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    Future russian aircraft carriers.

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    GarryB

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers.

    Post  GarryB on Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:01 am

    VSTOL are needed for 20K ton vessels, but with 50-70K ton vessels most Russian fixed wing land based aircraft have the thrust to weight ratio to operate with the addition of folding wings, a bit of structural strengthening, and a tail hook of course.

    Having a plane 90% related to a land based model makes a lot of sense.


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    eehnie

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers.

    Post  eehnie on Wed Aug 02, 2017 12:15 am

    Unfortunately for the intoxicators, one of the most important points in the economic balance of the big aircraft carriers vs the small ones is in the air component. The big aircraft carriers need not specific designs, need not different aircrafts, wich means very big cost saving for the Russian Navy.

    The next aircraft carrier will be comfortable for the aircrafts of the MiG-29/35, Su-27/30/33/35 and the Su-PAK-FA platforms. This is a minimum. Of course combat helicopters and unmanned aircrafts.

    And surely it will allow the use of something else.
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers.

    Post  AlfaT8 on Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:39 am

    As i see it, the next AC will have to handle Mig-29/35K, mini AWACS (very important), Perhaps a navalised SU-34K (unlikely), UCAVs, and of course T-50K, considering Russia's priorities the main wing will consist of mostly of Migs, 1/2 mini AWACS and the usual choppers, should be easily doable given the Migs size compared to the Su-33s, and of course the new carrier having Nuclear instead of conventional propulsion.
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    eehnie

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers.

    Post  eehnie on Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:01 am

    I agre. Surely mini AWACS will be also unmaned (I was including them between the unmanned aircrafts)

    Su-34? Likely in mind.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers.

    Post  GarryB on Fri Aug 04, 2017 2:58 am

    A tethered airship could have enormous conformal array antennas on its outer surface and operate at 30km or higher, tethered to a destroyer or large vessel providing it with power via the tether.

    It could operate 24/7 with excellent views of the surrounding airspace.

    The Su-34 is too heavy to operate from aircraft carriers... hypersonic cruise missiles would make rather more operational sense anyway for land attack missions.


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    Firebird

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers.

    Post  Firebird on Fri Aug 04, 2017 9:48 am

    GarryB wrote:A tethered airship could have enormous conformal array antennas on its outer surface and operate at 30km or higher, tethered to a destroyer or large vessel providing it with power via the tether.

    It could operate 24/7 with excellent views of the surrounding airspace.

    The Su-34 is too heavy to operate from aircraft carriers... hypersonic cruise missiles would make rather more operational sense anyway for land attack missions.

    Wouldn't it make sense to have an airship solar panel powered, or lots of very small turbines on it (I mean really small ones effectively forming the "skin"). Or even some sort of nuclear system?

    I'm convinced many things could be done with airships in the military AND civillian spheres. Much like ekranoplans.

    Airships could be used as radar posts. They could be faster cargo carriers than ships. They could be bases for drones, or even landing strips for planes. They could be launch posts for missiles. They could even be lowered towards sea level to hide from enemy radar.

    Perhaps a more outlandish option would be for airships to compact themselves/depressurise and sink under the waves, in readiness for the ultimate in stealth attacks OR launch anti-ICBMs.

    The oceans are so vast that certain times of airship could really disappear for lengths of time.

    T-47

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers.

    Post  T-47 on Fri Aug 04, 2017 3:24 pm

    Firebird wrote:
    Wouldn't it make sense to have an airship solar panel powered, or lots of very small turbines on it (I mean really small ones effectively forming the "skin"). Or even some sort of nuclear system?

    I'm convinced many things could be done with airships in the military AND civillian spheres. Much like ekranoplans.

    Airships could be used as radar posts. They could be faster cargo carriers than ships. They could be bases for drones, or even landing strips for planes. They could be launch posts for missiles. They could even be lowered towards sea level to hide from enemy radar.

    Perhaps a more outlandish option would be for airships to compact themselves/depressurise and sink under the waves, in readiness for the ultimate in stealth attacks OR launch anti-ICBMs.

    The oceans are so vast that certain times of airship could really disappear for lengths of time.

    Shocked Dayyymmm Firebird, even Avengers didn't have that type of thing Shocked
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    GarryB

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers.

    Post  GarryB on Sat Aug 05, 2017 9:52 am

    For a cargo role an airship could have a payload capacity of 1,000 tons... you could build whole turbine sets for a dam and pick it up from the factory it is made at and carry it directly into the middle of nowhere where the dam is to drop it off on site.

    to ship it or to fly it there you would need to partially dismantle it load it into the aircraft or ship and fly or sail it to the nearest port (air or sea) and then transport it likely by rail or road to the dam... which means building rail or road networks to and from the dam.

    A very large airship could carry a dozen enormous radar arrays covering a wide range of radar and radio frequencies to allow scanning for air targets through to communications with submerged submarines.

    Using modern light composite materials for the structure and hydrogen for the lifting gas you could regulate height with a fuel cell that generates power and converts the hydrogen to water and vice versa. Solar panels, nuclear power plants, diesel engines, fuel cells, could all provide power and lift... diesel engines can also generate heat to add buoyancy and thrust... a tethered airship could get power directly from the ship it is tethered to...

    Most people think of the Hindenberg, but its outer skin was basically guncotton so the fire risk was enormous. Nitrogen purged airship with both hydrogen and helium for lift and a fuel cell so hydrogen can be turned to water and back again to hydrogen so there would be no need to vent lifting gas to operate.

    Note in a conventional airship it always weighs the same so when it comes in to pick up its 20 ton payload it needs to dump 20 tons of ballast, or lose 20 tons of lifting power to remain buoyant. As it moves it normally burns diesel which generates heat and lightens the aircraft by removing liquid diesel from the fuel tanks. Converting some of the lifting hydrogen to water means the lift remains the same, but if you need to climb or descend water can be dumped or converted to hydrogen fairly rapidly.

    New technologies therefore make the airship concept much more efficient... and I like the idea of a submersable airship... a hard inner shell and the ability to store a lot of water ballast would make a sub perfectly possible... using a fuel cell and an electrical current to turn the water into hydrogen should not be impossible either...


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    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

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