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    Soviet SAM systems. What are your thoughts?

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    Isos

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    Re: Soviet SAM systems. What are your thoughts?

    Post  Isos on Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:33 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:The recent claims of electronic warfare in Syria had me thinking about how current and modernized AD-systems would work.
    And although IRST's were meant as a back-up, but could it also serve as a 3rd factor for authentication with respects to short-to-medium AD-systems?
    I mean we have the Search Radar then the Targeting Radar and finally the IRST.

    In Soviet times, perhaps the technology for identifying target at that range wasn't doable, but now with current IRST systems such a thing should be very simple.
    Or am i way off, what are your thoughts guys?

    You have different search radars in the integrated air def system. Before you turn on the search radar of your air defence system, you will use long range rdars like p-18 or Nebo which are much harder detected by fighters because they need a big antenna and are very long range 300-600km. Those radar will tell you where the fighters come from so you can guess if they are bad or friends.

    Then when they are in range you use the search radar of your system which will be detected by the fighters but if they are in range of missiles you don't care. They are short legs than the first one I mentioned. I think for pantsir it is something like around 50km and tracking radar at 28km. So it should be detected by passive RWR of fighters at 100km.

    When you jam a radar you have no idea if it works. The radar crew if well trained can go through your jaming. They can also use other radars to track you. They can also wait turned off and use optics to find you while and p-18 far away from both of you will give your position in real time.

    Moreover they don't need to identify you. If you jam the  ground radars it means you are a bad guy.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Soviet SAM systems. What are your thoughts?

    Post  GarryB on Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:24 am

    It simplier to use a thousand of cluster munitions inside the sa-5 and release them from 1km altitude to cover all the airfield.

    Of course it would be simpler to use cluster munitions... but not really effective.

    First of all how to you get a good even pattern spread of munitions?

    How do you ensure that 99% of those munitions don't just land in open ground and explode harmlessly?

    1% is likely to hit the runway,, but even then the chances of getting the air defence systems and aircraft sitting on the runway is poor.

    In Soviet times, perhaps the technology for identifying target at that range wasn't doable, but now with current IRST systems such a thing should be very simple.
    Or am i way off, what are your thoughts guys?

    What are you expecting the IRST to do?

    Basically, what it will do is detect hot spots... in the air it is probably an aircraft, but on the ground it could be a black coloured rock that has been heated up by the sun so that it stands out as a potential target.

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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Soviet SAM systems. What are your thoughts?

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sat Apr 21, 2018 6:04 am

    GarryB wrote:
    In Soviet times, perhaps the technology for identifying target at that range wasn't doable, but now with current IRST systems such a thing should be very simple.
    Or am i way off, what are your thoughts guys?

    What are you expecting the IRST to do?

    Basically, what it will do is detect hot spots... in the air it is probably an aircraft, but on the ground it could be a black coloured rock that has been heated up by the sun so that it stands out as a potential target.


    That's the thing, in the event of electronic warfare, like the one recently claimed in Syria, where fake boogies reportedly appeared, would the IRST be used as a visual authenticator before firing?
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    Isos

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    Re: Soviet SAM systems. What are your thoughts?

    Post  Isos on Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:55 am

    New post  GarryB Today at 2:24 am

    It simplier to use a thousand of cluster munitions inside the sa-5 and release them from 1km altitude to cover all the airfield.

    Of course it would be simpler to use cluster munitions... but not really effective.

    First of all how to you get a good even pattern spread of munitions?

    How do you ensure that 99% of those munitions don't just land in open ground and explode harmlessly?

    1% is likely to hit the runway,, but even then the chances of getting the air defence systems and aircraft sitting on the runway is poor.

    Well you can still add a gps/glonass receiver for each munitions and make them bigger.

    The chances are not poor to hit aircraft. If you want to destroy an airbase you don't use one missile but tens of them. And then you send some bombers finish the work.

    Ten missiles with hundreds cluster munitions inside them will destroy the runway unless if it misses by 2 km. The outdoor parked aircraft won't have a chance too. You can also mix warheads for your missiles some can be guided to destroy precise targets like air def systems or the middke of the runway.

    Depend from what altitude you release them, cluster munition can cover a large surface. Everything inside will be touched.

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