Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    Verba MANPAD

    Share

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 9:58 am

    I read somewhere that USA want to improve defense of A10-thunderbolt ii against MANPADS. I readed something about DIRCM pods. What they are?

    Werewolf
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 5390
    Points : 5639
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  Werewolf on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:05 am

    victor1985 wrote:I read somewhere that USA want to improve defense of A10-thunderbolt ii against MANPADS. I readed something about DIRCM pods. What they are?

    Probably something like AMASE/DIRCM pods.

    They look like that.


    Pods with extra sensors that can detect Missiles that are incoming to the jet/helicopter and those sensors can detect missiles due the IR/UV spectrum of their exhaust plume.

    http://www.terma.com/media/90427/terma_update_july_2006.pdf


    Last edited by Werewolf on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:06 am; edited 1 time in total

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:06 am

    But now USA utilize something else like f22 and f35. Can be maked a aircraft totally invisible? Against visible light (are some researches for materials that bend the light), against radar ( can a aircraft have composite materials that totally absord radar waves?), against IR (can the flame be covered by something?) and against noise?

    Werewolf
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 5390
    Points : 5639
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  Werewolf on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:09 am

    victor1985 wrote:But now USA utilize something else like f22  and f35. Can be maked a aircraft totally invisible? Against visible light (are some researches for materials that bend the light), against radar ( can a aircraft have composite materials that totally absord radar waves?), against IR (can the flame be covered by something?) and against noise?

    Nothing can be made invsisible, there will be always some electromagnetic spectrum where you always have reflection, regardless when you make it invisible in the human eye spectrum, there will be still exhaust gases and radar spectrum along with far to ultra radar spectrum, which is not used today in army, but when their radar spectrums for detection deplets they will expand in other spectrums. Nothing can be made totally invisible against everything and anything, there is always a spectrum you can detect it.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:14 am

    That supposing that ultra radar spectrum cant be absorbed by composite? Cause in this will be a battle who gets the larger spectrum and who gets the composite materials. As far as i know more you go ahead to gamma ray nothing can stop.

    Werewolf
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 5390
    Points : 5639
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  Werewolf on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:16 am

    victor1985 wrote:That supposing that ultra radar spectrum cant be absorbed by composite? Cause in this will be a battle who gets the larger spectrum and who gets the composite materials. As far as i know more you go ahead to gamma ray nothing can stop.

    Today it is much easier to use different spectrums for detection than developing new materials in high enough quality and quantity to use against those spectrums.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:18 am

    Yes but nothing guaratees that doesnt exist a supreme composite material.

    Werewolf
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 5390
    Points : 5639
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  Werewolf on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:21 am

    victor1985 wrote:Yes but nothing guaratees that doesnt exist a supreme composite material.

    Physically speaking, highly unlikely, since all materials we know so far only a handful of those materials among them exotic have only some minor attributes of absorbing electromagnetic wavelengths for specific bandwiths.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:22 am

    Now i got it. If you use different spectrums he will be forced tu use different composites. But one composite is vulnerable to other waves so they are founded.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:25 am

    Ok radar works but.... that doesnt mean a rocket fired by a s400 can for sure hit the aircraft. So here is the problem. But this is another topic question.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 10:54 am

    One last question : i read that long wave radar cant offer a fire solution cause the wave is too long. What is about this?

    TheArmenian
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 1511
    Points : 1674
    Join date : 2011-09-14

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  TheArmenian on Wed Mar 11, 2015 12:28 pm

    victor1985 wrote:I read somewhere that USA want to improve defense of A10-thunderbolt ii against MANPADS. I readed something about DIRCM pods. What they are?


    And I read somewhere that the USA wants to retire the A10.

    attack

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:39 pm

    Was just a theoretically discusion. In fact USA want to retire but in the context of new weapons that can secure a low altitude plane it is a small posibility to keep them. But was only a theoretical discusion.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:13 pm

    Werewolf wrote:
    victor1985 wrote:But now USA utilize something else like f22  and f35. Can be maked a aircraft totally invisible? Against visible light (are some researches for materials that bend the light), against radar ( can a aircraft have composite materials that totally absord radar waves?), against IR (can the flame be covered by something?) and against noise?

    Nothing can be made invsisible, there will be always some electromagnetic spectrum where you always have reflection, regardless when you make it invisible in the human eye spectrum, there will be still exhaust gases and radar spectrum along with far to ultra radar spectrum, which is not used today in army, but when their radar spectrums for detection deplets they will expand in other spectrums. Nothing can be made totally invisible against everything and anything, there is always a spectrum you can detect it.
    what about those based on propellers(airscrews)?

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:38 pm

    The propeller could reflect waves into a material that surround the propeller and reflect in back

    Werewolf
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 5390
    Points : 5639
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  Werewolf on Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:39 pm

    victor1985 wrote:The propeller could reflect waves into a material that surround the propeller and reflect in back

    What?

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Mar 11, 2015 7:10 pm

    Propeller is also sinonim whit skyscrews.

    GarryB
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 15470
    Points : 16177
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  GarryB on Thu Mar 12, 2015 1:46 am

    Propellers create a very distinctive radar return pattern that makes them fairly easy to identify.

    In thermal optics the pattern generated by propellers and rotor blades also makes them easy to spot as the leading edges of the blades are heated by friction and stand out clearly in modern imaging IR devices.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:00 am

    Yes but since jet engine existed noone tryied to perfect blades of propeller. They can be also masked somehow. But is just a theoretical thing.perfect invisible plane........ who knows...... maibe one day.....

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:03 am

    I know verba van see in different wavelenghts. Wouldnt be nice to add that to all weapons? X rays maibe can see enough far away like hundreds of kilometers. Maibe a form of comunication based on xrays.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:05 am

    Toghether used whit radio would be impossible to jam. Or a comunication based on modulation of radar waves.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:07 am

    As long as a wave no matter which can be transmittes in a logical form (a understandable langiage) like morse code can be used for comunication

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:11 am

    One thing i dont understand:lets say a radio station emit in 90,9 frecvency. How a model is transmittes if the frecvency is only 90,9? As far as i understanded the radio waves are transmited whit changed frecvency in order to deliver a message.

    victor1985
    Major
    Major

    Posts : 852
    Points : 901
    Join date : 2015-01-02

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  victor1985 on Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:32 am

    The s500 can have a kind of this equipment.

    Morpheus Eberhardt
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts : 1967
    Points : 2092
    Join date : 2013-05-20

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  Morpheus Eberhardt on Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:41 am

    victor1985 wrote:One thing i dont understand:lets say a radio station emit in 90,9 frecvency. How a model is transmittes if the frecvency is only 90,9?

    The quoted frequency is the carrier frequency, even though the carrier itself may not always be transmitted. The signal spectrum includes the sideband/sidebands.

    As far as i understanded the radio waves are transmitted whit changed frecvency in order to deliver a message.

    The information is transmitted by modulating the signal. Frequency modulation is one method. Irrespective of the modulation technique, the signal spectrum width is finite (nonzero), for the signal to have any informational content.

    Sponsored content

    Re: Verba MANPAD

    Post  Sponsored content Today at 11:33 am


      Current date/time is Wed Dec 07, 2016 11:33 am