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    1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

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    Militarov

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Wed Mar 02, 2016 10:57 pm

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Sat Mar 05, 2016 6:15 pm



    Movie "Houston, We Have a Problem!" which claims that secret underground airfield Željava in Yugoslavia was home of secret space program.
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Fri Mar 11, 2016 9:17 pm

    All those weapons you like and praise in Middle East were product of once mighty 22,5million citizens country from Balcan, respected even on global scale, waging balance between two superpowers. How would world look if Yugoslavia still existed:

    "In an alternative universe, what if Yugoslavia still existed? NATO’s expansion, the Cold War still being waged, the so-called democratic western nations destroying freedoms in the name of democracy, we’re already living World War III. At this crucial juncture in history, it’s absolutely imperative that we examine what has transpired the last 25 years. Yugoslavia and western intervention there, is perhaps the best place to begin. This article calls to question the peace that might have been. More importantly, it calls to question whether or not peace was ever a democratic goal.

    Can you imagine Europe today with Yugoslavia as a key player among nations? I can. Yugoslavia was in fact, one of the greatest cultural and human experiments in history. Formed in the crucible that was the conflict in between the Austro-Hungarian Empire and the Ottoman Empire, Yugoslavia melded together people’s of both cultures, and in ways not seen since the time of Alexander the Great’s assimilation of peoples after immense conquest. The experiment, if I may call it that, lasted a little over half a century. The ideal was, to form a single state for all southern Slavic peoples. While Yugoslavia’s creation was partly a geo-strategic move on the part of Britain and France, in order to restrain or block Germany, the underlying idealism was sound and just. The provisions of the so-called “Corfu Declaration” called for what amounted to a constitutional monarchy not unlike England’s. Rights and suffrage, and core principles of something known as the Illyrian movement, were promising aspects of early Yugoslavia. Even though King Alexander would eventually suspend the constitution and elections, the melding of ethnic groups and cultures still showed promise. War, political machinations, internal and external pressures preyed heavily always on this fledgling world power. As has been the case in many such experiments, ultimately authoritarian rule became the necessity, even desirable.

    To end the history lesson, when the national hero turned Dictator and world celebrity, Josip Tito was firmly in control, Yugoslavia played on the world stage. Then when his power waned, opposing forces found their foothold. No scholars or politicians speak of it today, but Tito’s part in establishing the Non-Aligned Movement of nation states was magnanimous and extremely significant, especially for the people who now live in Croatia, Serbia, Montenegro, and the other former Yugoslav regions. I’ll get into this further along, but for now it seems important to outline this Non-Aligned Movement’s ideals.

    The NAM’s foundations were built in Belgrade in 1961 by the initial ideas of Tito’s Yugoslavia; India’s first prime minister, Jawaharlal Nehru; Indonesia’s first president, Sukarno; Egypt’s second president, Gamal Abdel Nasser; and Ghana’s first president Kwame Nkrumah. To be concise here, maybe reflecting one of NAM’s greatest proponents, Cuba’s Fidel Castro. In a speech given during the Havana Declaration of 1979, Castro laid out the real purpose behind NAM, saying the movement should strive for:

    “The national independence, sovereignty, territorial integrity and security of non-aligned countries” in their “struggle against imperialism, colonialism, neo-colonialism, racism, and all forms of foreign aggression, occupation, domination, interference or hegemony as well as against great power and bloc politics”

    So essentially, the NAM was to be an independent movement of nations in between the great powers, with the idea of negating the Cold War was in novel and interesting one. Of course the major powers engaged in this new political and idealistic warfare had at their core strategy, the inclusion of every one of these fledgling independents. As we see today, the battle goes on to fragment, divide and render powerless, countries and peoples everywhere on the globe. This can be seen most easily in the carving up of the former Yugoslavia, and in the fact the resulting states have shown no inclination to be part of NAM now. Instead, the EU and NATO have been the gravitational pull that moves Croatia and the others. We see the prevalence of “Cold War” strategy in the fact Belarus and Azerbaijan are the only two members of the Movement in Europe, Azerbaijan and Fiji being the most recent entrants, having joined back in 2011. However, the 2012 NAM Summit saw higher attendance than any previous year, a bit of a sign of our crisis time now, I expect. With a declared purpose of “world peace”, and fundamental rights and integrity as its dogma, NAM was and is a valid theoretical mediating framework. But let me return to the fantasy case for Yugoslavia now.

    Looking at the breakup of Yugoslavia in retrospect, framing what is Washington geo-strategy everywhere takes solid form. The Clinton administration’s actions at that time have been parlayed and propagandized with the same Orwellian “doublethink” the public is mystified with today. Reading Washington think tank propaganda like that of the Brookings Institute reveals this. In “Decision to Intervene: How the War in Bosnia Ended” from 1998, author Ivo H. Daalder begins:

    “While many have written eloquently and passionately to explain Washington’s—and the West’s—failure to stop the ethnic cleansing, the concentration camps, and the massacres of hundreds of thousands of civilians, few have examined why, in the summer of 1995, the United States finally did take on a leadership role to end the war in Bosnia.”

    The truth is a much simpler reality. No one needed a think tank to discover why President Bill Clinton hesitated to intercede in Bosnia. Clinton was in fact, continuing the policies of his predecessor, George Bush the senior, to destabilize the Yugoslavian socialist success. We know now that US covertly trained insurgents played a vital role in fragmenting the region via an organization known as the Atlantic Brigade, which fought in the Kosovo war at the side of the Kosovo Liberation Army (KLA), numbering some 400 armed fighters (Also see Christian Science Monitor 1999). There’s not space within this report to reveal the subterfuge and death dealing that came about because of US proxy wars in the former Yugoslavia. I will direct the reader to an expert.

    The decorated soldier and award winning journalist, Colonel David Hackworth (November 11, 1930 – May 4, 2005) was a war hero and defender of truth for the thousands and millions blown to pieces by these wars. “Hack”, as he was often called, was one of the most decorated soldiers in history having worn; 2 Distinguished Service Crosses, 10 Silver Stars, 8 Bronze Stars, 8 Purple Hearts, and 34 Air Medals, to name a few. A journalist for Newsweek and others, “Hack” was in the former Yugoslavia at the critical moment. This piece by him shines light on the lies the American people were told about Bush’s and Clinton’s war there.  Comparing US policy in the former Yugoslavia to that of Vietnam, Hackworth uses the case of Sgt. Richard Casini, a recon trooper in Kosovo who stepped on a mine. In this singular incident, we see what we know now as a “ritual” of lying propaganda to mislead Americans and the world. When the boy’s dad was notified of his son’s injuries, “Your boy is being flown to Germany on the general’s jet,” was the news he got. Unfortunately, “Hack” was contacted later by Sgt. Casini, who had lost a foot, and learned how the boy had been flown to the hospital on a cargo plane wedged in between crates.

    David Hackworth is gone now, he succumbed to cancer a few years back. The legacy of “soldiers against war” goes on, only with different proponents like those at Veterans Today and elsewhere. As for Bill Clinton’s playing at reluctance in the region once known as Yugoslavia, the sordid history of genocide and graft seems endless now. Another story I found, the tale of a Frenchman who trained with the Atlantic Brigade, it calls to mind Ukraine, Libya, and Syria of late. You see “patterns” lead us to the truth more often than not, ask any criminal profiler. The ghastly killing fields of the legitimate country of Yugoslavia, the investments in carving up the pieces left over, stain the hands of US presidents, British lords, and neo-Nazi German industrialists.

    In an interview with a French mercenary names “Jacques’, Jean-Luc Porte reported back in 1999 how the US backed “Atlantic Brigade” was formed up. The skin head killer of Serbs and Croatians, by his own admission, outlines for us how fascism and Nazis akin to those seen in Ukraine of late, made up a killing brigade effecting the dismemberment of a former great nation. Wounded, rethinking his service to the cause, the Frenchman who joined other multinationals in Albania bore the mark of “HOS for Ustashis,” a proud brand of Croatian Nazis who joined the Germans in World War II. Not unlike the Banderites of the Ukraine crisis, the various proxy wars in the Balkans were manned by lethal killers from abroad. And top American officials knew full well the breed of murderers they pulled the strings on in Kosovo and throughout the Balkans. Yugoslavia, you see, became the template for Afghanistan and Iraq, Arab Spring, and the current anti-Russia onslaught. The names of Madeleine Albright, Javier Solana, General Wesley Clark and others continue to reverberate. In the former Yugoslavia the friends of key players in government planned a literal carving feast of potential creditor nations and investment bonanzas. The tale of this genocide in the name of democracy is almost too awful to speak of. Most of the people of these nations were set back 200 years, into a kind of medieval existence without hope. The only glimmer of possibility for most former Yugoslavians is quite naturally, the EU and its NATO protectors.

    As I write this American, Brit and German planners are already carving up Syria. This Rand Corporation plan is not surprisingly clinical, even matter of fact, about partitioning a sovereign state. For those unaware, Rand Corporation is the Big Brother of all hegemonic think tanks. If you see it in print from these guys, the US military industrial complex invested money in it – period. Certainly there was genocide on both sides of the Albania-Kosovo conflict, as well as the other wars in the Balkans. This is not the point really, for the totality of catastrophe is what I am focused on. First of all the people of the united Yugoslavia no longer have any real voice. Secondly, the breakup of that nation has led to the death or dislocation of millions now. This is another story. But my “fantasy” Yugoslavia should be an eye opener. Let me conclude.

    Yugoslavia was built on an idea that Southern Slavs would not remain a weak and divided people. A united nation of Yugoslavia was not easy prey for imperialist intentions like we see taking place today. It is a fact, that after World War II, socialist Yugoslavia became something of a European success story. Between 1960 and 1980 the country had one of the most vigorous growth rates in the world: a decent standard of living, free medical care and education, a guaranteed right to a job, one-month vacation with pay, a literacy rate of over 90 percent, and a life expectancy of 72 years. To my knowledge, not one of the Balkans states that were created can claim half this prosperity. It was this prosperity which caused western interests to want to destroy Yugoslavia.

    Yugoslavia’s multi-ethnic citizenry also had affordable public transportation, housing, and utilities. The not-for-profit economy was mostly publicly owned, not exactly the poster child for western democratic love obviously. The county could not be allowed to compete with Germany, France, and especially Britain, and the London and Luxembourg bankers could not extract their billions in a socialistic system. Yugoslavia had to die, and the Reagans, Bushs, and Clintons helped make it happen. Award winning author, political scientist, and Visiting Fellow at the Institute for Policy Studies in Washington, D.C., Michael Parenti has outlined the Yugoslavia disaster many times. According to Parenti, the U.S. goal has been to transform the Yugoslav nation into a Third-World region:

    incapable of charting an independent course of self-development;
    a shattered economy and natural resources completely accessible to multinational corporate exploitation, including the enormous mineral wealth in Kosovo;
    an impoverished, but literate and skilled population forced to work at subsistence wages, constituting a cheap labor pool that will help depress wages in western Europe and elsewhere;
    dismantled petroleum, engineering, mining, fertilizer, and automobile industries, and various light industries, that offer no further competition with existing Western producers.
    Does this strategy sound familiar? Remember the Rand Corporation plan for Syria. Were Ukraine, Donbass, and Crimea understood before the Euromaidan? What is the plan for Russia? This is where the metal meets the meat my friends. In the Balkans catastrophe the West demonized the Serbs. In Libya it was Colonel Muammar Gaddafi, in Syria it is Assad, and the pattern goes on with Vladimir Putin as the biggest trophy head to put on some banker’s den wall. If that sounds contrite, I am sorry, this is the world we live in now. By the power of sleeping American citizens drugged stupid with worthless trinkets of super-capitalism – the world is being taken over by tyrants.



    But what if Yugoslavia had survived? What if the great ethnic-socialist experiment had worked? It’s safe to say our world would be totally different today. For one thing, the EU with the Non-Aligned Movement of nation states (NAM) operating within its current boarders would be less potent, far less influential geo-politically. All of Europe might have led to Belgrade, and from there into the six republics now fighting for crumbs from Brussels. To galvanize how my fantasy Yugoslavian nation might look, I’ll leave you with the relative economic situations of current Balkans states, and the Yugoslavia GDP in 1991, positioned at 24th among world nations. As former President Ronald Reagan used to say; “Are you better off?”

    As of 2015, Bosnia and Herzegovina is 112th economically, and conditions are worsening. Still the poor Bosnians think joining the EU will solve all problems. Croatia is currently 76th in the world economically, but Bloomberg just named the country one of the 10 worst on Earth. Macedonia ranks 130th, with agriculture being the only real industry, unemployment in the country is above 30%. Montenegro, despite the sheer beauty of the tiny country, is 149th among world nations. Like some other former republics, Montenegro believes EU ascension will solve everything. Serbia is ranked 87th in GDP, and seems more stable in many regards than her contemporaries. Slovenia ranks 81st in GDP, and is for some a potential miracle if tourism and other industries continue to grow there.

    From a personal perspective, I recall a moment of prosperity in the former Yugoslavia, the 1984 Olympics at Sarajevo. Those were the first Winter Olympics ever held in a Communist nation, as I recall. The torch relay through Dubrovnik, then Split, Ljubljana, Zagreb, and countless other Yugoslavian cities, culminated in a proud moment in Sarajevo. The names of the gold medal athletes there have become blurred in my mind now, but the little wolf mascot Vučko, created by the Slovenian painter Jože Trobec is framed in my mind’s eye for some reason. A cartoon here in Yugoslavia at the time, the little wolf represented the people of these Balkans nations well. Wolves are prominent in Yugoslavian fables, they are the embodiment of courage and strength and the also symbolize winter. And as I type these final letters, I think about what the courageous and strong people of Yugoslavia might have won had their destinies not been interrupted by outsiders? All I know is, 24th place is a far cry from 149th in the Olympics. As for Yugoslavia, that nation is gone forever."


    Source: http://m.journal-neo.org/2016/02/22/a-yugoslavian-fantasy-24th-versus-149th-place/
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    Militarov

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Mon Mar 14, 2016 11:50 pm



    Suprisingly so many pro-Serbian comments on this video, quite rare sight.
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Mon Mar 14, 2016 11:55 pm

    Militarov wrote:

    Suprisingly so many pro-Serbian comments on this video, quite rare sight.

    Which puts in to question the legitimacy of Kosovo independence. It's been said that 1/3rd of the refugee's in Europe are from the mafia state of Kosovo, and the whole purpose of the fraudulent independence was to install the Bondsteel base. Hence the reason why I refuse to call them Kosovars, I refer to them as ethnic 'Bondsteelians'.
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Tue Mar 15, 2016 11:19 am



    Serbian monasteries on Kosovo
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Werewolf on Tue Mar 15, 2016 7:02 pm

    Do you even know how many kosovarians are here in germany from all yugos? There are like 80% kosovarians and bosnians, the rest are serbs but almost all off them refer to themselfs as yugos rarely anything else except serbs.
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:18 pm

    Werewolf wrote:Do you even know how many kosovarians are here in germany from all yugos? There are like 80% kosovarians and bosnians, the rest are serbs but almost all off them refer to themselfs as yugos rarely anything else except serbs.

    I wonder why actually. They tend to bark on Yugoslavia alot when they come home during summer Very Happy
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Werewolf on Wed Mar 16, 2016 11:17 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:Do you even know how many kosovarians are here in germany from all yugos? There are like 80% kosovarians and bosnians, the rest are serbs but almost all off them refer to themselfs as yugos rarely anything else except serbs.

    I wonder why actually. They tend to bark on Yugoslavia alot when they come home during summer Very Happy

    That is exactly what i get here, lot bitching about Yugoslavia but at the same time weird relationships to germany and yugoslavia, but from part of them i hear alot of pro-russia stuff, to some part some are not as random as they strike one, care for politics and the fact that US(NATO) committed warcrime against Yugo's at the same time trying to be uptodate on politics, which the germans literally do not do unless you ask the old reservists of the Bundeswehr, they are surprisingly uptodate and with more correct informations than you would expect, certainly not consumers of CIA financed german propaganda.
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Thu Mar 17, 2016 10:37 pm

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Sat Mar 19, 2016 1:54 am



    International forces posting in front of burning Serbian house March 18. 2004. After huge campagin aganist remaining Serbs across Kosovo another 100.000 Serbs left their homes during next year, some 5000 directly caused by this unrest. 16 Serbs were killed and 900 wounded, another 11 Albanians were killed during self defence by Serbs or by Police/Italian soldiers (one fell and died while trying to climb church to cut down the Cross). 35 monasteries got burned and about 1000 houses.



    Devič Monastery burned, built in 1434.



    Serbian part of Prizren

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:25 pm

    "BREAKING: German police have arrested 3 persons from Kosovo in a Belgian car near Rosenheim after receiving a tip off of a possible terror attack."

    Ill leave it here Suspect
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed Mar 23, 2016 3:07 am

    Militarov wrote:"BREAKING: German police have arrested 3 persons from Kosovo in a Belgian car near Rosenheim after receiving a tip off of a possible terror attack."

    Ill leave it here Suspect

    Surprise, failed state Kosovo produces more (than usual) Frankensteinian abominations...
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Fri Mar 25, 2016 11:24 pm

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Tue Mar 29, 2016 3:54 pm

    In the article “Kurdistan – Turkey’s Kosovo” Prof. Sotirović compared different aspects of Turkish Kurdistan case to the Kosovo one, found some parallels and pointed out Turkey’s hypocrisy.
    While Prof. Sotirović is right in his assessment that Turkey is hypocritical to say at least, he failed to expose the fundamental differences between Kurdistan and Kosovo. His article contains some inaccuracies, misinterpretations and lacks in detail. Such an imprecise comparison may lead a reader who is not familiar with Balkans to acquire a false impression. A reader might come to conclusion that Kosovo Albanians had experienced the same level of suffering and injustice as did the Kurds which later led them to rebellion. That would seriously mislead the readers . To substantiate this view let’s point out few errors in the article in question.

    Status of the minority

    "Stubborn reluctance of any kind of the Turkish government to recognize the Kurdish separate existence as the ethnic group of its own specific language and culture… The Turkish rejection to recognize a minority status of the Kurds with granting a national-cultural or political autonomous status for Turkey’s Kurdistan… Ankara’s discrimination and oppressive anti-Kurdish policy led finally to the establishment of the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (the PKK) in 1978 for the sake to fight for unrecognized the Kurdish minority rights“

    Albanians were in a completely opposite situation. Its ethnic minority in Yugoslavia was recognized. Their language was recognized too. Albanians did have their ethnic state, Albania, while Kurds never enjoyed such privilege. Besides, Albanian minority had their own unique ethnic university in Kosovo since 1969 (no Western “democracies” have ever allowed its minorities to establish universities). In 1974, to appease endless Albanian minority irredentism and their sporadic violence, the Yugoslav government carved out a part of historic Serbian land of Kosovo as Albanian autonomous province (this act can be compared to Khrushchev’s selfish donation of Crimea to Ukraine in 1954).
    Nevertheless, Albanians, inspired by anti-Yugoslav circles in the West, renewed disorders in 1981 demanding federalization. Please take note that 1981 was long before strongman Milosevic appeared. In fact, Milosevic rose to power in 1989 promising people that he would put an end to Albanian violence in Kosovo. So if we compare humiliated Kurds in Turkey and privileged Albanians prior to their insurgency in 1981, we must say the two cases are fundamentally different.



    Serbian grandmother Anna weeps at the graves of twin infants dug up by Albanian attackers in Grace in Kosovo, 1988.

    The bellicose component:

    … the KLA [Kosovo Liberation Army] – a typical terrorist organization as a replica of the PKK, the IRA, the ETA or the Hezbollah.


    This is implicitly wrong. KLA is a paramilitary wing of deeply-rooted Albanian mafia (for better understanding of the history, nature and cultural background of Albanian mafia please read very insightful Jana Arsovska’s article “Gender-based subordination and trafficking of women in ethnic Albanian context. The upward revaluation of the Kanun morality” [Journal of Moving Communities, vol.6, No.1, May 2006]). his new brand name, Kosovo Liberation Army, was coined for mere propaganda purposes. The intent was to give a false impression to the western audience that the US-backed project was actually a fight for someone’s freedom, which, if true, would be a legitimate cause. KLA (read Albanian mafia) was armed, trained, and injected into Yugoslavia by CIA. They still keep supporting it up-to-date in its citadel of Kosovo. By contrast, the name of Kurdish Workers Party reflects the Marxist ideology of their leader. The name does not appear to have been fashioned to appeal to tastes of Western mainstream media propaganda consumers.

    Number of victims

    For the matter of comparison, during the Kosovo crisis in 1998−1999 both the West and the US saw the terror acts carried out only by Serbia’s government…


    If we compare tens of thousands of obliterated and hundreds of thousands expelled Kurdish civilians in Turkey from 1978-present with the “terror acts carried out by Serbia’s government”, the picture will not be that impressive:
    “One year later, the International War Crimes Tribunal, a body in effect set up by NATO, announced that the final count of bodies found in Kosovo’s “mass graves” was 2,788. This included combatants on both sides, Serbs and Roma murdered by the Albanian KLA as well…” (John Pilger, Reminders of Kosovo) In addition, can any of the following terror-related facts justify the struggle for self-determination?

    “Indeed, even as Blair the war leader was on a triumphant tour of “liberated” Kosovo, the KLA was ethnically cleansing more than 200,000 Serbs and Roma from the province. Last February the “international community”, led by the US, recognized Kosovo, which has no formal economy and is run, in effect, by criminal gangs that traffic in drugs, contraband and women. But it has one valuable asset: the US military base Camp Bondsteel, described by the Council of Europe’s human rights commissioner as “a smaller version of Guantanamo” (John Pilger, Don’t Forget Yugoslavia)

    Guests on the land

    … [Kurds are] the oldest population in Turkey living in Anatolia almost 3.000 years before the first (Seljuk) Turks came there at the end of the 11th century.
    For the matters of accuracy, we should also remark that the state in 1999 was Yugoslavia, and not Serbia.


    Opposite is the case of Kosovo Albanians. According to a Turkish census made in Kosovo in 1455 (!), there were 13,000 Serb households and only 46 Albanian there. Since Kovoso Albanians obtained factual “independence” in 1999, they are busy desecrating, detonating and turning into rubble the unique medieval Serbian churches and monasteries throughout Kosovo. Only four of many Serbian monasteries in Kosovo are included in the UNESCO World Heritage list, but they are still endangered despite kind of protection from the international peacekeeping forces. Hundreds of other Serbian cultural sites there are subject to total elimination due to barbaric Albanian “self-determination”. In this sense Kosovo should be compared not to Kurdistan, but Daesh/ISIS.

    Source: http://orientalreview.org/2016/03/28/kosovo-is-not-serbias-kurdistan-but-balkans-isdaesh/
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Godric on Tue Mar 29, 2016 6:27 pm

    Hey Militarov what are the feelings of ordinary Serbs in regards to Radovan Karadzic ? ... as I said before the whole reporting on the former Yugoslavia in the West was very one sided back then social media was not what it is today 17 years on from the bombing of Serbia and Montenegro
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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Tue Mar 29, 2016 6:45 pm

    Godric wrote:Hey Militarov what are the feelings of ordinary Serbs in regards to Radovan Karadzic ? ... as I said before the whole reporting on the former Yugoslavia in the West was very one sided back then social media was not what it is today 17 years on from the bombing of Serbia and Montenegro

    Uh, nice and hard question at the same time. But ill try to form some kind of picture for you.

    As i am originally from Bosnia and Herzegovina, my family actually, as i was just a kid during 1991. war i came to see two sides of medal regarding Serbs as nation. Serbs in Bosnia and Herzegovina (at least its part Republic of Serbs( people praise Radovan as some his actions saved thousands of lives, not only his but also few other "war criminals" as they portray them on the West. Did bad things happen in that war? For sure they did, however there is deeper reason for that happening. In 1941. villages in Bosnia and Herzegovina and todays Croatia that had Serbian population were massacred, belive it or not Germans and Italians on more than few occasions were the one trying to defend Serbs from Croats and Muslims. Very few or none were punished for thousands and thousands dead in those massacres.. so imagine hatred that was growing in many common people that lost father, older brother... mom?

    So when war broke up more than few took justice in their own hands if they got a chance. It was almost never organised by military or police, and those happenings were quite sporadic. Take note also that many "mass graveyards" were actually just mass graves for dead combatants, or ppl that died from desease, noone was going to dig separate graves if you have 30 dead people, however post war they all became "Victims of Serbian butchers".

    However as you cross into Serbia, you will hear more and more of "Filthy Serbs from Republic of Serbs killing those innocent Croats and Bosniaks". Simply coz they never saw war with their own eyes, never lost anyone from family in those wars etc etc, reasons are countless. So lets say like this 85% of Serbs in Republic of Serbs support Radovan and consider him their warleader that saved them, in Serbia itself its more like 60ish...% maybe even less, since they barely ever were in any threat during Yugoslav civil war so they dont even care whatsoever. Also Serbs in Serbia would sell their mothers for sack of potatoes if chance would appear. Not all naturally but sadly big percentage is like that.

    In my personal opinion, if you care for it anyways, is that Radovan Karadžić was right man in a wrong time, so to say. Him and Ratko Mladić probably saved more Muslim lives than anyone during that war, however you wont hear that from anyone ever, especially not in the west. My father that served in that war was giving his field rations to Croats in village they were stationed at, later after the war they claimed in Dubrovnik how they were tortured, kept in 1 room and similar stuff.

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Godric on Tue Mar 29, 2016 7:54 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    Godric wrote:Hey Militarov what are the feelings of ordinary Serbs in regards to Radovan Karadzic ? ... as I said before the whole reporting on the former Yugoslavia in the West was very one sided back then social media was not what it is today 17 years on from the bombing of Serbia and Montenegro

    Uh, nice and hard question at the same time. But ill try to form some kind of picture for you.

    As i am originally from Bosnia and Herzegovina, my family actually, as i was just a kid during 1991. war i came to see two sides of medal regarding Serbs as nation. Serbs in Bosnia and Herzegovina (at least its part Republic of Serbs( people praise Radovan as some his actions saved thousands of lives, not only his but also few other "war criminals" as they portray them on the West. Did bad things happen in that war? For sure they did, however there is deeper reason for that happening. In 1941. villages in Bosnia and Herzegovina and todays Croatia that had Serbian population were massacred, belive it or not Germans and Italians on more than few occasions were the one trying to defend Serbs from Croats and Muslims. Very few or none were punished for thousands and thousands dead in those massacres.. so imagine hatred that was growing in many common people that lost father, older brother... mom?

    So when war broke up more than few took justice in their own hands if they got a chance. It was almost never organised by military or police, and those happenings were quite sporadic. Take note also that many "mass graveyards" were actually just mass graves for dead combatants, or ppl that died from desease, noone was going to dig separate graves if you have 30 dead people, however post war they all became "Victims of Serbian butchers".

    However as you cross into Serbia, you will hear more and more of "Filthy Serbs from Republic of Serbs killing those innocent Croats and Bosniaks". Simply coz they never saw war with their own eyes, never lost anyone from family in those wars etc etc, reasons are countless. So lets say like this 85% of Serbs in Republic of Serbs support Radovan and consider him their warleader that saved them, in Serbia itself its more like 60ish...% maybe even less, since they barely ever were in any threat during Yugoslav civil war so they dont even care whatsoever. Also Serbs in Serbia would sell their mothers for sack of potatoes if chance would appear. Not all naturally but sadly big percentage is like that.

    In my personal opinion, if you care for it anyways, is that Radovan Karadžić was right man in a wrong time, so to say. Him and Ratko Mladić probably saved more Muslim lives than anyone during that war, however you wont hear that from anyone ever, especially not in the west. My father that served in that war was giving his field rations to Croats in village they were stationed at, later after the war they claimed in Dubrovnik how they were tortured, kept in 1 room and similar stuff.


    a lot of atrocities against Serbs were hushed up in the Bosnian conflict ... apart from 1 incident where a entire village of Serbs were murdered by Croats and Colonel Bob Stewart opened fire on the Croats outside the village after he told the croat commander what he thought of him and his mens actions and their were also reports of muslims butchering Serbs and that was hushed up as well .... I fully understand Serbs feelings towards Croats/Muslims you have been victims for hundreds of years by these people ... I have this book about the Waffen SS "Loyalty is my Honor" I bought it because I wanted to understand why they did it .... and several sections go on about Croats and their treatment of Serbs .... complaints were made to OKB and Himmler about Croats being inhuman and that coming from the Waffen SS .... I like to think of myself to being open minded ... I don't like being told from just the one side
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    nemrod

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  nemrod on Fri Apr 15, 2016 12:57 am

    During Kosovo's war, serbian army downed two -as Pierre Sprey- F-117, and one B-2 A, but for evident geopolitic reasons US could not admit..







    These are the true concret result of NATO bombing's campaign agaisnt Serbia in 1999.

    As you can realize, -this is what I claimed for a while - the damage on the serbian army was at most very very low. In fact the serbian army was completely  intact, and ready to resist US agression against this little country, in a fair ground battle. But US did not want, in fact they feared serbian ground forces. The US coward trap on Iraqi army in Kuwait during Desert Storm few years before did not function against serbian army. For US it was like a joker, you could use it only once, but not twice times. After the losses of F-117s and the B-2 NATO aircrafts bombed at higher altitude, but at this range, the bombardments were completely inaccurate. Now, Talk me about the so called effectiveness of this shits of A-10 Warthog, M1 Abrams, or F-16, or F-15 E, F-15 C etc.... Nothing,... just a hype.
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    Militarov

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Fri Apr 15, 2016 3:39 am



    Enjoy "nice" movie about Serbs and 1999. Smile
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    VladimirSahin

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  VladimirSahin on Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:25 am

    Militarov wrote:

    Enjoy "nice" movie about Serbs and 1999. Smile

    First thing I will watch when I get home from work Laughing
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    Militarov

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:41 pm

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    Militarov

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Mon Apr 25, 2016 8:32 pm



    Eternal glory to the heroes from Košare



    Members of 63rd para brigade of Yugoslav army

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    Militarov

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Militarov on Wed Apr 27, 2016 4:24 pm

    "Gen. David Goldfein, a battle-tested command pilot who flew combat missions in the Gulf War, the Afghanistan War, and in NATO's 1999 air war to force the president of the former Yugoslavia to end his campaign of ethnic cleansing in Kosovo, has been nominated to be the service's next chief of staff, the Pentagon said Tuesday.

    If approved, Goldfein will succeed Gen. Mark Welsh, who is retiring July 1. He has been the Air Force's vice chief of staff since August 2015.

    "I'm extremely humbled by the nomination to serve as the Air Force's 21st chief of staff," Goldfein said in an Air Force release. "If confirmed, I pledge to serve our airmen and their families unwaveringly and honor our remarkable heritage and legacy of integrity, service and excellence."



    Air Force Secretary Deborah Lee James and Welsh also lauded Goldfein's selection in the release.

    "Gen. Goldfein possesses the experience and vision needed to address dynamic global challenges and increasing military demand," James said. "He knows how to build and sustain key partnerships, has important warfighting experience, and will exercise the critical judgment required to balance our manpower and resources as we shape tomorrow's Air Force. There is not a better person to lead our airmen into the next century of airpower dominance."


    So, guy that was shot down over Yugoslavia is to become commander of US Airforce.






    Source: http://www.airforcetimes.com/story/military/2016/04/26/goldfein-nominated-next-chief-staff/83542108/
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    Grazneyar

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

    Post  Grazneyar on Wed Apr 27, 2016 7:40 pm

    General David Joofein ? Well I never did ! A worthless propagandist who has been 'tested' in combat (and failed), is now leading anti-Russia propaganda in the airforce is a joo. I would never have guessed.

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    Re: 1999 NATO bombing of Yugoslavia

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