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    Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

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    GunshipDemocracy
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Tue Feb 02, 2016 5:57 pm

    Shoigu: resuming production of the Tu-160 is a priority

    http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160202/1368663568.html
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  sepheronx on Tue Feb 02, 2016 6:34 pm

    franco wrote:
    George1 wrote:5th modernized Tu-160M. thumbsup

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1707137.html

    Read the other day that there are only 30 some Tu-95MS's still active. Had read at one point last year there were 43 left in action. That would explain the reports of only 80 bombers to be modernized by the end of 2020 (~ 15 Tu-160, 35 Tu-95MS and 30 Tu-22M3). Not a lot of info out there on this subject.

    They should update all Tu-22M's to newest. These bombers would be ideal. Work with Tu-160 and phase out the Bear altogether.
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  Big_Gazza on Wed Feb 03, 2016 5:23 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    franco wrote:
    George1 wrote:5th modernized Tu-160M. thumbsup

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1707137.html

    Read the other day that there are only 30 some Tu-95MS's still active. Had read at one point last year there were 43 left in action. That would explain the reports of only 80 bombers to be modernized by the end of 2020 (~ 15 Tu-160, 35 Tu-95MS and 30 Tu-22M3). Not a lot of info out there on this subject.

    They should update all Tu-22M's to newest.  These bombers would be ideal.  Work with Tu-160 and phase out the Bear altogether.

    I disagree strongly. The Tu-95 main drawcard is its stupendous operating range (~15,000km unrefuelled) making it an unrivalled platform for maritime patrol, and has an unparalleled loiter time when used as a strike bomber with long range ALCMs. The Tu-160 has about 12,000-ish km range and is simply too valuable to waste its engine hours on maritime patrol. The Tu-22M is under 7,000 km so its useful as a medium range tactical bomber or a fast-reaction maritime strike bomber but is next to useless for patrolling the open seas.

    The PAK-DA of course will likely be an entirely different story....
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  GarryB on Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:08 pm

    I have to agree with Big Gazza here... many look at the bear and its propellers and think WWII bomber... in fact those engines are turboprops... jet engines that turn propellers at their fronts to propel the aircraft.

    At moderate subsonic speeds and in a wide range of altitudes it is vastly more efficient than a turbojet or turbofan engine, and being a jet engine is much simpler and cheaper to maintain than a piston or radial engine.

    It has another enormous advantage over the Tu-22M3M in that it has inflight refuelling, so it can take off with reduced fuel to allow a heavier payload and then in flight on the way to the target area it can be topped up.

    It is the cheaper potential bomb truck with greater range than the Backfire or the Blackjack.

    Hopefully the PAK DA will be even cheaper to operate though likely more expensive to buy... and they were made in the 1980s and 1990s so they are still very young airframes.

    Perhaps the new NK-32 based turbofans for the new PAK DA could be used on upgraded Tu-95s to further improve performance... two engines instead of four could further improve range and fuel economy, with a reduction in weight and having only two engines instead of four.

    Would be an indirect poke in the eye to the US who has been trying to reduce the number of engines on the B-52s from 8 down to 4 for decades...


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    Post  d_taddei2 on Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:40 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    franco wrote:
    George1 wrote:5th modernized Tu-160M. thumbsup

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1707137.html

    Read the other day that there are only 30 some Tu-95MS's still active. Had read at one point last year there were 43 left in action. That would explain the reports of only 80 bombers to be modernized by the end of 2020 (~ 15 Tu-160, 35 Tu-95MS and 30 Tu-22M3). Not a lot of info out there on this subject.

    They should update all Tu-22M's to newest.  These bombers would be ideal.  Work with Tu-160 and phase out the Bear altogether.

    I disagree strongly.  The Tu-95 main drawcard is its stupendous operating range (~15,000km unrefuelled)  making it an unrivalled platform for maritime patrol, and has an unparalleled loiter time when used as a strike bomber with long range ALCMs. The Tu-160 has about 12,000-ish km range and is simply too valuable to waste its engine hours on maritime patrol.  The Tu-22M is under 7,000 km so its useful as a medium range tactical bomber or a fast-reaction maritime strike bomber but is next to useless for patrolling the open seas.

    The PAK-DA of course will likely be an entirely different story....


    i also back up with what you have said, the Tu-95 has more uses than the Tu-22M's due to range, if anything aircraft was to be removed then i would go for the Tu-22M, if the Tu-22M could be upgraded to provide better range or given in flight refuelling probes. Dontget me wrong the Tu-22M still has its uses, just not as many as the Tu-95. But like all aircraft they will eventually be replaced (sad day when it does).
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  George1 on Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:47 pm

    Tu-95's range is 15.000km but with how many missiles carried?


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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  George1 on Tue Feb 09, 2016 7:46 am

    Excellent!!

    Deputy head of the Ministry of Defense: The resumption of the production of Tu-160 goes according to plan


    Production of engines for "White Swan" resumes


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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  wilhelm on Tue Feb 09, 2016 8:51 am

    So from reading that, the first new improved engine, which will be used for qualification, has been built and is entering testing, and 4 others which will be production variants are in the process of manufacture?
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  sepheronx on Tue Feb 09, 2016 9:03 am

    George, dont forget to update the website when you got a chance! 

    You guys are awesome.  Whilhelm, you got any technical data on the new engines?

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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  wilhelm on Tue Feb 09, 2016 2:42 pm

    sepheronx wrote:George, dont forget to update the website when you got a chance! 

    You guys are awesome.  Whilhelm, you got any technical data on the new engines?

    I don't unfortunately.
    When they say improved or upgraded, to my mind that could only mean one or more of 3 things:
    1. More thrust
    2. Better fuel consumption
    3. Longer life/less maintenance

    Or a combination of 1, 2, or all 3.

    I don't for example see things such as improved throttle response etc as being particularly useful on a platform such as a strategic bomber.

    I wonder if it has new engine controls/updated FADEC...
    I would be very interested in what has been aimed for....I guess we'll have to wait.
    Good news.
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  GarryB on Wed Feb 10, 2016 1:48 am

    The Tu-95MS16 was the best upgrade, but used the old smaller Kh-55SM cruise missile with a nuclear warhead and a 3,000km range. The conventionally armed Kh-555 has a shorter range.

    Both these missiles are in the 1.2-1.5 ton range and are much smaller than the newer Kh-101 and Kh-102, which have the choice of nuke or conventional warheads and 5,000km flight range.

    The difference is that the Tu-95MS16 can carry 6 of the smaller missiles (Kh-55/-555) in an internal rotary launcher, but it can carry a further 10 missiles under its wings on pylons (two pylons under each wing holding three and two cruise missiles each respectively.

    That means the Bear can carry 6 Kh-55 or Kh-555 missiles internally and 10 of the same or the newer Kh-101/-102 missiles under its wings for a total of 16 cruise missiles.

    In comparison the Backfire is not known to carry cruise missiles though some reports claim 8 can be carried externally on four hard points... but I have never seen this.

    I have seen 6 Kh-15 short range attack missiles internally and up to three large Kh-22m missiles externally.
    The Blackjack can carry 12 cruise missiles including the Kh-101/102 in its internal weapon bays (which are huge.)


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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  Morpheus Eberhardt on Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:49 am

    I think an engine that was developed for Tu-160 that was drop-in-compatible with the NK-321 was NK-74. It probably was a more efficient, variable-geometry engine.
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  max steel on Wed Feb 10, 2016 6:00 am

    Production of Tu-160 bombers to resume by 2023

    The plan to resume production of Tu-160 bombers is alive and well. Reporting on a visit of the deputy defense minister to the Kuznetsov plant in Samara, the ministry of defense press service said that preparations are underway, although not everything is going smoothly. The plan is to begin production of new aircraft no later than 2023. The new bomber, while still Tu-160, is expected to be almost a new plane, which is not surprising given that the design is more than 30 years old. There was no word on the number of planes that will be produced this time.

    Meanwhile, Russia continues to upgrade its current Tu-160 fleet. In December 2015, the Gorbunov Aviation Plant in Kazan completed an overhaul of the Vasily Senko bomber. According to the CAST blog, it's the fifth Tu-160 aircraft that underwent deep modernization:

    2006: Valentin Bluznyuk, 19 red, RF-94113, serial number 2-02
    2011: Valery Chkalov, 17 red, RF-94110, 5-04
    2014: Andrey Tupolev, 18 red, RF-94111, 6-05
    2015: Vasily Reshetnikov, 02 red, RF-94102, 7-02
    2015: Vasily Senko, 11 red, RF-94114, 6-02

    This appears to be the process of deep modernization that is supposed to be completed by 2019. Or maybe not - it appears that some bombers go through a different kind of overhaul. For example, neither Aleksei Plokhov, which returned to service in 2009, nor Ivan Yarygin, returned in 2010, is not on the CAST list.

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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  wilhelm on Wed Feb 10, 2016 10:05 am

    Morpheus Eberhardt wrote:I think an engine that was developed for Tu-160 that was drop-in-compatible with the NK-321 was NK-74. It probably was a more efficient, variable-geometry engine.

    The NK-74 sounds interesting...do you have any further info on it? When was it developed or designed?
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  Morpheus Eberhardt on Thu Feb 11, 2016 12:49 am

    wilhelm wrote:
    Morpheus Eberhardt wrote:I think an engine that was developed for Tu-160 that was drop-in-compatible with the NK-321 was NK-74. It probably was a more efficient, variable-geometry engine.

    The NK-74 sounds interesting...do you have any further info on it? When was it developed or designed?

    Yefim Gordon mentions it in his "2003" book on Tu-160, but, of course, NK-74 was developed a long time before.
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  George1 on Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:19 am

    VKS got a modernized Tu-95MS strategic bomber

    https://t.co/aRz7xRxLnt


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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  Militarov on Mon Feb 22, 2016 7:35 am

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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  George1 on Sun Feb 28, 2016 1:52 pm

    "Sokol" Plant to produce first part for new Tu-160 (M2?) in 2016


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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  George1 on Wed Mar 02, 2016 5:08 am

    Russia's upgraded Tu-160M2 strategic bomber may make maiden flight in 2019 — commander

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/defense/860146


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    The flights of the upgraded Tu-160 is scheduled to begin by 2019

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Wed Mar 02, 2016 6:47 am

    The flights of the upgraded Tu-160 is scheduled to begin by 2019

    MOSCOW, 2 Mar — RIA Novosti. The flights of the upgraded strategic bomber Tu-160 is scheduled to start by 2019, said on Wednesday the commander of the aerospace defence forces of Russia Colonel-General Victor Bondaryev.
    "The resumption of production of strategic bombers Tu-160 is by the decree of the President of Russia. And I think that by 2019 this modernized aircraft will start flying," said Bondarev at a meeting on the development of Russian military aviation.
    The decision to resume production of the Tu-160 was received by the President of the Russian Federation Vladimir Putin on the proposal of the Ministry of defense in may 2015. Deputy defense Minister Yuri Borisov said in February 2016 that works to restore the production of this aircraft attracted a huge cooperation


    http://ria.ru/defense_safety/20160302/1382992789.html
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  George1 on Tue Mar 15, 2016 10:46 am

    First 3 newest Tu-160M2s will be assembled from old USSR-era airframes that were at storage (Kazan)

    https://twitter.com/KURYERSAT/status/709731302325493760


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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  Viktor on Wed Mar 16, 2016 11:45 am

    Countdown has begun ... Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  Viktor on Sun Apr 03, 2016 5:52 am

    Tu-160M2 will be Meteorit-A capable Very Happy

    http://imgur.com/XMJyGeg
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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Apr 04, 2016 3:48 pm


    Long article here(Russian):

    http://www.sdelanounas.ru/blogs/76086/

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    Re: Tu-160 and Tu-95MS ( Blackjack and Bears )

    Post  Big_Gazza on Tue Apr 05, 2016 3:41 am

    Viktor wrote:Tu-160M2 will be Meteorit-A capable  Very Happy

    http://imgur.com/XMJyGeg

    Not possible... Kh-90/Meteorit-A was a Soviet era project that was abandoned before the USSR dissolved. I think the graphic should say Zircon.

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