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    The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

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    YuriBierazo
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    Foreigner questions

    Post  YuriBierazo on Fri Oct 19, 2012 3:55 am

    I heard that Russia is forming its own foreign legion but im having trouble finding anything about it on Google other than old forums. I was hoping anyone from Russia could answer some of my questions such as how bad is the dedovshchina, can you only serve in the Russian army or can you serve in the VDV or the Russian Marines? How are the living conditions iv heard it varies from base to base....etc any info would be appreciated.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  SWAT Pointman on Fri Oct 19, 2012 5:52 am

    The dedovshchina is still really bad, and they've done little to nothing to solve it. There are talks however about implanting a military police to solve these problems.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Fri Oct 19, 2012 11:33 pm

    It depends on the unit and the region... in some places and in some units it is very bad.
    Most military units have initiation rituals, the more sadistic ones are called hazing, and most organisations all round the world have issues with such things... including universities and sports teams.

    If you are afraid of a little bullying then perhaps military life is not for you.

    Not to justify it in any way.

    Also I would say that the introduction of a military police force to deal with Hazing suggests they are not doing nothing and are taking the problem very seriously.

    Regarding the Foreign Legion, AFAIK and from what I have read it appears to me to be aimed at people from former Soviet Republics that want to get Russian citizenship, and that priority number one would be that you speak and write in Russian like a native of Russia.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  SWAT Pointman on Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:52 am

    It's not just a blanket party or simply bullying, a lot of people actually get killed or seriously injured because of hazing in the Russian military.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  TR1 on Sat Oct 20, 2012 3:57 am

    How many is a lot?
    do you have figures for past several years?

    The dedovshina problem is serious, but big strides have been made in past years with prosecutor process.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Sat Oct 20, 2012 7:43 am

    People actually being killed directly is very rare.

    Suicides or revenge rampages are not as rare.

    The worst case I have read about was one soldier who had to have his genitals and legs amputated because he was put in a stress position for 3 hours... but then that is something the CIA does all the time.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Sat Oct 20, 2012 5:28 pm

    what does dedovschina mean? Fatherland?


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  flamming_python on Sat Oct 20, 2012 10:13 pm

    Dedovshchina is not such a big problem anymore. Pretty much everywhere has been shaken up over the past 2-3 years. Although you will certainly continue to have some units here and there where its still strong and of course individual incidents are still commonplace even in places where conditions might otherwise be alright; there are thousands of cases brought to prosecution every year, some of them quite serious. Odds are though, you'll be fine.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:19 am

    Legionary74 wrote:Returning to a question in the OP, can a foreigner (American) join the VDV? I've read somewhere that we can't without citizenship? What about working on a Submarine as a sonar operator?

    No, you cannot join any Russian military service without citizenship and fluency of the language.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:22 am

    SWAT Pointman wrote:The dedovshchina is still really bad, and they've done little to nothing to solve it. There are talks however about implanting a military police to solve these problems.

    It is not as bad as the past. A snitch hotline has been added which has had a real impact on its use. Removal of officers having this under their command has skyrocketed over the last few years.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Sun Oct 21, 2012 8:15 am

    What you are talking about is a foreign legion type unit that is attached to the Russian military like the French Foreign Legion is attached to the French military.

    I have heard of such units for people from former Soviet Republics to gain Russian citizenship, but a foreigner just walking into the VDV or serving on a submarine would be very very unlikely.

    The Russian military has conscription, so Russian citizens are liable to have to serve unless they can get out of it.

    The purpose of foreign legion type units is for people to become Russian citizens.

    The basic requisite would be fluent in Russian (written and oral)... that is assuming they would consider accepting westerners, of whom they would be highly suspicious of your motives as would the US military if a Russian citizen wanted to join the US military.

    Needless to say if they did take you on expect to get the sht jobs and there would be no chance of joining an elite force like the VDV.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 8:26 am

    Well, you just crushed all my career plans for the rest of my life...

    Well, damn.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  ssk1777 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 11:00 am

    It would be a good idea for Russia to make a foreign leigion beceause it would expand there military.And some foreigners that want to become russian citizens will have a better chance at becoming one.But the russian military i think is great in size right now.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Sun Oct 21, 2012 3:53 pm

    Can anyone please explain what dedovschina means?


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  SWAT Pointman on Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:07 pm

    I've thought about joining the Russian army too, but it's quite difficult for foreigners to get in. Plus I have only basic Russian speaking and writing skills. And as an American, they would chew you up and spit you out probably. And I never would join the American military.


    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Can anyone please explain what dedovschina means?

    It's basically where they beat the shit out of you and bully you, some times to death. It's like an invitation.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:21 pm

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  TR1 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:28 pm

    ssk1777 wrote:It would be a good idea for Russia to make a foreign leigion beceause it would expand there military.And some foreigners that want to become russian citizens will have a better chance at becoming one.But the russian military i think is great in size right now.

    It's actually undermanned, at least compared to official force structure.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:49 pm

    I thought dedovschina meant fatherland Suspect

    Well thats really horrible what you say. Has it been widespread in soviet times or is it after that when budget and discipline is low?

    Do army officials and officers encourage torturing the newcomers or is there just no interest in removing the problem?

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Sun Oct 21, 2012 8:05 pm

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:04 am

    And some foreigners that want to become russian citizens will have a better chance at becoming one.

    The French use their foreign legion as cannon fodder... to go in first or for dangerous missions.

    Initially they wont trust you fully so you will not be used where you need to be trusted. You'll get crappy or dangerous missions and if you do a respectable job and don't get killed you will likely earn their respect and will be treated as a brother.

    It's basically where they beat the shit out of you and bully you, some times to death. It's like an invitation.

    No. It is more like an initiation ritual to become part of the group.

    I remember reading one case where a group of new recruits were out on training and when they came back they found a nice clean towel at the foot of their beds. Most stepped over it and got cleaned up and went to bed, but one who clearly had a relative from the outfit took the nice clean towel and washed himself with it. In the middle of the night a group of older soldiers came in and gave the new soldiers a few punches to say... our towels are not good enough for you?

    Other times it is stuff like the new recruits clean the boots of the older guys.

    The justification is usually that this is the ritual for this unit and we had it done to us so we are doing it to you and you must do it to the next group.

    Half the problem is that there is a rotation of groups so there is always one group that is new and one group that is half way through its training, which means one group new and weak and one group fit and strong.

    Naval units have their own rituals like a pilot that lands on a carrier for the first time will be picked up by his mates and carried to the back of the plane and have his ass smacked against the tailhook of the aircraft... totally harmless.

    Another naval ritual common around the world is when you pass the equator you have to drink a glass of sea water taken from very deep down underwater... some members of the crew dress up like Neptune or mermaids etc etc.

    American Universities have all sorts of Hazing rituals too, some of them are bizarre, most are quite harmless, and for the most part the same can be said of Russian hazing.

    To put it in perspective I have read about Canadian soldiers in some units being forced to drink their own vomit, and get urinated on by other members of the unit... the term hazing is not new and is not Russian exclusive.

    Some people have committed suicide (I think about 230 people died during 2011 due to dedovchina). I actually think it's on the first page of this thread that they were talking about it, Im too lazy to go look

    That is total suicide rate for the military, which in a million man military is probably below the national average.
    Very few people actually die directly from this... the people who do it are not trying to kill the new recruits... it is like a test... are you tough enough to join this unit.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Mon Oct 22, 2012 7:02 pm

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  flamming_python on Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:25 pm

    Legionary74 wrote:Well, you just crushed all my career plans for the rest of my life...

    Well, damn.

    If you're serious about it, come to Russia, start learning the Russian language, and once you progressed a little start enquiring.
    I think that nothing's impossible as far as such things go; there have been certain 'precedents'.

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:51 am

    EDIT: If my research is correct, the pay is about $4,000 USD a year?

    It is not something you would do for the money, it is often done for very different reasons and of course there can be as many different reasons as there are recruits.


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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  Legionary74 on Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:52 pm

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    Re: The "I want to join the Russian Army" Thread

    Post  GarryB on Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:17 am

    Most of the things you will need will be paid for already, like rent and food etc.

    On some bases in the middle of nowhere there will be little to spend your money on anyway.


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