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    UFOs & Extraterrestrial Life

    starman
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    Post  starman on Sun Jun 10, 2018 12:08 pm

    George1 wrote:They announced that they found evidence of organic life

    So I heard...I wasn't impressed by that or the methane discovery.
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    Firebird

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    Post  Firebird on Mon Jun 11, 2018 4:25 pm

    I went to Google Earth Mars. Then I looked at the panoramas from one of the vehicles.
    Obviously lots of red rock. But I also saw what looked like a muddy swamp part. And the rocks looked green tinged, as if a moss or lichen was covering them. I'll try and dig out the pic I saw of it.

    People talk about things being "hidden in plain view". I always thought the "Faces on Mars" stuff was bullshit. But these pics looked just like parts of Earth. Plus its been confirmed that there is polar ice that surely melts in the warmer season. Mars is big enough, and its temperature is ok for life - infact OK its atmosphere is different to Earth, but so is Earth's sea, especially deep down. Most of us here know the crap that's written about Russia. So why wouldn't the powers that be in NASA write bullshit about Mars? So for that reason, it wouldn't surprise me at all if Mars still has life, even life with some level of sentience and intelligence.
    Walther von Oldenburg
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    Post  Walther von Oldenburg on Mon Jun 11, 2018 4:49 pm

    Martian atmosphere cannot support liquid water. It boils at some 10 degrees Celsius. Diurnal temperature variation is also too high - imagine lakes on Earth continuosly boiling and freezing every day - not a good place for life to flourish, eh?
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    Post  Firebird on Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:58 pm

    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:Martian atmosphere cannot support liquid water. It boils at some 10 degrees Celsius. Diurnal temperature variation is also too high - imagine lakes on Earth continuosly boiling and freezing every day  - not a good place for life to flourish, eh?

    Hmm yeah. THat means that life would be differnt to our own, not necessarily non existent.
    On Earth we have life under the sea in volcanic activity areas, with huge pressure and lots of sulphur.
    We also have intelligent life in incredibly cold conditions on Earth. (Altho the life from Ya.kut.sk I have experience of is anything but intelligent, but I digress : D )

    You could even have life with silicon not carbon compounds.

    The boiling is due to low pressure, not extreme heat.

    There's also the possibility of life under ice, or underground.
    Mars was probably more like Earth in the past.
    Plus with it being billions of years old, life could have adapted to suit conditions.
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    Post  starman on Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:50 pm

    Firebird wrote:
    Plus its been confirmed that there is polar ice that surely melts in the warmer season.

    The southern cap consists of frozen CO2, and the northern cap experiences spring/summer under aphelic conditions, so it's never warm enough to melt. It does sublimate though.


    Mars is big enough, and its temperature is ok for life

    The planet is way too small and way too cold for surface life.


    infact  OK its atmosphere is different to Earth, but so is Earth's sea

    Mars hardly even has an atmosphere--just 4-6mb pressure over most of it.

    So for that reason, it wouldn't surprise me at all if Mars still has life, even life with some level of sentience and intelligence.

    No serious researcher believes that anymore.


    Last edited by starman on Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  starman on Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:53 pm

    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:Martian atmosphere cannot support liquid water. It boils at some 10 degrees Celsius. Diurnal temperature variation is also too high - imagine lakes on Earth continuosly boiling and freezing every day  - not a good place for life to flourish, eh?

    Mars never really gets hot, and seldom even warm enough for biological activity except perhaps underground. Martian lakes, even a sea, existed in Noachian (-Hesperian?) time but even then they probably had an ice cover.
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    Post  starman on Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:01 pm

    Firebird wrote:
    Hmm yeah. THat means that life would be differnt to our own, not necessarily non existent.
    On Earth we have life under the sea in volcanic activity areas, with huge pressure and lots of sulphur.
    We also have intelligent life in incredibly cold conditions on Earth. (Altho the life from Ya.kut.sk I have experience of is anything but intelligent, but I digress : D )

    Life may be adaptable but there are limits to the severity of what it can endure and the Martian surface appears beyond the threshold. It's not just the intense cold and radiation. The surface is oxidized and that wipes out organic material.


    You could even have life with silicon not carbon compounds.

    Highly unlikely.

    The boiling is due to low pressure, not extreme heat.
    There's also the possibility of life under ice, or underground.

    Right.

    Mars was probably more like Earth in the past.

    It was a little more like earth for a geologically rather limited period of time known as the Noachian. Already by Hesperian time the atmosphere was practically gone.


    Plus with it being billions of years old, life could have adapted to suit conditions.

    If it ever existed it MIGHT have just survived underground.
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    Post  nomadski on Wed Nov 28, 2018 1:49 am


    I have said before , that I personally have no problems in accepting the possibility of alien life on other planets . Be this primitive or advanced . I neither shake with fear , nor turn into a religious nut . Worshiping aliens . Given the large number of reliable cases involving police or military witnesses . Together with radar evidence . From many countries . I think that the possibility that some of these UFO's are of extraterrestial origin exists . This leads me to think that if this is true , then our alien neighbours seem to be on safari . Taking a tourist trip . And collecting some samples . I have no problem thinking about alien abductions being true . Since our alien visitors seem to be ethical in conduct . Returning people unharmed .

    However I also think that this UFO story is being used by various western militaries , to confuse and distract us from real events . They do this by :


    ( 1 ) Blaming fails in radar and aircraft and even nuclear silo on alien intervention . Rather than malfunctions and human error . The story sometimes involved gremlins . In the machine . But aliens are more believable . And can explain away many shortcomings in activities of sensitive groups .

    ( 2 ) The alien story also misdirected us about technological blind alley . For example by claiming that the yanks have reverse engineered an alien anti-gravity drive . And claim it works . They hope to push us into spending billions into blind project . And waste our time . They even publish fake photo of triangular anti - gravity craft on deck of aircraft carrier . This tactic also covers up the research avenue they chose that led them into advanced projects . Like stealth aircraft . Here they hide cause from effect .

    On this note . Can we try to uncover this tactic . By naming cases . And possible reasons for alien cover story and CIA motives . I remember one case when they lost control of nuclear missile base by electrical fail and they cooked up a story about alien craft visiting base . Does anyone know about this case ? It was in UK .

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    Post  GarryB on Wed Nov 28, 2018 9:12 am

    Actually the only musical movie I can stand watching has Extratranvestites in it... it is called the Rocky Horror picture show...

    The guy who wrote it lives in New Zealand now... ashamed to say it took him ages to get citizenship... in my opinion he should have gotten automatic citizenship and a bloody knighthood... lots of Kiwis have been Knighted for rather less...

    In this infinite universe there are bound to be a wide variety of life forms, but I am sad to say the process is slow because it is basically random chance rather than intelligent design.

    There were something like 6 major extinctions just on earth from all sorts of various factors.... one of them was the development of photosynthesis that created a sudden deluge of free oxygen into the atmosphere that killed off most of the existing organisms, but injected the atmosphere with a highly reactive chemical that other animals could use to grow and develop beyond basic levels of lifeforms.

    Humans basically evolved from mammals... the same mammals that apes and monkeys evolved from (apes are out cousins and not our ancestors BTW), but that was just the way things went... a great variety of other animals could have evolved instead to waste time on the internet talking about this sort of BS.

    The main problem is that the universe is huge and most of it is expanding away from us at an enormous rate... most of the stories I read about encounters with aliens I think are probably drug or alcohol related.... why is it always some yokel in the middle of nowhere with grease smeared on his camera lens so he can never take a decent photo...

    I think statistically there has to be alien life throughout the universe, but I suspect much like on earth 99% of it is bacteria and insects, and in terms of actual intelligent life not even 1/50th of the human population would qualify for the position... but with trillions of galaxies and each with trillions of stars and most stars seeming to have planets orbiting them odds are there will be thousand of civilisations in this galaxy alone... as long as they don't kill each other before they get to the space age stage...
    Walther von Oldenburg
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    Post  Walther von Oldenburg on Wed Nov 28, 2018 12:57 pm

    Spacefaring civilizations would have basically no need for warfare.

    Distances between even closest stars are so astronomically huge that they are almost inaccessible with our laws of physics. A civilization that is advanced enough to travel efficiently at faster than light speed is probably so advanced that it could simply create matter out of nothing - if it can't then for every planet with inteligent life there are 1,000s possibly 10,000s of planets without it - I do not even count moons, comets, asteroids etc.

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    Post  GarryB on Sun Dec 02, 2018 3:29 am

    If the variety of life on earth is anything to go by, life from other planets could have developed in all sorts of different environments and resulted in some very different life forms... I mean look at trees and insects and spiders and reptiles... perhaps on a water covered planet the dominant intelligent form of life might be something like the octopus on earth... or the dolphin, or maybe it looks more like some of the species that have been extinct for thousands or millions of years... for some reason on their planet they didn't face the problem that removed them from the gene pool.

    Maybe different gravity, different air pressure, different chemical makeups of land, sea, or air led to totally different forms of life... maybe they are all plant based or reptile based or insect based... maybe even energy based.

    The real question you have to ask is why do the alien species travel the stars... is it conquest.... is it just raw materials to keep their civilisation growing... is it curiosity... keeping in mind that while Star Trek suggests it is curiosity... it normally either turns into conquest or trying to find resources that are useful.

    Lets face it... it is probably mining companies that will reach out the most... but I think most in the mining industry have a rather amusing view of space... I saw a programme on space colonisation where these guys were talking about asteroids and the mineral wealth they contain... what they don't mention that the asteroid fields you see in movies like Star Wars are bullshit... if you had to dodge and weave like that through a real asteroid field there would be so much mass there that it would relatively rapidly collapse and form major bodies like moons or planets.

    If our asteroid belt looked like the one in Star Wars there would be more rocky material in our solar system than there is matter in the sun. The orbital distance of the asteroid belt is huge... if it was full of matter lots more planets would have been formed.

    The reality is that you could be standing on an asteroid in our asteroid belt and not see another asteroid at all, or if you did it would be a tiny tiny dot.

    The fact is that there are a few big asteroids that might be worth a visit but the idea of zipping from one to another mining valuable metals and stones is bullshit the distances would be enormous.

    Most likely one big rock will be mined completely.... anything valuable will be launched on a trajectory passed earth that could be intercepted and collected... any rubbish material could be ground up into powder and launched in the opposite direction you wanted to move and therefore used as propellent to get to the next target asteroid.

    At best the alien life will be bacteria in this solar system, though some moons with oceans are potentially interesting subjects to talk about.
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    Post  starman on Tue Dec 18, 2018 3:57 pm

    nomadski wrote:
    I have said before , that I personally  have no problems in accepting the possibility of alien life on other planets........  Given the large number  of reliable cases involving police or military witnesses . Together with radar evidence .

    And landing traces etc.

    From many countries . I think that the possibility  that some of these UFO's are of extraterrestial origin exists

    The ETH is by far the best view.



    I have no problem thinking about alien abductions being true . Since our alien visitors seem to be ethical in conduct . Returning people unharmed .

    Not in all cases.....


    ( 1 )  Blaming fails in radar and aircraft and even nuclear silo on alien intervention . Rather than malfunctions and human error . The story sometimes involved gremlins . In the machine . But aliens are more believable..

    Smile No, I don't think so...not to most people.


    Last edited by starman on Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  starman on Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:01 pm

    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:
    Distances between even closest stars are so astronomically huge that they are almost inaccessible with our laws of physics.

    Our understanding of the laws and probably gravity specifically.

    A civilization that is advanced enough to travel efficiently at faster than light speed is probably so advanced that it could simply create matter out of nothing - if it can't then for every planet with inteligent life there are 1,000s possibly 10,000s of planets without it - I do not even count moons, comets, asteroids etc.

    True, interstellar travel means access to almost unlimited material resources. A naturally habitable world, however, is so rare it might be worth fighting over.
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    Post  starman on Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:10 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    The main problem is that the universe is huge and most of it is expanding away from us at an enormous rate...

    Well, our galaxy is "staying put" from our perspective and is probably large enough, with more than enough possible habitable planets, for ETs to appear.


    ....most of the stories I read about encounters with aliens I think are probably drug or alcohol related....

    Not according to investigators. Most witnesses are ordinary but credible people with no issues like that nor much (if any) prior knowledge of the phenomenon. Witnesses include professors, pilots, businessmen etc.



    why is it always some yokel in the middle of nowhere with grease smeared on his camera lens so he can never take a decent photo...

    There have been a number of clear photographs. As for sightings in less populated areas, that may be due to ET trying to minimize the risk of detection, or detection by many.

    I think statistically there has to be alien life throughout the universe,


    Right and the bulk of intelligent ET life is almost certainly much older, inasmuch as civilization here is a mere few thousand years old.
    Btw for a remarkably insightful look at this whole subject--one that really cuts through the bs we've been told for so long--see this. It's just a POD book, because no standard trade publisher would dare touch something this controversial:
    https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/1949483185/ref=tmm_pap_new_olp_0?ie=UTF8&condition=new8qid=&sr=

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