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    andalusia

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    Post  andalusia on 10/07/19, 12:25 pm

    This is a good explanation of what the US empire is all about:

    http://www.unz.com/mhudson/the-world-bank-and-imf-2019/
    Walther von Oldenburg
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    Post  Walther von Oldenburg on 10/07/19, 06:58 pm

    I really suggest you watch the show before passing a verdict. Anti Soviet/Russian bias in Chernobyl is very subtle, more like K-19, nothing like some more known Hollywood movies about Russia.
    flamming_python
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    Post  flamming_python on 10/07/19, 11:15 pm

    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:I really suggest you watch the show before passing a verdict. Anti Soviet/Russian bias in Chernobyl is very subtle, more like K-19, nothing like some more known Hollywood movies about Russia.

    It's a good fictional work.

    And it does portray many of the ordinary Soviet workers, soldiers, officers as heroes. Even some officials sympathetically.

    But at it's core is the message 'the cost of lies'. And then it goes ahead and lies itself and makes a whole bunch of stuff up that never happened.

    Regular
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    Post  Regular on 12/07/19, 04:44 pm

    flamming_python wrote:
    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:I really suggest you watch the show before passing a verdict. Anti Soviet/Russian bias in Chernobyl is very subtle, more like K-19, nothing like some more known Hollywood movies about Russia.

    It's a good fictional work.

    And it does portray many of the ordinary Soviet workers, soldiers, officers as heroes. Even some officials sympathetically.

    But at it's core is the message 'the cost of lies'. And then it goes ahead and lies itself and makes a whole bunch of stuff up that never happened.


    It did have artistic freedom. For me it was amazing show. It humanised soviets without using retarded accents. It showed Soviet military as competent force who gets the job done no matter how adverse it is. It portrayed Gorbachev and his close men as incompetent to deal with such scale disaster. This true as this man was useless! While it praised the simple men, it totally went overboard with apparatchiks and KGB. 86s Soviet union was a shitshow, but KGB wasn't as threatening and system was still functional, unlike in 89s when it was completelly falling apart..
    Anyways, Chernobyl is best western tv show ever made when it comes to quality, suspension and authenticity and not just about USSR.
    To think that it's anti-Soviet is to defend Gorbachev.
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    Post  kvs on 13/07/19, 03:29 am



    Western "liberals" accuse Russia of not acknowledging global warming. Here is the in-your-face proof that this is BS.
    Putin in his speech is 100% on the ball with the reality of anthropogenic global warming. In fact, he states facts that
    western politicians avoid as being too alarmist.

    Russia is warming 2.5 times faster than the global average and this is already having negative impacts. The NATO
    hate propaganda about Russia denying global warming is pure blood libel. The same blood libel that the west has
    been spewing at Russia for centuries.

    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov on 13/07/19, 04:10 am

    There is no plan for Brazil and the SU-57, never was such a thing could happen in the future but that's just Vann being well Vann.

    Putin DID offer the SU-57 to the Turks tho, if the F-35 deal falls apart.

    Which is just utterly ridiculous, has a guy who works for the US.

    Selling your Stealth fighter tech to a NATO ally is just beyond stupid.

    We have said IF the turks touch an S-400 we will not deliver any F-35's.

    Assuming the bosses stay true to those words.

    Putin may very well soon be selling Russian Stealth technology to a NATO ally. Which I hope his defense minister will tell him "No, that's a terrible idea we may has well just give Washington the data at that point".
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    Post  GarryB on 13/07/19, 05:13 am

    Turkey is a component builder of F-35s so there are secrets to be had both ways.

    The Russians are not idiots... they wont be including secret components and they certainly wont be including secret operational codes that could be used against them.

    What they are doing is undermining the trust between the US and Turkey, which might pay off dividends in the future... if Russia can lure a few countries in NATO to buy their products then that is a huge plus because planning and fighting against stuff you are familiar with is much easier because you have a better understanding of how it can be used and what its strong points are.

    The US started this by telling all its NATO allies not to buy Russian equipment and that they need to get Soviet equipment out of their inventories... preferably by buying US shit.

    If Turkey buys Su-57s it will almost certainly contribute a lot of their own equipment in its design.

    Russian experience with the Su-30MKI with french and israeli components and systems being added certainly contributed to making their own effort... the Su-35 and ultimately Su-57 better aircraft... they raised the bar...

    Some technology and secrets might have been compromised but secrets get out whether you sell the equipment or not... MiG-31 secrets got into western hands without a single export sale...

    Equally a good example is the sale of Tunguska to Britain and S-300V to the US... they didn't get the complete battery with all the sensors and systems and decoys and jammers and support equipment, so they have an idea of the performance, but not really enough to say they can defeat them...
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    Post  Regular on 13/07/19, 06:04 am

    kvs wrote:

    Western "liberals" accuse Russia of not acknowledging global warming.    Here is the in-your-face proof that this is BS.
    Putin in his speech is 100% on the ball with the reality of anthropogenic global warming.   In fact, he states facts that
    western politicians avoid as being too alarmist.

    Russia is warming 2.5 times faster than the global average and this is already having negative impacts.   The NATO
    hate propaganda about Russia denying global warming is pure blood libel.    The same blood libel that the west has
    been spewing at Russia for centuries.


    Global warming is not man made and the one we are having now has little negative impact on Russia. It should help with the explotation of resources and farming. Doom and gloom about extinction is only heard in West and used only just to extort their taxpayers.
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    nero

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    Post  nero on 14/07/19, 03:23 am

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:Putin may very well soon be selling Russian Stealth technology to a NATO ally. Which I hope his defense minister will tell him "No, that's a terrible idea we may has well just give Washington the data at that point".
    The entire process of metallurgy and manufacturing these devices is a secret. You won't be able to gain much from having one as an example, asides from some operational knowledge of how they work (~ish. The code isn't open-source either, you know).
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on 14/07/19, 04:06 am

    Isos wrote:https://mobile.twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1149733696305598464

    Good thread to understabd the s-400 for Turkey.



    Ragıp Soylu
    @ragipsoylu
    S-400s, a story:

    Everything started when Turkey downed a Russian jet, Su-24 in Nov 2015 for violating its airspace. Russians were repeatedly bombarding Turkman-led rebel groups by using Turkish airspace. Ankara issued several warnings. Then downed a jet.

    What was US reaction?

    US officials, on the record,  initially supported Turkey’s arguments. But had different talking points while briefing reporters on background.

    US defense officials undermined Turkey’s claim and said Russian jet was in Syrian airspace when it was hit. So much for NATO solidarity

    What else US thought of Turkey’s downing the Russian jet?

    They thought it was an overreaction to “a minor violation of its airspace”

    What about NATO?

    Oh, they were generous. They sent an air defence package against Russian incursions following the jet incident, including AWACS.

    But NATO diplomats WORRIED Ankara was too aggressive to defend its airspace against the repeated violations

    Next, Germany/Luxembourg declared that Turkey cannot count on NATO support if there is a conflict with Russia in Syria.

    “NATO cannot allow itself to be pulled into a military escalation with Russia as a result of tensions between the two”

    Briefly: You cannot invoke article 4


    Btw, US and Germany earlier in October 2015, a month before the downing of the jet, pulled their missile defense systems from Turkey.

    Not only US and NATO didn’t want to support Turkey against Russia, they also didn’t want to keep their missile defense systems in the country



    Not finished. But too long to post all the thread, you can see the link for the whole story.

    The whole "violated airspace" is complete discredited bullshit. Turkish govt. apologized and admitted it was a lie, moreover the Turks are the last people that should talk about violating airspace, as they've been violating the airspace of Iraq, Syria, and the Greek/Agean Archipelago islands for years.
    kvs
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    Post  kvs on 14/07/19, 05:05 am

    Cobalt bomb

    This is an older article but I have seen some other recent talk on this subject.

    This is pure anti-Russian propaganda. Russia has no reason to build some fancy dirty bomb. It is a certainty that it is the lunatics in NATO
    who are building cobalt bombs to apply "Carthago delenda est" to Russia. It is modern Rome, aka NATO, that wants to poison Russian
    land with salt and root out Russia from existence.

    By the logic of MAD Russia would need to build its own. But it should not do so. If NATO does use cobalt bombs on Russia, Russia should
    seize NATO lands as compensation. This would be a better solution to the NATO lunatic problem than throwing cobalt bombs on NATO.

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    Post  SeigSoloyvov on 14/07/19, 06:28 am

    nero wrote:
    SeigSoloyvov wrote:Putin may very well soon be selling Russian Stealth technology to a NATO ally. Which I hope his defense minister will tell him "No, that's a terrible idea we may has well just give Washington the data at that point".
    The entire process of metallurgy and manufacturing these devices is a secret. You won't be able to gain much from having one as an example, asides from some operational knowledge of how they work (~ish. The code isn't open-source either, you know).

    That is looking at it in an extremely limited view.

    The Turks could easily hand over data and specs that would severely compromise the aircraft and their stealth tech. They are ways to get more than enough from one sample, sure you can't get EVERY single thing but you can get close to 90 percent of the details.

    But hey if you think that's a good idea, then Let Russia sell their stealth fighter to a NATO ally, when we get our hands on all the information and we will just makes the airplanes worthless

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    Post  GarryB on 14/07/19, 10:37 am

    Actually cobalt bombs suit Russian nuclear weapon doctrine rather well... they should make all their ICBM warheads enormously powerful Cobalt bombs, because their nuclear weapons are not for conquest or to settle an argument... their bombs are to destroy the enemy currently in the process of trying to destroy them with a nuclear attack, which by definition means the other guys need to all die as a consequence of this attack... nothing says you are all going to die like a 1 Gigaton Cobalt salted nuclear bomb...
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    Post  GarryB on 14/07/19, 10:59 am

    I agree strongly, Turkey is still a NATO country and an enemy of Russia. You never sell excellent weapons to an enemy even an export model.

    Well what about the fact that a NATO country is buying S-400 missiles in preference to the US equivalent of Patriot or THAADS, and also the fact that this sale of S-400s might knock Turkey out of the F-35 programme which they built components for so it will cost the US 100 aircraft sales of a 120 million dollar aircraft, and lost revenue for operational costs and maintainence, not to mention it will put Turkey into the market for a new modern fighter they might consider joint modification of a new Russian type... none of this would be possible without the S-400 sale... which might in turn encourage other NATO countries to look to Russia for military equipment too.

    At the very worst Turkey cheats and lies and stabs Russia in the back and Russia cuts off trade and gas supples and makes things really uncomfortable on the Turkey/Syria border... they might even change their minds about support for the Kurds perhaps...

    But lets let Turkey make its decisions first...

    That is looking at it in an extremely limited view.

    Not really. Chinese and Soviet experience of reverse engineering has proven it is not easy or quick or cheap, and most of the time they don't get it right anyway.

    The Turks could easily hand over data and specs that would severely compromise the aircraft and their stealth tech. They are ways to get more than enough from one sample, sure you can't get EVERY single thing but you can get close to 90 percent of the details.

    But why would Turkey hand over the secrets of the air defence system they intend to use for the next few decades... do you think they might hope to get some Patriots in return... they already rejected them...

    But hey if you think that's a good idea, then Let Russia sell their stealth fighter to a NATO ally, when we get our hands on all the information and we will just makes the airplanes worthless

    The plane the Turks get wont be an Su-57, it will be more like the Su-30MKI the Indians got... the Russians are upgrading their Su-57s with new equipment all the time... the stuff they put in first will be what they show Turkey and Turkey can look at it and decide whether they want that old stuff or to make their own replacement material... Turkey are not backward and quite a few things they will likely want their own equipment used instead, and certainly their might be a few other European countries who might think contributing would be benefical in terms of selling kit and perhaps even offering their own airforce a better alternative to the F-35 currently on offer. They can NATOise the aircraft to make it more NATO compatible which will make it rather more attractive to NATO members who don't immediately leap when washington says they should...

    Would be funny if Germany joined the programme too... and if Le Pen gets in in France who knows what might happen...

    And all for the price of selling S-400 to Turkey... and I might also point out that Russia is also selling S-400s to China and India... do you think their might be a chance of a leak there too? And if there is then why are you so upset where the leak comes from... the point is that Russia needs to assume there will be leaks and that upgrades and improvements in design are the only solution to the problem... in the meantime... 5 billion each means 15 billion dollars in the fund to make some improvements...
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    Post  nero on 14/07/19, 04:27 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:The Turks could easily hand over data and specs that would severely compromise the aircraft and their stealth tech. They are ways to get more than enough from one sample, sure you can't get EVERY single thing but you can get close to 90 percent of the details
    What "specs" will they hand over that it would compromise the aircraft?

    What do you mean by compromise to start with?

    You talk about things you do not understand on the basis of a meme, that everything military is high-tech and very very secret.
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    Post  PapaDragon on 14/07/19, 05:22 pm

    GarryB wrote:Actually cobalt bombs suit Russian nuclear weapon doctrine rather well... they should make all their ICBM warheads enormously powerful Cobalt bombs, because their nuclear weapons are not for conquest or to settle an argument... their bombs are to destroy the enemy currently in the process of trying to destroy them with a nuclear attack, which by definition means the other guys need to all die as a consequence of this attack... nothing says you are all going to die like a 1 Gigaton Cobalt salted nuclear bomb...


    Completely agreed, they should put a pack of Cobalt on every single warhead they have

    No point halfassing the nuclear war

    Besides, it's not like it matters once it happens, no point in rest of the planet existing if they were all sitting around doing nothing while White Europeans and their hired contractors were deciding their fate for them

    A lesson for the next life


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    Post  kvs on 14/07/19, 06:07 pm

    GarryB wrote:Actually cobalt bombs suit Russian nuclear weapon doctrine rather well... they should make all their ICBM warheads enormously powerful Cobalt bombs, because their nuclear weapons are not for conquest or to settle an argument... their bombs are to destroy the enemy currently in the process of trying to destroy them with a nuclear attack, which by definition means the other guys need to all die as a consequence of this attack... nothing says you are all going to die like a 1 Gigaton Cobalt salted nuclear bomb...

    Cobalt does not increase the yield of nuclear devices. You are repeating an urban myth. Cobalt's sole "value" is in generating isotopes with the
    right half life to generate life-destroying radiation levels that last for decades. Conventional nuclear bombs based on plutonium (including
    hydrogen bombs) generate isotopes that are short lived (e.g iodine) and too long lived (strontium and cesium). So most of the radiation
    is in the first days of the fallout.

    SeigSoloyvov
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov on 14/07/19, 06:43 pm

    nero wrote:
    SeigSoloyvov wrote:The Turks could easily hand over data and specs that would severely compromise the aircraft and their stealth tech. They are ways to get more than enough from one sample, sure you can't get EVERY single thing but you can get close to 90 percent of the details
    What "specs" will they hand over that it would compromise the aircraft?

    What do you mean by compromise to start with?

    You talk about things you do not understand on the basis of a meme, that everything military is high-tech and very very secret.

    Not everything is but somethings are.

    You should know what compromises means, it means in this case details you would not want someone to know are learned.

    You assume because Russia says "Eh there is no way they can do that" I wouldn't take their word on that, long have you have the correct data you can easily figure out classified things about the design.

    Not to mention Nato friendly guys would hand over mechanical details.

    How to deal with it, how to best detect it, everything.

    Again think what you wish, just saying selling your stealth fighter to a NATO ally is absurd and foolhardy.
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov on 14/07/19, 06:46 pm

    @Garry

    Selling anything to China is a mistake unless it's two gens behind they will just reverse engineer it sure it may not be has good as the original but it will be cheaper and MUCH cheaper.

    I have made my opinions on selling up to date tech to China is a mistake from day 1.
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    Post  Isos on 14/07/19, 07:07 pm

    Again think what you wish, just saying selling your stealth fighter to a NATO ally is absurd and foolhardy.

    If they make an export version of su-57 for a nato country, it will be made in different materials, with different RAM coating and paint, totally different radar with half of the sources codes erased and lots of equipment swiched for western ones.

    You think you are smarter than Sukhoi engineers ? Like they don't know what can be done if they give sensitive tech to a nato country ?

    Selling anything to China is a mistake unless it's two gens behind they will just reverse engineer it sure it may not be has good as the original but it will be cheaper and MUCH cheaper.

    And who is buying them ? Even chinese army still wants russian stuff rather than the shit Norinco and other produce. Even arabs are disapointed with their shit while they have like no clue what is modern military technology and strategy.

    They "copied" S-300 but still buy S-400. They will "copy" S-400 but still beg for S-500 in 5 years when US will bring some IRBM near their shores.

    Modern stuff are not like the ones from 39-45. You can't just take the dimensions, see what material is used and copy it. You need a huge industry behind any single thing in the S-400. You also need the sofwares and the source codes which Russia will never give to anyone. You can't guess what the computers are doing and a big part of why S-400 is so good is the computing.

    Chinese reverse engineered will be MUCH cheaper but also much more bad. That was proven by anything china copied from small arms to jets. Their military industry suck and everyone knows that.
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    Post  Regular on 14/07/19, 08:20 pm

    Why would you use cobalt is you will need to repopulate wiped out lands? Russians should be able move in after decontamination. I'm almost sure Russia can win nuclear war and they would need new lands.
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    Post  PapaDragon on 14/07/19, 08:39 pm

    Regular wrote:Why would you use cobalt is you will need to repopulate wiped out lands? Russians should be able move in after decontamination. I'm almost sure Russia can win nuclear war and they would need new lands.

    Repopulate what exactly?

    After nuclear war there will be barely enough Russians left to repopulate outskirts of Moscow region

    If they go pussyfooting around in nuclear war they will be "repopulated" themselves when third party survivors come looking for payback

    They need to make sure nothing is left alive after nuclear war that walks on less than six legs, it's the ultimate deterrence policy


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    Post  jhelb on 14/07/19, 09:37 pm

    GarryB wrote:... the Russians are upgrading their Su-57s with new equipment all the time...

    Won't it make more sense for Russia to derive a light stealth fighter jet with small internal bays from the MiG-21? Mig-21 already has a small radar cross section.
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    Post  Isos on 14/07/19, 10:31 pm

    jhelb wrote:
    GarryB wrote:... the Russians are upgrading their Su-57s with new equipment all the time...

    Won't it make more sense for Russia to derive a light stealth fighter jet with small internal bays from the MiG-21? Mig-21 already has a small radar cross section.

    And where do you put the fuel ?

    Small fighter with weapons bay are a waste of time. F-16 and mig-29 were already very short legs and obliged development of conformal fuel tanks and SMT upgrade.

    With a lighter jet with weapons bay it would be already worse.
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    Post  Hole on 15/07/19, 12:25 am

    Just take a look at the F-35.

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