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    RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

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    Vladimir79

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    RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Vladimir79 on Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:58 pm

    Rosoboronexport has promised to deal with Chinese copies of the Su-27
    20/08/2009

    Russia is taking measures to combat counterfeiting on the global arms market and, in particular, is proceeding on the copy of the Su-27 China. This, according to RIA Novosti, said on Aug. 19 at the MAKS-2009 the general director of Rosoboronexport, Anatoly Isaikin.

    "The fact that the Chinese side apparently copied the Su-27 - is what to say Russia's side. Maybe it's a fact. ... This property is a complex technology - when the" appearance "may be one, and filling - the other. We have to understand many months and even years, whether it's an exact copy (Su-27), filling may be another ", - said Isaikin. He also clarified that at present are lengthy proceedings in this matter involving Sukhoi other organizations.

    It clarifies the Interfax news agency, letter of intent in every way to oppose unlicensed production abroad, Russia's technology and weapons announced today general director of the state corporation Rostekhnologii Chemezov. According to him, this is already done for manufactured abroad Kalashnikov, counterfeit aircraft units and equipment.

    "We together with the Prosecutor's Office, Bureau of Investigation will fight with companies that offer such counterfeit products both domestically and abroad", - stressed Chemezov.

    Recall that the establishment of the Chinese own a copy of one of the most massive Russia Su-27 became known in early 2008. In 1995, Beijing, Moscow has sold a license to produce 200 Su-27SK, which planned to be built under the name J-11 with Russia's components. Until 2003, China bought from Russia 95 kits for them, but from the remaining 105 declined.

    Experts believe that the Chinese will own a full analogue of the Su-27 only in 2013, but China's defense industry to cope with this problem much earlier. Rosoboronexport comment about copying the Chinese Su-27 at the time refused.

    Note that this is not the only fact of China copying combat equipment and weapons.

    Права на данный материал принадлежат Lenta.ru
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    Russian Patriot

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    Russia, China draft Kalashnikov copyright deal

    Post  Russian Patriot on Sat Oct 24, 2009 6:35 pm

    Russia, China draft Kalashnikov copyright deal

    RIA Novosti

    23:12 22/10/2009 KLIMOVSK, October 22 (RIA Novosti) - Russia is working to reach an agreement with China on copyright protection of Kalashnikov assault rifles, the head of Russia's state arms exporter Rosoboronexport said Thursday.

    "We have received China's national patent for Kalashnikov products. The documents have been handed to the Federal Service for Military and Technical Cooperation to prepare and conclude an intergovernmental agreement in the field," Anatoly Isaikin told journalists.

    Isaikin said the process of reaching a deal with China will be lengthy, but that Russia hopes it will be finished soon, and noted the huge number of unlicensed Kalashnikov rifles produced all over the world.

    "There are about 100 million Kalashnikov assault rifles worldwide, of which half are counterfeit, i.e. produced without licenses, patents and intergovernmental agreements," he said.

    Isaikin said over 15 countries, including Bulgaria, Romania, Egypt, and China, produce the rifles either on expired licenses or without them.

    "Even America produces the assault rifles, even though the country has never received a license for their manufacture," he said.

    Isaikin said there are at least 30 organizations illegally producing and trafficking the weapons, whose activities are very difficult to prevent.

    The best-known Kalashnikov rifle is the 1947 model known as the AK-47. It is the most widely produced used assault rifle in the world, and is used by both regular armies and militant groups.

    The creator of the AK-47, Mikhail Kalashnikov, is 89 years old and lives in Izhevsk.

    http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/news/2009/10/mil-091022-rianovosti09.htm
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    Vladimir79

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    RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:49 pm

    The first batch of D-30KP-2 production Saturn put the Chinese customer and will be staged in China before the end of the year

    02.12.2009

    The first batch of D-30KP-2 production of NPO Saturn, made under the contract between Rosoboronexport and China, handed over the Chinese customer and will be staged in China later this year. Signing the acceptance of eight engines of the first batch was held in NPO "Saturn" 30 November 2009.

    At the signing ceremony of the completion certificate was attended by Head of the Department of the Air Force, Rosoboronexport, Andrei Kharitonov, representatives of China's embassy in Moscow, headed by an advisor - Envoy Zhou Wei, the representatives of the Office of the Chief of military aircraft of the United National Army of China (GUVVT PLA), representatives of OAO "Saturn." document was signed by: on Russia's side - the representative of Rosoboronexport Andrei Kharitonov and commercial director of NPO Saturn, Sergei Popov, the Chinese side - Chief Engineer of the PLA Air Force HC Lee Chzhengan and head of foreign purchases PLA Air Force HC Gu Yan.

    JSC NPO Saturn has made the first batch of D-30KP-2, well ahead of time that well received by Chinese customers. The Chinese delegation also noted with satisfaction the rapid development of enterprise in the creation of modern production workshops with a new high-tech equipment.

    The subsequent contract NPO Saturn is planning to maintain the momentum of production. Manufacturing, commissioning and delivery of another four-party D-30KP-2 the company intends to complete in 2011. At the same time taking over the second, third and fourth parties scheduled, respectively, , in February, May and October 2010, and last, fifth, the party - at the beginning of 2011.

    In general, the contract between Rosoboronexport and China, which entered into force in April 2009, OAO "NPO" Saturn "is obliged to put the Chinese customer 55 D-30KP-2 in the period to 2012. The contract also provides technical support by the manufacturer during the warranty period.

    - We attach great importance to our work together - said the commercial director of NPO Saturn, Sergei Popov. - We have a long-standing friendly relations with Chinese customers. For Saturn is a great honor to work for this contract. We tried to qualitatively and in terms produce the first batch of engines. And we hope that the successful work of the Chinese contract will facilitate the adoption of new decisions on the continuation of our cooperation.

    JSC "Scientific-Production Association" Saturn "- engine manufacturing company that specializes in developing, manufacturing and after sales service of gas turbine engines for military and civil aircraft, ships of the Navy, power plants and gas pumping." NPO "Saturn" is a part " Joint new engine Corporation - a wholly specialized subsidiary of OAO OPK Oboronprom engine-management assets.

    OAO "United Industrial Corporation Oboronprom - a diversified engineering group, established in 2002. A municipality in the GC" Russia's technology. "The main activities: helicopter (JSC" Helicopters of Russia "), engine (CC" JDC "), other assets . Revenue enterprise corporation in 2008 exceeded 100 billion rubles.

    NPO "Saturn", a press release
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    Russia delivers 15 S-300 air-defense batteries to China

    Post  Russian Patriot on Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:21 am

    Russia delivers 15 S-300 air-defense batteries to China

    RIA Novosti

    02/04/201015:05

    MOSCOW, April 2 (RIA Novosti) - Russia has delivered a total of 15 batteries of S-300 surface-to-air missile systems to China, the manufacturer said on Friday.

    Igor Ashurbeili, general director of the Almaz-Antei concern, said it had thus completed the contract with China but gave no indication of how much it was worth or specifically how many S-300s had been delivered.

    An S-300 battery is typically comprised of four truck-mounted installations, each consisting of four missiles.

    He added that there was a "huge line" of foreign clients waiting to buy S-300s and a more advanced version, the S-400, but that no new contracts would be signed for the time being.

    "First we have to arm the Russian military. If there are available production capacities and we fulfill our current contracts, then this process [the signing of new contracts] will resume," he said.

    Ashurbeili added that the "available capacities situation" would not become clear until after the Defense Ministry adopted a state arms procurement program through 2020.

    He offered no indication of when that could be. Nor was it clear whether Russia was behind on its current contracts.

    The advanced version of the S-300 missile system, called S-300PMU1 (SA-20 Gargoyle), has a range of over 150 kilometers (over 100 miles) and can intercept ballistic missiles and aircraft at low and high altitudes, making the system an effective tool for warding off possible airstrikes.

    First deployed by the Soviet Union in 1979, it is still considered to be one of the most potent antiaircraft missile systems currently available.

    It can simultaneously track up to 100 targets and engage up to 12.


    http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/china/2010/china-100402-rianovosti01.htm
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    Vladimir79

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    Pogosyan to limit supply of RD- 93 to China

    Post  Vladimir79 on Tue Jul 06, 2010 3:14 am

    Pogosyan to limit the supply of RD- 93 in China is fully justified


    TSAMTO , July 5. The position of vice president for program coordination and combat aircraft KLA, Director General of Sukhoi and MiG , " Mikhail Pogosyan restrictive measures to tighten Russia 's delivery of RD -93 in China is fully justified , since their re-export to third countries, reduces the market MiG -29 .

    According to " Kommersant ", in letters sent to FSMTC and Rosoboronexport , M. Pogosyan noted that the re-export of these engines has to be agreed with the producers of final products that would not prejudice " . In Rosoboronexport, in turn , noted that " such an order to negotiate such contracts with the producers of final products, in this case the aircraft does not exist. "

    According to Kommersant , the reason that M. Pogosyan made against another impending deal with China on the RD-93 was the clash of interests between Russia and China on the Egyptian market ( RD -93 used in the Chinese FC-1 fighters and their export options ).

    Permission for re-export to Egypt, the RD -93 in the FC-1 was issued FSMTC in November 2007 . The engine can also be staged in Nigeria, Bangladesh, Saudi Arabia and Algeria. Re-export is carried out in accordance with the Government's decision . Therefore, the question of limiting re Russian engines should also be taken at the level of the Russian government.

    The possibility of re- RD -93 to a third country in its time was considered a very long time. The main opponent of that decision, then acted Russian Defense Ministry.

    The first contract to supply China 100 RD -93 in the amount of 237 million dollars was signed in 2005. Signed at the same time the framework agreement provides for the delivery of 500 RD - 93. China also said the possibility of purchasing up to 1000 upgraded the RD-93 engines with increased thrust . In this case, the overall program delivery RD-93 to China could make 3.75 billion dollars .

    To date, the second contract to supply China's regular 100 RD -93 has not been signed , reports Reuters , citing sources in the defense industry .

    It is obvious that the negotiations for this contract seriously progressed , forcing M. Pogosyan oppose this deal.

    According to TSAMTO , Russia for several years has been negotiating with Egypt for the supply of up to 40 MiG-29 SMT . The contract to be signed by the scheme trade in ( the new machines in exchange for the old MiG-21 , raised in Egypt more than 35 years ago ).

    Along with the negotiations with Russia and China, the Egyptian government has also initiated negotiations with Pakistan on the joint production of Chinese JF-17 (FC- 1) . Reassemble planned in Egypt. The volume of purchases may amount to no less than 48 JF- 17 " Thunder " . No concrete agreements have been reached and the timing of signing the contract talk premature.

    The main reason for the success of the Chinese fighter in third camp is the price factor and relatively acceptable performance characteristics . Yielding to the MiG- 29 on their performance characteristics , the Chinese fighter jet is significantly cheaper .

    The aircraft is equipped with a turbojet JF-17/FC-1 RD - 93. Prototype of JF-17 made its first flight in August 2003 . It is also envisaged the creation of two-seat training version of the combat fighter . Cost of JF-17 is estimated at 10-12 million dollars .

    The pilot batch of four turbojet RD -93 was produced in China in 2002-2003. for flight tests on three experimental aircraft FC- 1.

    Negotiations to conclude a contract for the delivery of the first consignment of engines were a very long time . China as the first phase proposes to supply 15 engines for a full set of flight tests . Russia, for its part, insisted on the delivery of the first phase of the 100 engines . As a result, the proposal of the Russian side was taken.

    "Chinese " version of the RD -93 is a deep modernization of the Russian RD-33 turbojet for the MiG -29 has a lower location of the box units, provides traction and velocity of 8300 kg to 2000 km / h at altitude 16.5 km.

    RD-93 turbojet developed by KB Plant them . Klimov .

    During the negotiations to conclude a framework contract plant them. Klimov expressed willingness to improve engine RD - 93 for FC-1 fighter . As a result of its attraction can increase by almost 10%, and more manoeuvrable aircraft will provide the installation with diverging nozzle thrust vector. China , for its part, expressed the then intention to continue cooperation on the RD- 93, as interested in increasing the traction motor and install it vserakursny nozzle with diverging thrust vector.

    Modernization of the RD- 93, providing for increasing traction with 8.3 to 9 mc , and installation of the nozzle with diverging thrust vector will significantly increase the performance of the FC- 1 and its combat effectiveness .

    China has long been on the market for military aircraft of Egypt.

    In December 1999, the Egyptian Ministry of Defense signed a five-year contract with China worth 345 million dollars on the production of 80 UBS K-8E « Karakorum "for the Egyptian Air Force . The first ten cars were built in China . Build the next two games out of 15 and 10 aircraft , respectively , was implemented at the facilities of the Egyptian company AOI from components of small and medium sizes. The remaining 45 cars were manufactured by 90 % in Egypt . In early 2005, Egypt has placed an additional order for another 40 aircraft K-8E. Thus, the total volume of the Egyptian order of 120 machines. Turbofan Engines TFE731-2A-2A for Egyptian K-8E put the U.S. company Allied Signal .
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    Viktor

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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Viktor on Tue Jul 06, 2010 8:00 pm

    Perhaps they should considered stoping AL-31F supply as well.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  GarryB on Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:14 am

    In a way they are playing a game between India and China.
    India gets production licence for the RD-33 with 9 ton thrust so China is only allowed to buy 8.3 ton thrust modified RD-93. The RD-93 is just an RD-33 with the gearbox and other components on the bottom to suit the design the Chinese made for it.
    They are supposedly working on more powerful improvements of the RD-33 that increase thrust to 10 and even 12 tons and when that is ready it will likely be offered to the Indians first, either in the Mig-35s (if they choose that) or more likely regarding the expected timescales with a joint Mig Indian small 5th gen fighter, and the Chinese will likely get 9 ton thrust RD-93s.

    The Chinese are already trying to make reverse engineered Al-31s and from what is publicly available they are not doing too well at it.

    Modern engines are complex things that not just anyone can make, they are very challenging in regard to design and materials.

    Selling them Al-31 engines earns Russia money, yet it is not also costing money because countries that want sophisticated heavy fighters want sophisticated heavy fighters, not a cheap knock off. With the RD-93 we are not talking about copying as the problem, but the fact that every RD-93 that Russia sells to China means one more cheap light fighter competing with Russian aircraft sales... not that modern Mig-29s are in the cheap light fighter category... they are more of a medium fighter.
    Sales of the Al-31 to China do not lead to China undercutting Russia in an aircraft that China export and Russia exports.
    Sales of RD-93s do.
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    Vladimir79

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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Jul 07, 2010 4:19 am

    It has more to do with FC-1 taking away MiG-29s market share. China has proven they are incapable of reverse engineering our engines, they already have RD-93s to look at so that is not the concern. If countries buy a bunch of FC-1, they won't need MiG-29 even though it is a 4th gen compared to a 3rd gen. FC-1 fills a low end nitch that we don't want China to fill, we want countries to buy a better medium nitch with the MiG-29. It is true we sell a down-rated engine to China, for good reason that we don't want them to see our latest design. We sold RD-93 to China so they could resell to Pakistan, that way we sell to a market we have closed off to ourselves to keep our Indian partners happy. It is a way for our engines to penetrate already established markets we don't really have access to through China as a mediator. We do not want China selling FC-1 to our client states cutting into our markets so the decision to limit sales is wise.
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    Negotiations to resume exports to China Russian armored vehicles

    Post  Vladimir79 on Mon Nov 01, 2010 3:54 am

    Negotiations to resume exports to China Russian armored vehicles

    Moscow. October 28. Interfax-AVN - Military-Industrial Company expects to resume shipments to China armored vehicles "Tiger", told Interfax-AVN on Thursday, a spokesman Sergei Suvorov.

    "We have set in China about 50 cars of the" Tiger "in the form of SPM-1, that is, the base modification. At present, negotiations are underway with the Chinese side on the resumption of supplies of" Tigers "- said Sergey Suvorov.

    According to him, in negotiations with the Chinese side has not yet discussed the possibility of production of "Tigers" in China under license.

    Previously reported that the PRC was delivered 10 machines, sets of which were supposed to meet "Tigers" in China directly at one of Beijing Motor Company.

    SA Suvorov, said that at the Arzamas machine-building plant, which is part of the military-industrial company, provide a special pipeline to build cars "Tiger". In 2008, running second conveyor.
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    China's Su-35 fighter order:

    Post  nightcrawler on Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:49 am

    Russia ready to sell Su-35 fighter jets to China

    Russia's state-run arms exporter Rosoboronexport said on Tuesday it was ready to hold talks with China on the delivery of advanced Su-35 fighter aircraft to the Chinese air force.

    "We are ready to work with our Chinese partners to this end [Su-35 deliveries]," Deputy General Director of Rosoboronexport Alexander Mikheyev said at the Airshow China 2010, which is being held on November 16-21 in Zhuhai.

    The Su-35 Flanker-E, powered by two 117S engines with thrust vectoring, combines high maneuverability and the capability to effectively engage several air targets simultaneously using both guided and unguided missiles and weapon systems.

    Russia's Sukhoi aircraft maker earlier said it planned to start deliveries of the new aircraft, billed as "4++ generation using fifth-generation technology," to foreign clients in 2011 and produce Su-35s over a period of 10 years up to 2020.

    China International Aviation & Aerospace Exhibition (Airshow China) is the only international aerospace trade show in China that is endorsed by the Chinese central government. The biannual arms exhibition has been held in Zhuhai since 1996.

    ZHUHAI (China), November 16 (RIA Novosti)
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    Viktor

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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Viktor on Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:21 pm

    That sale was expected long before China even showed some interest in it. It simply holds to much technologies China will not be able to reach soon.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  nightcrawler on Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:45 pm

    Viktor wrote:That sale was expected long before China even showed some interest in it. It simply holds to much technologies China will not be able to reach soon.

    They will try as hell to copy it; that I certainly know Laughing
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  GarryB on Thu Nov 18, 2010 5:31 am

    This is the head of the Russian Arms export company saying he is ready to talk to China about sales of Su-35s.

    I rather think the government clearance for such a sale might not be too forthcoming unless they order them in fairly large numbers and sign a prenuptial agreement so to speak.

    I would expect the Su-35 that China gets will be to the Su-35 that the Russian armed forces get what the Su-30MKK is to the Su-30MKI.
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    China wants to buy S-400, 117S

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Nov 24, 2010 11:09 am

    China wants to buy S-400, 117S

    China made a bid for the purchase of Russian aircraft engines such as 117C and the newest anti-aircraft missile system S-400 wrote on Tuesday, Vedomosti, citing defense ministry officials and a source close to the management of Rosoboronexport.

    After the visit of Russian Defense Minister Anatoly Serdyukov in China, held two weeks ago, a new package of proposals to the Chinese military-technical cooperation. According to the interlocutors of the newspaper, the Chinese side has made an application for purchase of aircraft engines such as 117C (modernized version of the AL-31F engine, intended for passing the test of Su-35) and advanced anti-aircraft missile system S-400. Another type of technology who are interested in Chinese, became a military transport aircraft Il-476.

    Sources of the publication also reported that the issue of engines 117S Russian side is ready to meet China. According to them, the export of advanced S-400 is possible after 2017, because the industry has sufficient production capacity, and the first such systems to be equipped with the Russian Armed Forces.

    From this year the state through loans of state banks and state guarantees funding the construction of three new plants Concern PVO Almaz-Antey "- a new production of the Obukhov factory in St. Petersburg, new industries based on Mashzavod Nizhny Novgorod in Nizhny Novgorod and plant Avitek" in Kirov. If these plans are implemented earlier, the application of China can be considered until 2017, the official said the Defense Ministry. But sales of the IL-476, according to him, more than real - in 2011, will build a prototype of this aircraft, the beginning of its production is possible through three or four years, while China is regarded as one of the first customers.

    On Tuesday in Beijing has passed 15 session of the Russian-Chinese intergovernmental commission on military-technical cooperation, which was attended by Minister of Defense. Serdyukov, together with the Deputy Chairman of the Central Military Commission of the PRC, General-Colonel Goh Bosyunom signed a protocol that defines the future direction of development of relations between the two countries in military-technical sphere. First of all, is the realization of contracts for the supply of spare parts for air defense systems, aircraft and naval equipment, as well as the development of military products for the Chinese side in the development work.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Viktor on Wed Nov 24, 2010 2:44 pm

    As I said, China has no option but to turn for Russian arms market once again but now under different prices and time lines cozz its R&D is slower than those of other countries.

    Su-35BM will be bought, S-400 too.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Nov 24, 2010 10:07 pm

    If they are still hunting for Russian engines, the WS-10A must not be going very well at all.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  GarryB on Thu Nov 25, 2010 3:00 am

    I want to buy S-400 and Su-35S... will you take a cheque?

    What you want and what you can have of often very different.

    Most of the real high tech stuff you can't simply copy it by taking it to bits.

    Otherwise PS-90A engines that have American components wouldn't have American components any more.

    The solution for Russia is to buy the technology to make the components they can't currently make and therefore they will part own the manufacturing process to make them.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  nightcrawler on Tue Nov 30, 2010 4:07 pm

    S-400....India surely will bark affraid
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  GarryB on Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:35 am

    S-400....India surely will bark

    I rather doubt Russia will sell China S-400, or Su-35 or T-50 or anything they consider their best now.

    In 7 years time when the Russian AF is introducing the T-50 into operational service they might sell China something like the Su-35 but it will likely resemble the Su-335 of now rather than the Su-35 of 2017 with more T-50 bits and pieces in it.

    Great way of reducing costs and improving fleet performance is commonality of parts and systems so buying AAMs for the whole fleet rather than just T-50s makes a lot of economic sense. Even just with logistics it makes it easier to service and maintain a narrower range of weapons etc.

    I would think that in 2020 the Russians might sell S-400s to China but by then they will likely be operating S-400xyz model with improved performance and systems along with S-500.

    India wont bark because their T-50s will be better than Chinas Su-35s. With the mountains between China and India I would think even the S-400 might have problems covering all the valleys and approaches.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:20 pm

    China can ask for it all they want to. Unless they buy big enough orders to make up for the eventual IP theft they will commit, no sale will be made.

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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  KRON1 on Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:04 am

    Vladimir79 wrote:China can ask for it all they want to. Unless they buy big enough orders to make up for the eventual IP theft they will commit, no sale will be made.

    If Russia needs sales to keep their companies alive, they will make them. It all depends on how good the other markets are whether they can afford not to keep China.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  GarryB on Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:36 am

    That is less of an issue now really as long as the Russian military is actually buying of course.

    In the past there were no orders at all so a sale to China was much more likely.

    They weren't stupid however and didn't accept generous Chinese offers like to purchase 2 Mig-31s.

    Maybe if it had been 250 Mig-31s they might have agreed because that money could have been used to fund a Mig-31 upgrade.

    The thing is that now there are Russian military orders so selling 2 Mig-31s to China (or 2 of anything) would be very shortsighted and in the end counter productive for Russia.

    Of course if the Russian military really doesn't want the BMPT then why not sell it to the Chinese?

    And also of course the S-400 and 117S engine really do not fit into that category.

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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Austin on Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:30 am

    I just hope that even of Russia sells Su-35 and S-400 to China they make it almost impossible for them to reverse engineer it technically plus sign IP agreements with Russia that makes it legally binding for them to protect each others IP , much like they did with India.

    I do not think India has the right to complain if China buys advanced stuff from Russia as India buys equally advanced stuff from US , French which ever best suits them.

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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  Minghegy on Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:58 pm

    GarryB wrote:I want to buy S-400 and Su-35S... will you take a cheque?

    What you want and what you can have of often very different.

    Most of the real high tech stuff you can't simply copy it by taking it to bits.

    Otherwise PS-90A engines that have American components wouldn't have American components any more.

    The solution for Russia is to buy the technology to make the components they can't currently make and therefore they will part own the manufacturing process to make them.

    Where did they copy the anti ballistic missile and anti ship ballistic missile? They are far more advanced than SAMs.
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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

    Post  GarryB on Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:40 am

    First of all I would like to say I have a lot of respect for the Chinese, they invented gunpowder and much more importantly printing and paper making. There would be no computers without these two inventions... the Church would dominate knowledge and history with monks the only literate people in the community for which writing was as much an art as it was a method of storing and retrieving information and communication.
    Modern society couldn't exist as we know it without these two vital inventions and they also invented many other things too.

    However... to shoot down a satellite you just need the capability to launch a satellite and that will suffice.
    An anti satellite weapon is just something designed to intercept a satellite in orbit and as Arthur C Clarke once said the easiest way to shoot down a satellite is to launch into an opposite orbit a bucket of nails... if it misses the first time around that is no problem because every 45 minutes or so they will come around for a second chance and the slowly spreading cloud of nails will eventually hit its target. Orbital speed is something like 10km per second so the closing speed will be easily sufficient for nails to be very destructive against any satellite. A small flake of paint weighing a fraction of a gramme would penetrate the skin of most spacecraft at such speeds. A 10 gramme nail would be almost impossible to stop as the armour thickness needed would be too heavy to get into orbit.

    And this so called anti ship ballistic missile would require a terminal warhead similar to the new MARVs the Russians are putting in their TOPOL-Ms and RS-24s to actually have a chance of hitting a ship reliably and I really don't believe the Chinese can do that yet.

    I have every confidence that China could make S-400 quality missiles or Su-35 quality aircraft, but doing it on their own will cost enormous amounts of investment in time and money and resources. They clearly want to buy it off the shelf rather than do that.

    As has been mentioned, unless they are prepared to sign a contract to make significant numbers it is rather unlikely the Russians will be interested.
    Of course they will also likely demand payment up front as they have already bought a licence production agreement for Su-27SMs than then didn't complete the number they wanted to make.

    I just hope that even of Russia sells Su-35 and S-400 to China they make
    it almost impossible for them to reverse engineer it technically plus
    sign IP agreements with Russia that makes it legally binding for them to
    protect each others IP , much like they did with India.

    As far as I know the Russians make all their customers sign intellectual property agreements to prevent technology being stolen without fair payment for the IP.

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    Re: RUSSIA - CHINA Military Contracts:

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