Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues

Iskander delivered to Syria512

    Iskander delivered to Syria

    Share

    SOC
    Lieutenant
    Lieutenant

    Posts: 597
    Points: 656
    Join date: 2011-09-13
    Age: 36
    Location: Indianapolis

    Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  SOC on Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:18 am

    Russia has delivered the Iskander to Syria in response to NATO plans for Patriots in Turkey:

    http://www.wnd.com/2012/12/russia-arms-syria-with-powerful-ballistic-missiles/

    http://www.worldtribune.com/2011/12/21/russia-sent-advanced-rockets-to-syria-due-to-threats-from-turkey/

    The second one has an interesting line at the end:

    “There will be strict supervision over the latest weapons sent by Russia to make sure they are not used to begin a regional conflict,” the source said.

    Does that mean that they aren't going to be used to shoot at Israel just because, well, Israel? Or that they won't be targeting rebels/insurgents, as that's what the West is falling all over itself about and considering action over (i.e. shooting them in the conflict could finally get the West involved, ergo they'd be used to begin a regional conflict)?

    Seems to me much ado about nothing on all sides. Turkey wants NATO SAM/ATBM protection, big deal. They were in the market for a strategic SAM anyway, so had this occurred, say, two years from now, Turkey would have its own SAM systems to deploy. Besides, if it's PAC-3 systems that deploy, to have the greater ATBM capability, the engagement range isn't really that impressive against aircraft. The Buk-M2E is in the same neighborhood in terms of range. Is this an example of butthurt over the forthcoming SAM decision?

    Maybe this is a very sly marketing job. Send the weapons to Syria, let them show how accurate they are in combat, and get more export orders.

    Or, maybe this actually stabilzies the situation somewhat. Being able to shoot these highly accurate weapons at rebels/insurgents (and actually make headway in defeating them) rather than the hilariously useless SCUD or its DPRK knockoffs would significantly reduce collateral damage and perhaps alleviate the need to break out the WMD warheads since, you know, the SRBM force as previously constituted couldn't be counted on to hit anything except a huge city. Which is, of course, what you once again get by relying on comparatively ancient technology for too long. At least Syria seems to be learning the technological lessons demonstrated since 1991. Can't really say the same about Iran or the DPRK!

    Viktor
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts: 4100
    Points: 4574
    Join date: 2009-08-26
    Age: 34
    Location: Croatia

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Viktor on Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:03 am

    This info could be true but I would still wait for more official confirmation.

    Western newspapers are for to long trying to

    1. Distort the truth by all means and ways possible
    2. Portray Assad as lunatic
    3. Portray as terrorist are wining by reporting only their stories and successes but none of Syrian Army
    4. Showing that in all that mess hyping insignificant situation throw out all media all is doomed and Assad will have to resort to chemical
    weapons
    5. Portray Putin as a sole (interesting how China is not mentioned but equal supports Syria) supporter of "terrorist" Assad who has nothing
    on his mind but to kill his own civilians with WMD Very Happy and other he could think of
    6. And because Assad has no other option to stay on power (disregard the democratic elections 70% + people voted and REAL oposition exists)
    as free Syrian protesters and unarmed are gaining ground will have to resort to using WMD responsibility of the World is to stop that
    lunatic maniac by bombing etc.

    No matter what numerous "western" stories about situation in Syria where proven to be staged events and obvious lies to its readers no one seems to give a f....
    Specially is interested that right after each and every one of the "Frends" of Syria meting takes place some Russian official words are being misunderstand and media hype goes on its rampage around the world with Russians trying to be heard.
    Right before "Frends" of Syria takes place terrorist offenses begin, bomb trucks activate its deadly cargo etc on a much larger scale than on average ...

    Well Im offtopic now and Im not ...

    Syria has placed orders on Iskander / S-300 (five batteries) / MIG-31E / MIG-29M2 and other heavy weapons none of which will be delivered

    before situation gets clearer. Iskander missiles along with S-300 is said by Russia will NOT be delivered long before conflict started and was not delivered.

    As far Im I aware no S-300 (except for search radar 36D6) has managed to find its way to Syria much less Iskander, MIG-31E althrow there where all these years newspaper articles coming from Israel papers about Russia delivering S-300 divisions and regiments etc etc ...

    On the other hand It could be that Russia got irked by Patriot deployment or some other thing and delivered Iskander but up until now Russia has only and always showed policy of piece and respect for Syrian people and its need to be heard. I dont think Russia will all the sudden completely abandon its way and practice weapon delivery policy.


    Last edited by Viktor on Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:07 am; edited 1 time in total

    TR1
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts: 4751
    Points: 4978
    Join date: 2011-12-07

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  TR1 on Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:06 am

    I find the reports to be highly unlikely.

    flamming_python
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts: 1445
    Points: 1514
    Join date: 2012-01-30

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  flamming_python on Mon Dec 17, 2012 12:25 pm

    TR1 wrote:I find the reports to be highly unlikely.
    Yeah my ass Russia is going to risk its Iskanders falling into NATO hands and its crews beheaded by some Allah-Akbarians.

    Besides which, Russia has not shown any sort of hostility towards Turkey or Israel for the duration of this entire crisis - why would it suddenly want to bring Iskanders into Syria in order to threaten them? It's got ICBMs for that anyway.

    SOC wrote:Or, maybe this actually stabilzies the situation somewhat. Being able to shoot these highly accurate weapons at rebels/insurgents (and actually make headway in defeating them) rather than the hilariously useless SCUD or its DPRK knockoffs would significantly reduce collateral damage and perhaps alleviate the need to break out the WMD warheads since, you know, the SRBM force as previously constituted couldn't be counted on to hit anything except a huge city. Which is, of course, what you once again get by relying on comparatively ancient technology for too long. At least Syria seems to be learning the technological lessons demonstrated since 1991. Can't really say the same about Iran or the DPRK!

    Ultimately, Iskanders used in this way won't make an impact in the final result - all that Russia will end up with is wasting extremely expensive missiles on some irregular infantry, with NATO Radar sites and instruments close-by in order to track the trajectories and patterns.

    If Russia wanted to kill insurgents from afar, it could base Uragans/Smerches or Tochka-Us in Syria's defended coastal-regions, or employ its naval task force with its cruise missiles and the Admiral Kuznetsov airwing. All far more viable approaches.

    Pyrrus
    Corporal
    Corporal

    Posts: 82
    Points: 93
    Join date: 2011-09-21
    Age: 43
    Location: Gloucester, UK

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Pyrrus on Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:33 pm

    I've heard about plans to deliver these rockets not a fact of delivery. Once asked why they don't provide Arabic countries with the newest weapons Russians responded: they are not able to use older ones properly, what's the reason to send them even more sophisticated weapons?
    If this statement is true or not judge on your own. I recon these rockets are still in Russia. That's it.

    SOC
    Lieutenant
    Lieutenant

    Posts: 597
    Points: 656
    Join date: 2011-09-13
    Age: 36
    Location: Indianapolis

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  SOC on Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:40 am

    Pyrrus wrote:they are not able to use older ones properly, what's the reason to send them even more sophisticated weapons?

    Except Syria has already taken delivery of the Bastion system armed with Yakhont, arguably far more advanced than any of the Soviet or DPRK SCUDs. Granted, two different types of systems, but one is clearly far more advanced than the other from a technological standpoint.

    GarryB
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts: 10839
    Points: 11439
    Join date: 2010-03-30
    Location: New Zealand

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  GarryB on Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:47 am

    I wonder about the performance of Yakhont against Patriot batteries...


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    Cyberspec
    Captain
    Captain

    Posts: 734
    Points: 842
    Join date: 2011-08-08
    Location: Terra Australis

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Cyberspec on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:24 pm

    Well they definately have Tochka-U ...


    Viktor
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts: 4100
    Points: 4574
    Join date: 2009-08-26
    Age: 34
    Location: Croatia

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Viktor on Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:54 pm

    What they need is load of Su-25/UAV/and more Thocka-U Very Happy

    I sew that clip but It would be interesting to see effect of that launch. Very Happy

    Pyrrus
    Corporal
    Corporal

    Posts: 82
    Points: 93
    Join date: 2011-09-21
    Age: 43
    Location: Gloucester, UK

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Pyrrus on Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:15 pm

    Viktor wrote:What they need is load of Su-25/UAV/and more Thocka-U Very Happy

    I sew that clip but It would be interesting to see effect of that launch. Very Happy
    I agree, but first of all more protection against simple weapons used by rebels. Syrian Army's losses are mostly connected with snipers and IED devices. The effect is, now women started to be draft to army troops. They operate on the check points mostly.

    Viktor
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts: 4100
    Points: 4574
    Join date: 2009-08-26
    Age: 34
    Location: Croatia

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Viktor on Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:59 pm

    True but cutting their supply lines is essential for numerous reasons.

    I have seen Syria Army using bulletproof vests, helmets, swarms of snipers etc ... but supply lines ... those needs to be cut and in a matter of one month terrorist will collapse.

    Pyrrus
    Corporal
    Corporal

    Posts: 82
    Points: 93
    Join date: 2011-09-21
    Age: 43
    Location: Gloucester, UK

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Pyrrus on Tue Jan 22, 2013 4:02 pm

    Viktor wrote:True but cutting their supply lines is essential for numerous reasons.

    I have seen Syria Army using bulletproof vests, helmets, swarms of snipers etc ... but supply lines ... those needs to be cut and in a matter of one month terrorist will collapse.
    I agree, for now the Syrian government and army make effort to seal out the border with Jordan and Liban. It is not so easy with those with Turkey and Israel. Terrorists operate from there.

    Cyberspec
    Captain
    Captain

    Posts: 734
    Points: 842
    Join date: 2011-08-08
    Location: Terra Australis

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Cyberspec on Tue Jan 22, 2013 4:12 pm

    The Su-25 would be the best candidate for this sort of fighting. It's strange they never got it considering they use to receive a fair amount of equipment.

    I agree, but first of all more protection against simple weapons used by rebels. Syrian Army's losses are mostly connected with snipers and IED devices. The effect is, now women started to be draft to army troops. They operate on the check points mostly.

    I think the SAA is doing a lot better than what's reported on western channels and the rebels are suffering serious casualties in all these recent "offensives". That said, the SAA can't win a decisive victory since the rebels have safe heavens to retreat too and regroup and large scale foreign support.

    Interesting clip of a low level Su-22 attack, dropping delayed action bombs



    From a different angle (without the explosion but with the mandatory Alah akbar...Alah akbar)


    Pyrrus
    Corporal
    Corporal

    Posts: 82
    Points: 93
    Join date: 2011-09-21
    Age: 43
    Location: Gloucester, UK

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Pyrrus on Tue Jan 22, 2013 4:23 pm

    cyberspec wrote:
    I agree, but first of all more protection against simple weapons used by rebels. Syrian Army's losses are mostly connected with snipers and IED devices. The effect is, now women started to be draft to army troops. They operate on the check points mostly.

    I think the SAA is doing a lot better than what's reported on western channels and the rebels are suffering serious casualties in all these recent "offensives". That said, the SAA can't win a decisive victory since the rebels have safe heavens to retreat too and regroup and large scale foreign support.
    of course they do. Rebels, terrorists face colossal losses, but Saudi Arabia, Katar, Turkey, with advisory and financial support from USA and Israel keep sending new ones. Syria became ruined because of war. For now the army has the support from the most of civilians. But the longer the war will last the more they will lose their hope and belief. And this is what terrorists want to obtain. The thing is, army's and security forces' possibilities are limited. They are on the active side, but still have to react on rebels' actions and still keep reseves in case of possible war with neighbouring countries or NATO itself



    Last edited by Pyrrus on Tue Jan 22, 2013 4:25 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : mistakes)

    Viktor
    Colonel
    Colonel

    Posts: 4100
    Points: 4574
    Join date: 2009-08-26
    Age: 34
    Location: Croatia

    Re: Iskander delivered to Syria

    Post  Viktor on Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:11 pm

    Well here is final confirmation that Iskander system is NOT being delivered to Syria as there is no contract

    ANATOLY ISAIKIN 02/13/13: RUSSIA NOT TO SUPPLY SYRIA TACTICAL MISSILE COMPLEXES "ISKANDER"
    February 13 2013.

    ITAR-TASS . Russia not to supply Syria tactical missile complexes "Iskander" contracts for their supply is not present. The statement was made ​​Director General of "Rosoboronexport" Anatoly Isaikin a press conference at the press center of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

    "The total volume of Russian exports of military goods Syria takes place 13-14" - said General Director of "Rosoboronexport". He called a "complete nonsense" about allegedly perpetrated by Russia supplying Syria tactical missile complexes "Iskander". "No," Iskander "we have supplied Syria, no contracts to supply them we do not" - said Isaikin.

    He confirmed that most of Russia to supply Syria under earlier contracts air defenses, but did not specify which ones.
    http://www.itar-tass.com/

      Current date/time is Sun Oct 26, 2014 1:10 am