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    Russian Economy General News: #1

    Hannibal Barca
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    Post  Hannibal Barca on Sun Jan 26, 2014 1:06 pm

    Exactly. It was just one of this articles written with the sole purpose of creating a negative impact.
    Just to repeat the completely wrong by the scientific point of view term stagnation a few times and cast doubt open A PART of the total debt,
    to demonstrate that Russia's economic outlook is negative.
    For those who wonder this is exactly what they tried to do with China's corporate debt as well.
    All too common, low level Yankee propaganda.
    Actually they are so bad that they can't improvise, they just repeat the same tricks again and again.

    Having said this, I consider Stratfor one of the very best sites about geopolitics.
    2/3 of their articles is stupid propaganda but the remaining 1/3 are true masterpieces IMO.
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    Post  Austin on Sun Jan 26, 2014 2:30 pm

    Yes its all PR value create FUD about Russia and China .....Stratfor is nothing but a front end tool of US Agency masked in Civilian Clothing.

    I like little respect for these sites , Stratfor , The Economist ....the list is endless

    Check the latest Public Debt Clock this seem updated one

    http://www.economist.com/content/global_debt_clock


    The good thing for China is the West wont be able to do any thing that would hurt China economy without hurting itself equally bad so they are very cautious about when dealing with China ....nothing on official level.

    Russia economy has to face hurdles not just from media and bad PR but also Western Government who would like to bring hurdle ( check for Gazprom problem with West ) in order to hurt the economy.
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    Post  Hannibal Barca on Sun Jan 26, 2014 2:55 pm

    It's about reaching a threshold or loosing a threshold in terms of size, growth and trade, Austin.
    Russia and India doesn't reach this level yet, Russia actually might never reach given her population.
    USA are about to loose theirs.
    Interesting times ahead.
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    Post  Austin on Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:07 pm

    Hannibal Barca wrote:It's about reaching a threshold or loosing a threshold in terms of size, growth and trade, Austin.
    Russia and India doesn't reach this level yet, Russia actually might never reach given her population.
    USA are about to loose theirs.
    Interesting times ahead.

    True , Its highly unlikely Russia would reach the threshold , but may be by 2020 , Russias GDP nominal would cross GDP of Germany.

    Hopefully Russian Hard Power would be enough to deter even the largest and powerful country

    China is in a different league for sure.
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    Post  sepheronx on Sun Jan 26, 2014 6:23 pm

    Hannibal Barca wrote:It's about reaching a threshold or loosing a threshold in terms of size, growth and trade, Austin.
    Russia and India doesn't reach this level yet, Russia actually might never reach given her population.
    USA are about to loose theirs.
    Interesting times ahead.

    For now, Russia's main competition will end up being Germany, with the aid of France and maybe Germany itself (Germany will sell anything it seems). Majority of its products excluding automotive is a direct competitor. MaRussia was created to be a competitor to Jag, Corvette, Lamb, ect. But still not close enough to being there yet. But on the heavy industrial scale, I would say it is more about a direct competitor (They do build automated CNC and other machines, but only really sold in CIS countries as of right now). Coming years will be interesting.

    China is a direct competitor to USA, as its population can sustain itself if trade war did happen between the two (China has the ability to produce on their own since majority of their manufacturing can still churn out what they want and they still have over a billion pop to purchase said goods. As well, a lot of control from central gov, so any blow could be minimal.
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    Post  navyfield on Sun Jan 26, 2014 7:06 pm

    Not so fast, there was a question earlier if the uotput is the same and prices are high why doesnt russian economy grow stronger and ill answer that and some other.

    The new resourses are expencive, and that oil is harder and harder to get , increasing extraction cost eats away the profit form sold quantities, so while Russian production maybe the same,profits from that production are decreasing all the time ,thus yielding smaller and smaller returns to the government...
    Not to mention growing internal consumption because of stronger economy ,we know economic growth follows energy consumption growth ,leaving even less oil for export.
    Same is with shale because of expenses ,thats why conventional sourses still rule in Russia ,and why todays investments are not measured in millions but billions and take more time to get the oil to the markets.
    There are number of solutions: put most the profits into renewable energy expansion/hydro/tidal/geothermal/increase efficiency ,change some peoples habits /beter insulation /mass transit.
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    Post  Hannibal Barca on Sun Jan 26, 2014 10:25 pm

    sepheronx wrote:

    For now, Russia's main competition will end up being Germany, with the aid of France and maybe Germany itself (Germany will sell anything it seems).  Majority of its products excluding automotive is a direct competitor.  MaRussia was created to be a competitor to Jag, Corvette, Lamb, ect.  But still not close enough to being there yet.  But on the heavy industrial scale, I would say it is more about a direct competitor (They do build automated CNC and other machines, but only really sold in CIS countries as of right now).  Coming years will be interesting.

    China is a direct competitor to USA, as its population can sustain itself if trade war did happen between the two (China has the ability to produce on their own since majority of their manufacturing can still churn out what they want and they still have over a billion pop to purchase said goods.  As well, a lot of control from central gov, so any blow could be minimal.

    MaRussia is nowhere. The companies you list are mega in auto industry. Don't know if this gonna change but still MaRussia is one man's dream, certainly not in the process of getting hot in supercar industry.
    BTW can you post information about Elbrus 8c? I checked via google again. Still nothing. It would be even better if you can provide me with a shop to order online.
    You see in modern times CPU industry is shamefully easy. Just get a shop online, blow the benchmarks and next day Intel files for bankruptcy...
    IT DOES happen in silicon market from time to time, but yet with the sole exception of Kaspersky, no Russian product did it.
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    Post  sepheronx on Mon Jan 27, 2014 5:58 am

    Hannibal Barca wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:

    For now, Russia's main competition will end up being Germany, with the aid of France and maybe Germany itself (Germany will sell anything it seems).  Majority of its products excluding automotive is a direct competitor.  MaRussia was created to be a competitor to Jag, Corvette, Lamb, ect.  But still not close enough to being there yet.  But on the heavy industrial scale, I would say it is more about a direct competitor (They do build automated CNC and other machines, but only really sold in CIS countries as of right now).  Coming years will be interesting.

    China is a direct competitor to USA, as its population can sustain itself if trade war did happen between the two (China has the ability to produce on their own since majority of their manufacturing can still churn out what they want and they still have over a billion pop to purchase said goods.  As well, a lot of control from central gov, so any blow could be minimal.

    MaRussia is nowhere. The companies you list are mega in auto industry. Don't know if this gonna change but still MaRussia is one man's dream, certainly not in the process of getting hot in supercar industry.
    BTW can you post information about Elbrus 8c? I checked via google again. Still nothing. It would be even better if you can provide me with a shop to order online.
    You see in modern times CPU industry is shamefully easy. Just get a shop online, blow the benchmarks and next day Intel files for bankruptcy...
    IT DOES happen in silicon market from time to time, but yet with the sole exception of Kaspersky, no Russian product did it.

    It isn't out yet.  I have already stated this multiple times that Elbrus 8C is for 2015, 4C is sometime this year.

    http://mcst.ru/vosmiyadernyj-mikroprocessor-s-arkhitekturoj-elbrus

    They sell monocube through Kraftway running off of Russia's Elbrus 2C+

    http://20.mcst.ru/Monokub-PC/#2012

    or all in one

    http://20.mcst.ru/km4-elbrus/#2012

    Comparable to most high end Intel Atoms running at similar power consumption or less.  With DSP, better at multimedia.  And it will not be able to make intel bankrupt, as you know yourself (you said it) politics get in the way.  Sorry, it will probably not even enter the market in its own form, but something already set up as HTC's themselves.  They don't operate on a standard socket basis like Intel or AMD since those two companies have contracts with various others to make motherboards, while Kraftway really is the only one for MCST.  Elbrus 2C+ was designed on same characteristics as what PAK FA's radar needed for real time data transfer and processing.

    If you do not believe me on what has been happening, then look at what T-Platforms had to deal with regarding blacklistings from USA.  Same would happen with MCST to sell abroad.  Elbrus 4C is for industrial equipment.  And I already linked on Multiclet cell processors.  If you are interested in purchasing one (If you know coding in C/C++ and PYTHON) then give it a try.

    As well, they will have hard time since both Intel and AMD has too much influence in CISC instruction sets that is required under windows OS. So it would have to run under KNE or BSD based OS (Linux like Debian or Unix). So it has to actually compete with Sun (Oracle now) and Fujitsu company.

    MaRussia, for being one mans dream, owns a formula 1 team and introduced a new SUV. It is trying to compete with Lambo as they have low rate production and specialization.

    BTW, they have a plant opened in Finland
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    Post  Austin on Mon Jan 27, 2014 6:13 am

    Which processor PAK-FA uses ?
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    Post  sepheronx on Mon Jan 27, 2014 6:19 am

    Austin wrote:Which processor PAK-FA uses ?

    There is no hard evidence, but what was requested in need of a processor for the PAK FA's N035 AESA radar was very similar to the build of the Elbrus 2C+ microprocessor (so on MP.net, it was assumed that it is the processor).  DSP Cores, being RISC, are significantly more efficient at processing real time media data (like processing information from radar to the pilot), and the Elbrus 2C+ is a dual core CISC processor (its 90nm topology is built around same concept of Intel i960 for military, higher resistance to Electro magnetic pulses) with 4 Elvees DSP Cores.

    Completely missed the part where they are making an APU as well. Based on their CISC processor, having an integrated Graphics core.

    Their other developments seem to be aimed at industrial equipment:

    http://mcst.ru/modul-comexpress

    Makes sense really. Now with Multiclet having an OS (Based around machinery), then it seems that an internal competition for microprocessor development is happening.

    As well, future development of Elbrus is aimed at domestic production rather than Taiwan. Guess Micron will get it: http://mcst.ru/razrabotka-mikroprocessora-s-arkhitekturoj-elbrus
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    Post  Austin on Mon Jan 27, 2014 11:10 am

    sepheronx Thanks for the info.


    Interesting view on Rouble Devaluation.........Today Central Bank pumped in $500 million to prevent Rouble slide futher .....Interesting time ahead.

    Russia moving to devalue the ruble
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    Post  Hannibal Barca on Mon Jan 27, 2014 11:50 am

    sepheronx wrote:

    No reason to be agitate.
    When they finish _one_ of their end user products, the manufacturer can create an online page in English to sell their product and a few information about it's real compatibility from the end user point of view. Linux and Ubuntu are already quite popular so there will be no problem.
    Equally when MaRussia produce something that can compete in the same league with Lamborghini Aventador many renown magazines will be terribly interested to test and comment.
    Russians don't need to reinvent the wheel and there is nobody that can prevent you from reaching the masses if you have a good product.
    People may prefer Lambo over MaRussia but if MaRussia is faster more powerful and yet cheaper people gonna know.
    Finally Elbrus 8c looks promising on paper, lets see if it will ever reach everyday costumers.
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    Post  flamming_python on Mon Jan 27, 2014 1:16 pm

    Honestly amazes me how many experts we have on processor architectures here and on mp.net

    Hell I studied it, or at least computer architecture in general, a semester's worth - and I still don't understand more than half of what you guys are yammering on about all the time.
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    Post  sepheronx on Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:27 pm

    Hannibal Barca wrote:

    No reason to be agitate.
    When they finish _one_ of their end user products, the manufacturer can create an online page in English to sell their product and a few information about it's real compatibility from the end user point of view. Linux and Ubuntu are already quite popular so there will be no problem.
    Equally when MaRussia produce something that can compete in the same league with Lamborghini Aventador many renown magazines will be terribly interested to test and comment.
    Russians don't need to reinvent the wheel and there is nobody that can prevent you from reaching the masses if you have a good product.
    People may prefer Lambo over MaRussia but if MaRussia is faster more powerful and yet cheaper people gonna know.
    Finally Elbrus 8c looks promising on paper, lets see if it will ever reach everyday costumers.

    Sorry, i dont mean to agitate but sometimes I read what is said wrong, so I appologize if I was rude.

    Anyway, I would love to get my hands on a Epbrus R-1000 processor (specifically that model), Debian OS, and see what my wife can do with her programming as she is talented in Java, ASP.net and Python. Would be nice as maybe I could one day be a distributor of Russian products on the market. I know, big dream.

    But on the same token, im not sure how they implement it in an HPC enviornment. I look at their products and I see that it isnt simply a motherboard but some module with a proprietary connection (looked similar to whay CISCO uses in their fiber connection on their 6500 series. So it would be interesting to see how modular and expandable it is. As seen, they sell a module that has 4 R-1000 cores on it, and so that would mean a total of 16 cores per module. Once they have DDR3 memory controller installed (most of their processors have an IMC), then it would seem impressive in terms of pure calculations/number crunching, and would be a good alternative to T-Platforms. What hurts then though is lack of options for perfs. For example, you cannot change out the processors. But you would have to change the entire module and or motherboard (all processors are soldered in). I am looking forward to the R-100M (using lower powered transistors that will allow it to run at 15w of power with similar performance) and their Elbrus 4C. Im keeping my fingers crossed on that. But I doubt we will see their processors on anything other than specialized equipment.

    As for MaRussia, I heard their products are solid. But like a lot of other things, they are late to the game and thus does not have a name. And well, it makes the biggest difference is the name. People still purchase an Audi (even though bad track records are increasing in terms of maintenance) in pretty high numbers.
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    Post  sepheronx on Mon Jan 27, 2014 2:49 pm

    flamming_python wrote:Honestly amazes me how many experts we have on processor architectures here and on mp.net

    Hell I studied it, or at least computer architecture in general, a semester's worth - and I still don't understand more than half of what you guys are yammering on about all the time.

    I work in the field were we run various servers for SQL operations and virtualization, along with a massive line of networking (what I mostly deal with). I am learning some of this stuff every day. When my father worked for the US airforce back in the 80's, they used RISC processors for everything (and still do). So he would always explain to me the difference. When he gets too technical, it becomes confusing. Biggest difference between the two is that RISC processors are specialized processors to run 1 specific task, and will not move onto another till previous is done. They do not run instruction sets (well, they can but usually dont have then) thus they are all built around to do a specific task. Hence why you have MIPS, SPARC, ARM, PowerPC, ect. They run very optemized instructions and have better memory management. CISC on the other hand can do multiple tasks at once, of all types, and has various instruction sets for various tasks. They can handle both complex and not so complex jobs. But cannot do it nearly as efficient. All comes down to architecture. Hence why you see lower powered and lower speed RISC stomp a new CISC in number crunching but a CISC stomp the RISC in other categories. They have their ups and downs. I dont know much about the Intel i960 but the competitor Elbrus 2C+ uses both CISC (the dual core itself is its Elbrus S processors (with some instruction sets that are open source since AMD's and Intels copywrite protection is no longer valid) and 4 RISC DSP (Digital Signal Processors) in the mix to handle other tasks individually. Great for powerful radar systems and comm systems, but maybe not so much in other tasks. As for the other processors like MIPS, ect. I dont know too much about them as they are pretty rare.

    All that said, MCST tries to keep it all legit (Rather than Chinas semiconductor industries), in hopes their products will sell outside of CIS, but it isnt happening it seems. While AMD and Intel became quite powerful by either copying from others or each other, bypassing the laws on copywrite. Very hard to find an honest, large company these days.

    And dont worry Python, im still learning day by day about architecture designs and understanding. Its a never ending battle.
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    Post  AlfaT8 on Mon Jan 27, 2014 3:17 pm

    sepheronx wrote:
    flamming_python wrote:Honestly amazes me how many experts we have on processor architectures here and on mp.net

    Hell I studied it, or at least computer architecture in general, a semester's worth - and I still don't understand more than half of what you guys are yammering on about all the time.

    I work in the field were we run various servers for SQL operations and virtualization, along with a massive line of networking (what I mostly deal with). I am learning some of this stuff every day. When my father worked for the US airforce back in the 80's, they used RISC processors for everything (and still do). So he would always explain to me the difference. When he gets too technical, it becomes confusing. Biggest difference between the two is that RISC processors are specialized processors to run 1 specific task, and will not move onto another till previous is done. They do not run instruction sets (well, they can but usually dont have then) thus they are all built around to do a specific task. Hence why you have MIPS, SPARC, ARM, PowerPC, ect. They run very optemized instructions and have better memory management. CISC on the other hand can do multiple tasks at once, of all types, and has various instruction sets for various tasks. They can handle both complex and not so complex jobs. But cannot do it nearly as efficient. All comes down to architecture. Hence why you see lower powered and lower speed RISC stomp a new CISC in number crunching but a CISC stomp the RISC in other categories. They have their ups and downs. I dont know much about the Intel i960 but the competitor Elbrus 2C+ uses both CISC (the dual core itself is its Elbrus S processors (with some instruction sets that are open source since AMD's and Intels copywrite protection is no longer valid) and 4 RISC DSP (Digital Signal Processors) in the mix to handle other tasks individually. Great for powerful radar systems and comm systems, but maybe not so much in other tasks. As for the other processors like MIPS, ect. I dont know too much about them as they are pretty rare.

    All that said, MCST tries to keep it all legit (Rather than Chinas semiconductor industries), in hopes their products will sell outside of CIS, but it isnt happening it seems. While AMD and Intel became quite powerful by either copying from others or each other, bypassing the laws on copywrite. Very hard to find an honest, large company these days.

    And dont worry Python, im still learning day by day about architecture designs and understanding. Its a never ending battle.

    Hmmm... Very interesting, it looks like MCST got some rough roads ahead, but at the very least there trying to keep thing legit.
    So either way it's gonna be a while before i can buy an Elbrus processor from my local electronics store,

    About those instruction sets, you mentioned before that Intel/Amd had them patented, and without said instructions the Elbrus chips will not work with windows, but will work with KNE or BSD OSs, you weren't very clear about the Linux Based OSs?


    Last edited by AlfaT8 on Mon Jan 27, 2014 3:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  AlfaT8 on Mon Jan 27, 2014 3:19 pm

    Almost forgot.
    Medvedev Proposes Officials Return to State Company Boards
    Ria Novosti
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    Post  sepheronx on Mon Jan 27, 2014 3:31 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:Almost forgot.
    Medvedev Proposes Officials Return to State Company Boards
    Ria Novosti

    Bah, a complete uturn.

    That said, many non officials in a state run company were running the businessss to the ground in order to pocket extra change; I doubt officials could do better. Unless of course, they are being carefully watched. I say get rid of most of the non essential state run enterprises (hand out shares to the average person making it pubicly owned or sell it off entirely to be private). And only control key enterprises like defence.
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    Post  Austin on Mon Jan 27, 2014 4:58 pm

    CBR head: Ruble falls on dollar, euro growth versus all EM currencies

    http://en.itar-tass.com/economy/716466


    VLADIVOSTOK, January 27. /ITAR-TASS/. Ruble decline is explained by the ongoing macroeconomic processes in the world, the chairwoman of the Central Bank of Russia (CBR) Elvira Nabiullina said in the Pozner talk show on Channel One.

    “It is not ruble weakening but dollar and euro growth versus all currencies of the emerging markets,” believes Nabiullina. “The U.S. is now gathering stable growth pace. Capital redistribution and outflow from emerging markets are underway.” Further ruble dynamics depend on Russian and global economic growth, she added.

    “Our ruble is a market currency, and its price is not fixed administratively. Now the ruble’s price is being formed by market factors,” Nabiullina said.

    Asked what currency Russian people should choose to make their savings, Nabiullina cited “the golden rule of the economy: save up in the currency you use to buy”.

    She added the CBR’s task is to “prevent sharp ruble fluctuations, giving enterprises and people time to adopt to new conditions.” Last year alone $27.5 billion was spent for this purpose.

    According to Nabiullina, there were signs the ruble may strengthen, like Russia’s being one of the few countries with a trade surplus.
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:37 am

    Austin wrote:CBR head: Ruble falls on dollar, euro growth versus all EM currencies

    http://en.itar-tass.com/economy/716466


    VLADIVOSTOK, January 27. /ITAR-TASS/. Ruble decline is explained by the ongoing macroeconomic processes in the world, the chairwoman of the Central Bank of Russia (CBR) Elvira Nabiullina said in the Pozner talk show on Channel One.

    “It is not ruble weakening but dollar and euro growth versus all currencies of the emerging markets,” believes Nabiullina. “The U.S. is now gathering stable growth pace. Capital redistribution and outflow from emerging markets are underway.” Further ruble dynamics depend on Russian and global economic growth, she added.

    “Our ruble is a market currency, and its price is not fixed administratively. Now the ruble’s price is being formed by market factors,” Nabiullina said.

    Asked what currency Russian people should choose to make their savings, Nabiullina cited “the golden rule of the economy: save up in the currency you use to buy”.

    She added the CBR’s task is to “prevent sharp ruble fluctuations, giving enterprises and people time to adopt to new conditions.” Last year alone $27.5 billion was spent for this purpose.

    According to Nabiullina, there were signs the ruble may strengthen, like Russia’s being one of the few countries with a trade surplus.


    I think it's time for me to clear the air about the strength of currencies....it's a rigged game where hedge funds and oligarchical plutocratic financiers prop up a currency or destroy it. If your a country that's dependent on exports, they'll drive your currency in to the Ionosphere...if your a country dependent on imports then they'll drive your currency down to the pits of hell. Case in point the crisis in Greece is a complete fabrication, hedgefunds collectively ganged up on the Euro and attacked Greece as a weak flank. The Euro had been consistently gaining value over the weakening dollar up until 2010, when the hedge fund plutocratic financier oligarchy collectively attacked the Euro to make it look weak, and to save the dollar from it's slow demise:

    http://www.jstic.com/Newsgroup/WSJE/2010/WSJE_February_26th.pdf
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    Post  Hannibal Barca on Tue Jan 28, 2014 12:53 pm

    Eurozone countries have their own unsurpassed deficiencies. Nothing to do with a plan to destabilize them to survive. EU and USA work together in this to survive and not against each other. Greece, and I am Greek, suffered not because of a dirty plan of some selfish capitalists but because her real economy is pretty much non-existent. If not for the political and economical coverage of West, Greece would have problem at least a decade earlier already..
    Greece was crawling for years until West's top economies lost their abilities to hide the problem down the carpet.
    Italy, Spain, Portugal, Ireland fall to this category as well, is just that their problems are somewhat more manageable (but certainly not curable).
    Many more countries like France, UK, Belgium have also titanic structural problems in their economies but they are yet in the stage of coverage.
    Nevertheless they don't really reverse their own problems, just propagate them into the future, so no salvation are expected for them either.
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    Post  Viktor on Tue Jan 28, 2014 1:07 pm

    Viktor wrote:
    Much has been done during 2013, I hope the pace will continue and grow russia 

    Statistics: Production of cement in Russia in 2013. increased by 7.8% - to 66.4 million tons

    83 medical facilities finished in 2013

    LINK

    LINK

    130 kindergardens finished in 2013

    LINK

    LINK

    Construction of Russian seaports

    [url=Construction of Russian seaports]LINK[/url]

    199 sports facilities

    LINK

    LINK

    LINK

    New agricultural enterprises (only the biggest ones)

    LINK

    LINK

    200 medium and large new productions (51 launched with the participation of foreign investors, 134 built "from scratch")

    LINK


    Kindergardens: 195 (not all counting was finished)

    Overview kindergartens in 2013 (Part III)
    Viktor
    Viktor

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    Post  Viktor on Wed Jan 29, 2014 10:20 am

    Great  thumbsup 

    Russia, EU Agree to Let German Pipeline Run at Full Capacity
    zg18
    zg18

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    Post  zg18 on Wed Jan 29, 2014 11:05 am

    Russia is ranked world`s 3rd by foreign investments (FDI) with $94 billion for year 2013 , after US ($159 billion) and China ($127 billion). Y-on-Y FDI growth 83%.
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    Austin

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    Post  Austin on Wed Jan 29, 2014 11:50 am

    Indeed I was looking for stastics for FDI in 2013 linked below is some details

    http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/business/2014-01/29/c_126076489.htm

    Among BRICS 2013 FDI Stastics

    Brazil - $63 billion
    Russia - $94 billion
    India - $28 billion
    China - $127 billion
    South Africa - $10 billion

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