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    Mistral News thread

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    Vladimir79

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 9:52 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    Militarov wrote:Huh, mediocre navy like Egypt getting Mistrals.... eh...
    Maybe now but money from the Gulf is being pumped into it, think of it as an embryo Arab Navy.

    The Arab states are forming their own allied military funded by the GCC and manned by Egypt. They do so under the guise of fighting Islamists but they are trying to become a regional power. Like you really need Mistrals to patrol the Red Sea? Next stop Iran...


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    Militarov

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Militarov on Wed Sep 23, 2015 10:44 pm

    Vladimir79 wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:
    Militarov wrote:Huh, mediocre navy like Egypt getting Mistrals.... eh...
    Maybe now but money from the Gulf is being pumped into it, think of it as an embryo Arab Navy.

    The Arab states are forming their own allied military funded by the GCC and manned by Egypt.  They do so under the guise of fighting Islamists but they are trying to become a regional power.  Like you really need Mistrals to patrol the Red Sea?  Next stop Iran...

    I dont mind Egypt getting Mistrals, better Egypt than Canada or Saudi Arabia if you ask me, but they imo lack support ships and infrastructure to host and use such ships. Also tbh i dont know whats the point of Mistral ships for such fairly small navy, Mistral is not littoral patrol ship or frigate. I am aware they invested quite alot in their navy recently but still if i was in their skin id rather spend my money on something else.
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    Vladimir79

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 10:56 pm

    Militarov wrote:

    I dont mind Egypt getting Mistrals, better Egypt than Canada or Saudi Arabia if you ask me, but they imo lack support ships and infrastructure to host and use such ships. Also tbh i dont know whats the point of Mistral ships for such fairly small navy, Mistral is not littoral patrol ship or frigate. I am aware they invested quite alot in their navy recently but still if i was in their skin id rather spend my money on something else.

    I really don't buy the excuse of using it to fight Houthis rebels, the GCC infrastructure is good enough to get troops as close or closer to the action than a floating army base can get it. BPC is a tool for power projection. Egypt cites the need as they have discovered natural gas off the coast, but what are they going to do with it in open water? Hey, we need to send an armoured brigade to defend the drilling rig?


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    Militarov

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Militarov on Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:27 pm

    Vladimir79 wrote:
    Militarov wrote:

    I dont mind Egypt getting Mistrals, better Egypt than Canada or Saudi Arabia if you ask me, but they imo lack support ships and infrastructure to host and use such ships. Also tbh i dont know whats the point of Mistral ships for such fairly small navy, Mistral is not littoral patrol ship or frigate. I am aware they invested quite alot in their navy recently but still if i was in their skin id rather spend my money on something else.

    I really don't buy the excuse of using it to fight Houthis rebels, the GCC infrastructure is good enough to get troops as close or closer to the action than a floating army base can get it.  BPC is a tool for power projection.  Egypt cites the need as they have discovered natural gas off the coast, but what are they going to do with it in open water?  Hey, we need to send an armoured brigade to defend the drilling rig?

    Egypt does not have THAT big coast, you can fairly easy and fast transport whatever you want from land bases especially with their amount of helicopters and transport aircraft.
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    Vladimir79

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:32 pm

    Militarov wrote:

    Egypt does not have THAT big coast, you can fairly easy and fast transport whatever you want from land bases especially with their amount of helicopters and transport aircraft.

    That is what doesn't make sense.  The Sinai has some hard to reach terrain but it is no harder to drive there and hike than it is to conduct an amphibious operation and still hike into mountains.  Of course Egypt is rather indebted to fight Houthis now that GCC practically bought their new military so Yemeni operations are foreseeable. Maybe they want to invade Somalia too? That makes more sense for a PCB.


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    TheArmenian

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  TheArmenian on Thu Sep 24, 2015 12:33 am

    Just a (very) wild guess about the Mistral sales to Egypt:

    Egypt buys them. A few months later sells them back to Russia. US is outraged. French government fires the officials who "forgot" to put a clause in the contract that does not allow Egypt to sell the ships without French consent...

    Twisted Evil
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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  ExBeobachter1987 on Thu Sep 24, 2015 12:57 am

    TheArmenian wrote:Just a (very) wild guess about the Mistral sales to Egypt:

    Egypt buys them. A few months later sells them back to Russia.  US is outraged. French government fires the officials who "forgot" to put a clause in the contract that does not allow Egypt to sell the ships without French consent...

    Twisted Evil

    Certain Russians would be also outraged. angry
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    Vladimir79

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Thu Sep 24, 2015 1:43 am

    TheArmenian wrote:Just a (very) wild guess about the Mistral sales to Egypt:

    Egypt buys them. A few months later sells them back to Russia.  US is outraged. French government fires the officials who "forgot" to put a clause in the contract that does not allow Egypt to sell the ships without French consent...

    Twisted Evil

    They would void any service contracts or warranty, not to mention Egypt is in talks to buy Ka-52s. My only question is who is financing this... I heard rumours we could be offering low interest loans instead of French financing.


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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  PapaDragon on Sat Sep 26, 2015 2:31 pm


    lol1 lol1 lol1

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    JohninMK

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  JohninMK on Tue Sep 29, 2015 8:51 pm

    The ships are second owner now so Egypt will be negotiating hard on price, plus they come with complications in fitting out. Hollande's statement was certainly a hostage to fortune.

    According to the French Senate Finance Commitee, the country's budget is set to lose about 250 million euros on the deal to sell two Mistral ships originally built for Russia to Egypt. "If the agreement with Egypt to resell the ships is implemented, it will cost the nation's budget 200 to 250 million euros," the committee's statement reads.

    This is in stark contrast with last week's statement by French president Hollande that the nation would not bear any costs from the deal with Egypt. "A decision was made to provide the Mistrals to Egypt, we agreed with President Sisi on the terms and the price. France will not bear any financial costs from this agreement," he told reporters.

    France and Russia terminated a $1.3-billion contract last month following Hollande’s suspension of the warships’ deliveries late last year over the Ukrainian conflict. Paris repaid Moscow around $1 billion as compensation for breaching the contract.


    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/business/20150929/1027732282/mistral-deal-egypt-financial-costs.html#ixzz3n9ffTfqs
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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Sep 30, 2015 9:38 pm

    Razz
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    Vladimir79

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:44 pm

    JohninMK wrote:The ships are second owner now so Egypt will be negotiating hard on price, plus they come with complications in fitting out. Hollande's statement was certainly a hostage to fortune.

    Not really... the loss is in long lead contracts not yet signed which Egypt will have to sign later in order to maintain its Mistrals.  France will actually get more money out of Egypt as they can't build anything for it while we could replace most of it ourselves. The French Senate is trying to balance its budget and will be at a loss this year, however DCNS will get more business in the long term.


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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  JohninMK on Sun Oct 11, 2015 10:46 pm

    Its all over now. Egypt has signed the contract, finance mainly from Saudi. Delivery in March after training for 400 Egyptian sailors.

    No mention of fitting out etc.

    (AFP) Machine translation from the French

    French Prime Minister Manuel Valls Saturday in Cairo has finalized the sale to Egypt of two Mistral warships including the purchase by Russia had been canceled by Paris because of the Ukrainian crisis.

    French President Francois Hollande announced September 23 that it had agreed the sale with his Egyptian counterpart Abdel Fattah al-Sissi. For an amount of about 950 million, had they then specified within the French government.

    The French group of defense industries "DCNS" has signed with the Egyptian Navy contract of sale of the two buildings Mistral in the presence of MM. Sissi and Valls ", told AFP a member of the entourage of the French prime minister after his meeting with Egyptian President.

    Mr. Valls Saturday in Egypt began a four-day tour of the Middle East, which also take him to Jordan and Saudi Arabia and will be dominated by bilateral trade and regional conflicts.


    https://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.lalibre.be/dernieres-depeches/afp/mistral-valls-finalise-la-vente-de-deux-navires-a-l-egypte-56191b9d35700fb92f97d97e&prev=search
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    GarryB

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  GarryB on Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:52 am

    Well you say it is all over, but the Russians had signed and paid and got the training too... what happens when Egypt does something France does not like... or should I say what happens when Egypt does something Washington doesn't like...


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    Project Canada

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Project Canada on Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:26 am


    Rodinazombie

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Rodinazombie on Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:42 am

    Project Canada wrote:
    Second Time Lucky? France Says It Is Ready to Sell New Ships to Russia


    French president seems to be good at humor  Laughing

    You gotta be kidding me


    Then again, without trying to sound lke the twins, i can imagine russia doing it out of goodwill, in order to revive the relationship with one of its western 'partners'. Though i doubt it would be a military ship.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Militarov on Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:42 am

    Project Canada wrote:
    Second Time Lucky? France Says It Is Ready to Sell New Ships to Russia


    French president seems to be good at humor  Laughing

    He was probably talking about civilian shipbuilding, i doubt he has any ilusion about selling military ships to Russia, coz again contract would just get blocked by USA as did this one. They cant sell pencil abroad without consulting NATO.
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    medo

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  medo on Wed Oct 14, 2015 2:33 pm

    Project Canada wrote:
    Second Time Lucky? France Says It Is Ready to Sell New Ships to Russia


    French president seems to be good at humor  Laughing

    They could, but only under condition, that ships will be 100% build in Russian shipyards. In that way, Russia could buy new Mistrals as France could not block deliveries from St. Petersburg's shipyards. Russia could now buy only blueprints and documentation and build them themselves.
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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Wed Oct 14, 2015 2:38 pm

    medo wrote:
    Project Canada wrote:
    Second Time Lucky? France Says It Is Ready to Sell New Ships to Russia


    French president seems to be good at humor  Laughing

    They could, but only under condition, that ships will be 100% build in Russian shipyards. In that way, Russia could buy new Mistrals as France could not block deliveries from St. Petersburg's shipyards. Russia could now buy only blueprints and documentation and build them themselves.

    Russia has already ToT. What Russia needs is the blocks to make the modular assembly. These would be built in France and shipped in Russia by boat.

    Insert, "Hey dawg..." joke here.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Militarov on Wed Oct 14, 2015 2:41 pm

    "France currently operates 3 Mistral Class LHDs, after buying a 3rd using economic stimulus funds. Unlike other LHD designs, the Mistral Class can’t operate fixed wing aircraft, and some observers in Russia and elsewhere classify at as an LHA. Regardless, it’s an important tool of power projection. Mistral Class ships can carry and deploy up to 16 helicopters, including attack helicopters like France’s Tiger or Russia’s Ka-50/52. Their main punch revolves around 4 landing barges or 2 medium hovercraft, however, which deliver armored vehicles, tanks, and soldiers to shore. Vessels of this class are equipped with a 69-bed hospital, and could be used as amphibious command ships.

    Russia wants that kind of versatility – even as her neighbors fear it. After Russia’s annexation of Ukraine and the continued covert war in Eastern Ukraine, this contract became a major point of contention between Russia and NATO members."


    Not sure why, but i always start laughing at this typo Very Happy
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    Militarov

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Militarov on Mon Oct 19, 2015 2:55 pm

    "Rusija će isporučiti egipatskim „mistralima“ helikoptere i prateću opremu u vrednosti od preko milijardu dolara. To je saopštio šef administracije ruskog predsednika Sergej Ivanov. Prema njegovim rečima, Rusija će da isporuči svu nedostajuću opremu bez koje su ti brodovi „obične konzerve", uključujući, naravno, i helikoptere.Ranije je saopšteno da su ruski koncerni „Morinformsistema-Agat" i „Radioelektronske tehnologije" spremne da opreme ove brodove najnovijim tehnološkim sistemima, uključujući i sistem radioelektronske zaštite 5P28 Pobeditelj."



    Russia will deliver Helicopters and following equipment for Egyptian Mistrals worth over 1 billion USD. That was stated by chief of administration Sergei Ivanov. By his statement Russia shall deliver all missing equipment without which Mistrals are just "cans" including helicopters. It was earlier annoynced that Russian concern Morinformsistema-Agat and Radioelektronske tehnologije are ready to equip these ships with newest system including system for radioelectronic protection 5P25 Pobeditel".

    If anyone need any help with original serbian text i mean rest of it, feel free to ask.

    Source (Serbian): http://rs-lat.sputniknews.com/rusija/20151019/1100395735/rusija-isporuka-mistrali-egipat.html
    Source (translated Serbian): https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=sr&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=sr&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Frs-lat.sputniknews.com%2Frusija%2F20151019%2F1100395735%2Frusija-isporuka-mistrali-egipat.html&edit-text=

    "As is known, France is currently negotiating with Egypt for the sale of two Mistral ships that were previously built for Russia. On Thursday, Russian Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov said that Russia is ready to sell electronic equipment for the Mistral ships to their future buyer, as reported by RIA Novosti.
    KRET has proposed to equip the Mistral ships with 5P28 Pobeditel electronic defense systems, which can be installed on large ships such as aircraft carriers, helicopter carriers, and cruisers. The system greatly increases a ship’s life expectancy." - directly from KRET

    Source: http://kret.com/en/news/3999/
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    JohninMK

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  JohninMK on Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:41 pm

    Militarov wrote:"Rusija će isporučiti egipatskim „mistralima“ helikoptere i prateću opremu u vrednosti od preko milijardu dolara. To je saopštio šef administracije ruskog predsednika Sergej Ivanov. Prema njegovim rečima, Rusija će da isporuči svu nedostajuću opremu bez koje su ti brodovi „obične konzerve", uključujući, naravno, i helikoptere.Ranije je saopšteno da su ruski koncerni „Morinformsistema-Agat" i „Radioelektronske tehnologije" spremne da opreme ove brodove najnovijim tehnološkim sistemima, uključujući i sistem radioelektronske zaštite 5P28 Pobeditelj."


    Russia will deliver Helicopters and following equipment for Egyptian Mistrals worth over 1 billion USD. That was stated by chief of administration Sergei Ivanov. By his statement Russia shall deliver all missing equipment without which Mistrals are just "cans" including helicopters. It was earlier annoynced that Russian concern Morinformsistema-Agat and Radioelektronske tehnologije are ready to equip these ships with newest system including system for radioelectronic protection 5P25 Pobeditel".

    If anyone need any help with original serbian text i mean rest of it, feel free to ask.


    "As is known, France is currently negotiating with Egypt for the sale of two Mistral ships that were previously built for Russia. On Thursday, Russian Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov said that Russia is ready to sell electronic equipment for the Mistral ships to their future buyer, as reported by RIA Novosti.
    KRET has proposed to equip the Mistral ships with 5P28 Pobeditel electronic defense systems, which can be installed on large ships such as aircraft carriers, helicopter carriers, and cruisers. The system greatly increases a ship’s life expectancy." - directly from KRET

    Source: http://kret.com/en/news/3999/
    Fascinating, so not only did Russia get its roughly $1B back (plus saved its own fit out cost) but now it gets another $1B for fitting them out for the Egyptians. Got to be some happy faces in Moscow.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  Militarov on Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:46 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    Militarov wrote:"Rusija će isporučiti egipatskim „mistralima“ helikoptere i prateću opremu u vrednosti od preko milijardu dolara. To je saopštio šef administracije ruskog predsednika Sergej Ivanov. Prema njegovim rečima, Rusija će da isporuči svu nedostajuću opremu bez koje su ti brodovi „obične konzerve", uključujući, naravno, i helikoptere.Ranije je saopšteno da su ruski koncerni „Morinformsistema-Agat" i „Radioelektronske tehnologije" spremne da opreme ove brodove najnovijim tehnološkim sistemima, uključujući i sistem radioelektronske zaštite 5P28 Pobeditelj."


    Russia will deliver Helicopters and following equipment for Egyptian Mistrals worth over 1 billion USD. That was stated by chief of administration Sergei Ivanov. By his statement Russia shall deliver all missing equipment without which Mistrals are just "cans" including helicopters. It was earlier annoynced that Russian concern Morinformsistema-Agat and Radioelektronske tehnologije are ready to equip these ships with newest system including system for radioelectronic protection 5P25 Pobeditel".

    If anyone need any help with original serbian text i mean rest of it, feel free to ask.


    "As is known, France is currently negotiating with Egypt for the sale of two Mistral ships that were previously built for Russia. On Thursday, Russian Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov said that Russia is ready to sell electronic equipment for the Mistral ships to their future buyer, as reported by RIA Novosti.
    KRET has proposed to equip the Mistral ships with 5P28 Pobeditel electronic defense systems, which can be installed on large ships such as aircraft carriers, helicopter carriers, and cruisers. The system greatly increases a ship’s life expectancy." - directly from KRET

    Source: http://kret.com/en/news/3999/
    Fascinating, so not only did Russia get its roughly $1B back (plus saved its own fit out cost) but now it gets another $1B for fitting them out for the Egyptians. Got to be some happy faces in Moscow.

    Well not only that, KA52s will require maintenance, spare parts, ammunition, pilot and technician training, such contracts are long term source of money, well same goes for French aiding maintenance of Mistrals but still this one went quite well for Russians.
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    JohninMK

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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  JohninMK on Mon Oct 19, 2015 8:16 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:
    Militarov wrote:"Rusija će isporučiti egipatskim „mistralima“ helikoptere i prateću opremu u vrednosti od preko milijardu dolara. To je saopštio šef administracije ruskog predsednika Sergej Ivanov. Prema njegovim rečima, Rusija će da isporuči svu nedostajuću opremu bez koje su ti brodovi „obične konzerve", uključujući, naravno, i helikoptere.Ranije je saopšteno da su ruski koncerni „Morinformsistema-Agat" i „Radioelektronske tehnologije" spremne da opreme ove brodove najnovijim tehnološkim sistemima, uključujući i sistem radioelektronske zaštite 5P28 Pobeditelj."


    Russia will deliver Helicopters and following equipment for Egyptian Mistrals worth over 1 billion USD. That was stated by chief of administration Sergei Ivanov. By his statement Russia shall deliver all missing equipment without which Mistrals are just "cans" including helicopters. It was earlier annoynced that Russian concern Morinformsistema-Agat and Radioelektronske tehnologije are ready to equip these ships with newest system including system for radioelectronic protection 5P25 Pobeditel".

    If anyone need any help with original serbian text i mean rest of it, feel free to ask.


    "As is known, France is currently negotiating with Egypt for the sale of two Mistral ships that were previously built for Russia. On Thursday, Russian Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov said that Russia is ready to sell electronic equipment for the Mistral ships to their future buyer, as reported by RIA Novosti.
    KRET has proposed to equip the Mistral ships with 5P28 Pobeditel electronic defense systems, which can be installed on large ships such as aircraft carriers, helicopter carriers, and cruisers. The system greatly increases a ship’s life expectancy." - directly from KRET

    Source: http://kret.com/en/news/3999/
    Fascinating, so not only did Russia get its roughly $1B back (plus saved its own fit out cost) but now it gets another $1B for fitting them out for the Egyptians. Got to be some happy faces in Moscow.

    Well not only that, KA52s will require maintenance, spare parts, ammunition, pilot and technician training, such contracts are long term source of money, well same goes for French aiding maintenance of Mistrals but still this one went quite well for Russians.
    The million dollar question: where will the work be done?
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    Re: Mistral News thread

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Mon Oct 19, 2015 8:32 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    Militarov wrote:"Rusija će isporučiti egipatskim „mistralima“ helikoptere i prateću opremu u vrednosti od preko milijardu dolara. To je saopštio šef administracije ruskog predsednika Sergej Ivanov. Prema njegovim rečima, Rusija će da isporuči svu nedostajuću opremu bez koje su ti brodovi „obične konzerve", uključujući, naravno, i helikoptere.Ranije je saopšteno da su ruski koncerni „Morinformsistema-Agat" i „Radioelektronske tehnologije" spremne da opreme ove brodove najnovijim tehnološkim sistemima, uključujući i sistem radioelektronske zaštite 5P28 Pobeditelj."


    Russia will deliver Helicopters and following equipment for Egyptian Mistrals worth over 1 billion USD. That was stated by chief of administration Sergei Ivanov. By his statement Russia shall deliver all missing equipment without which Mistrals are just "cans" including helicopters. It was earlier annoynced that Russian concern Morinformsistema-Agat and Radioelektronske tehnologije are ready to equip these ships with newest system including system for radioelectronic protection 5P25 Pobeditel".

    If anyone need any help with original serbian text i mean rest of it, feel free to ask.


    "As is known, France is currently negotiating with Egypt for the sale of two Mistral ships that were previously built for Russia. On Thursday, Russian Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov said that Russia is ready to sell electronic equipment for the Mistral ships to their future buyer, as reported by RIA Novosti.
    KRET has proposed to equip the Mistral ships with 5P28 Pobeditel electronic defense systems, which can be installed on large ships such as aircraft carriers, helicopter carriers, and cruisers. The system greatly increases a ship’s life expectancy." - directly from KRET

    Source: http://kret.com/en/news/3999/
    Fascinating, so not only did Russia get its roughly $1B back (plus saved its own fit out cost) but now it gets another $1B for fitting them out for the Egyptians. Got to be some happy faces in Moscow.

    It's called Lol Sanctions.

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