Russia - Pakistan military deals

Nice   

Source: Pakistan may buy 10 Russian Mi-26 helicopters

Russia lifts embargo (was there one? didn't realized that), Pakistan interested in Mi-35 (and Mi-26) among other things:
http://itar-tass.com/politika/1232153

Indian members already going ape over at mp.net in regards tp this. But are quiet when you point out that their other connections sell more advanced or similar equipment to their enemy (French Mirage 5 to Pak and Mirage 2000 to India).

So I dont see what difference it makes that they sell helicopters to Pakistan, especially since India isnt buying Russian helicopters besides VIP ones. Add in fact, Pakistan uses Russian Il jets before hand and do use Russian engines as well for their JF aircraft.

sepheronx wrote:Indian members already going ape over at mp.net in regards tp this. But are quiet when you point out that their other connections sell more advanced or similar equipment to their enemy (French Mirage 5 to Pak and Mirage 2000 to India).

So I dont see what difference it makes that they sell helicopters to Pakistan, especially since India isnt buying Russian helicopters besides VIP ones. Add in fact, Pakistan uses Russian Il jets before hand and do use Russian engines as well for their JF aircraft.

Quite true. Russia will sell to Pakistan Mi-35, which is not the top attack helicopter in Russia and Russia offer to India Mi-28N, but India buy AH-64 instead.

But they arejumping around "predicting" FGFA cancelation and what not, over some proposed helicopters to Pakistan.

Indian members already going ape over at mp.net in regards to this

Indian members or "indian" members?   There are some certain interests (*cough* US of A *cough*) that would give anything to set India against Russia and destroy the mutually beneficial bilateral relations between the two, and transform India into yet another puppet state (the antagonism with China is bad enough). Selling a number of Mi-35s and Mi-26s to Pakistan means practically ZERO in the regional balance of power, certainly much less important than the sale of RD-93 for JF-17.

When Russia would sell Pakistan say i dunno, 100 Su-35, 100 MiG-35, 50 Su-34, a dozen regiments of Anteys and/or S-400, a dozen Ladas, a dozen Steregushchys and 50 Iskander units with i dunno, 500 or 1000 missiles then yes, but until then, there is no valid reason to go "ape" over anything.

Pakistan is also India. This retards should stop this nonsense.

Russia has every right to sell to Pakistan . It makes no difference what India thinks .

The Indian arms lobby at the Kremlin has been so strong that they have scuttled most of the arms deal that the Kremlin wanted to strike with Pakistan , China and the Middle East . It seems Putin has finally realized that this Indian arms lobby has to be destroyed if the arms industry in Russia has to reach out to lucrative markets .

Unbeknown to most Russians , India has now started a railway line to join Iran with the Russian Caucasus . Eventually this railway link will carry thousands of Indians into the Caucasus thereby reducing the local population in this area into a minority .

mack8 wrote:
Indian members or "indian" members?   There are some certain interests (*cough* US of A *cough*) that would give anything to set India against Russia and destroy the mutually beneficial bilateral relations between the two, and transform India into yet another puppet state (the antagonism with China is bad enough). Selling a number of Mi-35s and Mi-26s to Pakistan means practically ZERO in the regional balance of power, certainly much less important than the sale of RD-93 for JF-17.

When Russia would sell Pakistan say i dunno, 100 Su-35, 100 MiG-35, 50 Su-34,  a dozen regiments of Anteys and/or S-400, a dozen Ladas, a dozen Steregushchys and 50 Iskander units with i dunno, 500 or 1000 missiles then yes, but until then, there is no valid reason to go "ape" over anything.

talkin about IconOfEnema? guy's so butthurt i squirm whenever i read his verbal diarrhea.

George1 wrote:Russia has lifted the embargo on deliveries of weapons and military equipment to Pakistan.

There was never any Russian arms embargo on Pakistan . Russia supplied the Mi 17 helos to Pakistan . Consequently following the Indian example Pakistan too converted the Mi 17s into gunships .

Apart from that Pakistan has been getting Russian equipment ranging from aero-engines for its JF-17 fighters being produced with China to thinly-disguised Chinese variants of Russian radars, guns and the like .

Pakistan is the most attractive arms market in the world . It is also a [major non ] NATO member ( MNNA) . But there are a couple of questions that need to be answered :

(1) will Russia be able to sell to Pakistan at a price lower than that of China ? For example , China is pitching the Z 19 against the Mi 35 or Pakistan intends to purchase the [Saturn] AL-31F powerplant for the Chengdu J-10B . So can Russia sell these engines to Pakistan at a price less than what the Chinese are charging ?

http://www.defensenews.com/article/20140604/DEFREG01/306040023/Analysts-Welcome-Russian-Decision-Arms-Sales-Pakistan

(2) will the US still provide the finance if Pakistan opts for Russian weapons instead of "NATO weapons" ?

(3) will Saudi Arabia be willing to bankroll Pakistan if they decide to purchase Russian weapons ?

Pakistan rarely pays for the weapons it receives . It gets the money from the Saudis or the Americans and subsequently pays the Chinese with it .

Sujoy wrote:

George1 wrote:Russia has lifted the embargo on deliveries of weapons and military equipment to Pakistan.

There was never any Russian arms embargo on Pakistan . Russia supplied the Mi 17 helos to Pakistan . Consequently following the Indian example Pakistan too converted the Mi 17s into gunships .

Apart from that Pakistan has been getting Russian equipment ranging from aero-engines for its JF-17 fighters being produced with China to thinly-disguised Chinese variants of Russian radars, guns and the like .

Pakistan is the most attractive arms market in the world . It is also a [major non ] NATO member ( MNNA) . But there are a couple of questions that need to be answered :

(1) will Russia be able to sell to Pakistan at a price lower than that of China ? For example , China is pitching the Z 19 against the Mi 35 or Pakistan intends to purchase the [Saturn] AL-31F powerplant for the Chengdu J-10B . So can Russia sell these engines to Pakistan at a price less than what the Chinese are charging ?


http://www.defensenews.com/article/20140604/DEFREG01/306040023/Analysts-Welcome-Russian-Decision-Arms-Sales-Pakistan

(2) will the US still provide the finance if Pakistan opts for Russian weapons instead of "NATO weapons" ?

(3) will Saudi Arabia be willing to bankroll Pakistan if they decide to purchase Russian weapons ?

Pakistan rarely pays for the weapons it receives . It gets the money from the Saudis or the Americans and subsequently pays the Chinese with it .

Here is an interesting point. Saudi Arabia pay for weapons purchase from Russia for both Egypt and Pakistan. Interesting is, that main talks and negotiations with Saudi Arabia goes through China, who want, that Saudi Arabia also sell its oil for Juans. Something big is happening behind the scene as Iran and KSA are the larger oil and gas suppliers in ME, who could sell oil and gas in other currencies than USD and Libya and Iraq are sinking in new civil wars, which could practically blocked their oil supplies. EU will be even more dependent on Russian supplies and the fall of USD will also bring to fall of EURO. I hope India as member of BRICS group is close to this Russian-Chinese strategy against US empire.

Sujoy wrote:

(1) will Russia be able to sell to Pakistan at a price lower than that of China ? For example , China is pitching the Z 19 against the Mi 35 or Pakistan intends to purchase the [Saturn] AL-31F powerplant for the Chengdu J-10B . So can Russia sell these engines to Pakistan at a price less than what the Chinese are charging ?

http://www.defensenews.com/article/20140604/DEFREG01/306040023/Analysts-Welcome-Russian-Decision-Arms-Sales-Pakistan

I think pakis still haven't got J-10s, have they?

And with embargo lifted, it would actually make a lot of sense for them to buy Mig-29s, since they use the same engines as jf-17.

medo wrote:Something big is happening behind the scene as Iran and KSA are the larger oil and gas suppliers in ME, who could sell oil and gas in other currencies than USD and Libya and Iraq are sinking in new civil wars, which could practically blocked their oil supplies. EU will be even more dependent on Russian supplies and the fall of USD will also bring to fall of EURO .

China, Russia and India are emerging as the alternative powers for the Arabs who appear to be particularly unhappy by three recent developments — (a) US' declining energy dependence, (b) US disinterest in Syria and (c) US' potential toleration of a nuclear-capable Iran. The Sunni-dominated Arab states including Saudi Arabia is deeply apprehensive of Shia-dominated Iran’s influence in the region. Saudi Arabia's goal is to encircle Iran in the region, weaken its allies and stopping its regional aspirations. If this Saudi policy has to become successful it needs to wean away huge countries like India & China that have a massive demand for Iranian oil . Iran used to be the number two oil supplier to India, while India was Iran’s number two market. However, since 2011, Iran has steadily lost this position. In January 2014, Indian imports of Iranian oil were 35 per cent less than in the corresponding period last year. Saudi Arabia has already succeeded in forcing Pakistan to opt out of the Iran-Pakistan gas pipeline. Now Saudi Arabia is trying hard to wean away India from Iran .

etaepsilonk wrote:I think pakis still haven't got J-10s, have they?

No , the powerplant issue is holding things up . Pakis & Chinese want the AL 31F .

etaepsilonk wrote:it would actually make a lot of sense for them to buy Mig-29s, since they use the same engines as jf-17.

Again , question is can Russia sell the Mig 29 at a price less than that of the Chengdu J-10B ? In any case most of the weapons that the Chengdu J-10B carries are Chinese copy of Russian ( like R 77 ) and Israeli ( like Python 3 ) weapons .

Remember the Chinese even stole a march over the Americans by selling the CH-3 UCAV to Pakistan for < $1 million whereas the Predator cost > $30 million .

Sujoy wrote:

medo wrote:Something big is happening behind the scene as Iran and KSA are the larger oil and gas suppliers in ME, who could sell oil and gas in other currencies than USD and Libya and Iraq are sinking in new civil wars, which could practically blocked their oil supplies. EU will be even more dependent on Russian supplies and the fall of USD will also bring to fall of EURO .

China, Russia and India are emerging as the alternative powers for the Arabs who appear to be particularly unhappy by three recent developments  — (a) US' declining energy dependence, (b) US disinterest in Syria and (c) US' potential toleration of a nuclear-capable Iran. The Sunni-dominated Arab states including Saudi Arabia is deeply apprehensive of Shia-dominated Iran’s influence in the region. Saudi Arabia's  goal is to encircle Iran in the region, weaken its allies and stopping its regional aspirations. If this Saudi policy has to become successful it needs to wean away huge countries like India & China  that have a massive demand for Iranian oil . Iran used to be the number two oil supplier to India, while India was Iran’s number two market. However, since 2011, Iran has steadily lost this position. In January 2014, Indian imports of Iranian oil were 35 per cent less than in the corresponding period last year. Saudi Arabia  has already succeeded in forcing Pakistan to opt out of the Iran-Pakistan gas pipeline. Now Saudi Arabia is trying hard to wean away India from Iran .

etaepsilonk wrote:I think pakis still haven't got J-10s, have they?

No , the powerplant issue is holding things up . Pakis & Chinese want the AL 31F .

etaepsilonk wrote:it would actually make a lot of sense for them to buy Mig-29s, since they use the same engines as jf-17.

Again , question is can Russia sell the Mig 29 at a price less than that of the Chengdu J-10B ? In any case most of the weapons that the Chengdu J-10B carries are Chinese copy of Russian ( like R 77 )  and Israeli ( like Python 3 ) weapons .

Remember the Chinese even stole a march over the Americans by selling the CH-3 UCAV to Pakistan for < $1 million whereas the Predator cost > $30 million .

stolen？？ just because your country can build nothing, and become the world largest weapon dumping market?? If you say china is good at copy weapon system , India even has no ability to build any weapon system.

you country even import bullets , and no one want to invent wheels twice! Chinese people never treat India as threat even competitor, why most india keep talking shit

Again , question is can Russia sell the Mig 29 at a price less than that of the Chengdu J-10B ?

If all that mattered was price then Pakistan should buy MiG-15s.

A Pakistani newspaper has reported that Russia has agreed to supply Pakistan with Mi-28 helicopter gunships and 48 MI-35 helicopters.



Source : Mi-28 For Pakistan - Russia Agrees



( btw I can't translate it as I can't read Urdu )

4 Mi-35 for Pakistan

04/17/15 PAKISTAN WILL RECEIVE FOUR ATTACK HELICOPTERS MI-35M

Viktor wrote:4 Mi-35 for Pakistan

04/17/15 PAKISTAN WILL RECEIVE FOUR ATTACK HELICOPTERS MI-35M

where is the “nice”？

The serbs shot down several western drones with Hinds... in fact with men in the back of Hinds firing PKMs to shoot down the slow flying UAVs... I would expect the 23mm nose mounted cannon of the Hind would be devastating against a drone plus its new night and all weather capable systems will make it a very useful tool for COIN ops and anti terrorist ops.

type055 wrote:

Viktor wrote:4 Mi-35 for Pakistan

04/17/15 PAKISTAN WILL RECEIVE FOUR ATTACK HELICOPTERS MI-35M

where is the “nice”？

... only 4 but yeah its a "nice"

George1 wrote:This could be a setback for the relations with India however

"Rosoboronexport" to discuss with Pakistan the supply of Mi-35

Both are being encouraged to join SCO, so in a years time we will know for sure if that's the case.