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    The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

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    TR1
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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  TR1 on Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:07 am

    Money is vital to the Russian army actually staffing itself to regulation. Patriotism and a sense of duty is great and all, but it 1.) won't be enough, not by a long shot 2.) does not replace the need to make the army an attractive alternative to civilian life/an aid to education or career post service.

    The army will only be useful if it is manned by people who want to be there, surrounded by other people who want to be there. Asking young people to throw away several years of life (lets talk about contract soldiers here) which puts them at a disadvantage compared to their civilian brethren down the road, for vague concepts of nationalism/patriotism, take your pick.....will not work in the 21st century.

    If they need to keep shrinking the army in order to achieve this, then so be it. Why is Russia spending so much on a massive nuclear complex if it doesn't prevent large scale war in any case?

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    Post  Pugnax on Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:17 am

    Russia needs a force of standing professional troops,the air force is a given but army and navy are the red headed step children.As for a foreign legion,oh Russia is missing all those far east asians as fodder ?Why join a unit that will insult you,injure you,punish you,perhaps kill when you have a military that will happily do the same..oh a pay/citizenship issue.... buy a time machine jump back a few decades. Waffen SS did the same.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:38 am

    The problem is that professional can have a range of meanings.

    Paid to do it is the most common meaning, but it can also refer to attitude to a job.

    I think the Germans learned the hard way that there are a range of performance levels within the Soviet Military... in fact some even supported them as they rolled in.

    When fighting on home territory against an external invader I rather suspect no enemy of Russia will question the professionalism of the Russian soldier.

    I would dare say most other humans would be the same as it would be a rather common human characteristic to defend friend and family and home from external aggression.

    The amusing thing is that going to a professional army is no panacea either.

    With conscription you get almost everyone so you get a real mix of people which can sometimes cause problems, but also adds a range of skills too.

    With a professional force however you get a specific slice of person that you wont get with conscription.

    Personally I think politicians would be far more reticent to go to war if their own children and the children of their financial supporters might have to go to war too, but of course even with conscription there are perks of power and money.

    The funniest thing of all is the Feminists... they demand equal pay and equal rights, but you don't often hear them call for equal prison time for the same crime, or to be on the draft for conscription...

    The army will only be useful if it is manned by people who want to be there, surrounded by other people who want to be there. Asking young people to throw away several years of life (lets talk about contract soldiers here) which puts them at a disadvantage compared to their civilian brethren down the road, for vague concepts of nationalism/patriotism, take your pick.....will not work in the 21st century.

    You need rules and regulations that make serving attractive. ie no cushy government jobs for people who have not served in the military. Income tax break for 10 years if you serve in the military for 3 years. Free public travel, training in specialist areas they can use in civilian life and assistance for those whose training wont lead to a career when they leave.

    From the sounds of things there will be plenty of IT type jobs in the Russian military.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Wed Oct 24, 2012 11:38 am

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Wed Oct 24, 2012 6:38 pm

    If I were to join the russian armed forces (which BTW I might do when I grow if drop out of college) I wouldnt even think of joining the VDV or any kind of rifle wielding infantry at all. Same goes for vehicle operator and pilots.


    My personal wish would be to join as an ATGM operator (I would absolutely love to operate a kornet) or be a PVO battery operator.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:53 pm

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Thu Oct 25, 2012 12:05 am

    There would be enormous competition to join the VDV... I rather doubt they would accept foreign applicants for these positions as they would already likely have lots and lots of Russians wanting the job.

    As to tests... I am sorry, but I have no idea.

    I would guess as long as you could speak and understand Russian fluently and could write it and read it of course then communication should not be a problem.

    You would probably need fairly convincing answers to questions like Why don't you want to join the army of your own country? and why do you want to serve a country that you were not brought up in?

    The Russians are not fighting in Afghanistan like the US Army is so they will not be so desperate for recruits.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Thu Oct 25, 2012 12:13 am

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Cyberspec on Fri Oct 26, 2012 10:13 am

    If you're of Russian origin (1st generation?) then I suspect you could find it easier to join the Army. There were a couple of shows featuring a French guy of Russian origin serving in the Naval Infantry and a Cuban guy (his mother is Russian) serving in a Recce unit.

    Just a word of caution, serving in the Army isn't like in the movies....it's very hard for people used to a comfortable civilian life...especially the first month or two. I lost almost 10 kg when I served. When my mum saw me at the oath giving ceremony she nearly cried Very Happy I couldn't handle the food at first and you're constantly physically active with little rest or sleep...not too mention the harassment from the old hands

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Fri Oct 26, 2012 2:44 pm

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:I thought dedovschina meant fatherland Suspect

    It means rule of the grandfathers. When a senior hazes you for initiation into a unit, it is dedovshchina.

    Well thats really horrible what you say. Has it been widespread in soviet times or is it after that when budget and discipline is low?

    To meet the man power shortage after The Great Patriotic War, it was necessary to recruit criminals who brought it into the system.

    Do army officials and officers encourage torturing the newcomers or is there just no interest in removing the problem?

    Before it was just an accepted part of the system, now no officer that wants a job will encourage it. The problem was that 3 year conscripts would be serving their last year and haze first year recruits. Well that has been done away with to 2 year so conscripts are much closer together. Someone with a few months more experience than you isn't likely to go around bossing you as someone with nearly 3 years.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Fri Oct 26, 2012 3:01 pm

    Legionary74 wrote:

    Wait wha? In my understanding, if a foreigner joins the Russian military under a 5 year contract they can be granted citizenship after 3 year?

    That is the policy, but it isn't the case. No one but Russian ethnics in FSU countries with Russian bases have been granted entry. It is just another policy to promote border Russians back to their homeland and to fill billets at foreign bases.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Fri Oct 26, 2012 3:48 pm

    Legionary74 wrote:What exactly is this Russian Foreign Legion? Is it part of the Ground Forces or something, I can't find anything about it. Foreigners join up and do they live in Russia or are they stationed around the world or something? After 3 years we become a citizen in it? I can't find anything about it on the internet other than if we sign a 5 year contract we get citizenship after 3. Will it help out with my Russian skills? I'm learning Russian now, and have a good 3 years to go before I make any career decisions. How many Americans/British serve in it? How many people in total? Is the salary the same as the regular contract soldiers? After we become citizens, would they allow a transfer to the VDV or Navy?


    EDIT: If my research is correct, the pay is about $4,000 USD a year?

    There is no Russian FL. They are ethnic Russians living in FSU countries that have Russian bases or installations. They are usually stationed in the country they signed in on our foreign installations. They must be fluent in Russian as no language course will be given. There are no Americans, British or anyone from the West. They are all denied. It is never greater than 1200. They are signing a 5 year contract and are compensated the same as other kontraktniki. The pay rate has changed since I was in. I only received $700 a month in 2000 having para and war stipend. This is the new pay schedule as of this year.

    Monthly pay rate based on posting (min-max, depending on tariff bracket):

    Rifleman: RUB 10,000-12,500 ($350-450)
    Detachment commander: RUB 14,500-15,000 ($520-540)
    Platoon commander: RUB 20,000-20,500 ($720-730)
    Battalion commander: RUB 24,000-24,500 ($860-880)
    Brigade commander: RUB 29,000 ($1,040)
    Army commander: RUB 37,000 ($1,320)
    Deputy minister of defense: RUB 44,000 ($1,570)


    Monthly pay rate based on rank:

    Private: RUB 5,000 ($180)
    Sergeant: RUB 6,500 ($230)
    Lieutenant: RUB 10,000 ($360)
    Major: RUB 11,500 ($410)
    Colonel: RUB 13,000 ($470)
    Lt.-General: RUB 17,000 ($610)
    Col.-General: RUB 20,000 ($720)


    Extra bonuses:

    Monthly bonus for seniority: 2-5 years - 10%, 5-10 years - 15%, 10-15 years - 20%, 15-20 years - 25%, 20-25 years - 30%, 25 years and more - 40%
    Monthly bonus for class qualification: 3rd class - 5%, 2nd class - 10%, 1st class - 20%, master class - 30%
    Monthly bonus for working with classified materials: "Critical importance" - 25%, "Top Secret" - 20%, "Secret" - 10%
    Monthly bonus for special conditions of service: 100% of monthly pay rate
    Monthly bonus for peacetime service connected with risk to life and health: 100% of monthly pay rate
    Monthly bonus for special service merit: 100% of monthly pay rate
    Bonus for effective discharge of duty: Up to 3 monthly pay rates a year
    Annual material support: No less that one monthly pay rate


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  SWAT Pointman on Fri Oct 26, 2012 4:32 pm

    Just like I thought, it would be next to impossible for somebody from the west to join the Russian army. It's not a smart move on their part to deny foreigners entry, but I suppose they do not want an army composed of foreigners. It would look very bad for them.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Sat Oct 27, 2012 9:00 am

    Thanks for the correct info Vlad.

    The French have a foreign legion as very much a mercenary force that is disposable that they can use amongst their numerous colonies around the place.

    It wouldn't really make too much sense for Russia to have a foreign legion because they really don't have much use for them.

    It would also represent a way of infiltrating the Russia military, but then even serving in a foreign legion type unit I doubt a foreigner with French citizenship from serving in the legion would get into a position of trust with serious secrets etc.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Cyberspec on Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:54 am

    The 2 cases I mentioned previosly

    Gary the Cuban-Russian scout
    http://www.vesti.ru/only_video.html?vid=337082

    Alen, the Frenchie in the Russian Marines
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5KzIXJA__g

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Sun Oct 28, 2012 2:48 am

    So unless I spend 5 years as a civilian and then get citizenship, I have no hope of getting into the Russian military? Is there any kind of waivers or anything at all possible for a way to get in without having to get citizenship first?

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Pirate on Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:02 pm

    Vladimir79 wrote:
    Legionary74 wrote:What exactly is this Russian Foreign Legion? Is it part of the Ground Forces or something, I can't find anything about it. Foreigners join up and do they live in Russia or are they stationed around the world or something? After 3 years we become a citizen in it? I can't find anything about it on the internet other than if we sign a 5 year contract we get citizenship after 3. Will it help out with my Russian skills? I'm learning Russian now, and have a good 3 years to go before I make any career decisions. How many Americans/British serve in it? How many people in total? Is the salary the same as the regular contract soldiers? After we become citizens, would they allow a transfer to the VDV or Navy?


    EDIT: If my research is correct, the pay is about $4,000 USD a year?

    There is no Russian FL. They are ethnic Russians living in FSU countries that have Russian bases or installations. They are usually stationed in the country they signed in on our foreign installations. They must be fluent in Russian as no language course will be given. There are no Americans, British or anyone from the West. They are all denied. It is never greater than 1200. They are signing a 5 year contract and are compensated the same as other kontraktniki. The pay rate has changed since I was in. I only received $700 a month in 2000 having para and war stipend. This is the new pay schedule as of this year.

    Monthly pay rate based on posting (min-max, depending on tariff bracket):

    Rifleman: RUB 10,000-12,500 ($350-450)
    Detachment commander: RUB 14,500-15,000 ($520-540)
    Platoon commander: RUB 20,000-20,500 ($720-730)
    Battalion commander: RUB 24,000-24,500 ($860-880)
    Brigade commander: RUB 29,000 ($1,040)
    Army commander: RUB 37,000 ($1,320)
    Deputy minister of defense: RUB 44,000 ($1,570)


    Monthly pay rate based on rank:

    Private: RUB 5,000 ($180)
    Sergeant: RUB 6,500 ($230)
    Lieutenant: RUB 10,000 ($360)
    Major: RUB 11,500 ($410)
    Colonel: RUB 13,000 ($470)
    Lt.-General: RUB 17,000 ($610)
    Col.-General: RUB 20,000 ($720)


    Extra bonuses:

    Monthly bonus for seniority: 2-5 years - 10%, 5-10 years - 15%, 10-15 years - 20%, 15-20 years - 25%, 20-25 years - 30%, 25 years and more - 40%
    Monthly bonus for class qualification: 3rd class - 5%, 2nd class - 10%, 1st class - 20%, master class - 30%
    Monthly bonus for working with classified materials: "Critical importance" - 25%, "Top Secret" - 20%, "Secret" - 10%
    Monthly bonus for special conditions of service: 100% of monthly pay rate
    Monthly bonus for peacetime service connected with risk to life and health: 100% of monthly pay rate
    Monthly bonus for special service merit: 100% of monthly pay rate
    Bonus for effective discharge of duty: Up to 3 monthly pay rates a year
    Annual material support: No less that one monthly pay rate

    You have outdate information. Since this year the private of armed forces gets 830-930$ per month, the Sergeant gets 1,160-1,260$ per month. Lieutenants and Majors gets about 2,000$ and more

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    How does a 21 year old Australian go about joining the Russian Army?

    Post  mbwilding on Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:16 pm

    How does a 21 year old Australian go about joining the Russian Army?

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:50 pm

    Can you communicate (ie speak and understand written and verbal) Russian?

    Suggest you read this thread:

    http://www.russiadefence.net/t2171-foreigner-questions


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  flamming_python on Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:05 am

    Seems like there's someone like you coming along every few months Cool

    Anyway, check out this thread as well; I go into a little detail about the physical standards and such - maybe it can help you decide if its the right path for you http://www.russiadefence.net/t1768-englishman-here

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:15 am

    Hey, with all the new technology and weapons they are going to introduce over the next few years even I would consider joining the Russian military if I was in my 20s again.

    Sadly that ship has already sailed, so I will have to satisfy myself with books and videos and talking to people on the internet...

    Of course you would have to be pretty clear in why you would want to do this because of course they will ask and if you give the wrong answer or they don't believe you then I doubt they will take you on...

    Imagine a young Russian man wanting to join the US or Australian military who doesn't speak or read English.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  SWAT Pointman on Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:28 pm

    It seems quite improbable that a foreigner from a non former Soviet republic would have any chance of joining.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  flamming_python on Sun Dec 23, 2012 2:26 am

    SWAT Pointman wrote:It seems quite improbable that a foreigner from a non former Soviet republic would have any chance of joining.

    Well with all these Englishmen/Americans/Australians banging at the gates they will soon have to make provisions won't they Smile

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  BTRfan on Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:28 am

    Does Russia allow foreigners to gain citizenship and serve in the Russian Armed Forces?


    Would a foreigner be able to move to Russia and attend an Air Force or Naval Academy and earn a commission as an officer?

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Pirate on Fri Aug 23, 2013 7:26 am

    Legionary74 wrote:Hey again. I have a few years before I'm capable of moving anywhere on my own, but I have a few questions. I was born and raised in NYC, USA, but my family descends from Russia. I have a burning patriotism for Russia and the USSR, and a slight opposition to the US and NATO. I wish to go to Russia when I'm about 18-20. I began learning Russia not too long ago using pimsleur, I memorized the alphabet, and it's coming along nicely. To the point, however, I would like to move there to join the VDV, Navy or the Bureau of Prisons (I forgot the exact name). As an American, I've lived in a world surrounded by Anti-Russian propaganda, some of which is difficult to sort. In my understanding, dedovchina is the hazing of conscripts, and I wish to become a fully contracted soldier. Not to sound weak, but are the stories of abuse and forced prostitution among the military for contract soldiers really as bad as America makes it sound? Are the VDV an all volunteer force (I read that here a few minute ago)?

    Also in my understanding, if I signed a 5 year contract, I would be given the option for citizenship in 3? I also read that foreigners can join without an education? This is just in the worst of situations, I'm planning on getting my US high school diploma. Before I move to Russia, will I have to get it translated or converted in some way to the Russian equivalent? (I read its called the attestat something). I've read everything from Russian people being nice and caring to being brutal and anti-American to the core. In the Military, I would assume some are fiercely anti-American, but with my dislike for America and love for Russia, would they single me out in some way?

    I've read through the Russian Embassy site, and similar Military sites, but I haven't gotten a clear example on the salary. I read Lieutenants are guaranteed about 50,000 rubles a year (or month?) so if I'm correct, an entry level enlisted person would get $600 USD a year? Can a commanding officer take that salary and keep it for himself in some cases? I also read that most of Russia is incredibly poor and starving, etc, and I've also read the people are doing just fine. I'm having a difficult time clearing up between American exaggerated anti-Russian propaganda and the real thing. Can anyone clear it up?

    EDIT: Also, how long is VDV training, and what is it like? Does Russia have an organized training structure like the US, or are recruits just given to a CO and he trains them how he sees fit? I'm also a practitioner of Systema for what it's worth
    Man 50,000 rubles is about 2,000 US dollars. 1us dollar is 30 rubles

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