Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    Sino-Russian relations:

    Share
    avatar
    macedonian

    Posts : 1072
    Points : 1101
    Join date : 2013-04-28
    Location : Skopje, Macedonia - Скопје, Македонија

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  macedonian on Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:26 am

    ^^^

    Not only that, but remember that China joined Russia in an attempt to prevent the NATO bombardment of Serbia.
    And suffered consequences for it (the accidental Embassy bombing).
    Same goes for Libya, Syria etc.
    China is a good and reliable partner, there's no doubt about that.
    avatar
    George1

    Posts : 11932
    Points : 12409
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  George1 on Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:43 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    George1 wrote:i think China isn't such a reliable partner/ally as India. The past has shown differences and clashes with russia

    If we go by recent memory which powerful country outspokenly opposed ABM base proliferation on Russia's borders, and which country sent a warship to help Russia block an attempt by NATO to attack Syria? After you answer those questions, ask yourself this question...Is the geo-political landscape from the 1970's (where Russia and China were at odds) the same? Is Poland, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Georgia, Hungary, Czech/Slovak Rep., Bulgaria, Yugoslav states still close military allies with Russia? If not, then would it be a smart idea to make enemies when it's not needed? Besides when the Chinese are so dependent on Russian engines for their jets fighters, it makes you wonder why people are so quick to label them and enemy of Russia.

    The fact that they buy so many Russian jet engines means it's a sign of good-will and trust, and it also means that Russia has in-depth knowledge of the capabilities of Chinese jet fighters, and it means that if relations break-down than the spares and parts supply will be cut off...does that sound like a strategy of a country ready to pounce and take over Eastern Siberia?

    Dont forget that china has tremendous needs for energy and for this reason they always have their "aim" in siberia..
    avatar
    Werewolf

    Posts : 5268
    Points : 5473
    Join date : 2012-10-24

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Werewolf on Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:52 pm

    Really how naive and how deluded can someone be about geopolitics to think China and Russia are enemies?
    Both relly on each other and i don't mean in just economical way, but the fact that China wouldn't survive against NATO aggressions without Russia and Russia would be gladly left eaten out by all sides since NATO can not win open war only with isolation and playing one force against another ie China vs Russia.

    Russia and China know exact this is the plan of USA to have a war between China and Russia while NATO is pressuring both with more and more NATO bases. They just want another WW2 scenario where Germany was lead against Russia by UK since they can only make war with dirty tricks.

    There is no hostile behavior or policy between China and Russia, one falls other will fall right away, both know it so this is the opposite of the Mutual Assured Destruction, this is the Mutual Assured Survival.

    China has invested during the early 00s when Russia had rough times in russian companies, not just to make money out of it, because during that time this companies were not promising coming out of nowhere and/or revived, to raise the bipolarity in geopolitics which releases pressure from China.

    The fact that BRICS is established showes they can not be so hostile like some naive people think, is the step to destruction of the petro-dollar which means destruction of the US and the destruction of Israel if they don't have enough political influence in europe to assure the income of european tax payers money into the Israel economy.

    BRICS is checkmate to USrael hegemony and ensures safety for China and Russia, the entire Middle Eastern countries, some African countries and Central and South American countries.
    avatar
    macedonian

    Posts : 1072
    Points : 1101
    Join date : 2013-04-28
    Location : Skopje, Macedonia - Скопје, Македонија

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  macedonian on Tue Apr 15, 2014 1:10 pm

    George1 wrote:

    Dont forget that china has tremendous needs for energy and for this reason they always have their "aim" in siberia..

    Only in western wet dreams.
    End of
    avatar
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 4471
    Points : 4630
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Tue Apr 15, 2014 4:35 pm

    George1 wrote:
    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    George1 wrote:i think China isn't such a reliable partner/ally as India. The past has shown differences and clashes with russia

    If we go by recent memory which powerful country outspokenly opposed ABM base proliferation on Russia's borders, and which country sent a warship to help Russia block an attempt by NATO to attack Syria? After you answer those questions, ask yourself this question...Is the geo-political landscape from the 1970's (where Russia and China were at odds) the same? Is Poland, Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Georgia, Hungary, Czech/Slovak Rep., Bulgaria, Yugoslav states still close military allies with Russia? If not, then would it be a smart idea to make enemies when it's not needed? Besides when the Chinese are so dependent on Russian engines for their jets fighters, it makes you wonder why people are so quick to label them and enemy of Russia.

    The fact that they buy so many Russian jet engines means it's a sign of good-will and trust, and it also means that Russia has in-depth knowledge of the capabilities of Chinese jet fighters, and it means that if relations break-down than the spares and parts supply will be cut off...does that sound like a strategy of a country ready to pounce and take over Eastern Siberia?

    Dont forget that china has tremendous needs for energy and for this reason they always have their "aim" in siberia..

    1.) The Chinese will be building 21 LFTR reactors, their so called "demanding energy" needs is greatly exaggerated:

    http://www.pennenergy.com/articles/pennenergy/2014/03/china-moves-to-build-world-s-first-thorium-nuclear-reactor-within-a-decade.html

    2.) Secondly, your telling me that they'll risk fighting Russia, when they haven't even invaded Taiwan (after 60 years) despite that it's a non-nulcear state and thousands of times weaker than Russia in conventional military power?

    3.)Thirdly, the biggest perpetrators of the "Great Siberian War" scenario are neo-cons like Andrew "Yoda" Marshall of the Office of Net Assessment, who went from theorizing ways to undermine and destroy Russia (including a nuclear first strike) to now all of sudden voicing concern over Russia's well-being...isn't that a bit suspicious even in the least?

    http://www.dod.gov/pubs/foi/International_security_affairs/china/09-F-0759theGreatSiberianWarOf2030.pdf


    4.) Lastly Russia and China are cooperating on aerospace defense, do you know something that the totality of Russian intelligence doesn't know?

    http://en.itar-tass.com/russia/709553
    avatar
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 4471
    Points : 4630
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed Apr 16, 2014 3:39 am

    Russia, China to boost strategic cooperation — Lavrov

    BEIJING, April 15. /ITAR-TASS/. The upcoming summit of the Conference on Interaction and Confidence Building Measures in Asia (CICA), a multi-national forum for enhancing cooperation towards promoting peace, security and stability in the region, scheduled for May, will give a new impetus to the development of Russia-China relations of comprehensive partnership and strategic cooperation, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said at a meeting with Chinese President Xi Jinping in Beijing on Tuesday.

    “First of all, I would like to convey President Putin’s warmest greetings and good wishes,” Lavrov said. “He highly appreciated that you had accepted his invitation and came to (Russia's Black Sea resort) Sochi in February, for the Winter Olympics, where you had a very fruitful and important dialogue.”
    “Today, we have discussed with my counterpart Wang Yi the main parameters of preparations for Putin’s visit to China for bilateral talks and participation in the CICA summit, and we have made definite agenda proposals, taking into account those wishes you expressed during our talks in The Hague twenty days ago,” the minister said.
    “We have considered preparations of the documents for signing. This is quite a solid package, and we are sure that this summit will give an extra powerful impetus to the development of our comprehensive partnership and strategic co-operation,” he added.
    The Chinese president said that “Vladimir Putin’s visit to China in May and the CICA summit will enhance Russia-China relations of comprehensive partnership and strategic cooperation” and gave his “best regards and warmest wishes to the Russian president”.

    http://en.itar-tass.com/russia/727935
    avatar
    Viktor

    Posts : 5641
    Points : 6274
    Join date : 2009-08-25
    Age : 37
    Location : Croatia

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Viktor on Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:12 am

    Nice  thumbsup 


    Putin: a relationship of trust and cooperation with China are at an unprecedented level
    avatar
    George1

    Posts : 11932
    Points : 12409
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  George1 on Mon May 19, 2014 8:41 pm

    REVIEW: Russia-China Naval Drills to Showcase Military Might, Strengthen Ties

    MOSCOW, May 19 (RIA Novosti) – Russia and China will conduct large-scale joint naval drills to demonstrate the strengthening of military cooperation between the two powers as Russian President Vladimir Putin is due to arrive in China on Tuesday amid worsening relations between Moscow and the West over Ukraine.

    The drills will be conducted in the northern part of the East Chinese Sea between May 20 and 26. A total of 14 surface ships, two submarines, nine airplanes, six shipboard helicopters and two operational detachments of marines will participate in the exercise, the Chinese Defense Ministry said in a statement.

    “With more united, integrated and real combat conditions, the drill will improve the two navies' capacity to deal with maritime security threats,” Deputy Commander of the Chinese Navy Tian Zhong said, according to the statement.

    Compared with the previous two such drills, the Chinese and Russian naval forces participating in "Joint Sea-2014" will be mixed together. In addition, submarines and surface ships will confront each other. The countries’ navies will conduct simulated defense and attack exercises, as well as escort duty, search and rescue operations and the freeing of hijacked ships, the statement said.

    A Russian Pacific Fleet squadron, led by the guided-missile cruiser Varyag, has arrived in China to participate in the drills, the Russian Defense Ministry announced Monday.

    "There is no doubt the next Russo-Chinese naval drill will serve to further develop our relations," Russian Navy Deputy Commander-in-Chief Vice Admiral Alexander Fedotenkov said, according to the statement.

    This will be the two countries' third such joint training exercise this year, aimed at strengthening the cooperation of their fleets and the ability to withstand various threats in open water.

    China and Russia have close diplomatic, security and economic ties, and regularly carry out military exercises together. Last year, joint naval exercises were conducted in July in the Sea of Japan, involving about 20 ships and vessels from both sides.

    The drill comes as Russian President Vladimir Putin is due to arrive in Shanghai on an official visit on Tuesday to cement economic ties with China, including on energy, the Kremlin said. After Western powers sanctioned Moscow following the crisis in Ukraine, Russia has intensified contacts with Asian countries, primarily with China.
    avatar
    arpakola

    Posts : 1511
    Points : 1541
    Join date : 2014-03-12
    Age : 50
    Location : Athens

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  arpakola on Tue May 20, 2014 10:18 am


    Austin

    Posts : 6826
    Points : 7215
    Join date : 2010-05-08
    Location : India

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Austin on Tue May 20, 2014 12:18 pm

    Looks like after all the hype of Putin visit and Gas deal 99 % done ,No Gazprom-China Gas deal was signed , Sad  Sad
    avatar
    Viktor

    Posts : 5641
    Points : 6274
    Join date : 2009-08-25
    Age : 37
    Location : Croatia

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Viktor on Tue May 20, 2014 12:48 pm

    Austin wrote:Looks like after all the hype of Putin visit and Gas deal 99 % done ,No Gazprom-China Gas deal was signed , Sad  Sad

    Well they did not backed down from the deal either Very Happy

    Putin is still in China and negotiations are as we speak so perhaps we will see signing of the deal while Putin is in China or perhaps little later but that does not make any difference

    because that deal will happen and gas will in either way start flowing in 2018. But I understand you. I would also like to see that deal signed once and for all. Putin is on two day

    visit to China.
    avatar
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 4471
    Points : 4630
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Tue May 20, 2014 10:46 pm

    China pivot fuels Eurasian century
    By Pepe Escobar

    A specter is haunting Washington, an unnerving vision of a Sino-Russian alliance wedded to an expansive symbiosis of trade and commerce across much of the Eurasian land mass - at the expense of the United States.

    And no wonder Washington is anxious. That alliance is already a done deal in a variety of ways: through the BRICS group of emerging powers (Brazil, Russia, India, China, and South Africa); at the Shanghai Cooperation Organization, the Asian counterweight to the North Atlantic Treaty Organization; inside the Group of 20; and via the 120-member-nation Non-Aligned Movement (NAM).

    Trade and commerce are just part of the future bargain. Synergiesin the development of new military technologies beckon as well. After Russia's Star Wars-style, ultra-sophisticated S-500 air defense anti-missile system comes online in 2018, Beijing is sure to want a version of it. Meanwhile, Russia is about to sell dozens of state-of-the-art Sukhoi Su-35 jet fighters to the Chinese as Beijing and Moscow move to seal an aviation-industrial partnership.

    This week should provide the first real fireworks in the celebration of a new Eurasian century-in-the-making when Russian President Vladimir Putin drops in on Chinese President Xi Jinping in Beijing.

    You remember "Pipelineistan," all those crucial oil and gas pipelines crisscrossing Eurasia that make up the true circulatory system for the life of the region. Now, it looks like the ultimate Pipelineistan deal, worth US$1 trillion and 10 years in the making, will be signed off on as well. In it, the giant, state-controlled Russian energy giant Gazprom will agree to supply the giant state-controlled China National Petroleum Corporation (CNPC) with 3.75 billion cubic feet of liquefied natural gas a day for no less than 30 years, starting in 2018. That's the equivalent of a quarter of Russia's gas exports to all of Europe. China's present daily gas demand is around 16 billion cubic feet a day, and imports account for 31.6% of total consumption.

    Gazprom may still collect the bulk of its profits from Europe, but Asia could turn out to be its Everest. The company will use this mega-deal to boost investment in Eastern Siberia and the whole region will be reconfigured as a privileged gas hub for Japan and South Korea as well. If you want to know why no key country in Asia has been willing to "isolate" Russia in the midst of the Ukrainian crisis - and in defiance of the Obama administration - look no further than Pipelineistan.

    Exit the Petrodollar, enter the Gas-o-Yuan
    And then, talking about anxiety in Washington, there's the fate of the petrodollar to consider, or rather the "thermonuclear" possibility that Moscow and Beijing will agree on payment for the Gazprom-CNPC deal not in petrodollars but in Chinese yuan.

    One can hardly imagine a more tectonic shift, with Pipelineistan intersecting with a growing Sino-Russian political-economic-energy partnership. Along with it goes the future possibility of a push, led again by China and Russia, toward a new international reserve currency - actually a basket of currencies - that would supersede the dollar (at least in the optimistic dreams of BRICS members).

    Right after the potentially game-changing Sino-Russian summit comes a BRICS summit in Brazil in July. That's when a $100 billion BRICS development bank, announced in 2012, will officially be born as a potential alternative to the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank as a source of project financing for the developing world.

    More BRICS cooperation meant to bypass the dollar is reflected in the "Gas-o-yuan", as in natural gas bought and paid for in Chinese currency. Gazprom is even considering marketing bonds in yuan as part of the financial planning for its expansion. Yuan-backed bonds are already trading in Hong Kong, Singapore, London, and most recently Frankfurt.

    Nothing could be more sensible for the new Pipelineistan deal than to have it settled in yuan. Beijing would pay Gazprom in that currency (convertible into roubles); Gazprom would accumulate the yuan; Russia would then buy myriad made-in-China goods and services in yuan convertible into roubles.

    It's common knowledge that banks in Hong Kong, from Standard Chartered to HSBC - as well as others closely linked to China via trade deals - have been diversifying into the yuan, which implies that it could become one of the de facto global reserve currencies even before it's fully convertible. (Beijing is unofficially working for a fully convertible yuan by 2018.)

    The Russia-China gas deal is inextricably tied up with the energy relationship between the European Union and Russia. After all, the bulk of Russia's gross domestic product comes from oil and gas sales, as does much of its leverage in the Ukraine crisis. In turn, Germany depends on Russia for a hefty 30% of its natural gas supplies. Yet Washington's geopolitical imperatives - spiced up with Polish hysteria - have meant pushing Brussels to find ways to "punish" Moscow in the future energy sphere (while not imperiling present day energy relationships).

    There's a consistent rumble in Brussels these days about the possible cancellation of the projected 16 billion euro (US$22 billion) South Stream pipeline, whose construction is to start in June. On completion, it would pump yet more Russian natural gas to Europe - in this case, underneath the Black Sea (bypassing Ukraine) to Bulgaria, Hungary, Slovenia, Serbia, Croatia, Greece, Italy, and Austria.

    Bulgaria, Hungary, and the Czech Republic have already made it clear that they are firmly opposed to any cancellation, and cancellation is probably not in the cards. After all, the only obvious alternative is Caspian Sea gas from Azerbaijan, and that isn't likely to happen unless the EU develops its own construction projects.

    In any case, Azerbaijan doesn't have enough capacity to supply the levels of natural gas needed, and other actors like Kazakhstan, plagued with infrastructure problems, or unreliable Turkmenistan, which prefers to sell its gas to China, are already largely out of the picture. And don't forget that South Stream, coupled with subsidiary energy projects, will create a lot of jobs and investment in many of the most economically devastated EU nations.

    Nonetheless, such EU threats, however unrealistic, only serve to accelerate Russia's increasing symbiosis with Asian markets. For Beijing especially, it's a win-win situation. After all, between energy supplied across seas policed and controlled by the US Navy and steady, stable land routes out of Siberia, it's no contest.

    Pick your own Silk Road
    Of course, the US dollar remains the top global reserve currency, involving 33% of global foreign exchange holdings at the end of 2013, according to the IMF. It was, however, at 55% in 2000. Nobody knows the percentage in yuan (and Beijing isn't talking), but the IMF notes that reserves in "other currencies" in emerging markets have been up 400% since 2003.

    The Federal Reserve is arguably monetizing 70% of the US government debt in an attempt to keep interest rates from heading skywards. Pentagon adviser Jim Rickards, as well as every Hong Kong-based banker, tends to believe that the Fed is bust (though they won't say it on the record). No one can even imagine the extent of the possible future deluge the US dollar might experience amid a $1.4 quadrillion Mount Ararat of financial derivatives.

    Don't think that this is the death knell of Western capitalism, however, just the faltering of that reigning economic faith, neoliberalism, still the official ideology of the United States, the overwhelming majority of the European Union, and parts of Asia and South America.

    As far as what might be called the "authoritarian neoliberalism" of the Middle Kingdom, what's not to like at the moment? China has proven that there is a result-oriented alternative to the Western "democratic" capitalist model for nations aiming to be successful. It's building not one, but myriad new Silk Roads, far-reaching webs of high-speed railways, highways, pipelines, ports, and fiber-optic networks across huge parts of Eurasia. These include a Southeast Asian road, a Central Asian road, an Indian Ocean "maritime highway" and even a high-speed rail line through Iran and Turkey reaching all the way to Germany.

    In April, when President Xi Jinping visited the city of Duisburg on the Rhine River, with the world's largest inland harbor and right in the heartland of Germany's Ruhr steel industry, he made an audacious proposal: a new "economic Silk Road" should be built between China and Europe, on the basis of the Chongqing-Xinjiang-Europe railway, which already runs from China to Kazakhstan, to continue through Russia, Belarus, Poland, and finally Germany. That's 15 days by train, 20 less than for cargo ships sailing from China's eastern seaboard. Now that would represent the ultimate geopolitical earthquake in terms of integrating economic growth across Eurasia.

    Keep in mind that, if no bubbles burst, China is about to become - and remain - the number one global economic power, a position it enjoyed for 18 of the past 20 centuries. But don't tell London hagiographers; they still believe that US hegemony will last, well, forever.

    Take me to Cold War 2.0
    Despite recent serious financial struggles, the BRICS countries have been consciously working to become a counterforce to the original and - having tossed Russia out in March - once again Group of 7, or G-7. They are eager to create a global architecture to replace the one first imposed in the wake of World War II, and they see themselves as a potential challenge to the exceptionalist and unipolar world that Washington imagines for our future (with itself as the global robocop and NATO as its robo-police force). Historian and imperialist cheerleader Ian Morris, in his book War! What is it Good For?, defines the US as the ultimate "globocop" and "the last best hope of Earth". If that globocop "wearies of its role", he writes, "there is no plan B".

    Well, there is a plan BRICS - or so the BRICS nations would like to think, at least. And when the BRICS do act in this spirit on the global stage, they quickly conjure up a curious mix of fear, hysteria, and pugnaciousness in the Washington establishment.

    Take Christopher Hill as an example. The former assistant secretary of state for East Asia and US ambassador to Iraq is now an advisor with the Albright Stonebridge Group, a consulting firm deeply connected to the White House and the State Department. When Russia was down and out, Hill used to dream of a hegemonic American "new world order". Now that the ungrateful Russians have spurned what "the West has been offering" - that is, "special status with NATO, a privileged relationship with the European Union, and partnership in international diplomatic endeavors" - they are, in his view, busy trying to revive the Soviet empire. Translation: if you're not our vassals, you're against us. Welcome to Cold War 2.0.

    The Pentagon has its own version of this directed not so much at Russia as at China, which, its think tank on future warfare claims, is already at war with Washington in a number of ways. So if it's not apocalypse now, it's Armageddon tomorrow. And it goes without saying that whatever's going wrong, as the Obama administration very publicly "pivots" to Asia and the American media fills with talk about a revival of Cold War-era "containment policy" in the Pacific, it's all China's fault.

    Embedded in the mad dash toward Cold War 2.0 are some ludicrous facts-on-the-ground: the US government, with $17.5 trillion in national debt and counting, is contemplating a financial showdown with Russia, the largest global energy producer and a major nuclear power, just as it's also promoting an economically unsustainable military encirclement of its largest creditor, China.

    Russia runs a sizeable trade surplus. Humongous Chinese banks will have no trouble helping Russian banks out if Western funds dry up. In terms of inter-BRICS cooperation, few projects beat a $30 billion oil pipeline in the planning stages that will stretch from Russia to India via Northwest China.

    Chinese companies are already eagerly discussing the possibility of taking part in the creation of a transport corridor from Russia into Crimea, as well as an airport, shipyard, and liquid natural gas terminal there. And there's another "thermonuclear" gambit in the making: the birth of a natural gas equivalent to the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries that would include Russia, Iran, and reportedly disgruntled US ally Qatar.

    The (unstated) BRICS long-term plan involves the creation of an alternative economic system featuring a basket of gold-backed currencies that would bypass the present America-centric global financial system. (No wonder Russia and China are amassing as much gold as they can.) The euro - a sound currency backed by large liquid bond markets and huge gold reserves - would be welcomed in as well.

    It's no secret in Hong Kong that the Bank of China has been using a parallel SWIFT network to conduct every kind of trade with Tehran, which is under a heavy US sanctions regime. With Washington wielding Visa and MasterCard as weapons in a growing Cold War-style economic campaign against Russia, Moscow is about to implement an alternative payment and credit card system not controlled by Western finance. An even easier route would be to adopt the Chinese Union Pay system, whose operations have already overtaken American Express in global volume.

    I'm just pivoting with myself
    No amount of Obama administration "pivoting" to Asia to contain China (and threaten it with US Navy control of the energy sea lanes to that country) is likely to push Beijing far from its Deng Xiaoping-inspired, self-described "peaceful development" strategy meant to turn it into a global powerhouse of trade.

    Nor are the forward deployment of US or NATO troops in Eastern Europe or other such Cold-War-ish acts likely to deter Moscow from a careful balancing act: ensuring that Russia's sphere of influence in Ukraine remains strong without compromising trade and commercial, as well as political, ties with the European Union - above all, with strategic partner Germany. This is Moscow's Holy Grail; a free-trade zone from Lisbon to Vladivostok, which (not by accident) is mirrored in China's dream of a new Silk Road to Germany.

    Increasingly wary of Washington, Berlin for its part abhors the notion of Europe being caught in the grips of a Cold War 2.0. German leaders have more important fish to fry, including trying to stabilize a wobbly EU while warding off an economic collapse in southern and central Europe and the advance of ever more extreme rightwing parties.

    On the other side of the Atlantic, President Obama and his top officials show every sign of becoming entangled in their own pivoting - to Iran, to China, to Russia's eastern borderlands, and (under the radar) to Africa. The irony of all these military-first maneuvers is that they are actually helping Moscow, Tehran, and Beijing build up their own strategic depth in Eurasia and elsewhere, as reflected in Syria, or crucially in ever more energy deals. They are also helping cement the growing strategic partnership between China and Iran. The unrelenting Ministry of Truth narrative out of Washington about all these developments now carefully ignores the fact that, without Moscow, the "West" would never have sat down to discuss a final nuclear deal with Iran or gotten a chemical disarmament agreement out of Damascus.

    When the disputes between China and its neighbors in the South China Sea and between that country and Japan over the Senkaku/Diaoyou islands meet the Ukraine crisis, the inevitable conclusion will be that both Russia and China consider their borderlands and sea lanes private property and aren't going to take challenges quietly - be it via NATO expansion, US military encirclement, or missile shields. Neither Beijing nor Moscow is bent on the usual form of imperialist expansion, despite the version of events now being fed to Western publics. Their "red lines" remain essentially defensive in nature, no matter the bluster sometimes involved in securing them.

    Whatever Washington may want or fear or try to prevent, the facts on the ground suggest that, in the years ahead, Beijing, Moscow, and Tehran will only grow closer, slowly but surely creating a new geopolitical axis in Eurasia. Meanwhile, a discombobulated America seems to be aiding and abetting the deconstruction of its own unipolar world order, while offering the BRICS a genuine window of opportunity to try to change the rules of the game.

    Russia and China in pivot mode
    In Washington's think-tank land, the conviction that the Obama administration should be focused on replaying the Cold War via a new version of containment policy to "limit the development of Russia as a hegemonic power" has taken hold. The recipe: weaponize the neighbors from the Baltic states to Azerbaijan to "contain" Russia. Cold War 2.0 is on because, from the point of view of Washington's elites, the first one never really left town.

    Yet as much as the US may fight the emergence of a multipolar, multi-powered world, economic facts on the ground regularly point to such developments. The question remains: will the decline of the hegemon be slow and reasonably dignified, or will the whole world be dragged down with it in what has been called "the Samson option"?

    While we watch the spectacle unfold, with no end-game in sight, keep in mind that a new force is growing in Eurasia, with the Sino-Russian strategic alliance threatening to dominate its heartland along with great stretches of its inner rim. Now, that's a nightmare of Mackinderesque proportions from Washington's point of view. Think, for instance, of how Zbigniew Brzezinski, the former national security adviser who became a mentor on global politics to President Obama, would see it.

    In his 1997 book The Grand Chessboard, Brzezinski argued that "the struggle for global primacy [would] continue to be played" on the Eurasian "chessboard", of which "Ukraine was a geopolitical pivot". "If Moscow regains control over Ukraine," he wrote at the time, Russia would "automatically regain the wherewithal to become a powerful imperial state, spanning Europe and Asia."

    That remains most of the rationale behind the American imperial containment policy - from Russia's European "near abroad" to the South China Sea. Still, with no end-game in sight, keep your eye on Russia pivoting to Asia, China pivoting across the world, and the BRICS hard at work trying to bring about the new Eurasian Century.

    http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/CHIN-01-190514.html

    http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/CHIN-02-190514.html
    avatar
    zg18

    Posts : 883
    Points : 955
    Join date : 2013-09-26
    Location : Zagreb , Croatia

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  zg18 on Wed May 21, 2014 12:37 am

    Austin wrote:Looks like after all the hype of Putin visit and Gas deal 99 % done ,No Gazprom-China Gas deal was signed , Sad  Sad

    Oil deals with China are financially more important and in that sense Russia is covered , gas business has more politics and such deals are meant to be cornerstone of relations for decades to come so it`s not important if deal is signed few months sooner or later due to long-termity.
    avatar
    Viktor

    Posts : 5641
    Points : 6274
    Join date : 2009-08-25
    Age : 37
    Location : Croatia

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Viktor on Wed May 21, 2014 9:39 am

    And the gas deal with China is sealed !!!!!!  russia  thumbsup 

    ​Russia and China seal historic multibillion gas deal

    Austin

    Posts : 6826
    Points : 7215
    Join date : 2010-05-08
    Location : India

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Austin on Wed May 21, 2014 10:58 am

    Finally its done  attack  attack  attack 

    Russia and China seal historic $400bn gas deal
    avatar
    macedonian

    Posts : 1072
    Points : 1101
    Join date : 2013-04-28
    Location : Skopje, Macedonia - Скопје, Македонија

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  macedonian on Wed May 21, 2014 12:16 pm

    Woooohooooooo!!!

     russia russia russia 

    Take THAT m*#@!ers (and puppets)!
    avatar
    Viktor

    Posts : 5641
    Points : 6274
    Join date : 2009-08-25
    Age : 37
    Location : Croatia

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Viktor on Wed May 21, 2014 1:28 pm

    Total success  russia  russia  russia 


    The price of gas in the contract with China - a success for Russia, experts say

    "The final agreed price, presumably closer to the one on which Russia insisted, than the one that was willing to pay China. Instead, it was decided to abandon the idea of ​​a mandatory prepayment. Supply high price reflects China's willingness to pay more for cleaner fuel "- said in a pre-trial detention IHS, published in Shanghai after signing gas agreement.


    Russian gas price for China exceeds $ 350 per thousand cubic meters


    Judge base price under the contract "Gazprom" and CNPC - $ 380-390 per 1 thousand cubic meters
    avatar
    medo

    Posts : 3355
    Points : 3439
    Join date : 2010-10-24
    Location : Slovenia

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  medo on Wed May 21, 2014 2:31 pm

    Good business for both Russia and China. Some advantages for both parties:

    - There is no transit countries between them, so no loses for transit payment.
    - Payments will be directly between Chinese and Russian banks, so no loses for payments through financial centers like New York or London.
    - Payments will be in Rubles and Yuans, so no loses with changing of currencies as with buying and selling Dollars for payments.
    - This is the beginning of petroRuble and petroYuan, so their value will rise comparing to Euro and Dollar and will become the World's reserve currencies. They will buy more gold, which will rise against Euro and Dollar for back up of their currencies.

    This is the proper answer to US sanctions. Obama **** bricks now.
    avatar
    mack8

    Posts : 953
    Points : 1009
    Join date : 2013-08-02

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  mack8 on Wed May 21, 2014 3:59 pm

    Excellent news. In my opinion together China and Russia ARE invincible and they can crush (in whatever way necessary, economic or other) the US neo-empire. Oh you can bet the yankee bastards are working overtime to create intrigue between China and Russia (divide and conquer, remember), it is critical that China and Russia are aware of that and always be on guard for it, and even folks like us can play a small part in that, whenever we see " peoples" (most likely sock-puppets) promoting antagonism and distrust between Russia and China, stomp on them!

    Russia and China together with the allied countries, even if relatively few, have the potential to become a gigantic euro-asian powerhouse far exceeding the US block if they play their cards right. They really should try to get India into this too, the antagonism between India and China only serve US interests. The yanks will really be finished then! (and from my point of view, the weaker the bastards the better the chance of Europe finally shaking the US dominance and going our own way- which like i said, could and should bring  cordial and mutually  beneficial relations with Russia and the euro-asian block, rather than antagonism. Antagonism doesn't serve anyone over here).
    avatar
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 4471
    Points : 4630
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed May 21, 2014 6:09 pm

    Viktor wrote:And the gas deal with China is sealed !!!!!!   russia  thumbsup 

    ​Russia and China seal historic multibillion gas deal

    A true game-changing event in the long term geo-political stratagem for Eurasia and the world, the Pentagon's Hail Mary scenario of a "Great Siberian War of 2030" looks less-and-less likely by the day.
    avatar
    macedonian

    Posts : 1072
    Points : 1101
    Join date : 2013-04-28
    Location : Skopje, Macedonia - Скопје, Македонија

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  macedonian on Wed May 21, 2014 9:45 pm

    mack8 wrote:Excellent news. In my opinion together China and Russia ARE invincible and they can crush (in whatever way necessary, economic or other) the US neo-empire. Oh you can bet the yankee bastards are working overtime to create intrigue between China and Russia (divide and conquer, remember), it is critical that China and Russia are aware of that and always be on guard for it, and even folks like us can play a small part in that, whenever we see " peoples" (most likely sock-puppets) promoting antagonism and distrust between Russia and China, stomp on them!

    Russia and China together with the allied countries, even if relatively few, have the potential to become a gigantic euro-asian powerhouse far exceeding the US block if they play their cards right. They really should try to get India into this too, the antagonism between India and China only serve US interests. The yanks will really be finished then! (and from my point of view, the weaker the bastards the better the chance of Europe finally shaking the US dominance and going our own way- which like i said, could and should bring  cordial and mutually  beneficial relations with Russia and the euro-asian block, rather than antagonism. Antagonism doesn't serve anyone over here).

    Sh*t, now look at what you've posted! Now I have to go and agree with you!!! Very Happy ...then again..WHEN THE FACTS SPEAK, EVEN THE GODS ARE SILENT...I guess
    Don't want to spoil this hippie mood with what I really think of this 'United Europe' you cherish so much, so I best keep silent on that matter...

    Firebird

    Posts : 984
    Points : 1008
    Join date : 2011-10-14

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Firebird on Thu May 22, 2014 10:47 am

    It will be interesting to see how all this works its way out.

    1)Will Russia and the CIS start supplying less/higher priced to Europe?
    2)How will Russia supply other places? Will it produce more for them? Or perhaps supply less to other places?
    3)How will the Ru-China relat develop?
    In particular in military and tech transfer matters. Hopefully there wont be any substantial tech transfer.
    4)Will Russia really look to develop India, ASEAN and perhaps EU relats as a counterbalance to China?
    5)Finally, I wonder if the EU will think "Oh shit, we will have to treat Russia better from now on.."

    America, BTW I think is a lost cause, and infact I think the "America is a mincing rascal" is one of the best comments in recent times from a politician". Very Happy

    My preferred closest partners for Russia would in many ways be India and the EU. Former for military issues, latter for cultural.
    However, China is where the money is. I just hope Russia doesnt get over-seduced and let its eye off other issues.

    Asf

    Posts : 472
    Points : 491
    Join date : 2014-03-27

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Asf on Thu May 22, 2014 11:04 am

    There is an american geo-political theory of the Hearthland of Eurasia, it says those who control Syberia and China's territory dominates on the eastern hemisphere. So Russo-China treaty is a thing USA fears in the first place.
    avatar
    George1

    Posts : 11932
    Points : 12409
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  George1 on Thu May 22, 2014 10:15 pm

    Alexey Miller: Russia and China signed the biggest contract in the entire history of Gazprom

    Alexey Miller, Chairman of the Company's Management Committee and Zhou Jiping, Chairman of China National Petroleum Corporation (CNPC) signed today a contract to supply pipeline gas from Russia to China via the eastern route. The parties signed the document in the presence of Russian President Vladimir Putin and Chinese President Xi Jinping in Shanghai.
    In presence of Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping, Alexey Miller and Zhou Jiping sign contract to supply gas to China via eastern route.

    The 30-year contract stipulates that 38 billion cubic meters of Russian gas will be annually supplied to China. The mutually beneficial contract contains such major provisions as the price formula linked to oil prices and the 'take-or-pay' clause.
    In presence of Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping, Alexey Miller and Zhou Jiping sign contract to supply gas to China via eastern route. Photo by RIA Novosti
    Enlarged photo (JPG, 328 KB)

    “Russia and China have signed the biggest contract in the entire history of the USSR and Gazprom – over 1 trillion cubic meters of gas will be supplied during a whole contractual period. Russian gas will be sold at a brand new market with a huge potential.

    The arrangement of Russian pipeline gas supplies is the biggest investment project on a global scale. USD 55 billion will be invested in the construction of production and transmission facilities in Russia. An extensive gas infrastructure network will be set up in Russia's East, which will drive the local economy forward. Great impetus will be given to entire economic sectors, namely metallurgy, pipe and machine building.

    Today we started the first page of a big book, a fascinating story of the Russian-Chinese cooperation in the gas industry, and many more essential chapters are yet to be written in it,” said Alexey Miller.
    avatar
    George1

    Posts : 11932
    Points : 12409
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  George1 on Sat Jun 07, 2014 10:59 pm

    Russia, China Should Boost Potential of Regional Organizations – Russian Security Council

    BEIJING, June 6 (RIA Novosti) - Multiple challenges force Russia and China to develop not only bilateral cooperation formats and mechanisms of cooperation with Central Asian states, but also to boost the potential of regional organizations, especially the CSTO and SCO, Secretary of the Russian Security Council Secretary Nikolai Patrushev said.

    "There is a growing need to accelerate the implementation of the initiative of Russian President [Vladimir Putin] to establish a universal center to counter modern challenges and threats to security on the basis of the SCO (Shanghai Cooperation Organization) Regional Counterterrorist Structure. We are grateful to China for its support of our efforts in this direction," Patrushev said on Friday after the 10th round of Russian-Chinese consultations on strategic security.

    The Afghan factor and its impact on regional security was also touched upon during the talks, Patrushev noted. "I am convinced that the military presence of extra-regional forces in Central Asia should be linked with the objectives of stabilization efforts in Afghanistan. The necessity for such a presence, and even more so for its spread to Central Asia, should cease to exist in the course of the formation of the national armed forces, security and law enforcement agencies in Afghanistan," Patrushev clarified.

    The increased activity of the terrorist groups in Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region of China in recent months is not accidental, according to the secretary of the Russian Security Council. "We have expressed our condolences to our Chinese friends concerning the tragic terrorist attacks that occurred in this autonomous region of China," Patrushev said.

    Founded in 2001, the Beijing-based SCO comprises Russia, China, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan. Afghanistan, India, Iran, Mongolia and Pakistan have observer status in the political and military organization.

    The Collective Security Treaty Organization (CSTO) is a military alliance of former Soviet states; it comprises Armenia, Belarus, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Russia, Uzbekistan and Tajikistan.

    On May 23, Russian Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu announced at the International Security Conference that Russia decided to strengthen its military bases abroad as well as to help to boost the armed forces of the CSTO and the SCO.

    Sponsored content

    Re: Sino-Russian relations:

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Wed Sep 26, 2018 1:36 pm