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    Russian Radar systems

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    victor1985

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  victor1985 on Wed Apr 20, 2016 1:04 am

    Singular_trafo wrote:
    Austin wrote:
    victor1985 wrote:
    Austin wrote:Came across this info on upgraded radar for patriot using GaN module , Does Russia have any GaN project for AESA , I believe so far they are all using GaA TR module

    what is so special at those Gan modules?
    if it is about weight well i think that doesnt matter for a truck like s400.....maibe for a handheld radio or something.... [/quote

    Lighter Weight , Long Life , Twice the Power Output , Twice the Range , Cheaper atleast once it goes into production

    Not cheaper.

    It is a nice update to the emitors of the AESA radars, the GaAs has lower efficiency than the GaN, it means smaller size, less power and less cooling requirements.

    It is not so critical in the land based radadars, it is good to have on airborne radars.


    However he stealth anyway pushed up the wavelenght, that push down the emitter module count in the radars, so the benefit smaller or marginal than it should be say 30 years ago.

    Additionaly the stealth put more emphasis onto the receiver logic , that is the critical infrastructure part now.

    That is the reason why Russia spent a lot of money into the Elbrus cpu development, that is more critical than the GaN for the radars.


    I think they will work in the comming years on the GaAs anyway, they need that for the MRAM spin transfer torque mechanism .

    And at the moment the biggest priority for russia is to manufactre high speed spaceborn cpus an memories.
    i have a question :
    as far as i know the radio antenna (some of them) has sensitivity to one direction..... if we have 2 antennas with the most directivity in diferent direction ....the waves that are hitting those two antennas ....are registered as different in the two antennas? because like this you can see wich waves are moving according to a direction of a plane .....
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    max steel

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  max steel on Wed Apr 20, 2016 1:22 am

    If GaN is more useful for airborne radars than ground based radars then where's the advantage for Russian IADS new radars ?

    Singular_trafo

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  Singular_trafo on Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:51 pm

    victor1985 wrote:
    i have a question :
    as far as i know the radio antenna (some of them) has sensitivity to one direction..... if we have 2 antennas with the most directivity in diferent direction ....the waves that are hitting those two antennas ....are registered as different in the two antennas? because like this you can see wich waves are moving according to a direction of a plane .....

    Directional antenna, like a yagi will increase the gain, and decrease the sensitivity to a narrow angle.

    If you have tow antennas the challange will be to make a receiver that syncronised to be capable to see the phase shift between the same wave.

    It is a bit hard to do cheap at home, but there area few example of RTL sdr projects where the guy made from RTL dongles a phase array radar sensor , by synronishing the clock of all dongle.

    Singular_trafo

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  Singular_trafo on Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:56 pm

    max steel wrote:If GaN is more useful for airborne radars than ground based radars then where's the advantage for Russian IADS new radars ?

    In ariborne aplications the weight ,cooling requirements and power consumption quite important.

    With a ground radar not.

    The Russian Micron has GaN manufacturing capability, but as I read they need a new plant to manufacture those.


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    George1

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  George1 on Thu Apr 21, 2016 10:06 am

    Purchase of radar "Niobium-SV"

    The site procurement April 18, 2016 was posted information about the conduct of Russian Ministry of Defense tender for purchase in 2017-2018 six new radar standby meter waveband 1L125 "Niobium-NE".

    According to the tender documents, the first two stations 1L125 "Niobium-CB" must be placed by October 25, 2017 to the Military Academy of Air Defense Forces of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, Marshal of the Soviet Union AM Vasilevsky in Smolensk, and to the military unit 33860 (106 th Training Center Army Air Defence of the Armed Forces) in Orenburg.

    The other four radar must be placed by October 25, 2018 to the military units in the Red River (Khabarovsk), Rybinsk-18 (Yaroslavl region), Novocherkassk (Rostov region) and Gagarin (Sverdlovsk region) - in all cases refers to the storage and repair of military base art.



    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1861742.html


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    George1

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  George1 on Sun May 22, 2016 5:55 am

    Russia’s Western Military District Equipped With Nebo-U Mobile Radar



    Russia’s Western Military District (WMD) received into service the 55Zh6 Nebo-U (NATO reporting name Tall Rack) mobile radar, the district spokesman said Saturday.

    Rostec Develops Radar Optical Vehicle for Russian State Borders Protection
    MOSCOW (Sputnik) – The Nebo-U station boasts friend-or-foe identification and active signal jamming direction finding capabilities, he added. The radar works in both standalone mode and as a component of a wider system.

    Col. Igor Muginov noted that the 2014-2015 state defense procurement allowed the district to re-equip its aerospace defense system, creating a single radar field and ensuring total control over airspace in its area of responsibility.

    "The radar locator is intended to detect, measure coordinates and track aerial targets of various categories from aircraft to cruise and guided missiles, including small hypersonic, ballistic and stealth [rockets] in the range of 600 kilometers [372 miles]," Muginov said.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20160521/1040022197/nebo-u-radar-russia.html#ixzz49L7dfPol


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    medo

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  medo on Sun May 22, 2016 1:05 pm

    I think it was meant Nebo-M radar, not Nebo-U, which is different. On the picture is Nebo-M.
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    max steel

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  max steel on Sun May 22, 2016 3:24 pm

    Are these radars powerful than Duga radar in Chernobyl. An over-the-horizon radar system over 10 MW power
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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  Viktor on Sun May 22, 2016 4:21 pm

    max steel wrote:Are these radars powerful than Duga radar in Chernobyl.  An over-the-horizon radar system over 10 MW power

    Not as powerfull but mobile!

    Mobility is an issue many lose sight off but as it does not correlate with the technical carateristics of the system but makes a whole strategy of use around and for Russia one

    that is most important.
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    franco

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  franco on Sat Jul 02, 2016 8:41 pm

    New Russian radar capable of spotting stealth aircraft being deployed;

    http://en.ria.ru/science/20160702/1042341025/russia-podsolnukh-radar-f35.html

    Vann7

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    Anyone have heard of Sunflower radar?

    Post  Vann7 on Sun Jul 10, 2016 9:46 pm



    Anyone have heard of Sunflower radar?
    Russia have the ability to see over the horizon without any external aid ,like patrol aircrafts
    or boats. The radar will detect not only planes beyond the horizon line of sight.. about ~50km.
    but also all the way to 450km ,by sending a signal that follows the curvature of the water surface.

    This is truly a major development in radar technology , when radars can up to 300 boats and planes movements. up to 450km away and without any deployment of airforce or navy to extend the radar view. This means Russia right now have complete full monitoring capabilities of anything that happens in Baltic sea ,caspian sea or black sea in the water or above it, up to 450km distance from the radar. really interested stuff. and if all that was not good enough
    to deter mass waves of surprise attacks ,flying low. Sunflower radars can also see F-35.

    apparently the Sunflower radar is already operating in Sea of Okhotsk, the Sea of Japan and the Caspian Sea.

    http://sputniknews.com/military/20160710/1042734198/f35-engine-radar.html


    Wondering if NATO also developed and in service over the horizon surface wave radars.
    This technology can also significantly save a lot of money in patrols , since the radars will keep
    updated Russia with every movement in the water and over it up to 450km away.


    Austin

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    Russian Strategic Air Defence

    Post  Austin on Sun Jul 10, 2016 10:29 pm

    Yes Sunflower is younger brother of Container OTH radar

    JohninMK

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  JohninMK on Tue Jul 12, 2016 2:03 am

    Austin wrote:Yes Sunflower is younger brother of Container OTH radar
    This I put up so that some of you can have a smile. It is the infamous David Axe on the Sunflower. You will enjoy the comments. Just wish Milatrov was still here with his gems of Serbian SAM wisdom.

    https://warisboring.com/dont-sweat-russia-s-stealth-fighter-detecting-new-radar-94ce6fc66883#.9f6ku5upo
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  AlfaT8 on Tue Jul 12, 2016 4:20 am

    JohninMK wrote:
    Austin wrote:Yes Sunflower is younger brother of Container OTH radar
    This I put up so that some of you can have a smile. It is the infamous David Axe on the Sunflower. You will enjoy the comments. Just wish Milatrov was still here with his gems of Serbian SAM wisdom.

    https://warisboring.com/dont-sweat-russia-s-stealth-fighter-detecting-new-radar-94ce6fc66883#.9f6ku5upo

    Ooh god, not this BS argument again, "so you can see our uber-stealth fighters, but you can't target us, because reasons", this pathetic excuse isn't exclusive to Mr.Axe here, it has become quiet common, it came from Military and Defense industry officials desperately trying to save there a$$.
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    George1

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  George1 on Thu Aug 11, 2016 3:40 pm

    Russia will station additional Podsolnukh (Sunflower) radars that are capable of detecting cutting-edge stealth aircraft, including Lockheed Martin's F-35 Lightning II and F-22 Raptor, to protect the country's exclusive economic zones in the extreme North, the Baltic Sea and Crimea in 2017, Rossiyskaya Gazeta reported.

    http://sputniknews.com/military/20160810/1044129781/russia-podsolnukh-radar.html


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    magnumcromagnon

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed Oct 12, 2016 1:41 am

    Russian scientists have increased the accuracy of the optical radar (LIDAR) 10 fold
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    Airman

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  Airman on Thu Nov 03, 2016 1:01 am

    franco wrote:New Russian radar capable of spotting stealth aircraft being deployed;

    http://en.ria.ru/science/20160702/1042341025/russia-podsolnukh-radar-f35.html

    I found this photo about that radar.



    It looks realy different.
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    franco

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  franco on Fri Dec 16, 2016 6:53 am

    65th Anniversary of Radar Troops;

    http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12106257@egNews

    Austin

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    General VKS explained how the radar troops recognize aircraft stealth

    Post  Austin on Sun Dec 18, 2016 10:52 pm

    General VKS explained how the radar troops recognize aircraft stealth

    https://life.ru/t/%D0%B7%D0%B2%D1%83%D0%BA/948211/ghienieral_vks_obiasnil_kak_radiotiekhnichieskiie_voiska_raspoznaiut_samolioty-nievidimki


    To detect aircraft with reduced visibility, radar troops of the Russian Federation using locators that are effective in the centimeter, decimeter and meter wavelengths, said the head of the radio Life forces VKS Russian Major-General Andrew Coban.

    - To date, the aircraft carried out under the "Stealth", it is not difficult to detect the object for radio engineering troops. We discover them by means of radar. Due to what is achieved?


    This is achieved through the use of radar raznodiapazonnyh. Technology "Stealth", they are effective in the centimeter wavelength range, in the decimeter wavelength range, but this efficiency is significantly reduced in the meter band. Physics can not be fooled. We use multi-band means, one such means, as I said, are radars "Sky-M" and the entire range radars "Heaven", such as "Sky-Y", "Sky-PA", "Sky-MM". All these multiband radar, so through the use of multi-band, integrated application of radar, we can detect all aircraft, including those carried out by "stealth" technology, - said Andrey Coban.

    He also noted that the radar troops detect aircraft not only near the borders of Russia, but also at a great distance from them.

    - On -TERM means the radar can detect objects at low, medium and high altitudes with serious boundaries detection. They are measured in hundreds of kilometers. Equipment and structure of radio troops can detect airborne targets, including reconnaissance aircraft, not only approaching the state border of the Russian Federation, but also far beyond the borders - said Coban.

    December 15, 2016 marks 65 years since the founding of the Russian troops VCS radio. Radio engineering troops give out information about the beginning of the air attacks of the enemy, the combat information for the anti-aircraft missile forces and air defenses, as well as information for call control, air defense units and divisions.

    The technology "Stealth" - a set of methods to reduce the visibility of combat vehicles in different areas of the detection range.

    HM1199

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    NEBO M complex

    Post  HM1199 on Sat Jan 14, 2017 12:35 am

    can someone tell me , at what range a NEBO M complex can detect an f22 or an f35? or at least if it can detect it from a reasonable distance?
    also , can someone explain how does that ''multispectral queing" thing works ?
    thank you Very Happy
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    Singular_Transform

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  Singular_Transform on Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:40 am

    HM1199 wrote:can someone tell me , at what range a NEBO M complex can detect an f22 or an f35? or at least if it can detect it from a reasonable distance?
    also , can someone explain how does that ''multispectral queing" thing works ?
    thank you Very Happy


    Without any trouble, from 100s of kilometres.

    The the wavelength works together, say if you see strong response from the NEBO,and very weak from the fire control radar then it is a stealth aircraft : )


    It is works like the colours, the black and white picture carry less data and information than a colour one.




    HM1199

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  HM1199 on Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:01 am

    thanks for the answer singular transform , and can the Nebo-M generate a missile guiding track at long distances as well?
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  Militarov on Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:12 am

    Singular_Transform wrote:
    HM1199 wrote:can someone tell me , at what range a NEBO M complex can detect an f22 or an f35? or at least if it can detect it from a reasonable distance?
    also , can someone explain how does that ''multispectral queing" thing works ?
    thank you Very Happy


    Without any trouble, from 100s of kilometres.

    The the wavelength works together, say if you see strong response from the NEBO,and very weak from the fire control radar then it is a stealth aircraft : )


    It is works like the colours, the black and white picture carry less data and information than a colour one.




    From million miles. It actually can detect aircraft flying in Mars orbit.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  Militarov on Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:57 am

    HM1199 wrote:can someone tell me , at what range a NEBO M complex can detect an f22 or an f35? or at least if it can detect it from a reasonable distance?
    also , can someone explain how does that ''multispectral queing" thing works ?
    thank you Very Happy

    You want real answer? We dont know.

    Also depends what you call "reasonable distance".

    Here you have decent article on radars in general, both "meter" and "decimeter" wavelenght ones: http://www.radioamatore.info/attachments/article/1773/NNIIRT-55Zh6M-Nebo-M-VHF-Radar-1S.pdf

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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Radar systems

    Post  GarryB on Sat Jan 14, 2017 10:00 am

    F-22 and F-35 are optimised to evade the signals from X band radars because that was the most common tracking radar frequency and still is.

    the problem for the stealth aircraft of today and near future is that NEBO uses three different frequency ranges that are each rather different.

    NEBO is very big and rather powerful compared with the seeker in a missiles nose or an aircraft nose so even the X band component of the system will offer better detection performance against stealth aircraft.

    Most small RCS items and even large RCS items can be stealthy if mistaken for clutter... an An-2 flying at low level at near its stall speed of 75km/h was feared to be the first effective stealth aircraft in that look down radars that could detect it could also detect cars on a motorway doing 100km/h so to remove the cars and other ground based fast moving objects the An-2s flying in that airspace would also be removed from the display as noise.

    For the same reason a low flying F-35 might be removed to prevent golf balls and birds appearing on the radar screen except the flight speed of the F-35 (at more than 150km/h) would mean it would clearly not be a golf ball or bird so even look down radars would display it if enough of a return signal could be detected.

    Long wave radar signals are not effected by the shaping of the aircraft so stealth shapes wont effect the detection range of metric wave radar and coatings are not thick enough to have much effect either.

    You need a much bigger aircraft (closer in size to the radar wave length) to effect longer wave radar signals... like the B-2.

    Newer radar technology including Photonic radar may change things dramatically though.


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