Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues
GarryB wrote:Well except for the fact that they probably never made that many Granits... Remember there were Vulcans and Kh-22Ms as well...
Isos wrote:GarryB wrote:Well except for the fact that they probably never made that many Granits... Remember there were Vulcans and Kh-22Ms as well...
They were supposed launch all the missiles togather in salvos in coordinated attacks between ships and bombers. So 500-1000 missiles of all types or one type coming at 20 or so ships has the same result.
dino00 wrote:Radar group: small rocket ships will be the directors of fire
The Navy will have an "all-seeing eye"
https://iz.ru/875626/aleksei-ramm-aleksei-kozachenko/radarnaia-gruppa-malye-raketnye-korabli-stanut-navodchikami-ognia
Importance of numbers!
Vladimir79 wrote:dino00 wrote:Radar group: small rocket ships will be the directors of fire
The Navy will have an "all-seeing eye"
https://iz.ru/875626/aleksei-ramm-aleksei-kozachenko/radarnaia-gruppa-malye-raketnye-korabli-stanut-navodchikami-ognia
Importance of numbers!
On the Caspian Sea... oh yes, so important! Try doing that in the North Atlantic or Western Pacific and you will watch those dingys sink at the first tall wave.
PapaDragon wrote:Isn't that precisely the reason why Russians developed Karakurts and discontinued Buyans?
Vladimir79 wrote:PapaDragon wrote:Isn't that precisely the reason why Russians developed Karakurts and discontinued Buyans?
I thought it was a welfare project to keep Crimea's dilapidated shipyards open.
PapaDragon wrote:
By giving contacts to Pella in St. Petersburg? And Amur outside Vladivostok?
Vladimir79 wrote:PapaDragon wrote:
By giving contacts to Pella in St. Petersburg? And Amur outside Vladivostok?
By giving contracts to More in Crimea.
PapaDragon wrote:
Majority was made in Pella, and will be made there, rest in Amur
Crimea made like one Bykov or something (another ship class Russia is realistically capable of building, ironically because it's made to commercial standard like French ships are)
Giving contracts for ships you can actually build to several shipyards simultaneously is pretty much how you build a Navy, no other way around it
that is the reason why their control was given to more efficient shipyards (More to Pella, Zaliv to zelenodonsk and Sevastopol repair plant to Zvezdochka), and they were given some contracts during their modernisation. They will get there. Otherwise what other way of improving the building capabilities of those shipyards could they have employed?Vladimir79 wrote:PapaDragon wrote:
Majority was made in Pella, and will be made there, rest in Amur
Crimea made like one Bykov or something (another ship class Russia is realistically capable of building, ironically because it's made to commercial standard like French ships are)
Giving contracts for ships you can actually build to several shipyards simultaneously is pretty much how you build a Navy, no other way around it
You give it to a shipyard that can specialise in it to be efficient and keep costs down. You don't parse out orders that are made to different standards. The dilapidated yards in Crimea are not efficient at anything which is why it takes them twice as many man hours to produce something.
PapaDragon wrote:
Construction of upgraded Buyan-M ships might be continued after 2024
https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3674075.html
They were supposed launch all the missiles togather in salvos in coordinated attacks between ships and bombers. So 500-1000 missiles of all types or one type coming at 20 or so ships has the same result.
Also I guess the fact the engines are available would be a plus factor (even if dodgy quality, actually physically arriving Chinese engines is a big advantage over not arriving Zvezda engines)
Granits and Vulkans had 1970s computer hardware technology... they did coordinate their attacks but only in groups of something like 24 or 32...
Also keep in mind that these are huge missiles.... even a significantly sized sub like an Oscar only carried 24 missiles, while enormous cruisers like Kirov class ships had 20, and Slava class ships had 16 missiles so the idea of thousand of missiles being used against one carrier group does not hold water
4 kirov (80 missiles) + 4 kiev (32 missiles) + should have had 13 Oscar (312 missiles) + 4 slava (64 missiles) + kuznetsov (12 missiles) + 21 Sovs (168 missiles) + 36 Nanushka corvette (216) + 125 Tu-16 (125-250 missiles) + 497 build tu-22M (497-1491 missiles).
That's 2625 ready to fire missiles and I'm not counting missiles boats, coastal missiles and tactical fighter/bombers and other subs that could carry anti ship missiles.
That's 2625 ready to fire missiles and I'm not counting missiles boats, coastal missiles and tactical fighter/bombers and other subs that could carry anti ship missiles.
Of course it would be impossible to coordinate all that but US forces were not all in the atlantic but they would try to launch them so that a big part come at the same time on the carrier groups. Subs would also use their 650mm from 70km away.
US air defence systems also had 70-80s tech computers so I doubt they could intercept that much missiles.
GarryB wrote:The only US air defence systems worth a damn are on their AEGIS class ships... and it wasn't bad... but any defence can be overwhelmed...
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