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    BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

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    George1
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  George1 on Sat Sep 26, 2015 5:08 am

    Rail Phantom: Russia Developing Invisible 'Death Trains' With Nukes

    For the first time since 2005, Russia is set to resume the manufacturing of its "death trains" - covert railway complexes with ballistic missiles - but on a higher technological level which will make them even more untraceable now.

    The Soviet Union decided to produce combat railway missile complexes (BZhRKs) with ballistic missiles in 1969 in response to the US' powerful system of nuclear-capable submarines.

    The USSR operated 12 BZhRKs with three missile launchers each, and it was an efficient and intimidating solution. The vehicles travelled across the system of railroads on the country's vast territory and closely resembled ordinary cargo trains, bringing to naught the capabilities of satellite surveillance.

    As it was impossible to precisely determine the place where they could fire a nuclear missile, they were dubbed as "death" or "phantom" trains.

    In 2005, Russia decommissioned the trains. Ten years later Moscow has decided to embark on the idea again.

    Russian military industry official Viktor Murakhovsky explained the advantages of the next-generation nuke trains:

    "They will not need any specific big cars. They will completely coincide with the existing parameters of railcars and will therefore be completely hidden from a foe's reconnaissance and surveillance. Moreover, the system will enable launches virtually everywhere on the railway bed in contrast with the previous system that required special launch conditions."

    The new project, codenamed "Barguzin," will carry six ICBMs RS-24 Yars (a land equivalent of the submarine-launched Bulava).

    A Russian BZhRK's cars can resist an explosion of a nuclear warhead just several hundred meters away. Such a train can run for a month autonomously and pass up to 1,000 kilometers daily at the speed of nearly 100 kmph.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20150926/1027575725/russia-death-phantom-nuclear-train.html#ixzz3mrT4aNpX


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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  George1 on Wed Dec 16, 2015 3:14 am

    Sketches of Russia's railway-based missile system ready — missile force chief

    Earlier reports said the new complex might go operational in 2019

    MOSCOW, December 16. /TASS/. The sketches of Russia’s future railway-based missile complex Barguzin have been finalized and at the moment design documents for its individual parts and components are being developed, the commander of the Strategic Missile Force, Colonel-General Sergey Karakayev, said on Wednesday.

    "Sketches have been completed. Work is in progress on design documents for individual parts and systems," he added.

    "Under the defense minister’s decision of May 6, 2015 the sequence of works to create the complex has been specified. In 2017, a special report is to be submitted to the president regarding the prospects for its deployment," Karakayev said.

    He did not mention when the work on the technical documents might be finalized, the new complex tested and put on duty.

    Earlier, a source in the defense-industrial complex told TASS Barguzin specifications were to be finalized by the middle of 2016. There were reports the new complex might go operational in 2019. Earlier, the strategic missile force commander said Barguzin would remain in service at least till 2040.


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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  kvs on Thu Dec 17, 2015 11:34 am

    "sketches" = blueprints

    Silly automatic translation software.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  George1 on Sat Dec 19, 2015 12:44 am

    Source: missile complex "Barguzin" will be adopted no earlier than 2020


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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  George1 on Thu Jan 21, 2016 1:36 pm

    Nuclear-Armed Trains Roaming Russia

    Russia continues to modernize its nuclear arsenal. One of the most interesting plans regards the reintroduction of nuclear missile systems deployed on trains


    During the Cold War years, a huge rail network was built as a nuclear detterent and is still present in Russia today. Thanks to this immense infrastructure, ready for use, the decision to reactivate this particular deterrent will not require much effort. The goal is to have this missile system ready by 2020.

    The greatest challenge for Russia is in building the new trains. Of the 12 available in Soviet times, 10 were destroyed according to the START-2 framework agreement and 2 ended up in museums. In terms of design they will be based on blueprints already used in the past. The great advantages of this system is the possibility of camouflaging the train completely , passing it off asa regular commercial train. This prevents the enemy from tracking it or follow the deployment of nuclear warheads. In addition, in some places the dense railway network penetrates hundreds of meters inside mountain ranges guarantying protection and virtually absolute invisibility. Other features include new electronic warfare systems (ECM) installed on the trains.

    The major technological overhaul will allow the trains ‘Barguzin’ to transport six RS-24 Yars ICBMs, instead of maximum three outdated Scalpel missles on the old Molodets model. The nuclear arms are probably smaller than the Molodets missiles system that had 10 MIRVed warheads yielding more than 5 megatons. Instead, each Yars has four warheads totaling up to 1.2 megatons. Yars are much less devastating but much more accurate and have a greater range. In the art of modern nuclear deterrence, combined with the ABM being developed, precision, speed and invisibility is far more important than megatons.

    Service life estimates are a minimum of 20 years, with the possibility of modernizing to extend their operational period.

    Russia aims to create a strategic level of nuclear deterrent to deploy and use, significantly faster than their American colleagues . In this sense the Barguzin is a formidable system for multiple reasons but mainly for its ability to be deployed in remote areas quickly. The train is capable of traveling 1000km per day providing enormous flexibility in terms of displacement and positioning.

    In terms of nuclear doctrine, it should be remembered that the train's missiles are to be understood as second strike capabilities. Nevertheless, the return of missile trains is yet another example of how Russia is focusing on nuclear deterrence, improving all its strategic forces.

    It’s very difficult to find actual footage of the Moldets tests. This video, shows a demonstration of the old Soviet Missile train launching a missile.

    http://russia-insider.com/en/trains-and-nukes-deter-american-stupidity-video/ri12350


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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  sepheronx on Thu Jan 21, 2016 1:55 pm

    A little late to the news, no?

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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  Austin on Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:24 pm

    Russian rail-mobile ICBM project set to be axed

    http://www.janes.com/article/57829/russian-rail-mobile-icbm-project-set-to-be-axed
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  sepheronx on Mon Feb 08, 2016 7:12 pm

    What? No mention of who said it will be axed and why? And defense budget didnt change, so that is wrong too.

    Sap2020 is still going as schedualed and ready stated no changes to it.  Only thing so far is lack of Sap2025.

    Jabes is usually so so but this article is so far not good.  They need to provide: sources, links and as well as reasoning.  But nothing in the article.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  max steel on Mon Feb 08, 2016 8:23 pm

    NO such news was published by any Russian outlet. I also view (in)famous Jane's with a great deal of irony, politely speaking--these were the guys, who on the eve of Debaltsevo disaster were spreading Ukronazi propaganda about how the victory for criminals in Kiev was at hand.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Tue Feb 09, 2016 6:37 am

    max steel wrote:NO such news was published by any Russian outlet. I also view (in)famous Jane's with a great deal of irony, politely speaking--these were the guys, who on the eve of Debaltsevo disaster were spreading Ukronazi propaganda about how the victory for criminals in Kiev was at hand.

    The only shred of credibility left for Jane's is SCO's articles. 10-15 years ago Jane's was far more neutral and far less sensationalist with unsubstantiated claims, but alas times have changed.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  max steel on Tue Feb 09, 2016 8:03 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    max steel wrote:NO such news was published by any Russian outlet. I also view (in)famous Jane's with a great deal of irony, politely speaking--these were the guys, who on the eve of Debaltsevo disaster were spreading Ukronazi propaganda about how the victory for criminals in Kiev was at hand.

    The only shred of credibility left for Jane's is SCO's articles. 10-15 years ago Jane's was far more neutral and far less sensationalist with unsubstantiated claims, but alas times have changed.

    I CHECKED it again. Same results. I wonder why people still pay for their full time subscription. Lying with bold face and no facts to back their claim. Suspect
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  Project Canada on Tue Feb 09, 2016 8:40 am

    one commenter said the sources (claimed to be from russian Mod) were provided on the full article,
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  max steel on Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:07 pm

    Finally found some info.

    a couple of month ago there was indeed a report about Barguzin readiness date moving to 2020 from the original 2018. But the program does not seem to be dead quite yet - following Jane's story a source in the industry told Interfax that the pop-up tests of the missile are scheduled to begin later this year. However, from what the source said it does seem that the program's future is in doubt.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  George1 on Sat Feb 20, 2016 2:11 am

    RVSN officer claims design for rail-based Barguzin ICBM being completed; program still on track.

    http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160220/1377773148.html


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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  George1 on Mon Feb 22, 2016 6:51 am

    Oldies but Goodies: Russia Preps Crews for ‘Doomsday Nuke Trains’

    Russia will soon start training crews for its feared missile trains, Echo Moskvy Radio reported citing the head of the Strategic Missile Forces’ military education department, Viktor Nesterov.

    Colonel Nesterov said that in 2020 Russia’s armed forces will receive a new generation of ICBM-launching trains.

    The Barguzin railroad ICBM system will carry six RS-24 Yars ICBMs, as compared to three RS-22 Scalpels carried by its predecessor, the Molodets railroad ICBM system.

    “We need to think ahead… Realizing full well that we are going to need specialists to operate this new missile complex we decided to launch special courses to train such specialists,” Viktor Nesterov said.

    The Molodets railroad ICBM system, armed with three RS-22 ICBMs was retired in 2005 in keeping with the START-2 treaty. Out of the 12 Soviet-era missile trains, 10 were destroyed and the remaining two were sent to a museum.

    Barguzin will be greatly superior to Molodets in terms of range, accuracy, and other characteristics. Ths will allow the system to remain in service for a long time, at least until 2040, Russia’s Strategic Missile Forces commander, Col.-Gen. Sergey Karakaev said.

    The missile trains are stealthy and highly mobile, capable of covering up to a thousand kilometers in a single day. Disguised as a freight train, a missile train cannot be spotted either by satellite or electronic surveillance.

    All necessary infrastructure, such as tunnels, reinforced tracks and launch sites, is still in place and ready to go.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/russia/20160222/1035170592/russia-nukes-trains.html#ixzz40v7vn01B


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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Mon Feb 22, 2016 11:47 am

    George1 wrote:RVSN officer claims design for rail-based Barguzin ICBM being completed; program still on track.

    http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160220/1377773148.html

    In this case on track is also literally Laughing
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  George1 on Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:43 am

    Barguzin rail-mobile ICBM axed, Project 4202 lives on

    http://russianforces.org/blog/2016/04/barguzin_rail-mobile_icbm_is_a.shtml



    Last edited by George1 on Thu May 18, 2017 8:01 am; edited 1 time in total


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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  sepheronx on Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:51 am

    The rail based ICBM system was an odd decision really. Didn't make too much sense. Mobile (road) does. But it I shelved for now. Save money for projects that is really needed.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  max steel on Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:58 am

    lol1 I wrote it in the Rail-ICBM thread but again they've not mentioned any source to prove their claim that's why I avoided.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  sepheronx on Wed Apr 06, 2016 2:00 am

    max steel wrote:lol1  I wrote it in the Rail-ICBM thread but again they've not mentioned any source to prove their claim that's why I avoided.

    They really need to provide sources. Makes them look amateurish. But if news is true, then OK.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed Apr 06, 2016 5:19 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    max steel wrote:lol1  I wrote it in the Rail-ICBM thread but again they've not mentioned any source to prove their claim that's why I avoided.

    They really need to provide sources. Makes them look amateurish. But if news is true, then OK.

    A lot of their sources are based on word of mouth, and or sources that you cant verify the credibility of (good ole' "unnamed" sources Rolling Eyes)  which is a reason to avoid the site.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  Militarov on Wed Apr 06, 2016 6:15 am

    http://russianforces.org in general is full of crap and BS, every month they release article on some USSR project from 80s/70s being revived, and not a single word about it anywhere else. Clickbiters.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  GarryB on Wed Apr 06, 2016 11:05 pm

    Rail based ICBMs are actually better than road mobile ICBMs because although rail models are limited to rails they can also move rather faster and there are plenty of rails and sidings in Russia to move to.

    Even a side track with earth mounds built up on either side and the front and rear would be enough to protect it from anything but a very near miss... and the west does not have enough nuclear weapons to cover every 1000km of Russian rail track let alone every 200kms.


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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  Militarov on Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:50 am

    GarryB wrote:Rail based ICBMs are actually better than road mobile ICBMs because although rail models are limited to rails they can also move rather faster and there are plenty of rails and sidings in Russia to move to.

    Even a side track with earth mounds built up on either side and the front and rear would be enough to protect it from anything but a very near miss... and the west does not have enough nuclear weapons to cover every 1000km of Russian rail track let alone every 200kms.

    But they have significant disadvantages in areas where you can deploy them, and enemy sort of has alot easier job detecting them as he knows they simply HAVE to be somewhere on railroad Smile Destruction of key points on railroads like bridges and major crossroads can severely reduce its effectiveness. But still i dont mind having such platform just for sake of diversity.
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    Re: BZhRK "Barguzin" railway ICBM

    Post  kvs on Thu Apr 07, 2016 4:31 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    GarryB wrote:Rail based ICBMs are actually better than road mobile ICBMs because although rail models are limited to rails they can also move rather faster and there are plenty of rails and sidings in Russia to move to.

    Even a side track with earth mounds built up on either side and the front and rear would be enough to protect it from anything but a very near miss... and the west does not have enough nuclear weapons to cover every 1000km of Russian rail track let alone every 200kms.

    But they have significant disadvantages in areas where you can deploy them, and enemy sort of has alot easier job detecting them as he knows they simply HAVE to be somewhere on railroad Smile Destruction of key points on railroads like bridges and major crossroads can severely reduce its effectiveness. But still i dont mind having such platform just for sake of diversity.

    The key is that the enemy cannot target the rail ICBMs like bridges since it does not know where on the rails they are at any given instant
    and even if the enemy manages to have spies pin their locations (very doubtful) and target them with a first strike they can be moved while
    the enemy ICBMs are incoming. So they are just as useful as road mobile ICBMs but can be heavier. They remove the first strike advantage.
    There is no need for these mobile ICBMs to be shuffled around the whole territory in some ergodic domain filling operation. The main thing is
    to be able to move them far enough from any point of impact of enemy warheads.

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