walle83 wrote:Russia has been delaying the Su-57 for years now. First it was 2015, then it was 2016...now they are talking about 2019? Becouse the lack of 5th generation engines?
The original plan was to offer them around 2015-2016 (and yes by then it was already a semi-mature design that could in principle be introduced into serial production) with the 4th-gen engines, with the 5th-gen ones being earmarked for 2020 abouts.
The RuAF evaluated it however and said that without the 5th-gen engines, it doesn't offer too much that the Su-35 doesn't offer; while costing a whole lot more.
You can see the same story with the Mi-38; a project which was around since the 90s, ready for production in the early 2000s - even when the partnership with the Europeans dissolved it wasn't a big hurdle. The main thing is that the RuAF had a look at it and said "you know this aircraft is great and everything, but the newest modifications of the Mi-17 series offer 95% of what it does, while costing only a fraction of the price".
And so as a result the Mi-38 has kept in limbo up until present time (and fully domestic engines have only become available for it very recently); last year I believe it was certified and has slowly entered production - I believe the RuAF is now wanting to trial a small batch before it decides its fate.
Well i would say becouse of the lack of cash. Lack of money leads to slow development that leads to things getting delayed, leading to fewer and fewer airframes getting orderd.
You can say whatever you desire.
But yes I guess it is a lack of cash. If the RuAF is not willing to order it and prefers to spend money instead on products that give it more value for the same amount of dough then I guess that counts doesn't it?
flamming_python wrote:Thats not really a fair comparisment. China and the US have no need for small corvettes with longe range missiles. They are filling thier navies with larger vessels for a different kind of warfare.
As for the 22800 it feels more of a panic replacement for the project 11356. When Ukraine stoped selling them engines for the larger vessels they had go small.
China probably could add long range missiles to their Type-056 corvettes if they wanted to, but its no need when they already have the larger frigates and destroyers doing that job.
So then what are you ragging on the Russians for? The Russians have developed the vessels they need, the Chinese the vessels they need.
Developing a blue-water navy is not a huge priority for Russia right now. It's still focused on the ex-Soviet space and the Middle East.
If Russia developed a blue-water doctrine then I'm sure as it focused the nation's efforts on reviving Soviet military might it surely would succeed and would rebuild the navy and shipyards pretty good.
But doing so is not cost-effective and is rather wasteful. Other aspects of the nation's military capabilities will also have to go on the back-burner. What will that blue-water navy give it right now? Strategic weapons, cruise and anti-ship missiles and new air defence systems pay far more dividends. The priority of Russia is countering NATO and the US Navy. It has to allocate its resources smartly. To a large extent, it can't afford the extravagances enjoyed by the Soviet Union which had a buffer of loyal Warsaw Pact allies in Europe.
Russia right now is building up new shipyards and reviving old ones. Shipyards in the Crimea that until 2014 were flapping around like fish on the beach are now revived and fulfilling orders. The one in Vladivostok is on its way too or already built; I believe Sevmash is also being expanded.
A new floating NPP has just been built in St. Petersburg; nuclear icebreakers before that. Civil stuff, but pretty large ships and with nuclear reactors. And built on time. Why can't they build a destroyer if they really want one?
The Mistral sections were being built on time too.
There are definitely successes in Russian shipbuilding to point to.
Subs are being built on time now.
If destroyers aren't being built and the Gorshkov or Ivan Gren or Lada sub are still undergoing trials then that just says that maybe the Russian navy lost interest in these projects and are looking at something else, and is just using the ships of these classes as experimental vessels to try different stuff with.
Frigates, landing/helicopter ships and new-gen diesel subs are all things Russia needs, but I guess it has some room for maneuver in all these aspects for now, and is aiming to get things right before committing to serial production.
Lider destroyers are something that are very necessary but there is no huge rush for them. Especially with the revival of the 2nd Kirov class cruiser and potential modernization of Udaloys/Sovremennys.
Get 2-3 Liders under the hammer by the early-2020s, then maybe a couple more by the late 2020s.
flamming_python wrote:Yeah, i would not give much hope for those replacement. As things are going right now i dont think we be seing any new russian destroyers before 2030. Also remember Russia is not famous for getting navy vessles finished in any hurry.
I wouldn't be so pessimistic.
flamming_python wrote:The J-20 is just following the rest of the timetable for the general PLA. Why woudnt a fighter be in service 7 years after its first flight?
Perhaps because they don't produce Su-35s themselves; so for all intents and purposes the J-20 is their best in every way domestically.
As for the Su-35 its hard to say, yes China could be wanting the tech for developing thier own fighters, but i think u really cant compare Su-35 and the J-20. The Su-35 is more of a air superiority fighter and the J-20 probably more of an stealth interceptor aircraft. But so far none really knows.
It's not hard to say. I'll tell you what they're interested in. The radar and the engines. To some extent maybe the missiles too.
What that says to me is that the J-20 is a 5th-gen aircraft but with some decidedly 4th-gen technologies; to the extent that the Russian MoD in the same position wouldn't acquire it, they would insist on 5th-gen engines as they are doing now, probably 3D TVC, more sensors and so on too.
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