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    Su-30 for Russian Air Force

    George1
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    Post  George1 on Thu Jan 31, 2019 3:00 pm

    Modernization of the Su-30SM fighter


    According to Irkut Corporation PJSC and the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, on January 30, 2019, the Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation, Army General Sergei Shoigu, visited the Irkutsk Aviation Plant (IAP), a branch of Irkut Corporation. At the enterprise, the head of the military department for the first time demonstrated a modernized Su-30SM fighter.

    Su-30 for Russian Air Force - Page 35 6484503_original

    The head of the defense department was interested in the issue of industrial modernization of multi-purpose fighters Su-30SM and the work of workshops for the production of combat-training aircraft Yak-130. He was informed that the Su-30SM aircraft had undergone a set of improvements and ground checks. This was announced by the head of the assembly and test production of the Irkutsk aircraft factory Andrei Balchugov.

    According to the head of production, this year the company will complete the modernization of combat aircraft and transfer four fighters to the experimental design bureau. For flight tests prepared three cars. After completing the tests, technical improvements can be introduced when building new Su-30SM fighter jets or when repairing them.
    The modernization program for Su-30SM fighters provides for the use of Russian components.

    Modernization of fighters is carried out on the instructions of the Ministry of Defense of Russia. The Air Force of Russia and the naval aviation of the Navy have over 100 aircraft of this type. Thanks to the changes, the combat capabilities of the vehicles increase: the range of detection and identification of aerial targets increases, and new high-precision means of destruction of air, land and sea targets are introduced at a range of several hundred kilometers.

    The head of the defense department was informed that two squadrons of Su-30SM aircraft had now been adopted by the army of Kazakhstan. In addition, the Asian country expects the following shipments. This year, the first batch of fighters plan to take the armed forces of Belarus.

    Su-30 for Russian Air Force - Page 35 6485704_original

    https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3513685.html
    AMCXXL
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    Post  AMCXXL on Fri Feb 01, 2019 2:02 am

    Contract of a batch of 4 Su-30SM for Armenia

    https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3514999.html

    Armenia acquired four Su-30SM fighters

    According to the newspaper Kommersant in the material by Ivan Safronov and Alexandra Dzhordzhevich "Russia sold fighter jets to Armenia like themselves. Four Su-30CMs went to the buyer at Russian prices" which the Armenian armed forces should receive in 2020.

    As it became known to Kommersant, for the implementation of the transaction with an ally of the CSTO, the Russian negotiators made serious concessions: they not only allocated a loan, but also sold the aircraft at Russian domestic prices rather than export prices. This contract can be considered symbolic for the Armenian authorities as a whole, and for the Prime Minister of Armenia Nikol Pashinyan: for the first time in decades, the Air Force of the country acquires a new aircraft that is not used.

    On signing a new agreement on Su-30SM fighter jets on Thursday, Sputnik agency reported with reference to the press service of the Armenian Defense Ministry. The defense ministry confirmed the fact of the deal, but did not specify either the number of aircraft purchased or the amount of the contract, adding only that “the process of acquiring weapons within the framework of the $ 100 million loan previously allocated by the Russian side is at the implementation stage”. In Rosoboronexport (a special exporter of Russian weapons) and the Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation, “Kommersant” refrained from commenting.

    The Armenian military began to show substantive interest in the Su-30SM back in 2010 because of the need to update the air force fleet (they are based on Soviet aircraft, most of which need major repairs and modernization).

    Moreover, as “Kommersant” reported earlier, approximately in 2012, Moscow and Yerevan signed a contract, under the terms of which Armenia was to receive at least 12 fighters for several years. But the agreement did not enter into force due to the financial difficulties of the customer.
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    Post  AMCXXL on Fri Feb 01, 2019 6:29 am

    miketheterrible wrote:I'm pretty certain it's more than 60 they need to order for VKS


    "more than 60" is for the Ministry of Defence, VKS+Navy

    This number refers only to the minimum number of aircraft that must be replaced surely in existing units

    In the Navy 50 for complete squadrons replacing the Su-24M/MR in the three existing regiments currently
    In the Air Force about 15 for complete the Millerovo regiment and the "two seaters" for the 4 regiments with Su-35 nowadays

    This is 65 or "more than 60" that the press sais

    However in long term is very proably that Navy gets another regiment for Pacific Fleet and also all flanker regiments get Su-30SM for "two seaters" , so this menas other 36 in total


    I think we will see several smalll contracts for 30 or 36 each, or as much the first contract for 48 and later other smaller contracts


    The production will be in about 24-28 year, 14 for Russia and 10-14 for export

    Ths year Belarus will get the first 4 and Kazakhstan 12 in two years, probably 6 each
    Next year 2020 Armenia also has plan to get the 4 contracted today
    LMFS
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    Post  LMFS on Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:23 pm

    Is there a clear understanding of what the modernization entails, apart from "Russification" of the plane? Talk was new radar, engines etc. but I guess this is a later step. Will the planes still be called SM or SM2?
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:31 pm

    Apparently radar improved detection range and what not. So what is the perameter? What was the exact adjustments.
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    hoom

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    Post  hoom on Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:02 pm

    I think the 'increased detection' is probably reference to the IRST, my understanding they have been using Thales gear for that -> is likely to be one of the things replaced with a domestic equivalent/improvement.


    Regarding import substitution stuff: the need to make an upgrade to put in Russian bits makes me wonder if some of the recently completed planes might have been completed without some of the foreign gear ie not full capability if exports of those components have been blocked?

    Or would Russia have had a sufficient store of components to complete a bunch of planes, perhaps made some bigish orders when sanctions started being rolled out?

    If there have been incomplete planes sent out its the sort of thing you'd expect western intel to leak to the trash propaganda -> infinite articles about it -> their absence presumably means its not the case.

    Edit: also interesting news that India is planning to buy a further 18* Su-30MKI, I thought they'd done with their orders long ago?
    Perhaps attrition replacements? http://militarynews.ru/story.asp?rid=1&nid=500779


    Last edited by hoom on Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:56 am; edited 1 time in total
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:41 pm

    They we're never using French irst. It was Russian since day one.

    The only thales tech was the HUD for it.

    I also read that it specified radar extending range.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:03 am

    Austin recently posted an article about Russian civilian aircraft production and domestic components replacing foreign parts... and the article actually mentioned that KRET had managed to replace the avionics components from Thales, and that the parts actually improved performance and were cheaper, so I rather suspect there was a bit of this as well with the military systems too.
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    Post  hoom on Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:30 am

    More about India Su-30MKI order https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3518648.html
    Basically says its replacement for older planes going out of service which were supposed to be replaced by Rafale & Tejas which haven't emerged in sufficient numbers.
    Will bring them up to 18 squadrons.
    Also helpfully keeps factory busy while waiting on MS-21 production to ramp up.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:33 am

    hoom wrote:More about India Su-30MKI order https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3518648.html
    Basically says its replacement for older planes going out of service which were supposed to be replaced by Rafale & Tejas which haven't emerged in sufficient numbers.
    Will bring them up to 18 squadrons.
    Also helpfully keeps factory busy while waiting on MS-21 production to ramp up.

    Those will be assembled in the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited company.
    JohninMK
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    Post  JohninMK on Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:58 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:
    hoom wrote:More about India Su-30MKI order https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3518648.html
    Basically says its replacement for older planes going out of service which were supposed to be replaced by Rafale & Tejas which haven't emerged in sufficient numbers.
    Will bring them up to 18 squadrons.
    Also helpfully keeps factory busy while waiting on MS-21 production to ramp up.

    Those will be assembled in the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited company.
    How big an assembly gets built to be shipped to India? Does this keep the Su-30 sub assembly and subcontractor lines humming without tying up the main production line?
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:35 pm

    Barely. HAL and subcontractors in India make up close to 80% of the aircrafts build. So maybe 20% of parts come from Russia esides the needed raw materials to build the aircraft.
    George1
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    Post  George1 on Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:12 pm

    Russian defense industry to ‘breathe new life’ into Su-30SM fighter jet


    The heavily upgraded Su-30SM plane may open a new niche for Russia in India, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov said

    IRKUTSK, February 26. /TASS/. The Sukhoi Su-30SM fighter jet will be standardized with the generation 4++ Su-35 fighter by its onboard equipment and armament to cut its cost price and breathe a new life into the plane, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov told journalists on Tuesday.

    "After completing the work on the Su-30SM upgrade, changing the layout of the onboard radio-electronic equipment to make the Su-35 and the Su-30SM more standardized and thus cut the cost price, and standardizing the airborne weapon systems, this may breathe a new life into the plane," the vice-premier said.

    The heavily upgraded Su-30SM plane may open a new niche for Russia in India, he noted.

    "Considering that there are about 200 such planes in India [the Su-30MKI as the baseline version of the Su-30SM], an opportunity will probably open for modernizing this fleet to prolong its service life," the vice-premier explained.


    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/1046519
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:59 pm

    I would like to know exactly what. I mean, onboard computers, HUD, etc. But most important would be radar, engines and APU. Rest is mostly stuff used from France in the Indian variant. So why would they purchase such an upgrade? Unless they upgraded the bars radar (more importantly the APU so it can output greater than 7KW of power) to drastically improve accuracy, search and track, sensitivity, etc.
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:04 pm

    What I understand is they will give it Irbis E. Or a if they are smart enough give it Biyelka and standardize them with su-57...

    Btw he is talking about indian modernization but as far as I know they really want AESA for their sukhois. So again if they are smart they should ask indian to give the money for designing an AESA radar for su-30 and make a domestic variant like pantsir and emirats.
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    Post  GarryB on Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:50 am

    If India are so dead set on AESA radar for their aircraft why not enter into a joint venture with a Russian company and develop them together... they they can own the end result and mass produce it everywhere.

    Radar is a bit like night vision equipment like thermal imagers... traditionally there are platforms that have thermal sights like tanks, but when you make your own you can start expanding their use to ATGM teams and snipers and even soldiers rifles and MANPADS teams and heavy weapon operators to make their use at night or in smoke and dusty conditions more effective... the more you make the more all weather and day and night capable your forces become.

    It will be the same with radar... these days tank APS systems have radar and ground radar is used in small bases to detect threats etc and of course adding it to MANPADs and other things increases their ability to operate 24/7 and in bad weather or dust or smoke...

    And of course obviously on ships of all sizes and aircraft small radar antenna are useful too...

    The Soviets even had a small portable radar that could be mounted on a heavy machine gun or automatic grenade launcher for blind firing in a war zone... anyone who approaches from this direction is the enemy and will be fired upon at distances of 1-2km or more... effective even in a snow storm...
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:23 am

    Isos wrote:What I understand is they will give it Irbis E. Or a if they are smart enough give it Biyelka and standardize them with su-57...

    Btw he is talking about indian modernization but as far as I know they really want AESA for their sukhois. So again if they are smart they should ask indian to give the money for designing an AESA radar for su-30 and make a domestic variant like pantsir and emirats.

    Pretty sure N036 can fit currently to both Su-30 and 35 due to the dimesons matching. N036 is an AESA variant of Irbis which Irbis is a hybrid variant of Bars. Now modern Bars radar is more hybrid than early adoption with much better accuracy and longer track/scan ranges. I can't imagine there is much more they can add to it. If they make an AESA variant of Bars, I don't know exactly the gain will be. Chances are, it will end up having similar range as modified bars has. May be able to track more targets, may have additional features. But in today's conflicts, radar is becoming obselete as sensor systems picks up even LPI rather easily and triangulate positions. Hell, anti radiation systems are becoming very popular in order to combat radar systems. The expense of changing the radar vs benefit would be silly imo. N036 is good and all, but Irbis is about as good and cheaper
    medo
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    Post  medo on Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:53 am

    Modernized Su-30SM Will have the same 117S engines as Su-35, so they could use either Irbis or N036 radar. Anyway, Irbis would be more than good enough for Su-30SM. It is still powerfull radar with excellent capabilities and range.
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    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:30 pm

    medo wrote:Modernized Su-30SM Will have the same 117S engines as Su-35, so they could use either Irbis or N036 radar. Anyway, Irbis would be more than good enough for Su-30SM. It is still powerfull radar with excellent capabilities and range.

    It is still the most powerful radar for fighter jets so far. I doubt that an AESA would benefit anything for it.
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:12 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:
    medo wrote:Modernized Su-30SM Will have the same 117S engines as Su-35, so they could use either Irbis or N036 radar. Anyway, Irbis would be more than good enough for Su-30SM. It is still powerfull radar with excellent capabilities and range.

    It is still the most powerful radar for fighter jets so far.  I doubt that an AESA would benefit anything for it.

    Tomorrow Indians will provide answer to that as it's going very hot above the border.
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    Post  Hole on Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:32 pm

    They still using MiG-21´s in that area! Shocked
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    Post  Isos on Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:59 pm

    Hole wrote:They still using MiG-21´s in that area! Shocked

    Wrong thred !! But yeah they are or should i say they were because since the lesson from this morning they won't anymore.
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    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:17 pm

    MiG-21 bis is actually a good jet still with capabilities to compete. If what is said true (MiG-21 taking down the Pak F-16) then the loss of the MiG-21 may have more to do with lack of support from other jets.
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    Post  Isos on Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:35 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:MiG-21 bis is actually a good jet still with capabilities to compete. If what is said true (MiG-21 taking down the Pak F-16) then the loss of the MiG-21 may have more to do with lack of support from other jets.

    There is still no evidence about the f-16.
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    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:42 pm

    It crashed in Pakistan territory. In other words, Pakistan won't release any evidence. There is no reason not to believe India side since Pakistan has a troubled history with lying

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