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    PAK-DA: News

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    OminousSpudd

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  OminousSpudd on Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:00 am

    sepheronx wrote:But the mod stated there were issues with various systems used in Syria. Guaranteed S-35S was one of them. Don't forget, it incorporates tech from fifth gen too.
    For sure, but they certainly would never have been deployed if they were in the state he made them out to be.
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    Militarov

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Militarov on Mon May 09, 2016 1:11 am



    Fanmade naturally
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    x_54_u43

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  x_54_u43 on Mon May 09, 2016 3:31 am

    Militarov wrote:

    Fanmade naturally

    Repost naturally
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    Militarov

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Militarov on Mon May 09, 2016 3:38 am

    x_54_u43 wrote:
    Militarov wrote:

    Fanmade naturally

    Repost naturally

    Cute.

    However that video was removed by the user and its no longer available and arronlee33 will keep it up.
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    GarryB

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  GarryB on Mon May 09, 2016 8:46 am

    AFAIK the problems with the Su-35 and indeed the other Sukhoi aircraft deployed to Syria was regarding dust ingestion on take off and landing... sand and grit in the engines on takeoff and landing are hard on turbine blades as the west found with its operations in the region.

    The MiG-29 would not have that problem because its FOD is solid and all air is sucked in through upper louvers, while the Sukhois either have grids on the Flankers or nothing on the Fencers.


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    jhelb

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  jhelb on Mon May 09, 2016 11:51 am

    Singular_trafo wrote:5-6 kg pu, 10-20 kg depleted uranium, few grams tritium.Any heavy metal should be good instead of the depleted uranium

    Thank You. Just to clarify, these are the [approximate] figures for warheads on any ICBM/SLBM and not just Topol, isn't it?

    Singular_trafo wrote:but using lead cut into half the yield of the bomb.

    Can you expand on this part, what exactly you meant by "lead cut into half"? Thanx.

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Singular_trafo on Mon May 09, 2016 7:32 pm

    jhelb wrote:
    Singular_trafo wrote:5-6 kg pu, 10-20 kg depleted uranium, few grams tritium.Any heavy metal should be good instead of the depleted uranium

    Thank You. Just to clarify, these are the [approximate] figures for warheads on any ICBM/SLBM and not just Topol, isn't it?

    Singular_trafo wrote:but using lead cut into half the yield of the bomb.

    Can you expand on this part, what exactly you meant by "lead cut into half"? Thanx.

    Every modern, three staged thermonuclear bomb contain this stuff, based on the available materials on the internet.
    Everyone who know it better will face several decade long prison in every country if sharing any confirmed details : )

    The second stage is the lithium hydrate , the first stage nuclear bomb compress it and heats it up, and it needs heavy metal encasing to compress it - it is like a tin can.
    If they use cheap depleted uranium then after the ignition of the second stage the fast neutrons will ignite the uranium encasing of the lithium hydrate.This can generate as much energy as the fusion of the hydrogen.

    They can use lead or tungsten as well, but in that case only the lithium hydrate will detonate( the excess neutrons from the spark plug and primary will transmute the lithium into tritium,and that will fusionate)

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    jhelb

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  jhelb on Tue May 10, 2016 11:10 am

    Singular_trafo wrote:
    jhelb wrote:
    Singular_trafo wrote:5-6 kg pu, 10-20 kg depleted uranium, few grams tritium.Any heavy metal should be good instead of the depleted uranium

    Thank You. Just to clarify,  these are the [approximate] figures for warheads on any ICBM/SLBM and not just Topol, isn't it?

    Singular_trafo wrote:but using lead cut into half the yield of the bomb.

    Can you expand on this part, what exactly you meant by "lead cut into half"? Thanx.

    Every modern, three staged thermonuclear bomb contain this stuff, based on the available materials on the internet.
    Everyone who know it better will face several decade long prison in every country if sharing any confirmed details : )

    The second stage is the lithium hydrate , the first stage nuclear bomb compress it and heats it up, and it needs heavy metal encasing to compress it - it is like a tin can.
    If they use cheap depleted uranium then after the ignition of the second stage the fast neutrons will ignite the uranium encasing of the lithium hydrate.This can generate as much energy as the fusion of the hydrogen.

    They can use lead or tungsten as well, but in that case only the lithium hydrate will detonate( the excess neutrons from the spark plug and primary will transmute the lithium into tritium,and that will fusionate)


    Ok! I get it. So basically the explosion itself, is caused by the use of the 5-6 kg of plutonium only, correct?

    The depleted uranium just provides the heavy metal encasing, as you put it?

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Singular_trafo on Tue May 10, 2016 7:55 pm

    jhelb wrote:

    Ok! I get it. So basically the explosion itself, is caused by the use of the 5-6 kg of plutonium only, correct?

    The depleted uranium just provides the heavy metal encasing, as you put it?

    Yes and no, the Pu-239 needed to trigger the bomb and it gives only small fraction of the explosion energy. The secondary hydrogen fusion gives at least half of the energy, and the depleted uranium casing gives the other half.

    The depleted uranium not needed, the bomb still works with any other heavy metal casing, but the power of explosion will be half as big.

    the low fallout thermonuclear bombs are using lead as tamper material, decreasing the fallout by several magnitude, but decrease the explosive power by 50%.


    The thermonuclear bomb is acutally three staged,last is the explosion of the depleted uranium casing.

    Example the czar bomb was used with lead casing during the test, in the final production version they used depleted uranium.so the field one had twice as big explosive power than the test one.

    Vann7

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Vann7 on Wed Jun 29, 2016 5:59 am



    speaking about nukes..
    there is a report of next generation nuclear weapons..

    http://www.veteranstoday.com/2016/06/28/electrodynamics-and-cold-fusion/

    any comments about those new nuclear bombs?

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Singular_trafo on Wed Jun 29, 2016 7:30 pm

    Vann7 wrote:

    speaking about nukes..
    there is a report of next generation nuclear weapons..

    http://www.veteranstoday.com/2016/06/28/electrodynamics-and-cold-fusion/

    any comments about those new nuclear bombs?

    The next developments was given up to decrease the cahnce of nuclear prolifilation:

    Nucelar powered transportation (ships)
    Nuclear powered mobile power plants
    Molten salt reactor (designed originaly for airplanes)
    Laser uranium enrichment

    And probably many more that I can't remember .
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    eehnie

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  eehnie on Sat Sep 17, 2016 11:17 am

    http://en.yibada.com/articles/157961/20160907/modernization-russia-s-tu-160m-bomber-delays-production-new-pak.htm

    I do not think a subsonic solution for the Tu-PAK-DA would be successful. The time will talk.

    Vann7

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Vann7 on Sun Nov 13, 2016 2:48 am

    eehnie wrote:http://en.yibada.com/articles/157961/20160907/modernization-russia-s-tu-160m-bomber-delays-production-new-pak.htm

    I do not think a subsonic solution for the Tu-PAK-DA would be successful. The time will talk.

    neither me..

    Russia needs no less than Super Sonic Bombers with mach 2.5 speed at least. so that they
    do skirmishes near US coast , shoot and run ,and evade chasing planes in case of a war.
    But ideally Russia will be better with Hypersonic planes or planes at least that can
    fly in the mesosphere from 40km altitude to 80km altitude which NATO navies have almost no defense to shut down planes at that altitude. Because is on a zone where there is no oxygen ,
    and still gravity ,were missiles can work ,or space mines could operate. Only Rail Guns ,could do it and only one warship they have that can do that. In case of war a dozen of Mesosphere bombers will have a field day sinking NATO battle groups with impunity. and only Main Land defenses like THAAD of Americans or Arrow 3 missiles could try to target them.

    Such kind of bombers will force Americans to a new weapons reduction treaty and even
    a disarmament Very Happy ,because their navy will be very vulnerable to such bombers. For Sure they will agree to remove their Missiles and nuclear weapons from Europe in change of Russia destroying those planes.
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    Militarov

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Militarov on Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:26 am

    Vann7 wrote:
    eehnie wrote:http://en.yibada.com/articles/157961/20160907/modernization-russia-s-tu-160m-bomber-delays-production-new-pak.htm

    I do not think a subsonic solution for the Tu-PAK-DA would be successful. The time will talk.

    neither me..

    Russia needs no less than Super Sonic Bombers with mach 2.5 speed at least. so that they
    do skirmishes near US coast , shoot and run ,and evade chasing planes in case of a war.
    But ideally Russia will be better with Hypersonic planes or planes at least that can
    fly in the mesosphere from 40km altitude to 80km altitude which NATO navies have almost no defense to shut down planes at that altitude. Because is on a zone where there is no oxygen ,
    and still gravity ,were missiles can work ,or space mines could operate. Only Rail Guns ,could do it and only one warship they have that can do that.  In case of war a dozen of Mesosphere bombers will have a field day sinking NATO battle groups with impunity. and only Main Land defenses like THAAD of Americans or Arrow 3 missiles could try to target them.

    Such kind of bombers will force Americans to a new weapons reduction treaty and even
    a disarmament Very Happy  ,because their navy will be very vulnerable to such bombers. For Sure they will agree to remove their Missiles and nuclear weapons  from Europe in change of Russia destroying those planes.

    They also could get The One Ring and Nazgûls. Or sign a pact with Independence Day alien race.
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    VladimirSahin

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  VladimirSahin on Sun Nov 13, 2016 3:35 am

    Militarov wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    eehnie wrote:http://en.yibada.com/articles/157961/20160907/modernization-russia-s-tu-160m-bomber-delays-production-new-pak.htm

    I do not think a subsonic solution for the Tu-PAK-DA would be successful. The time will talk.

    neither me..

    Russia needs no less than Super Sonic Bombers with mach 2.5 speed at least. so that they
    do skirmishes near US coast , shoot and run ,and evade chasing planes in case of a war.
    But ideally Russia will be better with Hypersonic planes or planes at least that can
    fly in the mesosphere from 40km altitude to 80km altitude which NATO navies have almost no defense to shut down planes at that altitude. Because is on a zone where there is no oxygen ,
    and still gravity ,were missiles can work ,or space mines could operate. Only Rail Guns ,could do it and only one warship they have that can do that.  In case of war a dozen of Mesosphere bombers will have a field day sinking NATO battle groups with impunity. and only Main Land defenses like THAAD of Americans or Arrow 3 missiles could try to target them.

    Such kind of bombers will force Americans to a new weapons reduction treaty and even
    a disarmament Very Happy  ,because their navy will be very vulnerable to such bombers. For Sure they will agree to remove their Missiles and nuclear weapons  from Europe in change of Russia destroying those planes.

    They also could get The One Ring and Nazgûls. Or sign a pact with Independence Day alien race.

    That would be way cheaper Laughing
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    Militarov

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Militarov on Sun Nov 13, 2016 4:17 am

    VladimirSahin wrote: That would be way cheaper Laughing

    And more likely to happen too...
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    GarryB

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  GarryB on Sun Nov 13, 2016 8:45 am

    Russia needs no less than Super Sonic Bombers with mach 2.5 speed at least. so that they
    do skirmishes near US coast , shoot and run ,and evade chasing planes in case of a war.

    They already have the Tu-160 which can fly at mach 2 for long distances...

    They are making more of them.

    Why would they bother making more of them if they are making PAK DA into a supersonic bomber?

    Unless the PAK DA is supposed to replace the Bear with a stealthy bomber with a large fuel load and a modest strategic weapon load which can be changed for a large bomb load and a modest fuel load for theatre bombing missions so that it can also replace the Tu-22M3 as well.

    High speed costs money and expensive aircraft can't be bought or used in large numbers... more Blackjacks and some subsonic stealthy bombers would be an ideal combination... especially considering the Tu-160s seem to have lost their ability to use conventional bombs...


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    Austin

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Austin on Wed Dec 28, 2016 12:51 pm

    "Machines for the Tu-160m2 and PAK DA will be the same

    http://vpk.name/news/171627_Postoyanno_izyiskivaem_rezervyi_chtobyi_vyipolnit_maiskie_ukazyi.html


    - Then turn to the long-range aviation. We now have two programs in the field of long-range aviation: a promising aviation complex (PAK), long-range aircraft (DA) and a deep modernization of the Tu-160 and Tu-level 160m2. Do we have enough resources? Do they compete, these programs?

    - No. Sometimes, indeed, the question arises: why are you, in fact, the two are being developed? To begin, perhaps, from the fact that the aviation strategic nuclear forces - an integral part of [our nuclear] triad. In the current conflict, we simply have to deal with it, to ensure proper readiness.

    Modernization capabilities of the aircraft Tu-160 were significantly higher than that laid first. According to its flight performance is still unparalleled in the world of long-range bombers. It has better performance characteristics, although not produced for almost 30 years.

    Therefore, recovery of production - this is a serious and costly step, we will not hide. But it will be a totally different plane. In fact, only the former will remain fuselage appearance. Even reproduced engines NK-32 to 10% more powerful, not to mention the avionics. The control system, navigation, weapons control system - this is a completely different generation. Moreover, the air attack will be others. During this period, they have already gone through several generations. That is, the combat capabilities of the Tu-160 release mid-1980s and the plane, first flight is expected in 2018 - are two big differences.

    Serial production of the Tu-160m2 will begin after the completion of all tests, 2021. We give a new life to this plane, save for R & D and spend only on workers' and digitization of the design documentation.

    As for the PAK DA, life-is also not standing still and the nature of warfare is changing. As you can see, replacing conventional aircraft weapons come hypersonic airborne weapons with greater range and with greater accuracy. And future aircraft carrier at the turn of 2025-2030's not necessary to have such characteristics as supersonic speed. It should be as long as possible and unobtrusively to be on duty in the air, so that, without going into the affected area, to release their means of destruction on their targets.

    However, we are so coordinated with the industry organization of all work that the preparation for the production of the Tu-160 and a new image for the PAK DA is carried out simultaneously. The maximum number of process steps will be the same. Roughly speaking, the machines will be used are the same for the production of the Tu-160 and for the PAK DA. In fact, in the pre-production money is spent once.
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    eehnie

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  eehnie on Thu Dec 29, 2016 12:03 am

    Austin wrote:"Machines for the Tu-160m2 and PAK DA will be the same

    http://vpk.name/news/171627_Postoyanno_izyiskivaem_rezervyi_chtobyi_vyipolnit_maiskie_ukazyi.html


    - Then turn to the long-range aviation. We now have two programs in the field of long-range aviation: a promising aviation complex (PAK), long-range aircraft (DA) and a deep modernization of the Tu-160 and Tu-level 160m2. Do we have enough resources? Do they compete, these programs?

    - No. Sometimes, indeed, the question arises: why are you, in fact, the two are being developed? To begin, perhaps, from the fact that the aviation strategic nuclear forces - an integral part of [our nuclear] triad. In the current conflict, we simply have to deal with it, to ensure proper readiness.

    Modernization capabilities of the aircraft Tu-160 were significantly higher than that laid first. According to its flight performance is still unparalleled in the world of long-range bombers. It has better performance characteristics, although not produced for almost 30 years.

    Therefore, recovery of production - this is a serious and costly step, we will not hide. But it will be a totally different plane. In fact, only the former will remain fuselage appearance. Even reproduced engines NK-32 to 10% more powerful, not to mention the avionics. The control system, navigation, weapons control system - this is a completely different generation. Moreover, the air attack will be others. During this period, they have already gone through several generations. That is, the combat capabilities of the Tu-160 release mid-1980s and the plane, first flight is expected in 2018 - are two big differences.

    Serial production of the Tu-160m2 will begin after the completion of all tests, 2021. We give a new life to this plane, save for R & D and spend only on workers' and digitization of the design documentation.

    As for the PAK DA, life-is also not standing still and the nature of warfare is changing. As you can see, replacing conventional aircraft weapons come hypersonic airborne weapons with greater range and with greater accuracy. And future aircraft carrier at the turn of 2025-2030's not necessary to have such characteristics as supersonic speed. It should be as long as possible and unobtrusively to be on duty in the air, so that, without going into the affected area, to release their means of destruction on their targets.

    However, we are so coordinated with the industry organization of all work that the preparation for the production of the Tu-160 and a new image for the PAK DA is carried out simultaneously. The maximum number of process steps will be the same. Roughly speaking, the machines will be used are the same for the production of the Tu-160 and for the PAK DA. In fact, in the pre-production money is spent once.

    If the Tu-PAK-DA is designed subsonic, this project will fall clearly under the performance of the new generation of the Tu-160 (which will be able to carry the same hypersonic weapons) and this will be the main reason of the failure of the Tu-PAK-DA. The Tu-160 will be ordered instead.
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    JohninMK

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  JohninMK on Thu Dec 29, 2016 12:44 am

    Think this is a pretty key statement. I believe the machines mentioned are those used to build the plane, CNC jigs etc

    Roughly speaking, the machines will be used are the same for the production of the Tu-160 and for the PAK DA. In fact, in the pre-production money is spent once.


    How about almost the same plane for both applications?

    The Tu-160M2 as the new supersonic bomber completely re-engineered as per the article and another version Tu-160M3 looking much the same and containing the same electronics etc systems but a much simpler and cheaper build with lower thrust engines and a fixed wing both optimised for sub-sonic performance and duration.

    Bear in mind that the US and Russian requirements for this type of aircraft are quite different, primarily the US seeming to want a first strike max-stealth mode, which AFAIK is not in Russia's defence plans. To me it looks like Russia plans to have very similar launch strategies for the three legs of its nuclear triad, SSBN protected near to its coast, bombers protected over its land and ground launched, silo or mobile protected on its land.
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    eehnie

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  eehnie on Thu Dec 29, 2016 2:27 am

    GarryB wrote:
    Russia needs no less than Super Sonic Bombers with mach 2.5 speed at least. so that they
    do skirmishes near US coast , shoot and run ,and evade chasing planes in case of a war.

    They already have the Tu-160 which can fly at mach 2 for long distances...

    They are making more of them.

    Why would they bother making more of them if they are making PAK DA into a supersonic bomber?

    Unless the PAK DA is supposed to replace the Bear with a stealthy bomber with a large fuel load and a modest strategic weapon load which can be changed for a large bomb load and a modest fuel load for theatre bombing missions so that it can also replace the Tu-22M3 as well.

    High speed costs money and expensive aircraft can't be bought or used in large numbers... more Blackjacks and some subsonic stealthy bombers would be an ideal combination... especially considering the Tu-160s seem to have lost their ability to use conventional bombs...

    The design of the Tu-160 is not exhausted, is the best today worldwide, and its production is not exhausted. The whole project will have better economic balance with a re-start of the production.

    But over all, if they are ordering more Tu-160 is because new units are needed in a timeline when the new aircraft can not be ready.

    It is the same reason that leaded to the development and the orders of the BTR-82 (variant of the BTR-80), in a moment when the Bumerang was being also developed.

    The new aircraft will likely overperform the Tu-160, and when it is ready the orders will go to the new aircraft.

    But, at same time, we can say safely that the orders of the Tu-160 will switch to the Tu-PAK-DA only if the new aircraft overperforms clearly the old. If not the new aircraft will have the same future of the BTR-90, if not worse (without orders).
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    eehnie

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  eehnie on Thu Dec 29, 2016 2:52 am

    JohninMK wrote:Think this is a pretty key statement. I believe the machines mentioned are those used to build the plane, CNC jigs etc

    Roughly speaking, the machines will be used are the same for the production of the Tu-160 and for the PAK DA. In fact, in the pre-production money is spent once.


    How about almost the same plane for both applications?

    The Tu-160M2 as the new supersonic bomber completely re-engineered as per the article and another version Tu-160M3 looking much the same and containing the same electronics etc systems but a much simpler and cheaper build with lower thrust engines and a fixed wing both optimised for sub-sonic performance and duration.

    Bear in mind that the US and Russian requirements for this type of aircraft are quite different, primarily the US seeming to want a first strike max-stealth mode, which AFAIK is not in Russia's defence plans. To me it looks like Russia plans to have very similar launch strategies for the three legs of its nuclear triad, SSBN protected near to its coast, bombers protected over its land and ground launched, silo or mobile protected on its land.

    I agree with the point about to find safety for the nuclear weapon launchers, but I agree not with to play the cheap card on them. A nuclear weapons launcher is too serious to play this card there, and at same time they are too few to be a real problem of money.

    Mobility increases safety, this is valid for all the branches. On land the trend should be to go to full to mobile launchers except for the missiles that are too big for it. And on air platforms I do not see the Russian Armed Forces accepting some downgrade in mobility from the current modern launchers (Tu-160).
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    Militarov

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Militarov on Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:42 am

    eehnie wrote:
    Austin wrote:"Machines for the Tu-160m2 and PAK DA will be the same

    http://vpk.name/news/171627_Postoyanno_izyiskivaem_rezervyi_chtobyi_vyipolnit_maiskie_ukazyi.html


    - Then turn to the long-range aviation. We now have two programs in the field of long-range aviation: a promising aviation complex (PAK), long-range aircraft (DA) and a deep modernization of the Tu-160 and Tu-level 160m2. Do we have enough resources? Do they compete, these programs?

    - No. Sometimes, indeed, the question arises: why are you, in fact, the two are being developed? To begin, perhaps, from the fact that the aviation strategic nuclear forces - an integral part of [our nuclear] triad. In the current conflict, we simply have to deal with it, to ensure proper readiness.

    Modernization capabilities of the aircraft Tu-160 were significantly higher than that laid first. According to its flight performance is still unparalleled in the world of long-range bombers. It has better performance characteristics, although not produced for almost 30 years.

    Therefore, recovery of production - this is a serious and costly step, we will not hide. But it will be a totally different plane. In fact, only the former will remain fuselage appearance. Even reproduced engines NK-32 to 10% more powerful, not to mention the avionics. The control system, navigation, weapons control system - this is a completely different generation. Moreover, the air attack will be others. During this period, they have already gone through several generations. That is, the combat capabilities of the Tu-160 release mid-1980s and the plane, first flight is expected in 2018 - are two big differences.

    Serial production of the Tu-160m2 will begin after the completion of all tests, 2021. We give a new life to this plane, save for R & D and spend only on workers' and digitization of the design documentation.

    As for the PAK DA, life-is also not standing still and the nature of warfare is changing. As you can see, replacing conventional aircraft weapons come hypersonic airborne weapons with greater range and with greater accuracy. And future aircraft carrier at the turn of 2025-2030's not necessary to have such characteristics as supersonic speed. It should be as long as possible and unobtrusively to be on duty in the air, so that, without going into the affected area, to release their means of destruction on their targets.

    However, we are so coordinated with the industry organization of all work that the preparation for the production of the Tu-160 and a new image for the PAK DA is carried out simultaneously. The maximum number of process steps will be the same. Roughly speaking, the machines will be used are the same for the production of the Tu-160 and for the PAK DA. In fact, in the pre-production money is spent once.

    If the Tu-PAK-DA is designed subsonic, this project will fall clearly under the performance of the new generation of the Tu-160 (which will be able to carry the same hypersonic weapons) and this will be the main reason of the failure of the Tu-PAK-DA. The Tu-160 will be ordered instead.

    High-subsonic bombers are few TIMES cheaper to operate, can allow LO flying wing configuration, extremly long ranges. Using Tu-160 based bomber to strike non-strategic targets on frontline would be major waste of resources.

    Something needs to replace Tu-22M in the roles of conventional bomber.
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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  eehnie on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:40 am

    Militarov wrote:
    eehnie wrote:
    Austin wrote:"Machines for the Tu-160m2 and PAK DA will be the same

    http://vpk.name/news/171627_Postoyanno_izyiskivaem_rezervyi_chtobyi_vyipolnit_maiskie_ukazyi.html


    - Then turn to the long-range aviation. We now have two programs in the field of long-range aviation: a promising aviation complex (PAK), long-range aircraft (DA) and a deep modernization of the Tu-160 and Tu-level 160m2. Do we have enough resources? Do they compete, these programs?

    - No. Sometimes, indeed, the question arises: why are you, in fact, the two are being developed? To begin, perhaps, from the fact that the aviation strategic nuclear forces - an integral part of [our nuclear] triad. In the current conflict, we simply have to deal with it, to ensure proper readiness.

    Modernization capabilities of the aircraft Tu-160 were significantly higher than that laid first. According to its flight performance is still unparalleled in the world of long-range bombers. It has better performance characteristics, although not produced for almost 30 years.

    Therefore, recovery of production - this is a serious and costly step, we will not hide. But it will be a totally different plane. In fact, only the former will remain fuselage appearance. Even reproduced engines NK-32 to 10% more powerful, not to mention the avionics. The control system, navigation, weapons control system - this is a completely different generation. Moreover, the air attack will be others. During this period, they have already gone through several generations. That is, the combat capabilities of the Tu-160 release mid-1980s and the plane, first flight is expected in 2018 - are two big differences.

    Serial production of the Tu-160m2 will begin after the completion of all tests, 2021. We give a new life to this plane, save for R & D and spend only on workers' and digitization of the design documentation.

    As for the PAK DA, life-is also not standing still and the nature of warfare is changing. As you can see, replacing conventional aircraft weapons come hypersonic airborne weapons with greater range and with greater accuracy. And future aircraft carrier at the turn of 2025-2030's not necessary to have such characteristics as supersonic speed. It should be as long as possible and unobtrusively to be on duty in the air, so that, without going into the affected area, to release their means of destruction on their targets.

    However, we are so coordinated with the industry organization of all work that the preparation for the production of the Tu-160 and a new image for the PAK DA is carried out simultaneously. The maximum number of process steps will be the same. Roughly speaking, the machines will be used are the same for the production of the Tu-160 and for the PAK DA. In fact, in the pre-production money is spent once.

    If the Tu-PAK-DA is designed subsonic, this project will fall clearly under the performance of the new generation of the Tu-160 (which will be able to carry the same hypersonic weapons) and this will be the main reason of the failure of the Tu-PAK-DA. The Tu-160 will be ordered instead.

    High-subsonic bombers are few TIMES cheaper to operate, can allow LO flying wing configuration, extremly long ranges. Using Tu-160 based bomber to strike non-strategic targets on frontline would be major waste of resources.

    Something needs to replace Tu-22M in the roles of conventional bomber.

    Only if you count not the costs of the loses in combat.

    As example you can compare the operational costs of the Su-24 and the Su-25 for Ukraine in the war.

    I would bet that the Tu-160 has not been the aircraft with higher operational costs for Russia in Syria.


    Last edited by eehnie on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:59 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Militarov

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    Re: PAK-DA: News

    Post  Militarov on Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:52 am

    eehnie wrote: Only if you count not the costs of the loses in combat.

    As example you can compare the operational costs of the Su-24 and the Su-25 for Ukraine in the war.

    Actually chances are that per unit (flyaway cost) of Tu-160M2 will be higher than one of PAK-DA. Tu-160 was the most expencive aviation project of USSR, by far, nothing ever came even remotely close to it, same goes for unit cost.

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