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    Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

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    GarryB

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  GarryB on Sun Dec 20, 2015 1:52 am

    The chinese AIP is a sterling engine... basically an internal combustion engine that uses liquid oxygen to run in a lo or no oxygen environment.

    the Russian AIP is superior in that it does not need a supply of oxygen which is not a safe material to have on any vessel due to risk of fire or explosion.

    the Russian AIP runs on diesel which means every port on the planet that is equipped to fuel ships already has the infrastructure to support the Russian AIP.



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    max steel

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  max steel on Sat Jan 02, 2016 6:24 pm

    Sea Ghost: New Russian Submarine is Stealthier Than a 'Black Hole'

    Russia’s newest silent submarine is even stealthier than its sneaky predecessor. The stealth capabilities of Russia’s new Lada-class diesel-electric submarines far exceed those of their predecessors, Admiraty Shipyard’s CEO Alexander Buzakov told the Russian press.

    According to Buzakov, the new vessels are even stealthier than Russian Kilo-class submarines, thought to be one of the quietest diesel-electric submarine classes in the world and dubbed "black holes" for their ability to "disappear” from sonars.

    The new submarines are able to maintain such a low profile thanks to a clever implementation of a next-generation anti-reflective acoustic coating and a new improved hydro-acoustic system, Buzakov said. He also added that during the new submarines’ construction and design process, the development team managed to gather a lot of valuable data which, among other things, allowed them to significantly improve the Kilo-class submarines as well.

    The Lada-class submarines are designed to defend coastlines against ships and other submarines, gather intelligence, provide surveillance and reconnaissance missions, and act as a mother ship for special forces. With its new air-independent propulsion plant, a Lada submarine can remain submerged for as many as 25 days. With its vast array of weapon systems, the Lada is also world’s first non-nuclear submarine to be equipped with specialized launchers for cruise missiles.



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    George1

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  George1 on Sat Jan 16, 2016 5:01 pm



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    Austin

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  Austin on Mon Jan 18, 2016 11:33 am

    Russian Navy: noise submarines type "Lada" is 10 times lower than that of the project 636 submarines

    http://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/2592426

    MOSCOW, Jan. 16. / TASS /. Noise of non-nuclear submarines of the fourth generation of "Lada" (Project 677) is reduced by 10 times compared to their predecessors 636 project. This is the radio "Russian news service," said the head of the Russian Navy ship captain Vladimir rag-pickers.

    "There adequately designed submarine 677 project" Harmony ". She is now undergoing trial operation in the Northern Fleet. Any questions, but when they are closed, finished trial operation, adjusted the working design documentation, the operating instructions - this is a serious underwater boat, which will have the noise level is lower than the currently possess submarines 636 project ", - he said the rag-pickers, speaking of the head submarine" Saint Petersburg ". "And now we are building in parallel two other submarines of this project. This is the" Great Luke "and" Kronstadt ", which are constructed taking into account those comments, which are revealed in the trial operation of the head of the boat," - said the representative of the fleet. show more
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    George1

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  George1 on Tue Jan 19, 2016 3:26 pm

    This projects ends

    Russia Scraps Plans of Additional Project 677 Submarines Construction

    The Russian Navy decided not to build Lada-class diesel-electric submarines (Project 677) since the funding will be spent on Kalina-class ships, a senior Russian Navy’s official said Tuesday.

    MOSCOW (Sputnik) – Construction of the Sankt Peterburg, the lead ship of the Project 677, began in December 1997. It was introduced into the Navy for trial operations in April 2010. Two other ships of the class have already been laid down.

    "The Navy has decided to complete the construction of two Lada-class boats and stop the work on the project. All three boats of this project will join the Baltic Fleet. Funding will be directed to the Kalina project," the official told RIA Novosti.

    He added that a Russian design bureau, Rubin, was working on the project of the submarines equipped with anaerobic (air-independent) power units, dubbed Kalina-class. Their construction is expected to be launched after 2020.

    Air-independent, closed cycle submarines, which usually use hydrogen-oxygen fuel cells, are quieter than conventional diesel-electric boats and do not have to surface or use snorkel tubes to breathe air, thereby exposing themselves to detection by radar and other sensors.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/russia/20160119/1033354924/russia-plans-additional-submarines-construction.html#ixzz3xhUHEOwm


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    JohninMK

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  JohninMK on Tue Jan 19, 2016 4:26 pm

    Looks like a really good move by the Navy, investing in the next generation.

    On the other hand, on the other side of the country we have more of the "10 times noisier" sub

    MOSCOW, January 16. /TASS/. A series of six conventional submarines (project 636) will be built for the Pacific Fleet, Chief of the Russian Navy's shipbuilding management department Captain 1st Rank Vladimir Tryapichnikov said on Saturday, aired by the Russian News Service radio station . "In the perspective the Navy is making attempts and, evidently, they should find a confirmation in construction of another six submarines (project 636), which would go to the Pacific Fleet," he said.

    More: http://tass.ru/en/defense/850127


    Last edited by JohninMK on Tue Jan 19, 2016 4:40 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Second item added)

    andalusia

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  andalusia on Sat Jan 30, 2016 11:14 pm

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    max steel

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  max steel on Mon Mar 21, 2016 2:48 pm

    Construction of Last Lada-Class Submarines to Be Completed in 2018-2019

    The two last Lada-class diesel-electric submarines (Project 677) will be constructed in 2019, an official representative of Russia's United Shipbuilding Corporation said Friday."The two Lada-class Project 677 submarines will be delivered as scheduled — in 2018 and 2019," the spokesman told RIA Novosti.

    Then the construction of the new non-nuclear Kalina-class submarines will be launched," he added.Air-independent, closed cycle submarines, which usually use hydrogen-oxygen fuel cells, are quieter than conventional diesel-electric boats and do not have to surface or use snorkel tubes to breathe air, thereby exposing themselves to detection by radar and other sensors.

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    George1

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  George1 on Mon Mar 28, 2016 5:18 pm



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    zg18

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  zg18 on Wed Jun 01, 2016 12:52 pm

    "Lada" class sub U/C, May 31st, Admiralty shipyards St. Petesburg


    Austin

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  Austin on Sun Jun 26, 2016 7:13 pm

    http://aviationweek.com/awin/new-submarines-use-advanced-technology-improve-performance

    Russia's Project 636 SSK, called Kilo in the West, set standards in the Cold War, but its designer—St. Petersburg-based CDB Rubin—is now playing catch-up after years of underinvestment. Rubin's general director, Andrey Dyachkov, tells DTI that the company is completing bench-testing of a prototype AIP system.

    The system is a hydrogen fuel cell, as used by TKMS-HDW, but instead of operating on stored hydrogen, it relies on chemical re- formation of the sub's diesel fuel, which eliminates special on-board tankage and hydrogen infrastructure on shore. According to Dyachkov, this technology has already been validated during AIP bench tests. “This allows us to use the standard diesel fuel and doesn't require complex ground support” compared to the German variant, he explained.

    Rubin plans to install AIP in the Amur 1650, offered for the Indian navy's tender for six conventional submarines. An export version of Russia's Project 677 Lada class, Amur has a surface displacement of 1,765 metric tons, submerged speed of 19 kt. and a crew of 35. It is designed to strike both sea-based and fixed land-based targets. The 66-meter (217-ft.) boat carries six torpedo tubes and Klub-S (SS-N-27) missiles in 10 vertical launchers that can be fired in salvos. For the Indian tender it also will be equipped with Russo-Indian PJ-10 BrahMos supersonic missiles fired from the same launchers.

    The AIP can be installed in the Amur 1650 in a separate module along with the conventional diesel-electric propulsion system. Using the AIP, the sub's endurance can increase by two or three more weeks from 45 days currently, based on a customer's request. Continuous submerged time increases from the current nine days to 14-20 days.

    The first Project 677 boat, the St. Petersburg, is undergoing reliability testing with the Russian navy in the Baltic Sea. In 2012, it is expected to complete the testing of its sonar system, says Dyachkov. The Admiralty Shipyards in St. Petersburg are constructing two more, the Kronstadt and Sevastopol, but so far there are no funds for completing these with AIP.

    Rubin plans to further increase Amur 1650 endurance by replacing lead-acid batteries with lithium-ion (Li-Ion) batteries. The designers do not report about their progress in this field, but say that lithium-ion batteries will be able to increase the sub's submerged endurance and distance by 50% at low noise patrol speed and threefold at full speed. Unlike the AIP, which is only compatible with the Amur, the new batteries can also be offered for Rubin's Project 636 Kilo boats.
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    George1

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  George1 on Fri Sep 30, 2016 12:19 am

    Operational evaluation of Russia's Lada-class lead submarine meets expectations

    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/902924?_ga=1.55244651.1337049799.1447427261


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    zg18

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  zg18 on Thu Nov 17, 2016 12:08 pm

    Lada class "Sankt Peterburg" test launches cruise missiles in Barents sea


    http://militarynews.ru/story.asp?rid=1&nid=432821
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    franco

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  franco on Wed Mar 22, 2017 9:43 pm

    Second Lada sub to be delivered in 2019. Third completion date depends on financing and no word yet on any further orders;

    http://forum.militaryparitet.com/viewtopic.php?id=15722
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Mar 22, 2017 10:12 pm

    franco wrote:Second Lada sub to be delivered in 2019. Third completion date depends on financing and no word yet on any further orders;

    http://forum.militaryparitet.com/viewtopic.php?id=15722

    I don't think they will be pursuing this project any further beyond completing ones they started.
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    Big_Gazza

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  Big_Gazza on Thu Mar 23, 2017 9:08 am

    PapaDragon wrote:I don't think they will be pursuing this project any further beyond completing ones they started.

    Agreed.  They'll move on to the Kalina class once they've finished these three. The Lada program hasn't been a waste as they are effectively testbeds for new technoogy and a good chance to try out new solutions.
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  AlfaT8 on Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:16 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    franco wrote:Second Lada sub to be delivered in 2019. Third completion date depends on financing and no word yet on any further orders;

    http://forum.militaryparitet.com/viewtopic.php?id=15722

    I don't think they will be pursuing this project any further beyond completing ones they started.

    They wouldn't have built the IAP for it if they weren't going to build more.
    Especially the VLS version which would be very useful for Russia.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu Mar 23, 2017 9:53 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:.............

    They wouldn't have built the IAP for it if they weren't going to build more.
    Especially the VLS version which would be very useful for Russia.

    They started that project back in the 90's and while they may have fixed all issues now basic design has become obsolete. They will be going with Kalina class for AIP subs.

    You mentioned VLS version. What do you know about it? If they install VLS on conventional subs it will be epic.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  GarryB on Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:20 am

    After the success of cruise missiles in the Syrian conflict it would not surprise me if they put VLS launchers in everything.

    There are options for VLS tubes in Kilo and improved Kilo designs so I would expect Lada and Kalina to have them too.


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    George1

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  George1 on Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:29 am

    since Kalina is coming then why to keep developing Lada. This is the point i guess


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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  AlfaT8 on Fri Mar 24, 2017 5:28 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:.............

    They wouldn't have built the IAP for it if they weren't going to build more.
    Especially the VLS version which would be very useful for Russia.

    They started that project back in the 90's and while they may have fixed all issues now basic design has become obsolete. They will be going with Kalina class for AIP subs.

    You mentioned VLS version. What do you know about it? If they install VLS on conventional subs it will be epic.

    I see, so Kalina is an entirely new project, honestly i thought it was simply a re-brand of Lada like how the Graney-class became the Yasen-class.

    Yes, extremely Epic, let's see how Nato hunt's down small VLS ready Diesel/AIPs.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  GarryB on Sat Mar 25, 2017 1:51 am

    since Kalina is coming then why to keep developing Lada. This is the point i guess

    The Lada class are not bad vessels, they have just been overtaken with new technology and new systems.

    They are not still developing the Lada class they are just completing them and fitting them with new equipment to make them useful.

    To scrap them now would be to scrap three vessels that are ten times quieter than the Kilos they currently have in service.

    Kalina is designed from scratch with new systems and new technology and will be better and probably cheaper too.


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    berhoum

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    Re: Lada class Submarine: News

    Post  berhoum on Mon Mar 27, 2017 5:59 pm

    Hello I would want to know if we can install(settle) an anaerobic propulsion system (or AIP) on Submarines Kilo [636 / 877]  study
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    Isos

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  Isos on Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:56 pm

    berhoum wrote:Hello I would want to know if we can install(settle) an anaerobic propulsion system (or AIP) on Submarines Kilo [636 / 877]  study

    Possible if you have money but they won't, Kilo's are pretty big to accomodate new systems. Most of them will be replace by kalina in the future which is an AIP subs design.
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    Singular_Transform

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    Re: Lada/Amur Submarine: News and Development

    Post  Singular_Transform on Mon Mar 27, 2017 9:34 pm

    Isos wrote:
    berhoum wrote:Hello I would want to know if we can install(settle) an anaerobic propulsion system (or AIP) on Submarines Kilo [636 / 877]  study

    Possible if you have money but they won't, Kilo's are pretty big to accomodate new systems. Most of them will be replace by kalina in the future which is an AIP subs design.

    Not possible.
    Cost should be as big as the cost of a new sub. Or more.

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