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    Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

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    Vladimir79
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    Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Vladimir79 on Tue Aug 25, 2009 5:22 pm

    In Russia are hypersonic tactical missile
    25/08/2009

    Russia is close to the creation of military vehicles that can travel at hypersonic speeds, said CEO of Tactical Missiles "Boris Obnossov. "I do not want to reveal all the secrets, but we are in this area are working hard and I think in the near future, the results appear," - said Boris Obnosov reporters at the air show MAKS-2009. He noted that on this subject in Russia "there is some hurt, and do not have to waste time." B. Obnosov likened the subject of significance "with the launch of the first man in space and the conquest of the Moon. "The achievement of these goals was sent to all the power of the Soviet Union and the United States with all their allies," - said Boris Obnossov. According to him, hypersound - "is a topic that will help the technologically and technically to achieve new goals in creating new types of weapons, materials, engines, fuel and so on."

    Права на данный материал принадлежат Время и Деньги (Казань).

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Viktor on Wed Aug 26, 2009 12:14 am

    This was taken from MAKS-2009



    Vladimir79
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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Aug 26, 2009 12:26 am

    Thanks for the photos. Soon we will be able to kill Wahhabis in seconds. sniper

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Stealthflanker on Wed Aug 26, 2009 1:38 pm

    well good at least i know Russian still make progress in the field... the GELA and Grom would still have a successor..

    hey Viktor.. what's the name of those cuties on your photos

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Viktor on Wed Aug 26, 2009 2:09 pm

    Dont know its name and can not see it from the picture but thiese are for sure relatively new projects revealed only now so will hear about them thats for sure.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Aug 26, 2009 2:51 pm

    Stealthflanker wrote:well good at least i know Russian still make progress in the field... the GELA and Grom would still have a successor..

    hey Viktor.. what's the name of those cuties on your photos

    That display is from the Central Institute of Aviation Motors. The prototype is called GLL "Igla" if IIRC. I didn't stick around in that pavilion too long.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Viktor on Wed Aug 26, 2009 5:07 pm

    That display is from the Central Institute of Aviation Motors. The prototype is called GLL "Igla" if IIRC. I didn't stick around in that pavilion too long.[/quote]

    That Igla thing was severally tested throwout 90ies.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Aug 26, 2009 6:00 pm

    Viktor wrote:

    That Igla thing was severally tested throwout 90ies.

    Its still on the website...

    http://www.ciam.ru/?SId=322&lang=RUS

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  GarryB on Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:47 am

    CIAM builds Europe’s largest bench for testing hypersonic engines


    DATELINE: MOSCOW April 22

    The Central Institute of Aviation Motors (CIAM) started up Europe’s largest bench for testing hypersonic engines in late March, Institute First Deputy General Director Valentin Solonin told Interfax-AVN on Wednesday.

    “The test bench is a part of the National Technological Modernization project. The construction started in 2007,” he said.

    “We intend to increase the capacity of the test bench. It can test samples of up to three meters now, but our goal is to test full-size samples in the future,” he said.

    The test bench can imitate Mach 6 conditions, Solonin said.

    Source: Interfax-AVN

    That should make testing a faster Brahmos much easier... Very Happy

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Vladimir79 on Sun Apr 25, 2010 1:18 pm

    The French like the CIAM facility. They use it to test their supersonic designs.

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    Russia lags behind in the development of a hypersonic weapon: Rogozin

    Post  Austin on Fri May 11, 2012 7:33 pm

    Rogozin considers the development in the U.S. hypersonic weapon dangerous to the Russian Federation

    "We understand that subjective decisions were taken (in the development of a hypersonic weapons), decision of the supreme political leadership of that time, the late 1980s, when the most advanced design of hypersonic were just artificially stopped. I can not, sorry to call another as a betrayal of national interests, "- he said during a visit to the state machine design bureau" Rainbow "name Bereznyak.

    "Today, unfortunately, we see a substantial backlog of Russia in this area. And as we saw today, it's not just about the dramatic factors that, in general, the impact on the state of industry, defense, national security, the disintegration of the Soviet Union" - Rogozin added.

    He said that the development of a long flight in the atmosphere at hypersonic speeds (5 to 6 times the speed of sound) - is a fundamental and qualitative leap in the air and rocket, which will create a highly efficient weapon, having a fundamentally new properties.

    "Samples of hypersonic weapons will significantly increase the effectiveness of combat weapons by increasing the speed, invulnerability, providing modern and advanced systems capture, range expansion of the range and altitude, as well as increasing the kinetic energy of the destructive elements" - said the acting deputy prime minister.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  GarryB on Sat May 12, 2012 9:02 am

    The US has a global empire to scare with military force.

    It makes sense for them to invest in such weapon technology.

    I would be disappointed if Russia was way ahead in these technologies... because while useful in certain fields there are more practical and less destabilising things they can spend their money on.

    Education and health are two important areas that would always benefit from investment and the results should be improved living standards and improved social situation in Russia... rather more beneficial than some high speed missiles that emulate ICBMs but don't follow ballistic paths.

    Being at the leading edge of technology is expensive and often dangerous, and offers a very short window of an advantage. Sometimes those that follow can examine your experience and avoid your mistakes completely... a good example is the US Space Shuttle and the Soviet Buran.

    The former was an example of how to make something that was supposed to save money really really expensive. In comparison the Buran was much simpler and cheaper and much more efficient. The only problem with Buran was that at the time they didn't actually need it.

    In many ways the US space shuttle was a one week space station that they could do experiments on... the huge irony is that if the cold war had continued and the US had decided to go to mars the US crews would likely have died because one week in a space shuttle gives you a very false impression about the effects of the long term effects of zero gravity.

    I remember seeing a US documentary where a US astronaut had been told by the Russians that after several months in space you are like a little baby and can't stand up on your own. In his words he suspected it was inferior Russian food and he also believed that superior US exercises would allow him to stand up and walk out of the capsule when it landed and he could show these Russians about US superiority in medicine and nutrition and their general superiority.

    Anyway when it came time to land he felt fine and when the capsule came to a stop he went to open his belt and found he couldn't lift his hand.

    It was then he realised that his cockyness, which was shared by fellow Americans, probably would have cost lives if they had sent astronauts to Mars because the period of zero gravity would have been much longer. In fact there is a good chance that the deceleration rockets probably would have broken bones...

    Another aspect is that... isn't this the same guy that said Russian tanks were rubbish and basically T-34s?

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  GarryB on Sat May 12, 2012 9:14 am

    BTW I think it is significant who the audience was... Rainbow... make cruise missiles, anti radiation missiles and anti ship missiles...

    Specifically they make Kh-58 AS-11 missiles, Kh-59M AS-18 missiles, Kh-55 AS-15 Kent missiles, and Kh-22M AS-6 missiles...

    I expect that after this pep talk suddenly a new product will be revealed that takes back the lead in hypersonic missiles... ie either a 1,000km range replacement for Onyx/Kh-22M/Granit, or something else.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Austin on Sat May 12, 2012 10:15 am

    GarryB wrote:Another aspect is that... isn't this the same guy that said Russian tanks were rubbish and basically T-34s?

    That was the General Staff Makarov and the Russian Army Chief.

    Infact Rogozin snubbed the General Staff when he said we dont need T-90 and Rogozin said that it was not just he who made such decisions and told him to shut up.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Austin on Sat May 12, 2012 10:17 am

    Hypersonic Weapons are needed , does not matter if US has it or not .....its just a logical step forward from supersonic weapon.

    Lets hope when he says behind they are not far behind and have some thing in development individually or jointly with India which shows up soon.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  GarryB on Sun May 13, 2012 2:07 am

    I still see it as a bit of a pep talk, which if backed up with money will probably lead to a few new weapons being revealed.

    Hypersonic weapons are hardly new... S-200, S-300, S-300V, S-400 and S-500 are all hypersonic weapons and are able to intercept targets flying at hypersonic speeds.

    The next Russian bomber will not be hypersonic as that would be too expensive...

    I rather suspect the only hypersonic things the Russians actually could use are long range anti ship and land attack missiles and ICBM/SLBM warheads... and we know they are already working on those.

    The technology will need a decade or so to mature before we see practical manned hypersonic aircraft... if not more.

    UAV and UCAVs might be interesting applications for hypersonic engine technology too... you can build a nuclear bomb the size of a 152mm artillery shell, so making an FAB-50 sized nuke should not be a big problem... a long sleek UCAV able to fly at mach 10 that can be filled with 1 ton of TN-50s (ie 20 nukes) that could be released as it flys along would be a very potent strategic weapon... Even in conventional warfare a 50kg bomb should be sufficient for most targets if accuracy is good enough and with Glonass guided weapons for the most part it should be.

    Hypersonic Weapons are needed , does not matter if US has it or not .....its just a logical step forward from supersonic weapon.

    The Soviets wasted a lot of money matching the US and then having to work out what to do with what they made...

    Russia needs to look at what it needs and wants and then decide what to do. Development of scramjets will be useful for a range of applications and the potential for a space plane would make such development directions useful too, but a hypersonic strategic bomber is ridiculous... there is no point racing to your enemies territory so your bombers arrive at the same time as your ICBMs or SLBMs or perhaps even before they do to a fully operational air defence network.

    Reducing the cost of getting to space on the other hand would be a very valuable goal.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Sujoy on Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:39 pm

    Sivathanu Pillai, chief executive officer of the Russia-India joint venture BrahMos Aerospace said in Moscow yesterday that the BRAHMOS hypersonic missile would be ready for flight testing in 2017.The new missiles would be capable of flying at speeds of Mach 5-Mach 7.The new missile will be made in three variants — ground-launched, airborne, and sea-launched.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  GarryB on Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:33 am

    The real step forward for Brahmos II is the engines.

    Going from Ramjet to Scramjet is like moving from propeller to turbojet engine.

    The difference is that when going from propeller to jet engine the barrier was the speed of sound that required quite a few design changes to aircraft to allow supersonic flight... further development of jet engines improved power and fuel efficiency to the point where supersonic speed became possible.

    With Scramjets the barrier is the heat barrier.

    Most jet engines choke on supersonic airflow... the fire goes out and a jet engine with no fire is no longer an engine... it is dead weight.

    A Scramjet engine or supersonic combustion jet engine can burn fuel supersonically which means there is no practical upper limit to their potential flight speed up to and beyond speeds needed to leave the atmosphere.

    On a conventional supersonic aircraft like the Mig-31 there is a complex air intake system that can open and close to change the air flow to the engine. On takeoff or during low speed flight the intake is opened wide to allow the maximum amount of air into the engine to produce thrust. At high speed however the intake is narrowed to reduce the amount of air going into the air intake so less air enters and as it enters it expands and slows down to subsonic speed before it hits the engine... even at mach 2.83.

    The SR-71 uses a different trick to fly fast... very simply there are air tubes that go around the engine so when it is flying at very high speed only a tiny amount of air goes through the engines and the vast majority bypasses the engines but with fuel added it acts like a ramjet engine.

    With a Mig-31 or Mig-25 the limit on top speed is the engines... if you replaced those big engines with smaller more efficient jet engines but had a scramjet down the aircraft centreline and used the turbojet engines to get airborne and to altitude and then closed off their intakes and opened the scramjet intake then your flight speed would become airframe limited... and that is mainly due to the heat barrier... the temperature at which you aircraft or scramjet engines components lose their structural integrity because of temperature.


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    Russian missiles 'Super-Holding' to Build Hypersonic Missile

    Post  George1 on Wed Sep 19, 2012 2:26 pm

    Russian 'Super-Holding' to Build Hypersonic Missile -Rogozin

    Russia will set up an aerospace "super-holding" company consisting of missile makers NPO Mashinostroyenie and Tactical Missiles Corporation to develop hypersonic weapon technology, Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin said on Wednesday.

    "Initially, we are talking about a big 'super-holding' based on Tactical Missiles Corporation and NPO Mashinostroyenie," said Rogozin, who oversees Russia's military-industrial complex.

    Discussions on the creation of such a super-holding have been underway at least six months, Rogozin said.

    "We have found an acceptable solution on how to form this super-holding," he said. "The main idea for this holding is hypersonic technology."

    Development of hypersonic weapons - meaning those capable of flying at several times the speed of sound, generally with scramjet engines - has been a pet theme of Rogozin.

    In May, during a visit to Tactical Missiles Corporation's NPO Raduga missile design bureau, Rogozin called on Russia's defense industry to develop hypersonic air-breathing weapons as a future strike system.

    He picked out American development work in the X-51, Falcon, HiFire and HyFly programs as examples of what he described as the perspective threat posed by U.S. hypersonic development work.

    "The undertaking of this work allows us to lay the basis for the creation of a national competitor in hypersonic weapons," he said.

    He has since frequently repeated his call for hypersonic weapons to be developed as a replacement for the Russian Air Force's existing long-range bomber fleet.

    "I think we need to go down the route of hypersonic technology and we are moving in that direction and are not falling behind the Americans," he said on Rossiya 24 TV in August. "We will use this technology when developing a new bomber."

    "The question is whether we will copy the Americans' forty-year experience and create a [Northrop] B-2 analog...or will we go down a new, ultramodern technology route, looking to the horizon, and create a machine able to penetrate air defenses and carry out a strike on any aggressor," he added.

    Aerospace analysts contacted by RIA Novosti say hypersonic technology is more likely to be relevant to an air-launched weapon itself, rather than a manned aircraft.

    Tactical Missiles Corporation, based in Korolyov, Moscow Region, was formed in 2002 by amalgamating a number of defense design and production enterprises, of which the main ones were Korolyov-based Zvezda-Strela (tactical air-to-surface missiles), Moscow-based Vympel (tactical air-to-air missiles), NPO Raduga (cruise missile design), and Region (tactical air-launched weapons).

    NPO Mashinostroyenie, based at Reutov just west of Moscow, has designed and produced most of the Russian Navy's submarine-launched cruise missiles as well as satellites and other space systems, and has previously conducted extensive research into hypersonic weapons technology, including making a prototype hypersonic air-launched missile called GELA.

    NPO Mashinostroyenie is also the Russian partner in the BrahMos joint venture with India to develop the BrahMos supersonic cruise missile, based on the Russian 3M55 Oniks. BrahMos has said it is developing a hypersonic successor system to its existing supersonic missiles in partnership with India.

    http://en.rian.ru/mlitary_news/20120919/176062184.html

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Viktor on Wed Sep 19, 2012 2:52 pm

    Excellent idea. I guess Rogozin got what he wanted.

    Given vast Russian experience in development and building of such engines it would be of enormous shame

    to let those documents and project rot in some god forsaken offices. Now it will be put to good use and all in one place.

    Also there has being some speculation about privatizing some part of Russia MIC complex. New money could give further give

    it much needed boost while state will always retain dominant influence in companies.

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  GarryB on Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:10 am

    Interesting that is an aerospace super holding... hypersonic weapons and craft for air and space use...

    With a scramjet engine it is quite conceivable that it could be launched as a large subsonic weapon with enormous but expendable external fuel tanks, so for the early part of its flight it could fly subsonic with a very simple scramjet providing propulsion for the majority of the way to the target, till the external fuel is burned up... perhaps 10,000km or more on a low thrust setting launched from a relatively high altitude bomber it could cruise enormous ranges, and then the external fuel tanks fall away leaving a slim high speed aerodynamic shape and the scramjet is moved to full throttle perhaps with the assistance of a small solid rocket booster to help it climb and accelerate faster to high altitude and hypersonic speed to penetrate the enemies air defences and rapidly reach the target.

    Or alternatively you could develop a hypersonic all the way missile with a solid rocket booster and scramjet combination already used (rocket/ramjet) in Onyx.

    The problems with engine thrust and fuselage heating encountered making hypersonic weapons will be invaluable for making hypersonic Bombers later on... new engine designs and new heat resistant materials etc.



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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  Firebird on Thu Sep 20, 2012 2:27 pm

    I've been wondering about the physics of hypersonic missiles/ planes.

    Obviously one problem is propulsion or indeed multiple propulsion systems for different stages of flight.

    The next problem, which ofcourse will occur in EM railguns too, is the friction and heat caused by it passing thro the air at high speed.

    So, I wonder, how could the heat on a missile tip be conducted thro a missile and then transferred to the propulsion and cooling units?
    Currently, I think insulators are used ie something that will stop the heat spreading into the missile. But surely that is hindering the missile AND a waste of energy?

    As an analogy, with superconductors, very low ( or actually zero) electrical resistance can be found.The problem is, low temperatures need to be achieved for the superconductor to work.

    As another analogy, rockets use technology to draw heat away from various components, otherwise the rocket would melt itself.

    So getting back to my point,I wonder how could the missile draw friction heat in from the tip to enhance performance( and indeed keep the missile intact)?

    Maybe decades into the future,a technology can be developed to absorb laser energy and redirect it towards an attacker?

    BTW this was an interesting article on the problems of hypersonics.
    Skin-peeling speed doomed hypersonic glider, U.S. says
    By Larry Shaughnessy

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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  GarryB on Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:57 am

    Obviously one problem is propulsion or indeed multiple propulsion systems for different stages of flight.

    The SR-71 showed what could be done in that regard... it uses two large turbojet engines, but in a special arrangement that allows the air to bypass the turbojet engines and just pass through empty tubes to the rear where the after burner is.

    An empty tube with an afterburner on the end is called a ramjet, where air is sucked in and compressed and then fuel is added and ignited generating thrust.

    So you simply use the turbojet engine to get the aircraft into the air and put it in full after burner and climb. As you get faster and faster you start feeding air around the turbojet till eventually all the air is going around the turbojet and you can shut the turbojets down and just run on ramjets.

    At very high speeds turbojets have problems because the rotational speeds of the blades in the engines gets so high the blades break and the engines overheat.

    So, I wonder, how could the heat on a missile tip be conducted thro a missile and then transferred to the propulsion and cooling units?
    Currently, I think insulators are used ie something that will stop the heat spreading into the missile. But surely that is hindering the missile AND a waste of energy?

    There are a few ideas... one is to use materials that remain strong when heated to high temperatures like Titanium, or ceramic materials. Another option is ablative materials like those used on the heat tiles of the Space Shuttle. Yet another option is a porous skin on the leading edge where friction with the air heats the surface, where you can pump fuel through to keep it cool. Rocket nozzles for very large missiles and space rockets use this method to keep the nozzles from melting already so it is not as far fetched as it might sound.

    Obviously there would be problems if you get a fuel blockage and the fuel stopped flowing...

    So getting back to my point,I wonder how could the missile draw friction heat in from the tip to enhance performance( and indeed keep the missile intact)?

    I rather suspect the final answer will be a combination of new heat resistent ceramic materials that use fuel to distribute heat to the fuel tank and could be used to prep the fuel before it goes to the engine.

    Maybe decades into the future,a technology can be developed to absorb laser energy and redirect it towards an attacker?

    Like a mirror? Smile



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    Russia will test an hypersonic missile this year

    Post  dino00 on Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:46 pm

    Russian Defense Ministry to set a date first full test launches promising hypersonic missile capable of speeds up to Mach Five (about 5.8 thousand kilometers per hour). According to the newspaper "Izvestia", the tests are scheduled for July and August 2013, and will be produced at the site in Akhtubinsk Astrakhan region.

    The project to create hypersonic missile secret, so neither its code, no problems, no performance characteristics are unknown. The first test launch took place at the site in Akhtubinsk in 2012, but they can not be considered full. The inspections rocket separated from the suspension plane runs its own engine, fly a few miles to subsonic speed and landing.

    The purpose of the preliminary tests was to check the throwing of control rocket in flight and its interaction with the system start-up and on-board equipment of the aircraft carrier. In the new test launch parameters will be expanded: the rocket will carry longer flights already at hypersonic speeds, and the engine will run ammunition in several modes.

    The development of hypersonic missiles actively conducted in the USSR in the 1970s, but in the 1990s, has practically disappeared. In particular, "the NGO engineering" to develop missiles "Meteorite" and the late start of work on the machine with the code "4202". ICB "Rainbow" in 1980 launched a project GELA X-90. In the 1970s, based missile system S-200 missile was created "Cold", which was able to develop a speed of six thousand miles per hour.

    Currently, "NPO engineering" is involved in a joint development with India hypersonic cruise missile "Brahmos" is capable of speeds up to five Mach numbers. In addition, the Corporation "Tactical Missiles" is engaged in the creation of missile capable of a speed exceeding the speed of sound in the 12-13 times.

    In September last year, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin announced that the country plans to create a "superholding" which will develop hypersonic technologies. The holding company is expected to enter the corporation TEV "NGOs engineering."


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    Re: Russia, US and other developments in Hypersonic Research

    Post  dino00 on Wed Jan 16, 2013 3:33 pm

    The Russian Defence Ministry will start testing advanced hypersonic missiles in the coming summer. At present, Russia is conducting research in several areas of developing hypersonic technology, but it’s unclear which will be successful.
    The work on hypersonic vehicles conducted by the Soviet Union and the U.S. during the Cold War was suspended after it was ended. But it has restarted now. Both countries are aimed at creating guided means of destruction which should be an alternative to intercontinental ballistic missiles. This task was set at the dawn of the hypersonic technology.

    At present, the main task is to develop an engine capable of giving the vehicle necessary speed. The manoeuvering warheads are not facing this problem because the booster gives them the necessary speed. The present task is to develop a hypersonic reusable vehicle.

    This task is being solved in the U.S. where an experimental vehicle X-27 has been developed. Its testing started in 2010. At present, it is making the third orbital flight started in December 2012. It will continue for several months. The testing is aimed at developing a hypersonic weapon carrier capable of manoeuvering in the orbit and entering the atmosphere to launch attacks on anywhere in the world. But many problems, such as the designing of the vehicle, developing navigation and communication systems, are yet to be solved to achieve this goal. The traditional radio communication and radio navigation are not working during flights at hypersonic speeds in the atmosphere.

    Russian developments of hypersonic vehicles are moving in several directions. Russian specialists have achieved great success in developing manoeuvering warheads. Such warheads that are heavier and bigger than ordinary ones are capable of manoeuvering in the atmosphere. This excludes their interception by the existing and promising anti-missile defence systems.

    A hypersonic missile for the Russian Navy will be developed in the next few years. The Tsirkon anti-ship system should be based on the hypersonic missile that is being developed by Russia and India on the basis of the Bramos missile. The Russian Air Force is interested in such missiles but the speed of the missiles for it should be more than ten times the speed of sound.

    Voice of Russia

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