Thx for taking time and energy for a detailed reply. However, for attack vrs defense, I want to keep nuclear option out for now. It does make sense as F22 bases would be on the top 20 list of items to attack in the first half an hour of war.
The point is that F-22s flying around in Russian airspace without permission would be an act of war... it is like asking about a Blackjacks chances of operating over US airspace... they wont go anywhere near it, and for obvious reasons.
But the main question is what tool will let RuAF detect, track and kill the F22 and at what distance. S400 at 60 kms is far too near and leaves rest of Russia open for F22s to go on rampage.
There aren't many things the S-400 needs to protect that are more than 60km across.
Long wave radar should be able to detect it at much greater ranges and would be accurate enough in terms of tracking to direct a large number of fighters towards any F-22s in Russian airspace.
Note any F-22s would need to operate without support aircraft like tankers and Awacs as they would be easy kills.
This limits range and operational performance of the F-22s.
Every SDB they carry is one less AMRAAM the local fighter defences have to deal with, and with modern pod based jammers and also ground based jammers I would think the F-22s would need as many as they could carry.
Long range radar systems like Nebo-M are already with S400s using VHF/L/X Bands and still give only 60km room. Pakfa not ready yet, any legacy plane does not hold a chance, if going by USAF simulations.
USAF simulations do not allow for Russian IRST technology or Russian IR guided AAM technology... and they generally assume the F-22s airfields will not be targeted directly for attack.
RF is throwing lots of weight on PAK-FA's IRST based QWIP technology but it does not give 'look first' ability. F22's radar when upgraded will be able to 'look first' from 400 kms and while it is looking the other plane would not know that it is being stalked (mainly due to US lead in AESA technology).
Hahahaha... so US uber AESA can detect PAK FA at 400km?
Combat between the US and Russia will not be decided by F-22 vs PAK FA, and it certainly wouldn't be decided by PAK FA vs F-15 either.
The thing is that the US is the aggressor, so it has the enormous disadvantage of playing away.
The Russians have just created a new defence force called the Aerospace Defence Force, which unifies the space defence and air defence structures. They are getting new radars and satellites and other systems to monitor the space above Russia from ground, well out into space.
More important their Humint tends to be rather better than the US so any planned attack could be compromised before hand leading to the potential for preemptive strikes on the airbases to be used.
Also, F22 radars might be powerful enough to be able to fry the opposing radar by using directed energy features.
Have you seen the size of the AESA being developed for use with S-400 and likely S-500? If there is going to be any radar based energy weapons these would be much more effective than any tiny set mounted in the nose of a fighter aircraft.
Also, do not know if F22's smacm cruise missiles can be used in air to air function and if so then it is game over from 300km...............already. (may be pakfa can kill the missile or outfly it)
So the F-22 is invisible to 60km with the enormous radar set of the S-400, but the PAK FA can be detected and tracked at 300km by F-22...
Are you being realistic?
Is that the only prospective defense Russia has against F22s (other than nukes ofcourse).
A Mig-29 with a powerful onboard jammer to defeat AMRAAMs, and the President-M system that uses DIRCMs to defeat IIR guided missiles plus its 30mm cannon and thrust vectoring to outfly and shoot down an F-22 would probably do the job.
A role the Su-35 can take over as it enters service.
Does anyone know how far is Russia into Quantum Entanglement Radar?
US has already patented some sort of Quantum Radar tech as back as 2008.
I am too new here to post any links.
Errr... I think a photon sensor that detects past, present, and future details through hyperspace is an amusing idea, but as it is based on photons or light elements, it will likely have similar problems to IRST.
Those ideal Lockheed Martin RCS figures won't hold up very long when the aircraft is being engaged from many angles.
Or indeed if ice crystals form on its outer surface.
The main problem as I see it is that even assuming the F-22 was totally invisible at any distance, the weapons it uses are not, and can be dealt with and the Russians have many systems with optical backup.
Pantsir-S1 for instance can engage targets up to 15km altitude and has an optical guidance channel that could deal with an F-22, and three other radar channels that could deal with weapons released by the F-22.
If a flight of four F-22s tried to engage a target protected by a battery of 6 Pantsir-S1s the SAMs would be able to engage 24 targets at a time, so even if all four aircraft released 5 weapons each, the battery would be able to deal with all the targets and the aircraft at once. The high speed of the missiles of the Pantsir-S1 system means that those targets would be rapidly engaged and a follow up engagement for another 24 targets would probably allow 2-3 engagements before any weapons from the F-22s could reach their targets... which means they probably wont.
Clearly one flight of 4 F-22s is not good enough in this case, so more would be needed.
Odds are there will be more Pantsir-S1 batteries than there will be F-22s.
The easier challenge might be to try to kill or waste the weapons that it launches. In a simulation about defending Taiwan from PLA, the US found that F22s got destroyed, not by direct variables but Chinese killed off the AWACS, JSTARS, Refuelers and then F22s ran out of weapons and fuel.
And with the domestic version of the RVV.BD called the R-37M with a flight range of at least 280km and the ability to hit 8g targets that might be even easier for the Russians than it would be for the Chinese.
The critical thing about QWIP sensors is that they can be sensitive in multiple frequency ranges like the three IR bands (Long Short and Medium), as well as UV, and even visible light (low light), and any combination.
We know the F-22 is not invisible in the visible light wave range because we can see it.
Russian optics makers have been experimenting with Image Intensification scopes with small computers in them for processing the light. It seems they have found a way to separate natural light from artificial light, so an object that is painted or dyed with artificial colours can be made to glow... put that in the nose of a missile and it can be used to shoot down F-22s all day and night.
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