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    Western propaganda

    higurashihougi
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    Post  higurashihougi on Sat Jan 26, 2019 5:26 am

    Aristide wrote:Europe is the continent with the highest living standards in the world

    ... by bloodsucking people in other regions for centuries. At the moment France still collects taxes from her former colonies in Africa.

    Capitalism wealth in Europe has been accumulated by the most despicable way.

    That's why European ruling class has been in panic when they witness the rise of Soviet Russia and communist China.
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    Post  Aristide on Sat Jan 26, 2019 3:45 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    As for blocking outside propaganda, i think thats excellent as well. No need for russian, chinese or american propaganda in France or Europe in general.

    Did you see Trumps reaction to Micron when he suggested a Euro army for use against Russia and China and the US...

    He crapped himself in a hissy fit... American propaganda is coming to the EU... powered by Microsoft...

    I´m the most fit person imaginable. I do bodybuilding and participate in contests. I´m very rarely sick but developed an allergy spontanous.

    Physical fitness and well being mean nothing to disease... a good case of Influenza can kill anyone...

    Europe is the continent with the highest living standards in the world.

    Yeah, you keep telling yourself that... and anything you see about other countries developing and improving can be ignored as propaganda... Russian or Chinese...

    Right now the US basically dominates all the international organisations and systems that make the world economy work, but they are abusing their position and over time more and more countries are looking for sensible alternatives and the US is trying to punish those that do.

    There will come a time when even weak countries that sit at Americas knee telling her how wonderful she is for a scrap of food like a dog... you know... the countries that call themselves the west, yet know that term really only means the US... will have to make a choice... to keep being Americas bitch.... or to step out on their own as their own thinking group or country, that does not hide behind other countries or use their military power to get their way.

    The countries of the EU are cowards and will likely sink with the US... and the world will lose nothing when they regress back to the monkeys they keep in zoos for entertainment...

    Trumps reaction is irrelevant. France does whats good for France.

    We bomb Kadhafi, we allow Iran business. We dont side with no one. At one day we smack russia, at other day we defend a russian gas pipeline.

    We are as trustworthy as the ocean.
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    Post  Aristide on Sat Jan 26, 2019 3:47 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:
    Aristide wrote:Europe is the continent with the highest living standards in the world

    ... by bloodsucking people in other regions for centuries. At the moment France still collects taxes from her former colonies in Africa.

    Capitalism wealth in Europe has been accumulated by the most despicable way.

    That's why European ruling class has been in panic when they witness the rise of Soviet Russia and communist China.

    Soviet Russia was a pathetic country stuck in poverty. I assure you, nobody is afraid about a country unable to feed its own people.

    Communist China never did rise. China did rise when it smashed communism into the trashbin. China today follows an extreme form of capitalism
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Sat Jan 26, 2019 11:49 pm

    Well the thread is about western propaganda.

    The current state of China is proof that democracy has nothing to do with wealth and that communist governments are able to better cope with managing a capitalist economy than a democratic one... but there can be no talk or speculation about that in the western free press... for the same reason the easter bunny and santa don't go for picnics in the off season...
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    Post  Aristide on Sun Jan 27, 2019 7:11 am

    GarryB wrote:Well the thread is about western propaganda.

    The current state of China is proof that democracy has nothing to do with wealth and that communist governments are able to better cope with managing a capitalist economy than a democratic one... but there can be no talk or speculation about that in the western free press... for the same reason the easter bunny and santa don't go for picnics in the off season...

    Chinas government is not communist. Its oligarchic hyper capitalist. A small elite of rich families controlling the impoverished masses. Sacrificing the well being of the small people for economic gains. Little to no worker rights, extreme exploition of people and nature for profits.
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    Post  GarryB on Sun Jan 27, 2019 9:44 am

    Chinas government is not communist. Its oligarchic hyper capitalist. A small elite of rich families controlling the impoverished masses. Sacrificing the well being of the small people for economic gains. Little to no worker rights, extreme exploition of people and nature for profits.

    Sorry... are you trying to describe the Chinese government or the American government?
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    Post  Aristide on Sun Jan 27, 2019 10:21 am

    GarryB wrote:
    Chinas government is not communist. Its oligarchic hyper capitalist. A small elite of rich families controlling the impoverished masses. Sacrificing the well being of the small people for economic gains. Little to no worker rights, extreme exploition of people and nature for profits.

    Sorry... are you trying to describe the Chinese government or the American government?

    Did you ever visit China?

    No country in the world is more capitalist than China. Its an extreme form of capitalism that is called "Manchester capitalism".

    China uses its workers like slaves. They kill themself in large numbers. The party relocates entire cities to build more industrial plants like Foxcom. The worker has no rights and nature gets crushed in extreme ways.

    The american government is elected and has to answer its voters. There are unemployment benefits in limited ways, welfare and all that.

    The chinese leadership has to answer noone.

    Nobody is better than that than China. China reached a level of Hyper capitalism that would be impossible to install in any western country.

    The irony is, that they did not create something new. They basicly just transformed the old slave system from the first emperor Qin Shin Huangdi into the new time.
    higurashihougi
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    Post  higurashihougi on Sun Jan 27, 2019 12:31 pm

    Aristide wrote:Soviet Russia was a pathetic country stuck in poverty.

    Do I need to respond to this kind of ignorance ?

    A country struck in poverty yet managed to MANUFACTURE cars, aircrafts, space rockets, ICBM, sattelites, houses, titanium goods, computers, electronic devices, accurate machines, managed to build nuclear power plants, extensive railway systems.

    A country struck in poverty yet managed to led a huge economic - military bloc stand opposite to the USA-led one.

    Do you think a pathetic country could manage to oppose NATO ?

    Where did you receive your education ?

    Did your parents fulfill their duty of teaching their offsprings ? Did your parents ignore you ?
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    Post  Kimppis on Sun Jan 27, 2019 12:35 pm

    Again: so that's why Chinese workers have experienced the most dramatic increase in salaries and living standards in human history? That's why China will have more industrial robots than the West (including Japan and even South Korea) combined very soon? That's why large parts of the economy are still state controlled, and in fact even major private companies and the Chinese state are heavily interconnected?

    But really, whatever. To quote Deng: "Poverty is not socialism. To be rich is glorious."

    IMO, most importantly, according to the Western religion of "universal Western values," which include liberal democracy as the end of history, none of this should be happening. At all. Huawei shouldn't exist. But somehow it does, and the Chinese are only getting started. But the faith still remains strong.

    I'm not saying that China is particularly "socialist" or anything like that, but I wouldn't call it "hypercapitalist" either. I do agree that the system overall has a lot of common with China's past systems of government and its dynasties.

    EDIT: And yes, despite all its failures, the USSR was quite well-off by global standards and it remained the world's second largest economy in PPP (almost) until its collapse.
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    Post  Aristide on Sun Jan 27, 2019 2:55 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:
    Aristide wrote:Soviet Russia was a pathetic country stuck in poverty.

    Do I need to respond to this kind of ignorance ?

    A country struck in poverty yet managed to MANUFACTURE cars, aircrafts, space rockets, ICBM, sattelites, houses, titanium goods, computers, electronic devices, accurate machines, managed to build nuclear power plants, extensive railway systems.

    A country struck in poverty yet managed to led a huge economic - military bloc stand opposite to the USA-led one.

    Do you think a pathetic country could manage to oppose NATO ?

    Where did you receive your education ?

    Did your parents fulfill their duty of teaching their offsprings ? Did your parents ignore you ?

    People dont eat aircrafts. The USSR was stuck in poverty. The income never reached 1/8 of a western european. There was widespread ,alnutrition, energy shortages and a 15 years shorter lifespan

    My father visited the eastern bloc. So he avtually did teach me. Eastern germany was a trash bin with people desperate to escape. And eastern germany was actually the most rich eastern bloc country.

    You dont need to build a wall to keep your people from running away, when you are paradise.

    Short question for you, as USSR citizen, could you buy pineapple, banana and oranges whenever you want? Yes or no?
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    Post  Aristide on Sun Jan 27, 2019 2:59 pm

    Kimppis wrote:Again: so that's why Chinese workers have experienced the most dramatic increase in salaries and living standards in human history? That's why China will have more industrial robots than the West (including Japan and even South Korea) combined very soon? That's why large parts of the economy are still state controlled, and in fact even major private companies and the Chinese state are heavily interconnected?

    But really, whatever. To quote Deng: "Poverty is not socialism. To be rich is glorious."

    IMO, most importantly, according to the Western religion of "universal Western values," which include liberal democracy as the end of history, none of this should be happening. At all. Huawei shouldn't exist. But somehow it does, and the Chinese are only getting started. But the faith still remains strong.

    I'm not saying that China is particularly "socialist" or anything like that, but I wouldn't call it "hypercapitalist" either. I do agree that the system overall has a lot of common with China's past systems of government and its dynasties.

    EDIT: And yes, despite all its failures, the USSR was quite well-off by global standards and it remained the world's second largest economy in PPP (almost) until its collapse.

    Of course china is not socialist. Socialism always fails. Its unbound capitalism that drives China.
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    Post  higurashihougi on Sun Jan 27, 2019 6:06 pm

    Aristide wrote:People dont eat aircrafts.

    Did your father teach you that people have to eat before building aircraft ?

    Did your father teach you that a country need to achieve a certain level in order to manufacture aircraft ?

    What kind of shithole are you living in ? Do you even have a proper family education ?

    Aristide wrote:The USSR was stuck in poverty. The income never reached 1/8 of a western european. There was widespread ,alnutrition, energy shortages and a 15 years shorter lifespan

    How the hell a country with widespread malnutrition and energy shortage manage to manufacture aircraft at large scale ? And not only aicraft, but one of the biggest industry in the world at that time ?

    Aristide wrote:My father visited the eastern bloc. So he avtually did teach me. Eastern germany was a trash bin with people desperate to escape. And eastern germany was actually the most rich eastern bloc country.

    Many other people also claimed that they witness the "truth" in Russia, China, North Korea and this and that... except all these turned out to be craps.

    I am sick of all these "personal experiences".

    Aristide wrote:You dont need to build a wall to keep your people from running away, when you are paradise.

    Have you ever seen any country does not employ this kind or that kind of border control and protection ?

    Even a certain spineless country who surrendered quickly when the Nazi invaded them does not intend to leave their border open.

    It is just building a long long long long wall to cover the border is impractical and not plausible in most of the cases, therefore in most of the case people employ different methods rather than a wall.

    Aristide wrote:Short question for you, as USSR citizen, could you buy pineapple, banana and oranges whenever you want? Yes or no?

    Is pineapples, bananas and oranges are the only standards for the well-being of the people ?

    Are you a monkey ?
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    Post  Aristide on Sun Jan 27, 2019 7:28 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:
    Aristide wrote:People dont eat aircrafts.

    Did your father teach you that people have to eat before building aircraft ?

    Did your father teach you that a country need to achieve a certain level in order to manufacture aircraft ?

    What kind of shithole are you living in ? Do you even have a proper family education ?

    Aristide wrote:The USSR was stuck in poverty. The income never reached 1/8 of a western european. There was widespread ,alnutrition, energy shortages and a 15 years shorter lifespan

    How the hell a country with widespread malnutrition and energy shortage manage to manufacture aircraft at large scale ? And not only aicraft, but one of the biggest industry in the world at that time ?

    Aristide wrote:My father visited the eastern bloc. So he avtually did teach me. Eastern germany was a trash bin with people desperate to escape. And eastern germany was actually the most rich eastern bloc country.

    Many other people also claimed that they witness the "truth" in Russia, China, North Korea and this and that... except all these turned out to be craps.

    I am sick of all these "personal experiences".

    Aristide wrote:You dont need to build a wall to keep your people from running away, when you are paradise.

    Have you ever seen any country does not employ this kind or that kind of border control and protection ?

    Even a certain spineless country who surrendered quickly when the Nazi invaded them does not intend to leave their border open.

    It is just building a long long long long wall to cover the border is impractical and not plausible in most of the cases, therefore in most of the case people employ different methods rather than a wall.

    Aristide wrote:Short question for you, as USSR citizen, could you buy pineapple, banana and oranges whenever you want? Yes or no?

    Is pineapples, bananas and oranges are the only standards for the well-being of the people ?

    Are you a monkey ?

    Yes, i´m a monkey. You are a monkey as well. All humans are. Same biological group as Gorilla, Chimps, Gibbons and Orang Utan.

    But for the record...no oranges, no pineapple and no banana for the people of the eastern block.

    Another question, with all those airplanes, where could the people travel?

    Lets say you are a citizen of the USSR and decide you want surf at the awesome beaches near Sydney. How easy was it to book a flight there? How about Samoa? Or a trip to Paris? Skiing in Switzerland?

    And there we come at the wall or iron curtain...the only wall ever build to keep the own people from running away.

    Eastern Germany lost 2 million people who escaped to the west. Then they build the wall to lock their own people in. Like a prison.

    France had neutral position in most aspects and so we had more contact to the eastern block.

    MY father had a business trip to eastern Germany and he said it was shocking. Eastern Germany was the richest part of the eastern block, yet it was extremly poor. People were desperate. The shops were empty.

    When west german chancellor Helmut Kohl visited eastern Germany in 1987...he broke away from the security in the city of Gotha. Local people swarmed around him and gave him little letters to help them.

    Eastern Germany even bought a cruise ship but banned it from entering any harbor in the west, because their passengers jumped off the ship to swim at shore.

    And thats amigo...is why your system fails. Its people like me who destroy your pathetic socialist dreams. I want freedom to travel the world. I want any fruit i wish to. I want the freedom to buy what i want.

    And with greatest pleassure i would sabotage for the "enemy". I would spy for the enemy. I would do evrything to gain that freedom. And with greatest joy i see your utopia collapse.

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    As for the rest of your bullshit, india is poor as shit. 80% of its people live under extreme poverty. Yet india builds aircrafts and rockets. wrong priorities.
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Jan 28, 2019 3:37 am

    Blah, Blah, Blah... you seem to confuse communism and capitalism when the two are barely linked... the opposite of communism is democracy and it purely political.

    You seem stuck on the economic aspects of communism, but real communism would be where everyone owned everything and therefore there would be no private ownership of anything which has never been attempted let alone achieved.

    Free market capitalism does not work... the market does not balance itself out... and having lots of rich people does not mean the money eventually trickles down and helps the poor.

    Eastern Germany lost 2 million people who escaped to the west. Then they build the wall to lock their own people in. Like a prison.

    You mean like Americas wall that may or may not get built... these 2 million people were economic migrants... much like the tens of millions of Europeans who fled to the US and Australia and New Zealand and Canada and many other countries... and just like all the poor Africans coming to France to live with you...
    higurashihougi
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    Post  higurashihougi on Mon Jan 28, 2019 3:44 am

    Aristide wrote:Yes, i´m a monkey. You are a monkey as well. All humans are. Same biological group as Gorilla, Chimps, Gibbons and Orang Utan.

    You are, but I am not.

    Human and monkeys evolved from a common ancestor. But a human is not a monkey.

    You are being a monkey and not a human... that's your problem. Probably that explains many things here.

    Aristide wrote:But for the record...no oranges, no pineapple and no banana for the people of the eastern block.

    Living as a monkey is not the standard of well being.

    Aristide wrote:Another question, with all those airplanes, where could the people travel?

    Lets say you are a citizen of the USSR and decide you want surf at the awesome beaches near Sydney. How easy was it to book a flight there? How about Samoa? Or a trip to Paris? Skiing in Switzerland?

    And there we come at the wall or iron curtain...the only wall ever build to keep the own people from running away.

    And why the hell should USSR people go to Sydney, Paris, Switzerland ?

    "Skiing in Switzerland?" Since when Switzerland are the only place for people to skiing ?

    Only Switzerland has snow ?

    The vast Russland have more than enough majestic scenery for people to enjoy.

    Living in a shithole for long time probably leaving a lasting impact to your perception of the world.

    And travel restrictions also came from the other side of the Iron Curtain, too. A "war" means mutual restriction from both sides. Do you understand such a basic knowledge ?

    Aristide wrote:MY father had a business trip to eastern Germany and he said it was shocking. Eastern Germany was the richest part of the eastern block, yet it was extremly poor. People were desperate. The shops were empty.

    Many people claimed that they visit China, Russia, North Korea, and say things like Kim Jong Un brutally massacre his officials and citizens... except these dead people re-emerged on the media several days later, safe and sound.

    Probably North Korea excels in biotechnology and medicine, they can revive dead people or make many clones of a human.

    Aristide wrote:And thats amigo...is why your system fails. Its people like me who destroy your pathetic socialist dreams. I want freedom to travel the world. I want any fruit i wish to. I want the freedom to buy what i want.

    No.

    You can't buy nuclear missiles, bombs, drugs and other banned goods that the governemnt considered as detrimental to the society.

    You can't travel outside of your country without informing the authorities, without going via the permitted ways and places.

    And it is not like you have all the money to buy whatever you wants... the people who donned the yellow vests will tell you that their relatives and friends deserve many things but your shithole of the society don't provide them and instead most of the wealth accumulate into a number of scumbags called "social elites".

    Aristide wrote:And with greatest pleassure i would sabotage for the "enemy". I would spy for the enemy. I would do evrything to gain that freedom. And with greatest joy i see your utopia collapse.

    The state should arrest you and punish you for high treason.

    Can't imagine what your father did to you so that you are here bragging about being a sociopath.
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    Post  Kimppis on Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:13 pm

    Aristide, many things you are talking about are either just false (i.e. exaggerations), or they have nothing to do with poverty per se. You are describing autarchy.

    Again, I'm not a fan of the Soviet Union. Central planning after 1960-70 was a mistake, for one thing.

    Life expectancy gap between the USSR and the US was never that large, nowhere near, and the USSR actually overtook America briefly in the 1960s. The fact that life expectancy started to stagnate and even decline after that had little to do with "poverty" and everything to do with alcoholism. Still a huge failure for the Soviet system of course.

    India's population is 5x that of the USSR. 0% of Soviets lived in extreme poverty, or something close to that. In PPP per capita the USSR was around 40% of the US by the 70s (France: 60-80%, dollar being the reserve currency, etc.).

    It can probably be argued that even in the west today a high percentage of the population does not care that much about "luxuries" you listed. The Soviet system did manage to deliver basic necessities, no extreme poverty. After they fully achieved that, the whole thing was more or less on life support until the end. Also the Western propaganda/soft power was very successful, any attempts to counter it totally failed.

    However, there's Ostalgie. How do you explain that, btw? In many countries living standards declined considerably for years, before recovering (in some countries that didn't happen at all, like Ukraine). Objectively, in a vacuum, East Germany in particular did quite well. The issue is that there were 4 times as many fellow Germans (!) right next door who were doing even better, made worse by West's massive soft power.

    Your rhetoric and views have no nuances. To you countries seem to be either "the richest in the world" or total shitholes.
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    Post  Aristide on Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:45 pm

    higurashihougi wrote:
    Aristide wrote:Yes, i´m a monkey. You are a monkey as well. All humans are. Same biological group as Gorilla, Chimps, Gibbons and Orang Utan.

    You are, but I am not.

    Human and monkeys evolved from a common ancestor. But a human is not a monkey.

    You are being a monkey and not a human... that's your problem. Probably that explains many things here.

    Aristide wrote:But for the record...no oranges, no pineapple and no banana for the people of the eastern block.

    Living as a monkey is not the standard of well being.

    Aristide wrote:Another question, with all those airplanes, where could the people travel?

    Lets say you are a citizen of the USSR and decide you want surf at the awesome beaches near Sydney. How easy was it to book a flight there? How about Samoa? Or a trip to Paris? Skiing in Switzerland?

    And there we come at the wall or iron curtain...the only wall ever build to keep the own people from running away.

    And why the hell should USSR people go to Sydney, Paris, Switzerland ?

    "Skiing in Switzerland?" Since when Switzerland are the only place for people to skiing ?

    Only Switzerland has snow ?

    The vast Russland have more than enough majestic scenery for people to enjoy.

    Living in a shithole for long time probably leaving a lasting impact to your perception of the world.

    And travel restrictions also came from the other side of the Iron Curtain, too. A "war" means mutual restriction from both sides. Do you understand such a basic knowledge ?

    Aristide wrote:MY father had a business trip to eastern Germany and he said it was shocking. Eastern Germany was the richest part of the eastern block, yet it was extremly poor. People were desperate. The shops were empty.

    Many people claimed that they visit China, Russia, North Korea, and say things like Kim Jong Un brutally massacre his officials and citizens... except these dead people re-emerged on the media several days later, safe and sound.

    Probably North Korea excels in biotechnology and medicine, they can revive dead people or make many clones of a human.

    Aristide wrote:And thats amigo...is why your system fails. Its people like me who destroy your pathetic socialist dreams. I want freedom to travel the world. I want any fruit i wish to. I want the freedom to buy what i want.

    No.

    You can't buy nuclear missiles, bombs, drugs and other banned goods that the governemnt considered as detrimental to the society.

    You can't travel outside of your country without informing the authorities, without going via the permitted ways and places.

    And it is not like you have all the money to buy whatever you wants... the people who donned the yellow vests will tell you that their relatives and friends deserve many things but your shithole of the society don't provide them and instead most of the wealth accumulate into a number of scumbags called "social elites".

    Aristide wrote:And with greatest pleassure i would sabotage for the "enemy". I would spy for the enemy. I would do evrything to gain that freedom. And with greatest joy i see your utopia collapse.

    The state should arrest you and punish you for high treason.

    Can't imagine what your father did to you so that you are here bragging about being a sociopath.

    Sorry to break it for you, but yes, humans are monkeys. We are in the "Hominidae" group. Same family as gorilla, chimps, bonobo, Orang Utan and Gibbon.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hominidae

    And yes, getting all fruits you want is a standard of well being.

    You have another explanation why the average french gets 15 years older than the average russian? Smile

    We have better food, better medicine.

    Why someone wants to visit Sydney? Paris? Switzerland?

    Well i´m a free man. I want see the world. Travelling is part of my freedom and my identity.

    I visited Egypt, Chile, Bolivia, Peru, Madagascar, Spain, Turkey, Greece, Italy, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Australia, Mauritius, Seychelles, Dubai.

    And i´m a very young man. I will see much more of the world and it is an absolute must for me. Same as my mother and my father. To travel is in french blood.

    Of course as soulless worker ant you can be happy in your pathetic little hole.

    As for your "basic knowledge".

    Care to explain why millions of people run away from the eastern bloc? Why eastern Germany was bleeding out? So much they had to build a wall to lock their own people in.

    Its strange, dont you think? Why escaped 2 million germans from east germans but not millions from west into the east?

    Also funny, why did the east germans crush their commusin regime and started a mass exodus to the west? Why not otehr way around? Smile

    At the end of the day you are happy as low class system. I demand for the best. And i fight with greatest pleassure a system who denies me that.

    So for the record, no fruitsm no freedom to travel, no freedom to take whatever job you want.

    For a matter of fact, french culture always was a culture of indiviualism. A shit system like USSR would not work here. People in France and western Europe in general think far too high about themself to belittle themself so much to exist on such a primitive state.

    I want greatness. The USSR would simply be too pathetic for a man like me.
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    Post  GarryB on Tue Jan 29, 2019 12:31 am

    Sorry to break it for you, but yes, humans are monkeys. We are in the "Hominidae" group. Same family as gorilla, chimps, bonobo, Orang Utan and Gibbon.

    Not even close to right.

    Humans are monkeys like horse are monkeys.... they share a lot of DNA, but there are lots of very important differences.

    Humans are related to Apes, not Monkeys.

    We share a common ancestor but we evolved along a different path.

    We did not evolve from Apes or Monkeys otherwise why would their still be Apes and Monkeys?

    They are not our ancestors... they are our cousins... but then you could say the same about spiders and insects too... it is just a case that the common ancestor is much much older and a lot more evolution took place for both of us... which is why we are so different.

    But please continue to educate us Mr Monkey Librarian...

    I guess that makes Cheese eating surrender monkey make even more sense.
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    Post  Kimppis on Tue Jan 29, 2019 4:59 pm

    Aristide wrote:

    You have another explanation why the average french gets 15 years older than the average russian? Smile

    We have better food, better medicine.

    Uhh... What!?

    Again: low life expectancy was and is due to alcoholism, period.

    And most crucially, Russian life expectancy is actually around 74 years at the moment and it's improving very rapidly. What is France's LE? Around 82? So that's a gap of 8 years, VERY FAR from 15, and probably already less than 5 years vs. the US.  

    Cuba's life expectancy is comparable to the US. So are you suggesting that Cuba's overall living standards are comparable?

    Life expectancy is not a great metric of living standards.

    Russians don't lack basic medicines or food. In fact, a huge percentage are overweight.

    When it comes to "medicine," you can look at infant mortality: Russia's is now comparable to that of the US. That actually measures the availability and quality of basic medical care quite accurately, but we all can cherry pick statistics. Heck, we can also simply use totally outdated figures or even just make them up, you like to do both.
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    Post  Aristide on Tue Jan 29, 2019 5:02 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    Sorry to break it for you, but yes, humans are monkeys. We are in the "Hominidae" group. Same family as gorilla, chimps, bonobo, Orang Utan and Gibbon.

    Not even close to right.

    Humans are monkeys like horse are monkeys.... they share a lot of DNA, but there are lots of very important differences.

    Humans are related to Apes, not Monkeys.

    We share a common ancestor but we evolved along a different path.

    We did not evolve from Apes or Monkeys otherwise why would their still be Apes and Monkeys?

    They are not our ancestors... they are our cousins... but then you could say the same about spiders and insects too... it is just a case that the common ancestor is much much older and a lot more evolution took place for both of us... which is why we are so different.

    But please continue to educate us Mr Monkey Librarian...

    I guess that makes Cheese eating surrender monkey make even more sense.

    You have no clue about biology.

    Humans are hominids. They form one group with Gibbons, Orang Utan, Gorilla, Bonobo and Chimps.

    Horse is to Zebra what Humans are to Gibbon.

    We did not evolve from apes, we are a ape species. Humans belong to the drynose clade of apes.

    I wasnt aware education is that bad in new zealand.
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    Post  Aristide on Tue Jan 29, 2019 5:06 pm

    Kimppis wrote:
    Aristide wrote:

    You have another explanation why the average french gets 15 years older than the average russian? Smile

    We have better food, better medicine.

    Uhh... What!?

    Again: low life expectancy was and is due to alcoholism, period.

    And most crucially, Russian life expectancy is actually around 74 years at the moment and it's improving very rapidly. What is France's LE? Around 82? So that's a gap of 8 years, VERY FAR from 15, and probably already less than 5 years vs. the US.  

    Cuba's life expectancy is comparable to the US. So are you suggesting that Cuba's overall living standards are comparable?

    Life expectancy is not a great metric of living standards.

    Russians don't lack basic medicines or food. In fact, a huge percentage are overweight.

    When it comes to "medicine," you can look at infant mortality: Russia's is now comparable to that of the US. That actually measures the availability and quality of basic medical care quite accurately, but we all can cherry pick statistics. Heck, we can also simply use totally outdated figures or even just make them up, you like to do both.


    I visited two russian cities, both were poor and worn down.

    St Petersburg and Irkoutsk.

    St. Petersburg had a nice tourism area. Outside of that grey and worn down. Irkoutsk was rotten to the ground.

    And of course they lack food and medicine. Go try and find good Sushi or Burgers there. You wont be sucessful.
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    Post  Kimppis on Tue Jan 29, 2019 5:24 pm

    That doesn't even deserve a reply. That being said, I actually largely agree with you on the monkey question. I certainly don't know a lot about biology, but "we" are all primates and even hominids, so it's not technically wrong... Why not? Sure you can use it as an insult, and in that sense it's similar to the word "animal". I can't wait for that debate! Are we Homo Sapies animals or not? Maybe some of you can start quoting Bible while you're it, or something?  Rolling Eyes  

    But wow, I just realized that the LE gap between Russia and the US is probably now similar to the gap between the US and many Western European countries!!

    And just a few short years ago Obummer and many Western "experts" kept ridiculing Russia's low life expectancy. Haha, who am I kidding, I'm sure they still do that. After all, in their world it's always, if not 1998 in Russia, then at the very least 2008 (though Russia is still about to take over the world at the same time, somehow...).  

    (That in addition to several other recent demographic improvements: firstly, the aforementioned infant mortality rate, and secondly, the fact that Russia's homicide rate is probably already lower than in the US, it's very very close.)
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    Post  miketheterrible on Tue Jan 29, 2019 6:03 pm

    How is it a troglodite like Aristide is allowed to spew his nonsense yet TR1 got banned?
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    Post  Aristide on Tue Jan 29, 2019 7:34 pm

    Kimppis wrote:That doesn't even deserve a reply. That being said, I actually largely agree with you on the monkey question. I certainly don't know a lot about biology, but "we" are all primates and even hominids, so it's not technically wrong... Why not? Sure you can use it as an insult, and in that sense it's similar to the word "animal". I can't wait for that debate! Are we Homo Sapies animals or not? Maybe some of you can start quoting Bible while you're it, or something?  Rolling Eyes  

    But wow, I just realized that the LE gap between Russia and the US is probably now similar to the gap between the US and many Western European countries!!

    And just a few short years ago Obummer and many Western "experts" kept ridiculing Russia's low life expectancy. Haha, who am I kidding, I'm sure they still do that. After all, in their world it's always, if not 1998 in Russia, then at the very least 2008 (though Russia is still about to take over the world at the same time, somehow...).  

    (That in addition to several other recent demographic improvements: firstly, the aforementioned infant mortality rate, and secondly, the fact that Russia's homicide rate is probably already lower than in the US, it's very very close.)

    Its idiotic to use monkey or ape as an insult.

    Humans, Gorilla, Chimps, Bonobo, Orang Utan and Gibbon belong to the very same group of animals - Hominidae

    Some here obviously have no clue what a clade is or biology in general.

    As for life expectancy

    Life expectancy in France is 82,27 years in 2016

    In russia its 71,59 years in 2016.

    Thats almost a 10 year difference.

    I dont know why you you bring up USA though.

    In France we say Russia is a Nigeria with snow. And the USA are a Russia with more money.
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    Post  Kimppis on Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:18 pm

    Aristide wrote:Its idiotic to use monkey or ape as an insult.

    Humans, Gorilla, Chimps, Bonobo, Orang Utan and Gibbon belong to the very same group of animals - Hominidae

    Agreed, exactly.

    As for life expectancy

    Life expectancy in France is 82,27 years in 2016

    In russia its 71,59 years in 2016.

    Yeah, in 2016. It was probably around 74 at the end of 2018. The gap is narrowing rapidly, that's the point...

    I dont know why you you bring up USA though.

    Because the US is "exceptional," "the richest country in the world" and "the shining city on the hill". (Russia on the other hand is Mordor, under the heel of Putler.) And come on now, the US is also your (read: Western Europe as a whole) master.

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