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    NATO: Discussion and News

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    Zivo
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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Zivo on Wed Oct 21, 2015 9:21 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    lol1 lol1 lol1



    While Russian Warplanes Bomb Terrorists, NATO Gets Stuck on a Sandy Beach

    Hovercraft and Hunvees taking part in NATO's Trident Juncture training made hard work of the Portuguese coast after being released from the USS Arlington, and eventually got stuck just meters from the shore.


    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20151021/1028896927/nato-portugal-beach-stuck.html#ixzz3pEPL1CgP

    Come on guys, when driving on sand you have to let the air out of the tires or you end up sinking like a rock. Rolling Eyes

    Whoever was in charge should have made them ditch the vehicles and march to their objective.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Kyo on Thu Oct 22, 2015 12:58 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    lol1 lol1 lol1



    While Russian Warplanes Bomb Terrorists, NATO Gets Stuck on a Sandy Beach

    Hovercraft and Hunvees taking part in NATO's Trident Juncture training made hard work of the Portuguese coast after being released from the USS Arlington, and eventually got stuck just meters from the shore.


    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20151021/1028896927/nato-portugal-beach-stuck.html#ixzz3pEPL1CgP
    Looks like a Brazilian joke on Portuguese fellas to me.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  AlfaT8 on Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:56 am

    For comparison (sadly not the same beach and i couldn't find one of Tigr-M on a beach)


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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Thu Oct 22, 2015 2:02 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:For comparison (sadly not the same beach and i couldn't find one of Tigr-M on a beach)


    Take note also, not every sand/beach is the same Smile In middle of desert you have places where Hummer will sink, and still you have places where tanks can go without an issue. Muricans like to call that "pathfinding". Failed this time it seems, and it wasnt much of a path, 50m Very Happy

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Sat Oct 24, 2015 2:23 pm



    During same exercise German mountain infantry transporting their mortar with mule.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sat Oct 24, 2015 2:54 pm

    Militarov wrote:

    During same exercise German mountain infantry transporting their mortar with mule.
    Unless they were traversing the mountains (ala Afghanistan) this just looks pathetic.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Sat Oct 24, 2015 3:00 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Militarov wrote:

    During same exercise German mountain infantry transporting their mortar with mule.
    Unless they were traversing the mountains (ala Afghanistan) this just looks pathetic.

    Na, same exercise, this Trident crap from few days ago. Yeah i know it looks patethic but they are after all mountain infantry, i belive Russians obtained donkeys for similar role some years ago. Horses/mules/donkeys are very useful animals for the army even today Smile

    Yugoslavian army for an example had 20mm AA guns that you could disassemble and then they would be carried by 4 horses/mules for mountain infantry Smile

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sat Oct 24, 2015 4:25 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Militarov wrote:

    During same exercise German mountain infantry transporting their mortar with mule.
    Unless they were traversing the mountains (ala Afghanistan) this just looks pathetic.

    Na, same exercise, this Trident crap from few days ago. Yeah i know it looks patethic but they are after all mountain infantry, i belive Russians obtained donkeys for similar role some years ago. Horses/mules/donkeys are very useful animals for the army even today Smile

    Yugoslavian army for an example had 20mm AA guns that you could disassemble and then they would be carried by 4 horses/mules for mountain infantry Smile
    Mountain infantry, then it all makes sense, btw were there mountains to traverse during this exercise??

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Sat Oct 24, 2015 5:07 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Militarov wrote:

    During same exercise German mountain infantry transporting their mortar with mule.
    Unless they were traversing the mountains (ala Afghanistan) this just looks pathetic.

    Na, same exercise, this Trident crap from few days ago. Yeah i know it looks patethic but they are after all mountain infantry, i belive Russians obtained donkeys for similar role some years ago. Horses/mules/donkeys are very useful animals for the army even today Smile

    Yugoslavian army for an example had 20mm AA guns that you could disassemble and then they would be carried by 4 horses/mules for mountain infantry Smile
    Mountain infantry, then it all makes sense, btw were there mountains to traverse during this exercise??

    I suppose in Spain


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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Bolt on Sat Oct 24, 2015 9:18 pm

    A little story from today that I've seen:

    There were some joint exercises in Lithuania, some elements of US Airborne participated, today was their final day here, so it was decided to make a little hearts and minds show in the center of Vilnius, right near the Cathedral.

    There's a small parking lot nearby, it wasn't closed and there were no warnings about the coming show.
    So, picture this: you, a guy and his wife, drive from Belorussia to Lithuania on a touristic trip, go to the center of the capital, park your car. And right away 8 Humvees with NATO and American flags surround you, with ATGMs and heavy MGs, and some guy in camo goes right to your car and puts a little NATO flag over your plate numbers (and over your country's flag). If I'd been this guy, it would be a big WTF moment for me. Very Happy






    (then didn't want this BMW to "spoil" their little PR show, it could be "uncool" to see a picture of a #strongeurope Humvee right next to some red commie car Smile. They did take that little flag after the owner of the car asked what are they doing though. They also did put a Lithuania's historical flag on the plates on the back).

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Airbornewolf on Sun Oct 25, 2015 12:58 am

    Bolt wrote:A little story from today that I've seen:

    There were some joint exercises in Lithuania, some elements of US Airborne participated, today was their final day here, so it was decided to make a little hearts and minds show in the center of Vilnius, right near the Cathedral.

    There's a small parking lot nearby, it wasn't closed and there were no warnings about the coming show.
    So, picture this: you, a guy and his wife, drive from Belorussia to Lithuania on a touristic trip, go to the center of the capital, park your car. And right away 8 Humvees with NATO and American flags surround you, with ATGMs and heavy MGs, and some guy in camo goes right to your car and puts a little NATO flag over your plate numbers (and over your country's flag). If I'd been this guy, it would be a big WTF moment for me. Very Happy



    (then didn't want this BMW to "spoil" their little PR show, it could be "uncool" to see a picture of a #strongeurope Humvee right next to some red commie car Smile. They did take that little flag after the owner of the car asked what are they doing though. They also did put a Lithuania's historical flag on the plates on the back).

    Yes, "Apeshit" would have came to my mind too. First off, i would have asked the imbecile why he touched my car. and Second, Propably tried to get into an arguement why he still liked to help American war criminals with their little show.

    I mean, i cant help it if i can name places, dates and names where Yanks bombed Afghan people while i was there. And then name the U.S officers that came into town and paid for every killed kid 60 dollars and got angry when certain afghan mothers said their kids could not be replaced with money. or how "Allies" are easily sacrificed and send out to drive in an ambush when the Americans knew it was there. or how the U.S likes to sacrifice their own SF troops under heavy fire just to avoid an political scandal in Afghanistan. Or how that Canadian C-130 was loaded with VX Nerve Gas where my guys where sitting in the back with Gas masks on flying from Kabul to KAF on 3rd of November 2008 that departed at 4 in the morning?. Im sure it was an "misplaced logistical order". ...outside of that, talk about seeing guys foaming with rage having to fly with an transport aircraft filled with nerve gas with pretty much zero protection...

    anyway, it does create the necessary "awkward" factor when i just so happen to know things like that. even the usual counter-arguements where they "check" if i was there. i can answer them all because i was actually there!.
    example, Yes i know Horton's, i stood 40 minutes in line too at Tim Horton's for that Iced Capuccino at KAF. Yes, the RSOI tents where an freaking oven by day and never ever eat the cheese spread out of the MRE's. they clog you up so bad you wont shit for a week. Everybody can recite the meals you get on the menu on the Dutch TK meals per day. The fact after 6 months you worship things like cold soda in the form of Mountain Dew. And that its always fun to see people run in utter panic to the bunker when an IDF alert goes off after the missile already landed and you just laugh outside the bunker and go back inside and go back playing games on your laptop while the new guys still think some precision strike might be imminent. and etc etc. thats just a handfull.

    the end result tough is that they feel even more Awkward i know all that.

    so, nah, ...im not an big NATO fan either apparently. and i definitely would have tried to screw up their Demo.

    the yanks overstayed their welcome since 1945, its high time they where sent home and we Europeans got some politicians in power that start to decide what is in Europe's best interests. starting off torching that monstrosity Brussels to the ground that acts as an Proxy U.S government and get some of our Sovereignty back.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Bolt on Sun Oct 25, 2015 8:35 am

    Airbornewolf wrote:

    Yes, "Apeshit" would have came to my mind too. First off, i would have asked the imbecile why he touched my car. and Second, Propably tried to get into an arguement why he still liked to help American war criminals with their little show.

    I mean, i cant help it if i can name places, dates and names where Yanks bombed Afghan people while i was there. And then name the U.S officers that came into town and paid for every killed kid 60 dollars and got angry when certain afghan mothers said their kids could not be replaced with money. or how "Allies" are easily sacrificed and send out to drive in an ambush when the Americans knew it was there. or how the U.S likes to sacrifice their own SF troops under heavy fire just to avoid an political scandal in Afghanistan. Or how that Canadian C-130 was loaded with VX Nerve Gas where my guys where sitting in the back with Gas masks on flying from Kabul to KAF on 3rd of November 2008 that departed at 4 in the morning?. Im sure it was an "misplaced logistical order". ...outside of that, talk about seeing guys foaming with rage having to fly with an transport aircraft filled with nerve gas with pretty much zero protection...


    That's pretty fucked up.. Sad

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Sun Oct 25, 2015 12:02 pm

    Bolt wrote:A little story from today that I've seen:

    There were some joint exercises in Lithuania, some elements of US Airborne participated, today was their final day here, so it was decided to make a little hearts and minds show in the center of Vilnius, right near the Cathedral.

    There's a small parking lot nearby, it wasn't closed and there were no warnings about the coming show.
    So, picture this: you, a guy and his wife, drive from Belorussia to Lithuania on a touristic trip, go to the center of the capital, park your car. And right away 8 Humvees with NATO and American flags surround you, with ATGMs and heavy MGs, and some guy in camo goes right to your car and puts a little NATO flag over your plate numbers (and over your country's flag). If I'd been this guy, it would be a big WTF moment for me. Very Happy






    (then didn't want this BMW to "spoil" their little PR show, it could be "uncool" to see a picture of a #strongeurope Humvee right next to some red commie car Smile. They did take that little flag after the owner of the car asked what are they doing though. They also did put a Lithuania's historical flag on the plates on the back).

    You know, these guys in Serbia would have very short life expectancy if they acted like this.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Sun Oct 25, 2015 12:32 pm

    Convoy of 36 USArmy Stryker vehicles crossed the border between Hungary & Romania.








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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Airbornewolf on Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:50 am

    Bolt wrote:
    Airbornewolf wrote:

    Yes, "Apeshit" would have came to my mind too. First off, i would have asked the imbecile why he touched my car. and Second, Propably tried to get into an arguement why he still liked to help American war criminals with their little show.

    I mean, i cant help it if i can name places, dates and names where Yanks bombed Afghan people while i was there. And then name the U.S officers that came into town and paid for every killed kid 60 dollars and got angry when certain afghan mothers said their kids could not be replaced with money. or how "Allies" are easily sacrificed and send out to drive in an ambush when the Americans knew it was there. or how the U.S likes to sacrifice their own SF troops under heavy fire just to avoid an political scandal in Afghanistan. Or how that Canadian C-130 was loaded with VX Nerve Gas where my guys where sitting in the back with Gas masks on flying from Kabul to KAF on 3rd of November 2008 that departed at 4 in the morning?. Im sure it was an "misplaced logistical order". ...outside of that, talk about seeing guys foaming with rage having to fly with an transport aircraft filled with nerve gas with pretty much zero protection...


    That's pretty fucked up.. Sad

    It is, My resentment towards NATO and particular to the U.S did not happen overnight. in my ten years of service in NATO it took a lot of negative experiences with the U.S and the NATO organisation in general to come to the outspoken conclusion i have today. i got 10 years experience in NATO's front line forces so i got plenty of knowledge and experience myself when it comes to NATO. i quit for several reasons, you can probably imagine some of them. I still keep in touch with my old friends and co-workers tough within NATO that do share at least some of my views.

    Its nice to hear some info of events within NATO from friends from time to time and i keep them updated what's really going on with Russia and Syria or Ukraine as they are not told anything by the Military themselves or what they are told is gross misinformation most of the times. For example, an F-16 ground crew friend of mine did not knew Pantsir-S1 was operational in Syria under SAA control. he passed the info and picture on to his Dutch Pilot that began to ask some difficult questions to the Americans that eventually admitted to "forgot" to share that information with them since they already did recon flights there and it was supposed to be "safe". A few days later i got an message about how the Russians apparently are seriously hampering the NATO Surveillance inside Syria and caught them off guard with a few events already. among them the Russia Cruise missile strike and the "stealth" interception of an U.S craft by an Russian SU-30. As NATO is still figuring out how the Russians managed to approach it to such close proximity before being able to detect and identify it properly.

    Its just one small example, on the threads here occasionally really good information passes by, pictures and video's that get posted showing the reality on the ground of conflict zones. If relevant i pass that on to my friends within NATO and when we talk again i get information too whats happening within NATO at times and i share it around here too at appropriate topics.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Fri Oct 30, 2015 5:10 pm

    "Senior US official: President Obama authorized deploying additional A-10s and F-15s to İncirlik base in Turkey."



    Source: https://twitter.com/CNNTURK_ENG/status/660114569801658368

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    This night Poland braeak to NATO counterintelligence center

    Post  Inetwarrior on Fri Dec 18, 2015 10:08 am

    1.30 AM with Millitary Police assistance they break. Slovaks are angry
    Link in Polish
    http://wyborcza.pl/1,75478,19364644,nocny-atak-macierewicza.html

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  max steel on Tue Dec 29, 2015 3:41 pm

    Spain To Stay With Patriots in Turkey; Italy Could Deploy Samp/T Missiles

    Spain will stay in Turkish soil with its Patriot air and anti-missile defense system despite the withdrawals of United States and Germany units.

    After 11 months of deployment, the Spanish government decided to extend its participation in the NATO operation "Active Fence" until Dec. 31, 2016, MoD told Defense News.

    The Patriot PAC-2 unit, with six launchers of 4 missiles in each one, is located near the airport of the southeastern city of Adana, the fifth most-populated city in Turkey and 63 miles from Syrian border.

    Last October, Turkey appealed to its NATO allies to shore up missile defenses in the country aimed at shooting down Syrian rockets, as United States and Germany decided to withdraw their batteries from the cities of Gaziantep and Kahramanmaras.

    NATO is considering an extra deployment of Italian anti-missile defense system Samp/T. The US Navy will offer one of the four Arleigh Burke class, based out of Rota,Spain, to be deployed on a constant basis in the Black Sea.

    "This could be the new NATO architecture of the anti-missile defense in Turkey after the withdrawal of the Patriot unit of US and Germany," military sources told Defense News.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  PapaDragon on Fri Jan 22, 2016 3:55 pm


    I got no idea where to put this:

    Hungary Intends to Buy Up to 30 Russian Choppers for $490 Mln

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20160122/1033560027/hungary-russia-helicopters-purchase.html#ixzz3xz9PRa3O

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Thu Mar 17, 2016 4:55 am



    Seems NATO decided to launch own version of tank biathlon.

    "U.S. Army Europe and the German Bundeswehr will co-host the Strong Europe Tank Challenge at Grafenwoehr Training Area from May 10 – 12, 2016. The award ceremony will be on May 13, 2016.
    This is the first Europe-wide tank challenge taking place at Grafenwoehr Training Area since 1991. Seven NATO nations are scheduled to take part in the Strong Europe Tank Challenge – each sending a tank platoon to vie for first place. The participating nations are: Czech Republic, Denmark, Germany, Italy, Poland, Slovenia and the United States.  Each team will be tested on offensive and defensive operations as well as tasks including vehicle identification, battle damage assessment, mounted orienteering and more. The Strong Europe Tank Challenge fosters military partnership while promoting NATO interoperability."


    What makes me laugh is that Slovenia will participate most likely with Yugoslavian built M84As Very Happy (M-84A4 Sniper, modernised with Fotona FCS)

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  max steel on Wed May 11, 2016 12:35 am

    Royal Navy fires warning shots as Spanish vessel harasses US sub in Gibraltar lol1

    The Royal Navy fired flares to warn of a Spanish patrol boat approaching an American nuclear submarine off Gibraltar.

    The fast patrol boat HMS Sabre fired warning shots across the bow of a Guardia Civil vessel as it twice tried to cut across the path of USS Florida during an incursion into Gibraltar’s waters.

    Gibraltar says Spanish vessels regularly stray deep into its territorial waters and the Foreign Office has attacked the incursions as provocative.

    But defence sources said it was rare for a Royal Navy vessel to fire flares and it had only happened a couple of times in the past two years.

    One Naval source said: "It just got too close and when it's a nuclear submarine, you get twitchy any way. If you have responsibility for the protection of it, then you are going to take action much quicker than you might normally. The force protection measures worked and the vessel went away."

    Officials in the British overseas territory have complained about the incident as USS Florida visited the British Naval base last month, the Sun reported.

    Spain claims sovereignty over the strategic outpost, which stands on the southernmost tip of the Iberian peninsula, but has been a British Overseas Territory since the Treaty of Utrecht in 1713.





    In recent years Madrid has warned it is ready to impose a new border tax, close its airspace to planes using the British overseas territory's airport, and investigate the affairs of Gibraltarians with Spanish economic interests.

    The row escalated in 2013 after Gibraltar began building an artificial reef it said would improve fish stocks depleted by incursions by Spanish fishermen.

    A spokesman for the Ministry of Defence declined to comment on nuclear submarine operations or force protection measures.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Wed May 11, 2016 8:24 pm


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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  Militarov on Fri May 13, 2016 8:34 am









    Slovenia with M84 i really wonder how well it will do aganist Leo2 variants.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  max steel on Fri May 13, 2016 10:41 pm

    Militarov wrote:


    Germany Claims Trophy in Strong Europe Tank Challenge

    Tank Challenge end.

    Germany - 2A6
    Denmark - 2A5DK
    Poland - 2A5
    Italy - C1 Ariete
    Slovenia - M-84
    US - M1A2




    All of them with Leos. Even though Leos were not the most modern versions like Abrams.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

    Post  max steel on Tue May 17, 2016 1:46 am

    To Confront Russia’s Subs, NATO Should Team Up on ASW Aircraft

    While in Europe recently, U.S. Defense Secretary Ash Carter called for “a continuous arc of highly capable maritime patrol aircraft” to meet the challenge of increasingly sophisticated and active Russian submarines at the boundary of the North Atlantic. It’s an important call to replace a depleted capability — and it will require a special kind of cooperation to make happen.

    The need is clear. Russia’s submarine force has become increasingly active; has demonstrated new capabilities, such as launching land attack cruise missiles; and is building new classes of conventional and nuclear submarines. Concerns are rising in NATO about Russian naval access to the Atlantic and the threat its subs might pose to U.S. reinforcements heading to Europe during a crisis.

    During the Cold War, maritime patrol aircraft patrolled the Greenland-Iceland-UK gap and other key waterways, listening for Soviet subs and standing ready to act. But over the years, Europe’s MPA fleets have quietly eroded. Britain famously retired its entire fleet of MPAs in 2010 in an attempt to save money, but the UK is far from the only example. The Netherlands sold off its P-3 Orions in 2003, and all of Greece’s MPAs are in deep mothball storage as a cost-cutting measure. Other countries, such as Germany, Italy, France, and Canada, have cancelled buys of new MPAs, opting instead to modernize parts of their current fleets. This leaves America’s European allies with a dwindling fleet of aging MPAs, most of which were introduced in the mid-1980s. NATO estimates that Europe will halve its MPA fleet over the next decade.

    The U.S. Navy’s MPA footprint in Europe has also shrunk considerably. Where once the U.S. dedicated two squadrons to Europe, today there are a total of five aircraft operating there. In 2006, the U.S. pulled up stakes at the Keflavik airbase, a key site for MPA patrols in and around the GIUK gap.

    There are some positive developments. The UK has declared that it is seeking to regain its MPA capability by 2020 through purchases of P-8 Poseidons, and the U.S. is looking to upgrade the Keflavik facilities and begin rotating its own Navy P-8s there for Atlantic patrols. Norway is also looking to deepen its bilateral cooperation with the United States around MPAs.

    But these moves do not reverse the long-term trend, nor meet the burgeoning need for anti-submarine warfare and maritime ISR capabilities. It is time for NATO to take a page from its own playbook, and create a consortium of alliance members who are interested in regenerating their MPA capacities.

    There is solid and promising precedent for this. In the mid-2000s, 12 alliance members plus partner nations Sweden and Finland joined to form the Strategic Airlift Capability. The group bought and pooled C-17 airlifters, making them available for both NATO missions and national requirements in a time-share system based on the national resources contributed to the consortium. This allowed the consortium members to quickly gain a heavy airlift capacity, with a platform that was out of financial reach for many of its smaller members.

    A new MPA consortium could be used to buy a family of aircraft and associated systems, cooperate in training and exercises, develop concepts, and establish shared maintenance. The consortium could even offer membership to NATO countries that do not fly MPAs, but which could offer pre-arranged basing and support. The right countries could allow MPAs to quickly swing from, say, the GIUK gap to the Baltic or Black Sea, two other maritime domains where Russia is challenging the European security order.

    And while the United States is recapitalizing its own MPA fleet with P-8 Poseidons and unmanned Tritons, it too has a role to play in a NATO-based MPA consortium. Again, there is precedent: the U.S. operates its own sizeable C-17 fleet, but also contributed resources to the C-17 consortium. In the same fashion, the U.S. could join a NATO MPA consortium, catalyzing European members and contributing its own fleet of P-3s, P-8s, and Tritons for common training, exercises, and patrols.

    Carter’s call for a new focus on MPA in Europe is certainly urgent and badly needed. But it will only become a reality if European nations work together and get U.S. leadership and active participation. Russia is once again contesting the sub-surface domain, and part of NATO’s answer should come from the once-ubiquitous maritime patrol aircraft.

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    Re: NATO: Discussion and News

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