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    Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

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    Which Sukhoi is better for Vietnam ?

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    higurashihougi
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    Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  higurashihougi on Fri Sep 19, 2014 9:44 am

    My personal idea is that I would like some Su-30SM with thrust-vector engine, and some Su-34 to replace the aging Su-22M4. But then there is the issues of cost and maintenance which I do not have good understanding of.

    http://soha.vn/quan-su/su-30m2-hay-su-35s-su-lua-chon-nao-phu-hop-voi-viet-nam-20140904155856793.htm (in Vietnamese)

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    At the moment, although the Su-30M2 is less attractive than Su-35S, but several analysists claimed that Su-30M2 is more suitable for Vietnam.

    First, Vietnamese Air Forces tend to use the fighters with 2-pilot cockpits, so that they can enhance the fighting capability and can use the aircrafts for pilot training. Su-35S with 1-pilot cockpit is not suitable for these goals, but Su-30M2 with 2-pilot cockpit can be.

    Second, long-range fighting capability of Su-30M2 is not significantly inferior to Su-35S, considering that Su-30M2 is equipped with the radar N035 Irbis-E. The inferior engines of Su-30M2 are not a problem for Vietnam, either, because Vietnam used Sukhoi mainly for naval combat; and in the open sea's condition the planes will less likely to face the ambush or dogfight with enemy's light fighters.

    Third, while Su-35S is mainly designed for air-superiority role, Su-30M2 can be modified for land and sea assaults. A Su-30M2 version with strong ground-attack capability is more suitable for Vietnam.

    Last but not least, for the sake of a highly cost-effective modernization process,a fighter which is not very different from the available Su-30MK2V, not very expensive, but with better capability, is the best choice for Vietnam.
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    Mike E
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  Mike E on Fri Sep 19, 2014 4:44 pm

    It depends on what they really want and need... They don't need the -35S, but it sure as heck wouldn't hurt their air force!

     - As you said, they really need the -34.
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  cyxthtycyxthcyx on Sat Sep 20, 2014 8:29 am

    Increase the standing force of Su-30MK2; coordinate replenishment/supply via China. Idealize Su-30MK2 intercept profiles for the locale to insure implementability.

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    magnumcromagnon
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sat Sep 20, 2014 6:14 pm

    cyxthtycyxthcyx wrote:Increase the standing force of Su-30MK2; coordinate replenishment/supply via China.  Idealize Su-30MK2 intercept profiles for the locale to insure implementability.


    Not likely to happen.
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    NationalRus
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  NationalRus on Sat Sep 20, 2014 6:23 pm

    i dont think a Suchoi is the right plane for vietnam
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  Mike E on Sat Sep 20, 2014 8:47 pm

    NationalRus wrote:i dont think a Suchoi is the right plane for vietnam
    Why not? Either they could go for a larger number of MiG's, a smaller number of Sukhoi's, or a preferred mix of both. I'd like to see them purchase a decent number of -35's and MK2's, along with a few SU-34's and MiG's "on the side". That would give Vietnam great flexibility that they simply don't have anymore. The MiG's (which would have to be purchased over time due to cost) would replace their aging fleet of -21's, the Flankers could supplement if not replace their older Flankers, and the -34 could replace their (also aging) fleet of -22's. Combine all those aircraft and you get a good overall fleet for a country the size of NAM', the only problem is cost....

    If they had to chose a single jet, I'd (now) say the MK2.
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  NationalRus on Sat Sep 20, 2014 10:31 pm

    what is vietnams military doctrine, minimum threats laos and combodia doent produce a air threat, so we have left the maximum threat china, what can vietnam do most to have a effective combat against china, surly no air superiority, at maximum most best they can keep chinas air force air superiority in the reagions north (200km radius) and north east (100km radius) of hanoi only, this will be the area of "air harassment and attrition", to not let them go further north vientam has to concentrate its military doctrine on a ridicules strong anti-air defence which can work well in vietnams flora, most best planes for not lossly air battles in the harassment and attrition areas would be a classic interceptor, MiG-31BM, since they are hard to service, and will be put off service near end 2030 i would take the SU-35 as the second best choise then, at least its capable of long range air to air engagments and has actaully with irbis-e a better radar

    for ground warfare and to harass ground operatons they should update ther mig-21's and su-22's to modern Su-25's and get some mi-28's

    over all:
    -less planes
    -more pantsir's and Buk's maybe a third s-300 batterie
    -MIG-31BM and update to Su-25

    but well since they already have Su's stay with them, to late to switch the main air force aircraft

    i would also dismantle the bases of 921's and 931's fighter regiments, to far north, will be lost anyway, in a surprise attack maybe evenwith the whole regiment, put them 150km behind hanoi
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  Mike E on Sat Sep 20, 2014 10:46 pm

    Well you raise a good point... However, other neighboring or unfriendly countries may not give up their airspace very easily. It is always better to have too many jets versus not enough. Plus they really do need to replace their Soviet-era jets ASAP, and the SU-34 and MiG's could easily take their places with the Flankers supplementing their current air-superiority force... As you may know, Vietnam already has a strong air-defense (via the ground) force, and they should probably focus at least a little more on their aircraft. That being said, SAM's are irreplaceable and NAM' should continue to buy and upgrade them.

    How about this....
     - Less jets, but have them be much more modern and useful MiG's and Flankers.
     - *Continue* upgrading their SAM "force".
     - SU-25 and/or the SU-34. Having both would be nice as they complement each other very well. - Yes, I know they have different roles. That is the main reason they should buy both.

    They don't have many, that is the problem.... They need many more, along with the MiG's.

    As mentioned earlier, the big problem is cost.... They'd need to stretch the purchases out for many years, and decide what to buy first etc.
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    higurashihougi
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  higurashihougi on Sun Sep 21, 2014 9:36 am

    The reason why PAVN choose Sukhoi over Mikoyan, as far as I know, is for the naval task. It is more multirole and has more capability of "not air" attack, i.e. targeting the enemy ships.

    The most vulnerable place, not including the aerospace, is Vietnamese East Sea where people can use their superior navy to attack into Vietnam's long and opened coastal regions. The PAVN needs something have long range, strong ground-attack capability, and have enough air-to-air combat to defense themselves against other fighter. Of course, not very expensive. The Vietnamese Su-30MK2V is modified for the task of naval assault and ship attackers.

    The role of air defense is mainly assigned to the lightweight fighter, mainly the damn f*cking old MiG-21, and the modernized Pechora system. S-300 are too few, and S-400 is not exported yet.

    That why in another thread I showed considerable attention to Indian Tejas, hope that there may be a successor to old man MiG-21. I also want a batch of modernized MiG-29, but Vietnamese media tends to favour French Dassault Mirage 2000, due to its cheap price and fairly good capability.

    I love the excellent supermaneverability of Su-35 and Su-30SM, but consider the given role of Vietnamese Sukhoi, probably the most popular choice is M2 standard. Su-34 is nice, but not cheap.
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    Re: Which Sukhoi aircraft is better for Vietnam?

    Post  George1 on Sat Nov 22, 2014 9:05 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:The reason why PAVN choose Sukhoi over Mikoyan, as far as I know, is for the naval task. It is more multirole and has more capability of "not air" attack, i.e. targeting the enemy ships.

    The most vulnerable place, not including the aerospace, is Vietnamese East Sea where people can use their superior navy to attack into Vietnam's long and opened coastal regions. The PAVN needs something have long range, strong ground-attack capability, and have enough air-to-air combat to defense themselves against other fighter. Of course, not very expensive. The Vietnamese Su-30MK2V is modified for the task of naval assault and ship attackers.

    The role of air defense is mainly assigned to the lightweight fighter, mainly the damn f*cking old MiG-21, and the modernized Pechora system. S-300 are too few, and S-400 is not exported yet.

    That why in another thread I showed considerable attention to Indian Tejas, hope that there may be a successor to old man MiG-21. I also want a batch of modernized MiG-29, but Vietnamese media tends to favour French Dassault Mirage 2000, due to its cheap price and fairly good capability.

    I love the excellent supermaneverability of Su-35 and Su-30SM, but consider the given role of Vietnamese Sukhoi, probably the most popular choice is M2 standard. Su-34 is nice, but not cheap.

    they could also choose MiG-35 from now and on or MiG-29SMT as a more cheap solution

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    Su-35K vs Su-30SM

    Post  indochina on Wed May 27, 2015 4:26 am

    Su-30SM vs Su-35K, Su-35K in future be exported to China, and Su-30SM will be exported to Vietnam, a newspaper of VN has made interesting comparisons of 2 lines Flanker this

    Recently, a lot of information, said the contract negotiation stage buy Su-35S fighters between Russia and China was about to end. Besides, there are many indications that Vietnam has decided to choose Su-30SM instead of "race" in other countries.
    Vietnam to put their faith in Su-30SM Su-35S instead of as many predicted before is quite unexpected but entirely understandable. We still follow a consistent policy is only choose the weapons, ammunition capacity has proven over a long period of operation.
    Su-30SM is made based on the Su-30MKI - a fighter very reliable, fully meet all the requirements of modern warfare and the future.
    Meanwhile, Su-35S is a new aircraft, the manufacturer features ads though very "terrorist" but there's never been tested through practice.

    Su-35S has not been selected Vietnam
    But just compare the parameters on the theory of two kinds of fighters on, who have many more advantages?
    Firstly, long-range air combat capability, Su-30SM radar equipped Su-35S N011M BARS also is N035 Irbis, both the scan type passive phased array radar, the maximum effective range of 400 km are achieved.
    Indeed, N035 Irbis radar was originally developed from N011M BARS should not have many technological breakthroughs, so long-range combat capability of Su-30SM and Su-35S can be considered equal.
    Next to the short range air combat capability, Su-35S advantage lies in engine thrust vector control 3D (3D TVC) AL-41F1S, making it capable of better motor slightly Su-30SM TVC 2D engine AL-31FP.
    But with major combat environment at sea and aircraft are unlikely to encounter situations that are not within close range combat trousers as if to confront the fighters appear unexpectedly light from the airfield War is covered terrain.
    Therefore, little advantage of maneuverability and a higher maximum speed (2,500 km / h compared to 2,100 km / h) of Su-Su-30SM 35S versus almost meaningless.

    Su-30SM Vietnam bid likely will be built capable missile BrahMos
    While not a strategic capability of Su-35S has not proved formidable Su-30SM, when comparing the attack power of the water targets, Su-30SM dominate completely. This can be due to anti-ship cruise missiles, supersonic BrahMos-A.
    BrahMos-A missile was developed by order of the Indian army, this is not anti-ship missile the size and weight of a huge, up to 2,500 kg, exceeding the maximum endurance of 1,500 kg of line Heavy stiff middle Su-30MKI fighters themselves.
    To meet the request of the Indian side, Irkut had reinforced the Su-30MKI framework of a comprehensive, this improvement will be replicated on the Su-30MKI and Su-30SM of production batches later.
    Thanks to a range, high-speed, flexible flying ability, BrahMos-A will help Su-30MKI / Su-30SM aircraft capable of killing perfectly formidable Su-30MK2, Su-35S even by Komsomolsk-on -Amur (KNAAPO) manufactured, which only Kh-31A missile Kh-59MK and.
    Obviously the Vietnam choose Su-30SM Su-35S instead is completely correct, could completely overwhelm enemy air-to-sea combat, while maintaining the ability to prevail on unnecessary .

    http://soha.vn/quan-su/su-30sm-viet-nam-se-mua-vuot-troi-su-35s-trung-quoc-o-diem-nao-20150526015223354.htm

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