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    "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

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    TheArmenian
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    "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  TheArmenian on Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:48 pm

    For a short while they were mistaken as the first "Boomerang" prototype. Turns out it is the "Karatelia" that is being developed by ZIL.





    Info from these sources:

    http://twower.livejournal.com/761600.html

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/189137.html

    I'll let the people with better Russian language skills than mine to provide further details from the above sites.

    GarryB
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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  GarryB on Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:08 am

    There is no way that could be boomerang... that looks like some sort of high speed scout car.

    Medium brigade boomerang will likely look something like BTR-90 with a rear ramp and possibly side doors as well for rapid entry and exit and it will be in the 25 ton class.

    The Boomerang 10 will not necessarily be physically smaller, but will be less than half the weight so it will still be a relatively big vehicle.

    This looks to be more of a fully enclosed armoured version of the beach buggy type vehicles the west likes using for its special forces. A rapid response armoured light vehicle with amphibious capability.

    Looks very cool.

    Can be fitted with a turret to carry a Kord 12.7mm HMG or 30mm AGS-30 or PKM.

    It can only withstand a 0.5kg HE under a wheel so they are clearly not armoured run flat tires, but it does have a central tire pressure regulation system.

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:08 am

    I think the big question here is how much that thing will cost. Looks very expensive.

    Still awesome though. Cool

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  GarryB on Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:27 am

    It is not an Army vehicle.

    AFAIK the letters on the front of it translate to Ts C N, which pretty much makes it special branch of the FSB, Vympel and Alpha and that sort of thing...

    From Wiki:

    In 1995, the FSB Special Operations Center (TsSN FSB) was granted control over Vympel. The group regained its original name and was reintegrated into the Intelligence Service structures. The emphasis shifted from covert and clandestine sabotage operations to counter-terrorism and nuclear safety enforcement. Vympel operatives undergo special training related to improvised or special explosive devices, permitting them to use "terrorist-like" tactics to carry out their operations. Physical training includes close hand combat, parachute training, diving, underwater combat techniques, climbing, and alpine rope techniques. Regional groups of Vympel were deployed in cities with especially important nuclear facilities.

    Vympel (i.e. the Directorate "V" of the TsSN FSB) is still a classified and secretive unit. It took part in Russia's Chechen campaigns and in storming of the Supreme Soviet building during the 1993 Russian constitutional crisis. Little is known about its current operations and activities, the exception being the capture of the Chechen militant leader Salman Raduyev in March 2000 and the assault on the school in Beslan in September 2004.


    So we are talking James Bond type car, though the Russian equivalent would work in teams... Twisted Evil

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:34 am

    Alpha and Vympel driving around in one of those? I like the thought of that. attack How much protection do you think it offers? Small arms resistance? .50 cal?

    Who knows, maybe the final version will have some of that nano tech ballistic armor those Russian scientists have been working on.

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  GarryB on Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:37 am

    I would expect SVD proof, and 50 cal resistant...

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Sat Apr 28, 2012 11:15 pm

    Sorry for my late reply Garry.

    Actually according to This article, the Karatelia only has level 5 protection, which as far as I know is only rated to stop up to 7.62x54, so maybe an SVD loaded with AP rounds at the most? Not that there's anything wrong with that of course.

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  GarryB on Sun Apr 29, 2012 4:24 am

    Actually according to This article, the Karatelia only has level 5 protection, which as far as I know is only rated to stop up to 7.62x54, so maybe an SVD loaded with AP rounds at the most? Not that there's anything wrong with that of course.


    How often do American police vehicles get shot at with 50 cal weapons?

    The design has the usual trade off of all these types of vehicles... it is clearly designed for high speed and mobility... if you start protecting it from 12.7mm ammo then you start to lose both high speed and mobility.

    Don't think of this vehicle as a BTR... this is a UAZ-469...

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Sun Apr 29, 2012 5:13 am

    Well of course it doesn't need to be protected against .50 cal. I was just answering my own question more than anything. Smile

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  Zivo on Sun Apr 29, 2012 6:49 am

    It looks like something from Red Faction. All it needs is some Mars landscape for the background.

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  GarryB on Sun Apr 29, 2012 7:53 am

    Well of course it doesn't need to be protected against .50 cal. I was just answering my own question more than anything.


    It could be 50 cal resistant, but unlikely to stop SLAP rounds or even full bore AP... but keep in mind that heavily sloped armour can cause full calibre bullets to bounce off so even if it wont actually stop 50 cal it might deflect the odd round just because of its shape.

    Many western critics talk about the thin armour on the BMDs and claim it is because the Russian government and military don't care about the lives of their soldiers... the irony is that the western equivalents of the VDV didn't have any armoured troop carriers at all at the time so not only were they less protected they were also less mobile and had less fire power.

    I realise you are not in that category, but when I see the "dune buggy" western vehicles with no armour at all like this:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Light_Strike_Vehicle

    I wonder why those same western experts don't criticise these vehicles for their lack of protection... even just from the weather and dust...

    It looks like something from Red Faction. All it needs is some Mars landscape for the background.


    I must admit when I first saw it my initial thought was that it was made for a movie, then I thought it was for a game...

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  Mr.Kalishnikov47 on Sun Apr 29, 2012 8:15 am

    [quote="GarryB"]


    It could be 50 cal resistant, but unlikely to stop SLAP rounds or even full bore AP... but keep in mind that heavily sloped armour can cause full calibre bullets to bounce off so even if it wont actually stop 50 cal it might deflect the odd round just because of its shape.

    Many western critics talk about the thin armour on the BMDs and claim it is because the Russian government and military don't care about the lives of their soldiers... the irony is that the western equivalents of the VDV didn't have any armoured troop carriers at all at the time so not only were they less protected they were also less mobile and had less fire power.

    I realise you are not in that category, but when I see the "dune buggy" western vehicles with no armour at all like this:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Light_Strike_Vehicle

    I wonder why those same western experts don't criticise these vehicles for their lack of protection... even just from the weather and dust...


    The experts can't say anything bad about America Garry, if they did then the kids would have nothing to brag about on Youtube.

    You seem to have mistaken my posts about the Karatelia's armor protection as some kind of judgement against it. On the contrary, I was actually just really interested in the vehicle and wanted to know what level of protection it was. It looked so futuristic I wouldn't have been surprised if somebody said it could stop a tank round Laughing

    In all seriousness though, Level 5 is not a bad amount of armor at all for a vehicle of that class, better than most actually. Definitely better than a Humvee.

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  GarryB on Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:01 am

    Sorry, I wasn't criticising you or judging... I was just speculating as to what level of armour they would likely want or need for such a vehicle.

    This is a vehicle for the MVD and FSB rather than an army vehicle so it is not really intended for battlefield use, though the fact that it is protected from most small arms fire is probably very useful.

    This sort of vehicle would be used instead of a UAV jeep type vehicle so it seems to have very good protection and I hope you didn't get the impression that my comment about "internet experts" complaining about lack of protection etc etc was directed at you.

    I find the vehicle interesting too... Smile

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  TheArmenian on Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:24 am

    Great info and lots of photos about project Karatelia, but my Russian language skills are just inadequate. Maybe someone can provide more insight.

    Part 1: http://rusautomobile.blogspot.com/2012/03/blog-post_28.html#!/2012/03/blog-post_28.html
    Part 2: http://rusautomobile.livejournal.com/219735.html

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    Re: "Karatelia"....Almost confused with "Boomerang"

    Post  Flanky on Wed Aug 22, 2012 3:01 am

    So any news on this one?
    Why it is being developed?
    To mee it looks like a small fast MRAP (judging from the chassis).
    In the case of Light Strike Vehicle - the mobility there was the absolute factor.
    Next factor was probably expendability, cost of maintenance and one of the last was battle survivability Smile

      Current date/time is Wed May 22, 2013 11:32 am