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    2008 South Ossetia war

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    Sukhoi37_Terminator
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    2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Sukhoi37_Terminator on Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:53 pm

    I need some information about the russian-georgian war:
    1-How many troops taked part in the conflict?
    2-How many casualties had each side?
    THANKS
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Pirate on Thu Dec 03, 2009 8:31 pm

    Sukhoi37_Terminator wrote:I need some information about the russian-georgian war:
    1-How many troops taked part in the conflict?
    2-How many casualties had each side?
    THANKS
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_South_Ossetia_war

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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  DrofEvil on Sun Dec 06, 2009 3:17 am

    http://sites.google.com/site/afivedaywar/Home/gesalvage

    This site has very detailed info.
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    Vladimir79
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Vladimir79 on Sun Dec 06, 2009 12:06 pm

    DrofEvil wrote:http://sites.google.com/site/afivedaywar/Home/gesalvage

    This site has very detailed info.

    Good Georgian info you mean?
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Sat Feb 25, 2012 10:44 pm

    I don't remember exactly where but I think I remember reading somewhere that a few U.S soldiers were found dead among the bodies of the Georgian troops. Again I don't remember where I read that, most likely some post on MP.net. Whether it's true or not is completely up to speculation.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  GarryB on Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:03 am

    Dead US soldiers or not, the US sent a clear message to Russia about who was friends with whom.

    Little has actually changed since the reset.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:26 am

    GarryB wrote:Dead US soldiers or not, the US sent a clear message to Russia about who was friends with whom.

    Little has actually changed since the reset.

    Agreed. Back here in America people still mostly believe Russia started the war. It just shows you how much of an illusion "freedom of the press" really is.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  TR1 on Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:35 am

    Mr.Kalishnikov47 wrote:I don't remember exactly where but I think I remember reading somewhere that a few U.S soldiers were found dead among the bodies of the Georgian troops. Again I don't remember where I read that, most likely some post on MP.net. Whether it's true or not is completely up to speculation.

    Yeah that's a myth with zero credibility.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  GarryB on Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:42 am

    That is what happens when for weeks your front pages say evil Ruskies invade innocent defenceless little Georgia, and then one day on the 23ed page in the bottom left corner there is a small statement saying it is possible the Georgians might have started it...

    The main problem is that news has become entertainment and most people don't really care about the truth anymore... entertainment has never had much to do with the truth... look at the cartoons... a rabbit that continuously outsmarts a hunter, a cat that can never catch the little yellow bird, the Rooster that always beats the dog.

    The opposite of reality... but we don't care because it is all about rooting for the underdog... and in this case the media has shown Georgia as the underdog....
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:49 am

    TR1 wrote:
    Yeah that's a myth with zero credibility.

    I didn't say I myself believe it, it's just something I've heard and thought I'd put out there for somebody with a higher level of expertise on this subject to speculate on.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  TR1 on Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:51 am

    Mr.Kalishnikov47 wrote:
    TR1 wrote:
    Yeah that's a myth with zero credibility.

    I didn't say I myself believe it, it's just something I've heard and thought I'd put out there for somebody with a higher level of expertise on this subject to speculate on.

    Not accusing you of believing it Smile.

    Just saying, no reputable Russian accounts of the war have this myth in them. And it was covered in veeeery fine detail on some Russian forums.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:34 am

    GarryB wrote:That is what happens when for weeks your front pages say evil Ruskies invade innocent defenceless little Georgia, and then one day on the 23ed page in the bottom left corner there is a small statement saying it is possible the Georgians might have started it...

    The main problem is that news has become entertainment and most people don't really care about the truth anymore... entertainment has never had much to do with the truth... look at the cartoons... a rabbit that continuously outsmarts a hunter, a cat that can never catch the little yellow bird, the Rooster that always beats the dog.

    The opposite of reality... but we don't care because it is all about rooting for the underdog... and in this case the media has shown Georgia as the underdog....

    That's a major part of it. The rest is our presidential candidates trying to unite us all against a common enemy (In this case Russia) and then promising to do something about it to get votes. That's how I see it.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  GarryB on Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:53 am

    It is just a case of basic common sense.

    The Georgian claim is that the Russians invaded first and Georgia just reacted to that invasion.

    The clear and obvious problem is that if the Russians invaded first how did Georgia prepare and attack South Ossetia so quickly... did Georgian forces push Russian forces back so they could bombard the South Ossetian capital for a couple of days?

    Give me a break.

    Second of all Russia already had peacekeepers in South Ossetia so they could not have been invading South Ossetia. Therefore the Georgians must be claiming that the Russians attempted to invade Georgia through South Ossetia, yet they were able to mobilise so quickly as to get forces to the capital of South Ossetia and lay siege to that city before Russian forces even got there let alone their objective of Georgian territory.

    Basically Saakashvili is full of it.

    It was a preplanned attack calculated to begin during the opening ceremony of the Olympic games... which is a traditional time for ceasefires, not invasions, and the fact that the civilian GPS suddenly stopped working shows the US supported them every step of the way.

    The irony is that the roots of the conflict was in Kosovo.

    When Kosovo declared independence the Russians reciprocated by opening its borders to South Ossetia and Abkhazia.

    Previously with its borders restricted both regions were dependent on Georgia so Georgia was happy. Once Kosovo declared independence however and Russia opened its borders with SO and Ab then they suddenly weren't so reliant on Georgia and could become real independent states.

    That is why Saakashvili attacked... to seize back SO... the weaker of the two regions by force so quickly that Russia would not know what happened.

    Fortunately there are plenty in North Ossetia who don't like Georgian treatment of South Ossetia and there are plenty of Chechens who also don't like Georgian support for rebels on their territory so there were plenty of volunteers for the rapidly put together force that went in a pushed the Georgians out. Their reaction was much faster than the Georgians anticipated and the result is fairly well known.

    I am glad that in recent statements that Putin has made it clear the problems are not between Georgia and Russia, they are between Russia and Saakashvili.

    That's a major part of it. The rest is our presidential candidates trying to unite us all against a common enemy (In this case Russia) and then promising to do something about it to get votes. That's how I see it.

    That is what we need... an alien invasion. Germany and Japan became western allies to face the new deadly commie threat. All their sins were eventually forgiven because the west needed them in their new fight...

    Of course if it was in the wests interests the western image of Russia and Russians would be rehabilitated... like Worf in Startrek next gen. The hated Klingon on the Enterprise... a Star Trek fan from the 1960s would be appalled, which is ironic as Mr Chekov was accepted, despite clearly being "Russian".

    Maybe the Russians need to vote in an idiot like Zhurinovsky (spelling) for the west to realise how good they had it with him and Medvedev.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:13 am

    [quote="GarryB"]the problems are not between Georgia and Russia, they are between Russia and Saakashvili.[quote="GarryB"]

    This is probably the most accurate way to describe the whole situation between Russia and Georgia.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Tue Mar 20, 2012 4:58 am



    Sure wish I spoke Russian.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  GarryB on Tue Mar 20, 2012 9:33 am

    Thanks for posting that... I am sure one of our Russian speakers could watch it and give us a general idea of what is being said and what is happening... Smile
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  TR1 on Tue Mar 20, 2012 5:50 pm

    Nothing really new in there, only that they found some markings from a joint Georgian-US excersise that happened before the war...though everyone knew those exercises happened before the war anyways.
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    U.S soldiers were found dead among the bodies of the Georgian troops

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Tue Mar 20, 2012 6:36 pm

    TR1 wrote:Nothing really new in there, only that they found some markings from a joint Georgian-US excersise that happened before the war...though everyone knew those exercises happened before the war anyways.

    Alright thanks, good to know.

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    2008- Ossetian War

    Post  gloriousfatherland on Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:38 am

    The following is a documentary discussing possible war crimes by the Suckassvhili:

    It raised some very serious points such as the possible involvement of American mercenaries in these war crimes
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  TR1 on Mon Apr 16, 2012 4:25 am

    If you are gonna charge Saakashavilli, might as well charge Putin, Bush, and a whole host of leaders of major powers involved in wartime decisions.

    The American mercenaries thing is a myth with no actual proof or evidence.
    The US certainly aided Georgia pre-war, and McCain embarrassed himself with his stupid war rhetoric (to anyone with any intellect that is), but that was about it.


    The media coverage in the US was teribad indeed, comically so.
    Luckily as the facts trickled out, the nonsense of these media reactions was revealed, even to non-Russians.


    Also, another thing I am very interested in, is the amount of control and communication Saaka had with ground forces in South Ossetia. I can't believe he would order them to attack the Russian peacekeeper base (not to give credit to the man, but no one who got elected is THAT dumb), and just the same , I wonder how much he was aware that the Georgian armed response consisted of shooting up Tskinval in a chaotic and ineffective manner.

    Russia however should thank Saaka for many things. Smile

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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  gloriousfatherland on Mon Apr 16, 2012 5:12 am

    TR1 wrote:If you are gonna charge Saakashavilli, might as well charge Putin, Bush, and a whole host of leaders of major powers involved in wartime decisions.

    The American mercenaries thing is a myth with no actual proof or evidence.
    The US certainly aided Georgia pre-war, and McCain embarrassed himself with his stupid war rhetoric (to anyone with any intellect that is), but that was about it.


    The media coverage in the US was teribad indeed, comically so.
    Luckily as the facts trickled out, the nonsense of these media reactions was revealed, even to non-Russians.


    Also, another thing I am very interested in, is the amount of control and communication Saaka had with ground forces in South Ossetia. I can't believe he would order them to attack the Russian peacekeeper base (not to give credit to the man, but no one who got elected is THAT dumb), and just the same , I wonder how much he was aware that the Georgian armed response consisted of shooting up Tskinval in a chaotic and ineffective manner.

    Russia however should thank Saaka for many things. Smile
    I see what you did there pirat ..hehe....Yeah i thought bush was bad until i saw him chewing his tie, knowing that big daddy was going to give him an as$ whopping Very Happy
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  GarryB on Mon Apr 16, 2012 5:48 am

    Odds are that saakashvili will never be held accountable for the deaths he caused, and I am disappointed that the Russian reaction was so muted regarding the outright murder of so many of its service people.

    The stupid senseless act however ensured that South Ossetia and Abkhazia got the independence they wanted and there is very little Georgia or the US can do about it.

    And yes I think that Suckarse mili vanili is stupid enough to order an attack on Russian peacekeepers, and it shows you the strength of character of the Georgian soldiers that their chosen method of attack was via artillery at maximum range which is always the best way for conventional forces to fight special forces.

    If we translate what happened in the region to Kosovo and Serbia... if milosovich had ordered an artillery attack on peacekeepers and launched an invasion of Kosovo I am sure the US response would have been as calm and controlled... I mean look at Grenada where the US invaded a country and overthrew its government because they feared for the safety of 200 US students... none of which were harmed.

    Of course the difference here is that South Ossetia and Abkhazia were part of Georgia only by decree of Soviet leader Joseph Stalin, whereas Kosovo is part of Serbia by a UNSC resolution... but thanks to the US government the word of Joseph Stalin is law and the UNSC is something that can be ignored if you are the right people.
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  chenzhao on Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:59 am

    But if here was a Greogian, he may say : "Our army were trying to reunite our country by force." Because at the time that the conflicts begins, Russia has not recognized South Ossetia and Abkhazia as independent country. So legally speaking, at that time, they're Greogian territory....... Greogian army were taking action at their home.

    I think that's the reason why China hesitate to blame Greogian and recognize the independence of South Ossetia and Abkhazia. Because at this issue, China's position is very similar to Greogia. If one day China deceide to attack Taiwan,we hope we may argue that we're taking millitary action at our own territory...
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  TR1 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:31 am

    Russia was internationally mandated to have peacekeepers in the area, and Georgia deliberately fired and killed those peacekeepers.

    Any legality regarding the territories went out the window when that happened.

    I don't think at this point China has any backing in attacking Taiwan from anyone, and rightfully so.
    It has been independent for too long, and has a right to self-determination.

    Ossetia and Abkhazia never got that chance when the USSR fell apart....
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    Re: 2008 South Ossetia war

    Post  GarryB on Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:52 am

    But if here was a Greogian, he may say : "Our army were trying to reunite our country by force." Because at the time that the conflicts begins, Russia has not recognized South Ossetia and Abkhazia as independent country. So legally speaking, at that time, they're Greogian territory....... Greogian army were taking action at their home.

    But if Taiwan is Chinese territory (and I am not saying whether it is or it isn't) then would you start an effort to retake Taiwan by shelling its capital city?

    The Reality is that Stalin made South Ossetia and Abkhazia part of Georgia because his parents came from south ossetia and georgia.

    In other words it was a dictator that decided rather than the people in the actual regions, so no, I don't consider those regions to be part of Georgia and neither it seems do they.

    Another term for white person is Caucasian, so as a white man do I have the right to go to the Caucasus and demand a piece of land?

    Russian peacekeepers were in South Ossetia and Abkhazia on a UN mission to keep the peace and they were attacked without warning by Georgian forces.

    Russia had rather more right to intervene than the west in Kosovo.

    It is glossed over a lot but it was Russias recognition and opening trade ties with South Ossetia and Abkhazia that created the conflict because before that response that was triggered by Kosovos declaration of independence both regions were totally dependent on Georgia so Georgia had some control. After Russia opened its borders both regions could become completely autonomous and that is why Georgia attacked without warning during the opening ceremony of the olympics... a traditional period of peace where many wars stop with truces.

    I think that's the reason why China hesitate to blame Greogian and recognize the independence of South Ossetia and Abkhazia. Because at this issue, China's position is very similar to Greogia. If one day China deceide to attack Taiwan,we hope we may argue that we're taking millitary action at our own territory...

    There are many regions in the world that want autonomy or even independence... places like the Falkland Islands, Northern Ireland, Kurdistan, places in France etc etc.

    Of course you have to ask yourself why two regions that are close together... one called North Ossetia and one called South Ossetia should not simply join and become one region called Ossetia. Both South Ossetia and Abkhazia have already said they don't want to be part of Georgia... Georgia just needs to man up and accept that.


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