalued Rouble. However if mass produced then the cost could go down by 2/3rds...but the real question remains, would the Ru ground forces want something like this?

    What does the Rouble rate have to do with its price?

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    Re: Russian made Scopes and Optics

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sat Dec 06, 2014 11:40 pm

    Morpheus Eberhardt wrote:
    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    Asf wrote:

    And here

    Wow, it has a ridiculous amount of capabilities...but unfortunately it'll probably cost at least $10,000 a piece even with the devalued Rouble. However if mass produced then the cost could go down by 2/3rds...but the real question remains, would the Ru ground forces want something like this?

    What does the Rouble rate have to do with its price?

    The cost of labor of manufacturing.

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