Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Share
    avatar
    eehnie

    Posts : 1629
    Points : 1654
    Join date : 2015-05-13

    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  eehnie on Fri Dec 08, 2017 5:55 am

    Militarov wrote:
    eehnie wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    eehnie wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    eehnie wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    The-thing-next-door wrote:The truck mounted Koalitsiya is a Bereg replacement as the navy clearly feels that the Bereg is inadiquate for the role of inefective coastal defence.

    No, it was designed as SPG for new light brigades

    What makes light this truck?

    To note that the A-222 Bereg is over 43 tons. This will not be lighter.

    Where this weapon is necessary likely a light brigade makes little sense. Where this weapon is necessary is likely to see Armata Brigades.

    Now i wonder if you actually ever went to the school of any kind. There is term for an example... "light tank" which isnt light at all at about fkn 30 tons. Take term "light" lightly...no pun intended.

    Light brigades are wheeled. This is wheeled... which somehow points toward fact that it will be used in dominantly wheeled future units. While tracked Coalition will be in other units dominantly equiped with tracked platforms. Not sure how confusing can it be.

    You mean light brigades like the future Russian BMD-4M brigades? Wheeled?

    Your comment is as ridiculous as it sounds.

    Where did you get info that light brigades will be BMD-4 based? Because you would be the first source of such information ever for me  Suspect

    Light brigades will be formed from wheeled platforms like Boomerang, Typhoons, Tigrs, Scropions etc.

    BMD-4s platforms are VDV exclusive as of now.

    I said not that light brigades will be all of BMD-4M.

    I said that it will be light brigades of BMD-4M. The brigades of BMD-4M will be light and will be tracked.

    Your previous comment was a joke. You was talking about "light tanks"  to say in the next sentence that light is wheeled. All the "light tanks" that you know are wheeled? Because most of them are also tracked (PT-76,...).

    As always you was trying to posture as the smarter in the room, but as alwyas you failed.

    First of all... we are not talking about some imaginary light brigades, but the reorganisation of the armed forces that Russia is planning to undergo, which will include splitting brigades into light, medium and heavy. Light will include almost entirely wheeled platforms (Boomerang, BTR-82A, Typhoon, Tigr-M etc) , medium will be based on mostly medium weight tracked platforms (Kurganec, BMP-2, BMP-3 etc), heavy brigades will be based on heavy tracked platforms (T-15, T-14, T-90 etc).

    Now.. what exactly you are failing to see ffor some reason is that wheeled Coalition is to be attached to light brigades as their SPG obviously. I have no clue what is so confusing to you here. MSTA-B, and Coalition on tracked platform will be kept in heavy brigades so they can follow up with rest of the units.

    BMD-4M wont be in Armys light brigades as that is not role it was made for, it will as always serve in VDV, which fyi is separate branch.

    Son, i mocked your litterate understanding of term "light". There is also light aircraft carrier that has displacement of 30.000t, is that more clear for you now? "Light", does not have to mean its fkn light. Are you using google translate to read the posts or what?

    Idea behind "light" brigade for it is to be whole wheeled, to cost less, to have great road mobility, reduced operating costs.. do you understand now? Light, like Stryker brigades US formed.

    PT-76 was more of an amphibious fire support vehicle, it was tank as much as i am Queen of England to be honest, but it was a designs limitation. On other hand, M551 Sheridan, PL-01, FV101 Scorpion, MMWT.. and list goes on, for about 50 more designs though last 60 years.

    Yea... i am really stupid. thumbsup

    And where is the MT-LB (tracked) in your pretty analysys? Embarassed Embarassed

    And where is the 2S21 Msta-K in the current wheeled "light brigades" of your pretty analysis? Embarassed Embarassed


    Last edited by eehnie on Fri Dec 08, 2017 5:59 am; edited 1 time in total
    avatar
    Militarov

    Posts : 5604
    Points : 5645
    Join date : 2015-09-03
    Location : Serbia

    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Militarov on Fri Dec 08, 2017 5:58 am

    eehnie wrote:And where is the MT-LB (tracked) in your pretty analysys? Embarassed Embarassed

    Medium brigades and Arctic brigades, and possibly as auxilary platform in some other structures.
    avatar
    eehnie

    Posts : 1629
    Points : 1654
    Join date : 2015-05-13

    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  eehnie on Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:01 am

    Militarov wrote:
    eehnie wrote:And where is the MT-LB (tracked) in your pretty analysys? Embarassed Embarassed

    Medium brigades and Arctic brigades, and possibly as auxilary platform in some other structures.

    Medium brigades, lol, do you remember that the MT-LB is ligther than the BTR-70 and the BTR-80? Embarassed Embarassed

    And where are the BMD-1/2 (tracked and lighter still than the MT-LB) in your pretty analysis? Embarassed Embarassed
    avatar
    Militarov

    Posts : 5604
    Points : 5645
    Join date : 2015-09-03
    Location : Serbia

    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Militarov on Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:09 am

    eehnie wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    eehnie wrote:And where is the MT-LB (tracked) in your pretty analysys? Embarassed Embarassed

    Medium brigades and Arctic brigades, and possibly as auxilary platform in some other structures.

    Medium brigades, lol, do you remember that the MT-LB is ligther than the BTR-70 and the BTR-80? Embarassed Embarassed

    And where are the BMD-1/2 (tracked and lighter still than the MT-LB) in your pretty analysis? Embarassed Embarassed

    BMD-1s are gone. BMD-2s are still in VDV son... not in the Army...

    And you still do not get what light brigade means... lol1
    avatar
    eehnie

    Posts : 1629
    Points : 1654
    Join date : 2015-05-13

    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  eehnie on Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:45 am

    Militarov wrote:
    eehnie wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    eehnie wrote:And where is the MT-LB (tracked) in your pretty analysys? Embarassed Embarassed

    Medium brigades and Arctic brigades, and possibly as auxilary platform in some other structures.

    Medium brigades, lol, do you remember that the MT-LB is ligther than the BTR-70 and the BTR-80? Embarassed Embarassed

    And where are the BMD-1/2 (tracked and lighter still than the MT-LB) in your pretty analysis? Embarassed Embarassed

    BMD-1s are gone. BMD-2s are still in VDV son... not in the Army...

    And you still do not get what light brigade means... lol1

    Ah... your theories are only for the Army... and I would bet are only for the Army of the US. If the MT-LB fits well for the artic is thanks to its light weight plus big contact surface.

    Your pretty theory about "light brigades" and "medium brigades" does not agree with the reality and is not able to include all the cases. This is your problem. In a few words is a shit of theory. Your problems to assume that in the reality there are light tracked brigades are absurd. This is the first thing that you seems to understand not. Embarassed Embarassed

    Second thing that you are not understanding. Talk us about the artillery used today in the light wheeled brigades please, without forget to mention the 2S21 Msta-K Embarassed Embarassed
    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 16861
    Points : 17469
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  GarryB on Fri Dec 08, 2017 10:25 am

    People... please calm down and lets cut the personal insults.

    The Russian Army is in the process of introducing four new families of vehicles.

    The armata is a heavy tracked vehicle, the Kurganets is a medium tracked vehicle, the boomerang is a medium wheeled vehicle and the Typhoon is a light wheeled vehicle.

    A wheeled artillery platform is highly mobile in places with good roads and would operate much better with a wheeled force than with a tracked force... a wheeled force is not likely to go where wheels are not suitable. A tracked force on the other hand might end up travelling in places where wheels don't work that well... you want your artillery to be mobile.

    This wheeled model of artillery is probably too powerful and heavy to operate with a light wheeled force, but if such a force needs artillery attached to it then wheeled forces would work better than tracked forces would.

    I would suspect however that if a medium force equipped with Boomerangs needed artillery support then I really can't see the enormous turret of a Koalition being fitted onto a Boomerang chassis, so this truck based model would be the ideal second choice.

    For an Armata brigade there is the tracked model with the armata chassis so all components will already be carried by the logistics tail, so it would be easier to support.
    If the wheeled Koalition operated with Armata or Kurganets brigades they would have to support the vehicles with lots of spare tires that likely no other vehicle in the brigade needs.

    A wheeled artillery vehicle has most of the mobility of a tracked vehicle but does not have the cost of track layers and their maintenance and support.



    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 16861
    Points : 17469
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  GarryB on Sat Dec 09, 2017 10:26 am

    I have deleted a few posts on this thread that clearly had nothing to do with the topic.

    If you would like to take a one week break from this forum by all means continue to abuse each other and post it on this thread.

    You have been warned.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    Sponsored content

    Re: 2S35 Koalitsiya-SV 152mm

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:50 pm