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    Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Sat Jun 15, 2013 1:57 am

    Finally we will see mock up of the new generation Russian spacecraft in few months 

    Russia to Unveil New Piloted Spacecraft at MAKS Airshow

    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:07 am

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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Mon Jul 01, 2013 9:02 pm

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    TR1

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  TR1 on Tue Jul 02, 2013 1:19 am


    But teh BBC told me they can't do anything right!1!!
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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Tue Jul 02, 2013 1:26 am

    TR1 wrote:

    But teh BBC told me they can't do anything right!1!!

    Difference is only going to get worse after those 70 bin $ intended for Russian space industry by 2020 kicks in. Still BBC will even that invent silly old stories.

    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:08 am

    Accident "Proton" is the third since the beginning of the year abnormal situation in the Russian space industry

    Moscow. July 2. NTERFAX.RU - Fall rocket "Proton-M" with three satellites "Glonass-M" - this is the third emergency situation in the Russian space industry for the current year

    "In addition to this accident, the 2013 accident rocket" Zenit "by the" Sea Launch "and unintended orbit insertion devices Defence," - said the "Interfax" a source in the space industry.

    According to him, this year Russia has carried out 15 launches from Baikonur and Plesetsk. The Russian-Ukrainian missile "Zenit" was used in the project "Sea Launch" and the rocket "Soyuz-ST" - in the launch from Kourou in French. The first stage of the Russian production was used to launch a South Korean rocket KSLV.

    Until the end of the year in the Russian Space Agency plans to launch 23 more space, told the agency.
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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:04 am

    This is the second time 3 GLONASS satellites are lost because of rocket failure. Someone must go to Siberia.

    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Tue Jul 02, 2013 1:45 pm

    Doing a thorough post Proton analysis and rectifying the fault and making quality control and QA as the top priority will help them in the long run rather then firing few people.

    The idea of firing few people would solve the problem has been done in past on quite a few occassion and we see this does not change thing.

    Its high time they just look deep within themself in the entire Space Industry and fix it for their own good.

    Also time to put Angara on high priority list of space program.

    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:00 pm

    http://rt.com/news/proton-m-rocket-takeoff-crash-514/

    Failed Russian space launches


    The Russian space industry has suffered from a series of launch failures over the last several years.

    On December 5, 2010 a Proton-M rocket with a DM-03 booster failed to deliver three GLONASS-M satellites into orbit.

    In February 2011 a Geo-IK-2 geodesic satellite with military applications was lost after a Briz-KM booster unsuccessfully delivered the satellite into orbit.

    On August 2011 a Proton-M rocket with a Briz-M booster and Express-AM4 satellite aboard lost communication with the control center.

    On August 24 a Soyuz-U rocket carrying a Progress M-12M spaceship as cargo launched from Baikonur but did not reach orbit after failing in the first stage.

    On November 9 a Zenith rocket launched from Baikonur delivered into orbit for the first time in 30 years Russia’s Mars probe Fobos-Grunt. But the probe’s engines failed to start in time and it subsequently plummeted back to Earth, partially burning in the atmosphere.

    In December 2011 a launch of a Meridian military telecommunication satellite from Plesetsk cosmodrome was reportedly unsuccessful due to engine failure.

    On August 6, 2012, the launch of a Proton-M rocket with a Briz-M booster failed to deliver two communication satellites – Russian Express-MD and Indonesian Telkom-3 – into orbit. Officially the booster failed to perform the fourth crucial thrust.

    On December 8, 2012 another Proton-M rocket with a Briz-M booster delivered a Yamal-402 communication satellite to off-nominal orbit – again due to a Briz-M booster failure. But later the satellite reached the desired orbit using its own orbit correction engine.

    With Tuesday’s Proton-M failure, three accidents have already beset Russia’s space industry in 2013.

    On January 15 the secret launch of a rocket from Plesetsk cosmodrome partially failed as three military Strela-3M communication satellites were delivered to non-nominal orbits. The military later reported that all the satellites we taken under control and functioned properly. The media however, said that only two of them were ultimately brought under control.

    On February 1 a Zenith-3SL rocket – a joint project between the Russian and Ukrainian space agencies – with an Intelsat-27 communication satellite failed to reach orbit. Launched from the Odyssey platform, which belongs to the international Sea Launch program, the rocket fell into the Pacific some 30 seconds after takeoff. The crash was caused by a malfunction of the first stage of the Zenith rocket, which was designed and built in Ukraine.
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    Deep Throat

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Deep Throat on Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:26 pm

    Proton crash resulted in a loss of $200 million .
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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Tue Jul 02, 2013 3:16 pm

    Austin wrote:http://rt.com/news/proton-m-rocket-takeoff-crash-514/Failed Russian space launches

    Still take a look at the overall launches:


    - 2007 - 26 launch (1 failed)
    - 2008 - 27 launch (1 failed)
    - 2009 - 32 launch (1 failed)
    - 2010 - 31 launch (1 failed)
    - 2011 - 35 launch (5 failed)
    - 2012 - 29 launch (2 failed)
    - 2013 - 18 launch (2 failed) - in progress

    That makes 198 launches in almost 7 year time with 93.44% success rate - which is overall very good score but still there are plenty of room to improvement


    at the same time US performed

    - 2007 - 29 launch (2 failed)
    - 2008 - 15 launch (1 failed)
    - 2009 - 24 launch (1 failed)
    - 2010 - 15 launch (0 failed)
    - 2011 - 18 launch (1 failed)
    - 2012 - 13 launch (1 failed)
    - 2013 - 8 launch  (0 failed) - in progress

    That makes 122 launches in almost 7 years time with 95.082% success rate - which is not that much better than Russia while at the same time

    Russia performed 38.4% more launches (almost 40% more)

    But if we want to be mean we can remember that many US rockets and S.Korea rockets use Russian engines (RD-180 and its derivatives with % tend to increase

    due to NK-33 purchased by the US) making US rockets essentially Russian ones. In that view we can safely conclude that Russian space market hold under its

    grip 70-80% of all world launches. So lets not panic immediately Very Happy


    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:15 pm

    Good Post Viktor as always and good point.

    Although I would still like to see Russia end every year with 0 failures or worst 1 ......even if it means making reliable but expensive rocket its fine I would say.

    These days satellites are more expensive then rockets , So loosing satellite is most costly compared to the rocket they launch , loosing both is worse.
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    Werewolf

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Werewolf on Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:18 pm

    Viktor wrote:

    But if we want to be mean we can  remember that many US rockets and S.Korea rockets use Russian engines (RD-180 and its derivatives with % tend to increase

    due to NK-33 purchased by the US) making US rockets essentially Russian ones. In that view we can safely conclude that Russian space market hold under its

    grip 70-80% of all world launches. So lets not panic immediately Very Happy


    The docu "Engines that came in from the Cold" about russian engines that were used on american rockets, translated by BitnikGr.

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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:29 pm

    Werewolf wrote:
    Viktor wrote:

    But if we want to be mean we can  remember that many US rockets and S.Korea rockets use Russian engines (RD-180 and its derivatives with % tend to increase

    due to NK-33 purchased by the US) making US rockets essentially Russian ones. In that view we can safely conclude that Russian space market hold under its

    grip 70-80% of all world launches. So lets not panic immediately Very Happy


    The docu "Engines that came in from the Cold" about russian engines that were used on american rockets, translated by BitnikGr.

    Tnx man. I have watched this documentary many years ago I think on National Geographic. In fact it was one of the several things (technical) that steered my interest and love towards Russian military engineering.

    Mindstorm

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Mindstorm on Tue Jul 02, 2013 6:55 pm


    grip 70-80% of all world launches. So lets not panic immediately




    Instead exist much more than a reason.........to worry about latest "development" in launch's efficiency of a vector system very-highly tested/reliable and for which exist a production's standard and validated quality control process codified long more than twenty years of production and operational experience.


    The very strange "selectivity" (more than two standard deviations out of normal distribution) in the latest space launch's history, in particular at damage of some highly critical military and scientific programs, cast more than a shadow on the "reliability" and even "alignment" of some personnel in component's sub-contractor and quality control chain and put under a complete different light the reason for the sudden, abrupt U-turn, in the test-launch's success percentage of "Bulava" SLBM , after that some eye begun to observe much more closely the actions of personnel in the sub-contractor component chain.


    Very likely Yeltsin's years have left some greedy "undesired guest" in the peripheral production chain....something say to me that we will see ,at brief , a selective and painful (for them) disinfestation in the field...
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    SOC

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  SOC on Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:13 pm

    Viktor wrote:Still take a look at the overall launches:


    - 2007 - 26 launch (1 failed)
    - 2008 - 27 launch (1 failed)
    - 2009 - 32 launch (1 failed)
    - 2010 - 31 launch (1 failed)
    - 2011 - 35 launch (5 failed)
    - 2012 - 29 launch (2 failed)
    - 2013 - 18 launch (2 failed) - in progress

    That makes 198 launches in almost 7 year time with 93.44% success rate - which is overall very good score but still there are plenty of room to improvement

    I'd be more concerned with the increase in failures. Is it a quality control issue? A component that needs replacing? You've got 4 failures in 116 launches (2007-2010, 96.55%), and then 9 in 82 (2011-2013, 89%). Whatever the problem is I hope they get it worked out.

    Viktor wrote:But if we want to be mean we can  remember that many US rockets and S.Korea rockets use Russian engines

    Nah. Mean would be this:



    angel 
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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Wed Jul 03, 2013 12:01 am

    My initial thought was in line with mindstorm and he could be right because most of the failure occurs mostly with rockets carrying military cargo. Much less with commercial one. But than again same situation was with Bulava malfunction too. At the end investigation revealed that it was quality control issue and with that settled Bulava functions perfectly.
    Another thing that I initially thought and was in line with minstorm was that Proton was (after Progress) the most reliable rocket ever build so how could it be that few of them carrying military cargo blows up in such short period of time. But than again this is not the same old reliable Proton of Soviet Union but highly modernized version with high influx of most likely Angara technology. So again it could be that quality control is once again the issue as SOC thinks too.
    Of course until the end of investigation we can only speculate.

    SOC wrote:angel 

    Well did you know that Russia intended to carry Olympic torch in space and back anyway so this could indeed be it Very Happy
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Cyberspec on Wed Jul 03, 2013 5:10 am

    This is a MAJOR stuff up, no two ways about it.

    They've announced a consolidation of all Space related companies into one holding company - Joint Rocket and Space Corporation....and looks like heads will roll


    Enterprises of the Russian space industry will be consolidated within one company. This was announced on July 2, Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin

    According to the vice-premier in charge of defense, the organization, is to be called "Joint Rocket and Space Corporation" into which will be transferred state-owned shares of the respective companies.

    ...

    "In it's current form, the  space rocket industry, we will not move forward," - said Deputy Prime Minister, commenting on the fall of the carrier rocket "Proton-M".

    Rogozin said that the accident will result in "very severe outcomes" in personnel and organizational terms.


    Full report: http://vpk-news.ru/news/16610

    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Wed Jul 03, 2013 7:08 pm

    First testing images of russian satellite Resurs-P - american cities

    http://www.federalspace.ru/main.php?id=2&nid=20195


    What about colour images ?
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  GarryB on Thu Jul 04, 2013 3:43 am

    Colour is over rated.

    Many colour satellite images are false colour anyway to highlight certain features...


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    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Fri Jul 05, 2013 2:16 pm

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    Viktor

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Fri Jul 05, 2013 4:06 pm

    Now here is a interesting development.

    Strategic Rocket Forces command centers equipped with the control system of the 5th generation

    The automated system will address not only the usual tasks - bringing orders, collection of reports and monitoring readiness of launchers - but also to make use of the automated change of plans and operational retargeting missiles.

    LINK


    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Fri Jul 05, 2013 6:22 pm

    In 2011 they said they were deploying 4th gen Command and Control system , now its moved to 5th Gen ?


    https://russiandefpolicy.wordpress.com/2011/04/27/rvsns-fourth-generation-asbu-being-introduced/

    In particular, presently, development is complete and introduction of the fourth generation ASBU into troop echelons has begun,’ Colonel Koval said.”

    The new system supports automated exchange of employment plans and operational retargeting of missiles, along with the resolution of traditional missions of transmitting orders, gathering reports and monitoring the combat readiness of launchers.”

    “‘And the transmission of combat command and control orders directly to launchers, without intermediate echelons, is supported, including under nuclear effects and radioelectronic suppression,’ Koval noted.”

    “He noted that each of the system’s stations, which are made using a new domestic component base, is provided with triple reserve communications and data transmission systems and malfunction scanning which precisely identifies the individual element needing replacement.”

    “Further improvement of the ASBU is connected, first and foremost, with improving the RF Armed Forces command and control system as a whole, and also with the command and control requirements of new generation nuclear missile weaponry.”

    Austin

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  Austin on Tue Jul 09, 2013 2:28 pm

    Human factor causes Proton accident: rocket sensors connected with wrong polarity - source

    The crash of a Proton-M rocket shortly after take off on July 2 was due to a human error, a source close to experts probing the accident told Interfax-AVN.

    "The angular velocity sensors were wired up with the wrong polarity. Therefore, the rocket was orientated incorrectly," he said.
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    TR1

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    Re: Russian Space Program: News & Discussion

    Post  TR1 on Tue Jul 09, 2013 9:30 pm

    As always, human stupidity is a far bigger threat than mechanical failure.

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