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    VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:07 am

    If UCAVs could perform the role then why bother developing the PAK FA... surely a UCAV can do that job too?

    The truth is that hunting enemy cruise missiles and stealth bombers is easier with a huge radar on board and an IRST and real people and I doubt that will change in 15 years.

    Austin

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Austin on Wed Jun 08, 2011 9:19 am

    ^^ because PAK-FA was designed 8-9 years back when there was no mature UAV technology forget about UCAV technology.

    15 years from now they would have UCAV technology and netcentric capability to make it useful and viable to replace Mig-31 types if it gets decommisioned from RuAF , I personally think Mig-31 will stay till 2030 after refurbishment.

    Till such time UCAV gets deployed in sufficient numbers they can always use derivative of PAK-FA in that role.
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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:11 am

    I disagree.

    The Mig-31 can be upgraded with new 5th gen engines and new radar and 5th gen avionics which should make it cheaper to operate... the new engines should even allow super cruising potential if the new avionics reduce weight enough... and of course the new engines should be more fuel efficient as well.

    Austin

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Austin on Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:15 am

    GarryB wrote:I disagree.

    The Mig-31 can be upgraded with new 5th gen engines and new radar and 5th gen avionics which should make it cheaper to operate... the new engines should even allow super cruising potential if the new avionics reduce weight enough... and of course the new engines should be more fuel efficient as well.

    They can but for how long , the airframe has technical life and if recent Indian Mig-29 upgrade is an indication , they can extend the airframe life to atleast 20 years , so lets says Mig-31 get deep refit which actually they did and its going on , its 20 more years which is 2025-2030 , unless they start building new Mig-31 they need to be decommisioned.

    So what ever replaces Mig-31 will need to start coming out by 2025 atleast or 15 years from now , good enough time to get UCAV in next 15- 20 years and in interim period get a modified PAK-FA for intercept role.
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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:25 am

    So far even the countries with the most experience with UAVs have used them for recon and assassination.

    I just really don't think a UCAV will be developed in 15 or 20 years time that can reliably perform air to air roles effectively enough to approach the performance and capabilities of manned aircraft.

    Remember it is not longer the PVO, it is air and space defence... they will likely go to satellites before they go to UCAVs.
    The most likely UCAVs they would employ would be airships rather than fixed wing UCAVs.
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    nightcrawler

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  nightcrawler on Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:53 pm

    @Austin

    I don't think the UCAV is anything but matured. We know because we had the first hand experience in the face of their victims. The precision targeting is all but BS. UCAVs just can't fire an adequately aimed missile but yes its good for recon. Evey time they fire a missile 4-5 civilians get killed * in a documentary US generals himself proclaimed that without public intel from the ground UCAVs are all but dumb
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    Vladimir79

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    Zelin reports on Air Force Project Status

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Aug 10, 2011 7:09 am

    Celestial outlook
    Air Force Commander spoke about the new aircraft and air defense systems, which must be received by the Russian army

    Air force

    Air Force Commander Colonel General Alexander Zelin said Tuesday, as will develop in the next few years he headed the Armed Forces.

    Zelin said that during this year's fleet of combat vehicles of the Russian aircraft filled up with six front-line bomber Su-34. "Last year we had four such machines, this year we get six more," - said Zelin. He added that such an aircraft is not the Americans, "they have departed from this theme."

    "Su-34 protects the crew, but in its maneuvering capabilities and tasks to be solved it is close to the park long-range aviation aircraft. If he will carry cruise missiles, then switch to another class, "- said the commander, passes the RIA "Novosti".

    Zelin said that during training the Air Force Su-34 with two fill-ups for 8 hours flew from Lipetsk to Komsomolsk-on-Amur, and could reach even further, provided refueling.

    In the coming years, said the commander in chief, the defense industry will create aircraft radar detection of a new generation. "We plan to get airplane A-100, a carrier which will be machine Il-476 with PS-90 with long range," - said the Zelin. According to him, the car should be ready by 2016.

    IL-476 is a deep modernization of the military transport aircraft Il-76MD: the fuselage of the new machine is practically not change, but the wing will be different structurally. It will be applied lengthy panel that is used in basic design and technology wing of the IL-96.

    Talking about future models of equipment, the commander in chief has complained that the multi-purpose Su-35 isn't created quickly enough. "As for the Su-35, then work on it do not go as I wanted" - said Zelin.

    According to him, in making this car has some glitches. According to Zelin, on-board equipment and integrated defense system of the Su-35 is inferior American aircraft of the same type.

    "Our plane should be more protected from the air defenses of the enemy," - said the commander in chief.

    At the same time work to create fifth-generation aircraft T-50, according to the commander in chief, going as planned. "By the fifth generation until we go to the chart. Such failure to stop and think about these issues we do not "- said the general.

    Recall that in early July, a number of statements in which the implementation of defense contracts this year has been questioned. The next day, spoke with Anatoliy Serdyukov public statementIn which critics called "alarmists." The Minister admitted that the allocation of funds for the purchase of advanced weapons is uneven, but explained that this unevenness is coordinated with all concerned agencies.

    Unmanned Army and

    The Commander said the decision of the leadership of the Armed Forces decision to transfer an unmanned aircraft in the Army. "Unmanned aircraft is still in its air force, but there is a decision of the General Staff to transfer it into the Army," - said Zelin.

    Mi-X1 - another project of Russian-speed helicopter, developed by Yakovlev Design Bureau. Mil. According to the developers, the car can reach speeds of up to 500 kilometers per hour and used to serve remote areas. According to genkonstruktora Plant, the Mi-X1 in the future can compete with the medium-haul aircraft

    According to him, this issue closely involved in the chief command of Russian Air Force. "Directive Chief of Staff perform" - said the commander in chief.

    He said that in the future of unmanned aircraft operational and tactical plans to pass into the air bases, which are directly subordinated to the commanders of military districts.

    In addition, Zelin said, the Defense Ministry decided in the next decade, nearly double the number of air bases army aviation. "Now in our part of eight air bases army aviation. Until 2020, must have 14 air bases "- leads "Interfax" Commander of the word.

    He confirmed that under the state program of weapons until 2020 is planned to purchase more than one thousand helicopters. The Commander said that the urgency of Army aviation experience confirmed the five-day war with Georgia in 2008.

    Now, said the general, the Air Force are on arms attack helicopters Mi-28N, Ka-52 military transport and combat helicopters of new modifications of the family "Mi". "They are able to operate both day and night" - said captain.

    He also noted that the BBC is extremely interested in the heavy transport helicopter Mi-26, in particular, as a tanker for the Army fuels and lubricants.

    Defense

    Col. Gen. Zelin said that last week on duty barred second anti-aircraft missile regiment equipped with the latest anti-aircraft missile system S-400 "Triumph". Earlier it was reported that by the end of this year to combat mission will begin and the third part of the military, armed with C-400, but Zelin said that before the deadline for combat duty will take not one but two of the regiment.

    The Commander added that plans to supply these systems "have shifted to the right" through no fault of Defense reasons. "The C-400 has problems with long-range missile. Nevertheless, an understanding of the industry is, and I'm optimistic, "- he said.

    Zelin said the Air Force command insists on building a new plant for production of anti-aircraft missile. "We put that question to the leadership of Concern" Almaz-Antey ", - said Zelin.

    Anti-aircraft missile system S-400 is designed to engage all types of aircraft - aircraft, unmanned aerial vehicles and cruise missiles. The system can work not only in the air, but also in near space, perform the tasks of non-strategic missile defense.

    On the effectiveness of the defeat of the full range of air targets, S-400 "Triumph" is able to replace three systems of type C-300. "Triumph" is intended to replace the S-300 and C-200 and is highly effective in combating new types of targets - aircraft performed using the technology of Stealth, small-sized cruise missiles and ballistic missiles with a range of less than 3, 5 thousand miles, and speed - 4.8 kilometers per second.

    "Triumph" has unique characteristics and has no analogues in the world. It can simultaneously track 300 targets and fire rockets into 36 of them.

    The Commander also said that the operational-strategic command (USC) military and aerospace defense (ASD) will in the near future, six air defense systems, "Armour-S1", recalling that four such complexes have already arrived in the army. "We got to the Air Force anti-aircraft system," Armour ", four armored anti-aircraft missile system near the action," Armour-S1, "they went on air defense missile regiment of the fourth command USC ASD in Novorossiysk," - said Zelin, without specifying when These complexes were obtained.

    Александр Зелин решил создать новую пилотажную группу (Фото: ИТАР-ТАСС)
    Alexander Zelin, decided to create a new aerobatic teams (Photo: ITAR-TASS)

    Speaking about the new developments, the general announced the creation of an air defense system, "Knight": "She at times exceed the stand in the arms of the Russian air defense system S-300. "The Knight" - a further improvement of the S-300 to increase the combat capabilities at times. "

    "In fact, this new system on a single launcher is displayed instead of 4 missiles 16" - added the commander.

    This system, according to the general, can destroy air targets at the same distances and altitudes, and C-300. "The" Vityaz "significantly increased the number of destination channels simultaneously shelled targets, ability to maneuver," - he said. "This system will be equipped with a completely different missile" - concluded Zelin.

    The Commander also spoke about the development of a new air defense missile system "Morpheus." "This is a short-range system with a maximum range of up to 5 km, it is intended to shield military sites, has both active and passive means of warfare" - said Zelin, transfers ITAR-TASS.

    "Morpheus" would destroy everything that moves within a radius of 5 kilometers, "- he said.

    "Watch" - the forbidden game

    Tell us about yourself on Russia.ru
    In the near future, said the commander in chief, in Russia there will be a new aerobatic team, which will fly a combat-training aircraft Yak-130. "Me was made by the Minister of Defense report on the subject, he held it me, we're going," - said Zelin.

    The Commander explained that the creation of light aircraft aerobatic team will extensively use smoke effects used by aerobatic teams from other countries, including France and Italy.

    Currently in Russia there are several aerobatic teams, the most famous of which - "Swifts" flying the MiG-29, and "Russian Knights" on the Su-27.

    On Tuesday, the commander in chief, confirmed that the dissolution of "Swifts" and "Russian Knights" is not planned. "I have not had any such aspirations. Before you destroy something, it is necessary to create something "- said the general. According to him, the two aerobatic teams, "no one tried and tried to abolish."

    Zelin also said that during a recent trip to the U.S., he invited a group of American "Puffin" to show their flying skills in Russia. "I think that in 2012 Russia in the sky they fly - the confirmation I received," - he said.

    http://vz.ru/society/2011/8/9/513604.html
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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Wed Aug 10, 2011 9:14 am

    With their move to mobile medium and especially light brigades those Mi-26s will become critical in the supply chain such mobile forces will need to operate properly.

    Of course such aircraft would need very strong defences because their speed will not be enough on its own to protect them from enemy interference.

    They will need MANTA DIRCMs and all sorts of other protections to defend against enemy attack.

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Pervius on Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:57 pm

    They shouldn't try to copy the world and create an Air stunt team.

    It wastes aircraft, people, fuel. Assets better used for defense.

    Unless they can sell enough merchandise to civilian populace to subsidize military.....which they can't.

    The Logistics cost alone to constantly move around an Air Exhibition Team is very costly.


    No mention of Russia's UCAV planes. They look pretty.
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    Vladimir79

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Aug 10, 2011 8:01 pm

    Su-35BM and S-400 development is pretty much stalled.
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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:25 am

    S-400 can go into service without the 400km range missile.

    That is not such a big deal for the moment.

    An Su-35 going into service without its ESM suite however is a more serious issue, perhaps systems developed for the T-50 can be adapted?

    ESM is expensive and complicated and requires all sorts of tricks and tactics to collect signatures of potential enemy weapons, so that they can be recognised and dealt with appropriately.

    It seems a few potential export customers are keen to get their hands on these aircraft, and I am sure the Russian AF is probably quite keen too.

    Hope they can sort this out.

    Clearly they must be developing a system for the T-50 and the system for the Su-34 might also be useful too.

    Or perhaps the hardware is not sophisticated enough...

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Austin on Thu Aug 11, 2011 8:41 am

    I think when they form the new aerobatic team with Yak-130 , they can disband the Knights and Strigzi .... they are not really rich to afford two aerobatic team.
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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Thu Aug 11, 2011 12:07 pm

    If they help sales I would think more display teams would be a good idea.

    Hinds, Havoks, even turboprop trainers.
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    medo

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  medo on Thu Aug 11, 2011 7:24 pm

    What bothers me in this article is, that he claim they will get first ten Pantsirs only now. Where are those Pantsirs, which were in parade in 2010 and in 2011? I think all those generals are making too much fog in their talkings.
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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Fri Aug 12, 2011 2:02 am

    Perhaps they went to testing units?

    Now they are going to operational units?

    Hard to say.

    Just read an article on the state of Russian air force aircraft and it was not actually that impressive.. here is what I read:

    The Title is Air Force Procurement Plans Part I Fighters:

    A long time ago, I promised some folks a report on the air force's procurement plans for the coming decade. Various other projects pushed that to the back burner, but with MAKS 2011 fast approaching, now seems to be the time to resurrect it. The following is largely based on Anton Lavrov's excellent chapter in the CAST center's "Russia's New Army" report. If you know Russian, I encourage you to go read the original. But if not, here's my summary, with some additions based on developments since the report went to press.

    Long term decay
    The Russian Air Force received virtually no new planes or helicopters between 1995 and 2008. This means that by the start of the Medvedev presidency, even the most modern aircraft were 15-20 years old, while many were approaching 30. This means that not only were the planes physically old, but their designs were outdated when compared to Russia's main military rivals. This means that almost none of them were equipped to use guided weapons. Furthermore, lack of money for maintenance meant that many aircraft were no longer in usable condition. Finally, lack of money for fuel meant that pilots did not receive adequate training to maintain or develop their skills, adding to the air force's overall state of deterioration. These problems were exposed during the 2008 war in Georgia, when six planes were lost in five days. Furthermore, the air force was assessed to be ineffective in combat operations due to a combination of its lack of guided munitions and the pilots' limited training.

    Fighter and Ground Attack Aircraft
    Throughout the post-Soviet period, the Russian air force's combat forces have consisted primarily of five types of aircraft:

    Su-24: The venerable Su-24 attack aircraft was introduced into the Soviet air force in 1974. According to warfare.ru, around 320 of these aircraft are in service in the Russian air force.
    Su-25: close air support plane introduced in 1981. Approximately 200 in service.
    Su-27: fourth generation fighter plane introduced in 1984. Approximately 260 in service.
    MiG-29: fourth generation fighter plane introduced in 1983. Approximately 190 in service.
    MiG-31: interceptor introduced in 1982. Approximately 140 in service.
    These planes will remain the primary combat aircraft in the Russian air force for the next decade. Some types have undergone significant modernization.

    Between 2003 and 2008, 55 Su-27s were modernized to the Su-27SM variant, including the installation of new engines, which has substantially extended their expected lifespan. The modernized aircraft are based at the 6987th and 6989th air bases in the Far East. An additional 12 new Su-27SM3 aircraft were ordered from Sukhoi in 2009. Eight of these have already been delivered and the rest will be received by the end of 2011.

    Relatively few MiG-31s have been modernized to the MiG-31BM version that includes improved avionics and navigation systems and better armament. Recent reports indicate that the defense ministry is preparing a contract to modernize another 30 MiG-31s to the MiG-31BM level.

    Substantial purchases of new combat aircraft began in 2008, after a 15 year gap. Initially, the air force bought 28 MiG-29SMT and 6 MiG-29UBT planes, which had been sold to Algeria but were then rejected by the latter ostensibly due to problems with the planes' quality. Despite these concerns, some analysts consider these aircraft to be highly capable because they are equipped with the most modern electronics and the best weapon systems of any aircraft in the Russian air force. An additional 26 MiG-29K aircraft are expected to be purchased in the next five years.

    They are to be supplanted by the Su-35S fighter planes, 48 of which are to be procured in the next five years together with 4 Su-30M2 two-seater trainers. However, there have been significant delays in the development of the Su-35s. The first plane was made available for flight testing in May 2011, five months behind schedule, and the timetable for subsequent aircraft has likewise been extended. The delays have been caused by limited space for final assembly at the Komsomolsk assembly plant, which is busy assembling Sukhoi Superjets for the civilian market. Analysts expect another 24-48 Su-35s to be purchased in the near future.

    Down the road, the T-50 is seen as the future of Russian fighter jets. This heavy fifth generation fighter is being developed jointly by Sukhoi and India's HAL Corporation. The first test flight was conducted in January 2010. The goal is to procure 60 T-50s in the 2016-2020 time period. It is slated to fully replace the remaining Su-27s in the following decade.

    However, there is no obvious replacement for the MiG-29 light fighter jets. The MiG-35's failure in the recent Indian MMRCA tender has left it with few prospects in either the domestic or export markets. In any case, it is not a next generation aircraft such as the American F-35, but merely an extension of the MiG-29 line.

    The situation is somewhat worse for the modernization of Russia's fighter-bombers. The air force has repeatedly declared that the Su-24 is to be replaced by the Su-34, which began development in the mid-1990s. After the first two aircraft were ordered in 2006, then defense minister Sergei Ivanov stated that 44 would be in service by 2010 and 200 by 2015, at which time all the Su-24s would be retired. However, only 6 Su-34s have actually been transferred to the air force as of the end of 2010, in addition to 5 prototypes that were built prior to 2006. Sukhoi seems to be on track to build 6-8 planes per year, which would allow the company to fulfill the 2008 contract for 32 planes by 2014, only a year or so behind schedule. The Russian press is reporting that contracts for another 80 Su-34s will be signed in the next few months. However, at the current rate of construction, it will still take 25 years to build all 200. Sukhoi would have to gradually double the rate of construction to get them built by 2025.

    Because of the delays with the Su-34s, the air force has decided to modernize the existing Su-24Ms, rather than simply replacing them. An initial 30 planes were modernized to the Su-24M2 level, which features improved navigation and weapons control systems and improved armaments, in 2007-09. Further upgrades may occur in the future.

    The air force has also been modernizing its Su-25 close air support planes. Between 2006 and 2010, a total of 40 aircraft were upgraded to the Su-25SM variant, which has improved avionics. Rather than buying or designing new planes, the air force has decided to extend the lifespan of its existing Su-25s to 40 years, allowing them to remain in service through 2030. In the meantime, the air force has ordered 16 Su-25UBM trainer planes, which will be received in the next 2-3 years.

    However, the experience of the Georgia war has shown that the Su-25 is highly vulnerable to enemy fire, because it is armed with unguided munitions and therefore has to approach within 600 to 800 meters of targets if it is to have any chance of hitting them. As a result, three Su-25s were lost and four damaged during the war. These losses should not have come as a surprise to the Russian military, as it sustained similarly high casualty rates on these planes in Afghanistan back in the 1980s. In a recent article, Ilya Kramnik argues that the solution is to restart building Su-25T (aka Su-39) aircraft, which are similar to the Su-25SMs but were designed to use guided munitions in any weather or light conditions. The Russian air force currently operates no more than six such planes, built in the 1980s and early 2000s.

    Overall, the situation with fighter aircraft seems to be relatively good for the long term. Sukhoi (and to a much lesser extent MiG) is in fairly good shape and can continue to supply the air force with relatively modern planes as long as it continues to receive funding. The joint venture with India's HAL Corporation may help in developing better electronic systems for the long term.


    Personally I disagree with the assessment of the Russian AF. The numbers of Georgian hardware left at the side of the road proves they feared the air force more than they feared the ground forces.

    I do agree that relying on Su-25s with dumb bomb and unguided rocket and cannon fire is going to lead to enormous casualties against a well equipped enemy and that something more sophisticated needs to be developed.

    Perhaps Sukhoi and Mil and Kamov could get together and create a unified air to ground package of sensors and weapons that included communications equipment so that the helicopters and close air support aircraft (and any light UCAVs) could communicate directly and could share the same info.
    Things like self defence suites etc could also be jointly worked on to share costs and increase production potential, so that instead of the Ka-52 needing 100 sets of radars for the 30 odd Army Aviation aircraft and 70 odd Naval aircraft, they could buy 700 sets of radars for the 100 Ka-52s, 300 Mi-28N and Mi-28M aircraft and another 300 for the Su-25TM2s.

    The larger production run should reduce costs, and the commonality of the equipment should make cooperation of the aircraft in the air much easier.

    The lack of speed of new aircraft entering service is disappointing, and could be helped by expanding production capacity a little and also easing the urgency by upgrading more existing types... especially low hours airframes that might have been in storage.

    The most important thing is to make sure maintainence and support keep the new ones in service in good service condition and that they get upgrades too.

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Corrosion on Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:13 am

    GarryB wrote:
    Su-24: The venerable Su-24 attack aircraft was introduced into the Soviet air force in 1974. According to warfare.ru, around 320 of these aircraft are in service in the Russian air force.
    Su-25: close air support plane introduced in 1981. Approximately 200 in service.
    Su-27: fourth generation fighter plane introduced in 1984. Approximately 260 in service.
    MiG-29: fourth generation fighter plane introduced in 1983. Approximately 190 in service.
    MiG-31: interceptor introduced in 1982. Approximately 140 in service.

    These are about 1100 in number. It will be a very difficult job to upgrade most of these or replace these 1 for 1. I am sure we will see more quality than quantity in VVS in future.
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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Fri Aug 12, 2011 10:17 am

    I agree, I think a lot of roles will be taken over by UAVs, and I also think a few new aircraft will be revealed over the next few years... the A-100 has been mentioned as the replacement for the A-50, though the A-50 has been given a modest upgrade too.

    A lot of aircraft will simply be worn out because they have endured a long period without proper maintainence and upgrades.
    I would expect there are a few Mi8s and Mi24s that are practically falling apart, but quite a few aircraft were put in storage... and though lots of parts might have been taken for keeping in service aircraft going, or simply been pinched, that doesn't really matter as most of their components would be completely replaced in an upgrade anyway.
    It is the hours on the airframe that is what counts and lack of fuel and aircraft in storage should have led to a few airframes that would be ideal for upgrades and being returned to service as a cheaper alternative to simply being stored further or expanding capacity for new aircraft.

    The problem with expanding capacity for new planes is that once the Russian AF has enough what are you going to do with that expanded production capacity?

    Production capacity has to increase from what it is now, but it is important to get it right or you might end up with too much production capacity and nothing to make.

    I am not suggesting everything gets a complete and expensive upgrade, but for example if you look at the Mi-35M export version of the Hind that incorporates a lot of technology and equipment from the Mi-28N it makes the older aircraft more capable, increases the production numbers for new components which should reduce their cost and ease maintainence problems. An upgraded Hind is cheaper to pay for than a brand new Mi-28N.

    A lot of the changes can be done during routine maintainence and overhauls.

    Obviously any airframes to old to bother maintaining will not be upgraded and can be replaced first by new airframes, but numbers I have seen talk about up to 100 Su-35s and 30 odd Mig-35s, thanks to the Algerian Migs they have Mig-29SMTs in service and they are probably electronically their most capable fighter aircraft. Spending a little more money they could apply that upgrade to another 150 Migs and change a force from mediocre to OK without spending much more than they should already be spending on maintainence.

    Remember the SMT upgrade reduces maintainence costs and flight costs of the Mig-29 by about 40% so after 2-3 years they will have saved more money than it cost them.

    A similar upgrade for the Flankers could see 150-200 Flankers get an SM upgrade which would at least leave most of the fleet able to fire R-77 and other post cold war new weapons.

    Regarding the Mig-31... I would have thought the Russian AF would not have all that large a number of Mig-31s... I would have thought they would have gone to the PVO and now Space and Air Defence units... and I think they would make the Mig-31 upgrade a priority.
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    Vladimir79

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Vladimir79 on Fri Aug 12, 2011 12:02 pm

    Corrosion wrote:

    These are about 1100 in number. It will be a very difficult job to upgrade most of these or replace these 1 for 1. I am sure we will see more quality than quantity in VVS in future.

    It is less than 1000 now and over half of them are unavailable. VVS is on the level of something like France in operational numbers... without the technology. If China was to come crossing that border now, we would be in hella trouble. We need 1000 new fighters yesterday.

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Corrosion on Fri Aug 12, 2011 2:05 pm

    GarryB

    I agree about 100 Su35 will give a lot of teeth to VVS. And when you add PAK-FA into equation, whose number will eventually go to 200+, Add upgraded Su-27SM and Mig29SMT and that is 400-500 air dominance fighters. A very capable air force. Only thing is that PAK-FA must succeed. I personally think they should stop making any more Flanker versions and concentrate on Su-34, Su-35, Pakfa and upgrading older ones, not sure about Mig-35, instead Mig can work on 5th gen small fighter or even a UCAV.

    I personally think when Indian AF Mig29UPG deal was signed Russia could have offered or India could have asked as well, some of Russian Mig29 for IAF, which were in similar condition to IAF Mig29(airframe usage wise). They could have signed a deal to acquire second hand Russian Mig29 cheaply and paid in full for the upgrade, exact same amount that IAF is paying per airframe for bringing Indian Mig29 to UPG standard. I don't think Russia is going to find much use for many of its Mig29 airframes .

    It would have been a win win situation for each side. Russia would have got more extra funds to apply upgrades to its own Mig29 planes and India could have raised is squadron strength which is a real worry we have in my country. 60 planes would have got IAF 3 squadrons with infrastructure, tactics, maintainable and pilots which is already there. The only problem I think which stopped Indian side from acquiring more Mig29 is bad rep Mig(not sukhoi) has in India in general. After all Mig29UPG can do almost any thing an Mirage2000 upgrade can do and India is paying about 40 milion plus per airframe for upgrade only for its mirages and it doesn't exceed the level of 29UPG.

    Pervius

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Pervius on Fri Aug 12, 2011 5:19 pm

    Corrosion wrote:GarryB

    instead Mig can work on 5th gen small fighter or even a UCAV.


    www.ntv.ru/novosti/115567/video/

    That Mig UCAV was made 5 years ago. Must be refined by now.

    It would be neat if that UCAV could take off with a Tupolev TU-95...then TU-95 releases refueling hose from rear, UCAV hooks up to it and gets towed to where it's needed. Gets released when near target airspace..spy...then come back and hook up for the tow home. It's light, simple fuel hose could tow it. Only modification to TU-95 is reel with hose in tail. Could have guy in tail of a TU-95 with a funnel and fuel can to pour down hose to save development costs.

    Or is this what they've been doing all along?
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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:16 am

    I agree about 100 Su35 will give a lot of teeth to VVS. And when you add PAK-FA into equation, whose number will eventually go to 200+, Add upgraded Su-27SM and Mig29SMT and that is 400-500 air dominance fighters. A very capable air force. Only thing is that PAK-FA must succeed. I personally think they should stop making any more Flanker versions and concentrate on Su-34, Su-35, Pakfa and upgrading older ones, not sure about Mig-35, instead Mig can work on 5th gen small fighter or even a UCAV.

    Practise building Mig-35s will be good for the production aspect of MIG, this aircraft incorporates new 5th gen stuff they are likely also working on for their 5th gen fighter.
    More importantly they have production capacity whereas the makers of Flankers are also the makers of T-50s and will be very busy over the next few years sorting out both aircraft.

    There is likely a few finishing touches needed for the Mig-35 too and it offers a potential cheaper alternative for countries operating Mig-29s than a T-50 till a light 5th gen can be designed and built.

    AFAIK the SKAT was shown because development was terminated and that is the only reason it was revealed... to get external support and funding. I believe Mig and Sukhoi are now working within the structure of the UAC that they are both part of to develop a new UCAV.

    Now that the prototypes of the T-50 are flying and that program is going ahead well it seems, they might start looking at a light 5th gen fighter as a numbers fighter for Russia and as a primary fighter for smaller countries.

    I personally think when Indian AF Mig29UPG deal was signed Russia could have offered or India could have asked as well, some of Russian Mig29 for IAF, which were in similar condition to IAF Mig29(airframe usage wise). They could have signed a deal to acquire second hand Russian Mig29 cheaply and paid in full for the upgrade, exact same amount that IAF is paying per airframe for bringing Indian Mig29 to UPG standard. I don't think Russia is going to find much use for many of its Mig29 airframes .

    I think the problem so far is that Sukhoi has too much political power. The SMT upgrade in its basic form is a modest upgrade that greatly reduces the operational costs of owning and using Mig-29s. It doesn't surprise me that European countries within NATO weren't interested because their bias means they wanted to get F-16s as soon as possible anyway as a political gesture, but for the Russians and Indians I think they looked at the upgrade and thought it looked nice but there was no point in making the Mig-29 a multirole fighter able to use air to ground guided weapons when they operate in interceptor units that will never use half the new capabilities.
    The problem is that the upgrade includes all sorts of self testing and equipment monitoring systems and the new equipment is easier to service and support it becomes much cheaper to fly and operate than a standard Mig.
    The Mig-29SMT aircraft Algeria rejected are currently the most sophisticated and capable fighters in the Russian AF inventory. One of the cheapest SMT upgrades doesn't even replace the radar, it simply modifies it to allow new weapons to be used.

    Russia is never going to be able to afford more than 200 odd PAK FAs, so a lighter 5th gen fighter is needed. Mig would be ideal to make that fighter as long as it remains a viable company. If it has no orders and no work it will not remain a viable company.
    Besides their production capacity would be useful to add to the capacity of all the Sukhoi factories... some of which are busy with the Superjet civilian aircraft.

    The only problem I think which stopped Indian side from acquiring more Mig29 is bad rep Mig(not sukhoi) has in India in general.

    I think MIG need to work on their customer service, but when there are no domestic orders for 20 years it is not easy to keep customers happy. Half their problem was that they were trying to sell Mig-29s during a period when air forces were getting rid of extra aircraft.
    I can understand Mig not offering the best customer service when India goes to Eastern Europe to buy cheap parts and support equipment for their Migs. Problem is when these parts turn out to be fake.
    Several sales of Migs to customers from Air Forces getting rid of airframes seemed to save money but when it came time to buy spare parts the air forces in question wanted to sell airframes, they didn't want to sell their supply of spare parts which they were keeping for their remaining aircraft or simply didn't have in the first place and that is why they were selling the air frames.
    Mig suddenly becomes the bad guy when it refuses to sell parts for planes it didn't supply?

    There is probably more money to be made in spares and support than selling the aircraft in the first place. Spares and support rarely includes offsets etc so it is more profitable.

    That Mig UCAV was made 5 years ago. Must be refined by now.

    As far as I know the SKAT is a dead program. It was a Mig program while Sukhoi had its own UCAV program. It seems they compared notes or both ideas were tested and Sukhois product was deemed better. The Skat was revealed to see if there was any international interest or funding... which apparently there wasn't, so Mig dropped the program and joined Sukhois program to develop their UCAV.

    There is a stealthy UCAV program, but it is something we haven't seen yet and with both companies working on it it should be quite good.

    From memory the SKAT was to have a flight speed of 800km/h and a flight radius of 2,000km and a 3 ton payload.

    The idea of towing UCAVs behind strategic bombers is interesting, they could be sent ahead to deal with any still active air defences... but I think in smaller conflicts it should already have the range capacity to reach most targets, where its stealth design should allow it to operate at medium and high altitude where it can fly faster and further than would be possible at low level.
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    Cyberspec

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    'Glissada-M' Laser Landing System

    Post  Cyberspec on Fri Sep 02, 2011 5:05 am

    A promising new Russian LLS has won the gold medal in Geneva back in May this year. Although a civilian system it does obviously have a potential military application...

    Kurumoch Airport has been awarded a Gold Medal at the
    39th International Exhibition of Inventions in Geneva for its Glissada-M laser landing system

    http://uwww.aero/en/news/26.05.2011/2863/

    A prototype glidepath laser landing system called Glissada-M was introduced at the 39th International Exhibition of Inventions in Geneva that took place from 6th to 10th April 2011, by the Innovative-Investment Fund of the Samara Region. This system developed by Kurumoch Airport in partnership with ZAO Glissada and ZAO Kantegir (Saratov) has been awarded a Gold Medal and Diploma at this prestigious event.

    The representatives of 45 countries from all continents participated at the exhibition in Geneva this April with more than one thousand innovations. But only some of them won Gold Medals, one of the highest accolades of this event. Among them was Kurumoch International Airport.

    Note:

    Glissada-M is a brand new unique system that, in addition to the existing modern airfield lighting systems, helps approaching aircraft complete a safe landing with zero-zero visibility, meeting Meteorological Minimum Category II and III conditions. Flight safety being the most important criterion here.

    By now, the Glissada-M laser landing system has been successfully tested in visual and adverse weather conditions on aerodromes in Samara and Saratov but also in the Russian airbase Novolazarevskaya in Antarctica.

    Certification of Glissada-M is now the final required step to introducing the system in Russia on aerodromes and at airports that are not equipped with lights that help indicate the approach.


    there's more info from a Russian article (fragments translated)

    - At the Samara airport tested an innovative system of landing aircraft. Accuracy of landing - 50 centimeters

    ...

    - The system has been tested in Antarctica during the polar night, where a IL-76 has successfully carried out a precision night landing.

    The LLS has been tested in Antarctica at the station "Novolazarevskaya". The continent does not contain any fixed airfield. For a few months during the polar night, Antarctica remains without an air service. Test pilot Ruben Yesayan became the first in the world, who landed a heavy IL-76 in the Antarctic night.

    "Visibility has deteriorated to less than 2000 meters. But we clearly saw the rays and landed on them. At this airport there are no special systems, we came in to land only by those rays, "- said the test pilot of the State Institute of Civil Aviation Ruben Yesayan.

    ...

    - Three laser beams in 'T' shape guide the aircraft to the runway. The rays are visible at night and in bad weather (mist and torrential rain and blizzards)




    Airports from Denmark, France, Austria, Czech Republic have shown interest in the system. However, at least 3 years of tests are expected before it's certified as commercial product.

    Source: http://www.nanonewsnet.ru/articles/2011/v-samare-sazhayut-samolety-s-pomoshchyu-lazerov


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    GarryB

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  GarryB on Fri Sep 02, 2011 10:35 am

    The Soviets had a fully automatic landing system for their Kiev class carriers for the Yak-38 and Yak-38M.
    Don't think it used lasers though, but was described by western observers as being "rock solid".


    Saw a technology update on RT the other day and it showed a laser system for use at airports that detects wind speed and direction.

    The system itself looked like a 152mm artillery shell but with the top cut flat with an optics window in the top and it fires a laser up into the clouds and measures the effect wind has on the lasers. It replaces a 20-30m tall tower that is covered in wind speed and direction sensors and seems to be very accurate.

    The future for airports seems to be lots of lasers... Smile
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    George1

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  George1 on Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:43 pm

    Ministry of Defense of Russia will acquire 6 An-140 aircraft in 2012


    Aviacor enterprise (Samara) will deliver six An-140 and two Tu-154 aircraft to the Russian Ministry of Defense in 2012. According to Lenta.ru, it has been reported by CEO of Aviacor, Alexey Gusev. He said that there are no problems with financing of these aircraft’s manufacturing, "the advancing is taking place according to schedule".

    The contract on delivery of An-140s to the Ministry of Defense has been signed in 2011. According to the agreement, Ministry of Defense shall acquire ten such vehicles. Probably, the rest four aircraft will be delivered in 2013. The acquisition of the vehicles is taking place in the network of State program in the area of arms for 2011-2020.

    Meanwhile, Aviacor has a large number of orders for different versions of An-140. In particular, the enterprise must deliver 60-70 aircraft to Rosoboronexport in the next few years and six more An-140s to the St. Petersburg-based Radar MMS company. Due to increase of order backlog, Aviacor intends to expand its staff by 250 employees.

    An-140 mixed cargo aircraft has a maximum flight speed of 540 km/h and its practical range is about 3000 km. The aircraft is intended for carrying 52 passengers. The military transport version - An-140T may transport cargo, weighing up to 6 tons.

    http://www.ruaviation.com/news/2012/1/20/741/

    Austin

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

    Post  Austin on Tue Jan 24, 2012 5:22 am

    Any reason why Russian cockpit use blue green colour ?

    http://русская-сила.рф/guide/air/s/su34-21.jpg

    Compare that to Indian Navy Mig-29K which uses pale grey colour

    http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3186/2555955534_80125abe0c_b.jpg

    I see even the latest Su-35 and PAK-FA cockpit with blue green colour

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    Re: VVS Russian Air Force: News #1

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