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    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Aug 22, 2011 3:26 pm

    For most helos I would agree, but for a naval attack helo being able to fire a Kh-31AD with an anti ship range of 150km or so, followed almost immediately by a Kh-31PD anti radiation missile if the ship spots the helo means even with the highest speed naval SAM the helo will have time to drop below the radar horizon and try to get some distance between itself and its launch position... leading to a decent chance of a hit and a reasonable chance of escape.

    For most targets such weapons are overkill, but for some the Kh-31AD is like a mini Brahmos.

    Certainly a Ka-29 troop carrying helo could probably do with a smaller and lighter ARM like the Kh-25 type ARMs and their range of 40km would still be rather useful... but I suspect a normal load would remain 8 Shturm/Ataka and two 20 shot 80mm rocket pods and the built in 4 barrel 30 cal gatling gun or the 30mm cannon.
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    Post  medo on Mon Aug 22, 2011 4:12 pm

    Cyberspec wrote:
    GarryB wrote:but there is a solid rocket booster that can be fitted to the Kh-31 to allow "slow" launches...

    Interesting....and thanks for the pics.

    Personally, I still think the Kh-31 would be overkill for a helicopter.

    Yes and no. Russian navy doesn't have large number of aircraft carriers, so naval infantry could have only support of helicopters on Mistral class ship. For example, Kuznetsov is in Northern fleet, Mistral will be in Pacific fleet. Ka-52 armed with Kh-31 will do anti-ship role and as well SEAD role to suppress enemy air defense before naval infantry reach the beach, that transport helicopters could transport troops and supply there. With Zhuk AESA radar, Ka-52 could be able to use R-73 and R-77 AA missiles, to do some air protection together with SAMs on ships.
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Aug 22, 2011 7:13 pm

    The air-launched version of the Kh-35 might be feasible though and the early Ka-52 demonstrator was shown with R-73 A-A missiles.

    Should also mention that the Kh-35 designed to be launched from helos also has a solid rocket booster... it is the same solid rocket booster with fins that is used for the ship launched version of the missile.

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    Cyberspec
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    Post  Cyberspec on Tue Aug 23, 2011 2:30 am

    The Kh-35 is more than sufficient for most roles. I don't think the Ka-52 is meant for attacking cruisers or destroyers.
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    Post  GarryB on Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:17 am

    The Kh-35 is more than sufficient for most roles. I don't think the Ka-52 is meant for attacking cruisers or destroyers.

    Never hurts to have a choice... if detected early enough even a stinger can be used against low flying subsonic missiles like the Kh-35. MANPADS would have serious trouble with a Mach 3 Kh-31 no matter how much warning is given as a relatively small missile viewed end on covering almost a kilometre a second is a difficult target.

    In weigh terms they are very similar in the 650kg range.
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    Post  Cyberspec on Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:22 am

    Ka-52 test aboard Navy destroyer
    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force - Page 3 Th_863255249_053094_122_63lo


    Arrow More pics here: http://bmpd.livejournal.com/65413.html
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    Post  GarryB on Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:42 am

    Nice.

    BTW the picture above of the Kh-31 I posted which shows an external rocket booster has also been shown under a weapon pylon on a Su-35 at MAKS, which makes me wonder if it really is just a solid rocket booster for slow or stationary launch platforms, or if this is the new versions of the Kh-31 with double the range performance (ie Kh-31PD and Kh-31AD).
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    Post  Cyberspec on Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:27 pm

    "Helicopters of Russia" and the Defense Ministry signed a contract to supply 140 helicopters Ka-52 for 20 billion rubles
    http://www.interfax-russia.ru/FarEast/news.asp?id=256474&sec=1671
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    Post  Viktor on Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:26 pm

    Cyberspec wrote:"Helicopters of Russia" and the Defense Ministry signed a contract to supply 140 helicopters Ka-52 for 20 billion rubles
    http://www.interfax-russia.ru/FarEast/news.asp?id=256474&sec=1671

    Wait a sec .... WoW 140 Ka-52 Hellos are ordered???? or just typo from newsman?
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    Post  Cyberspec on Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:47 pm

    Ria Novosti says "over a hundred" but keep in mind it's for the period up to 2020 and I'm guessing about 1/3 of them will be for the Navy
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    Post  Viktor on Sat Sep 03, 2011 7:06 pm

    Cyberspec wrote:Ria Novosti says "over a hundred" but keep in mind it's for the period up to 2020 and I'm guessing about 1/3 of them will be for the Navy

    Well number is 140 pieces of Ka-52 in contract worth 4 bin.

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/66721.html

    Great, future of Ka-52 is sealed. No we wait for Hermes. Very Happy
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    Post  GarryB on Sun Sep 04, 2011 4:25 am

    I think they will have about 16 Ka-52s per Mistral, which means 64 aircraft just to fully equip the four ships they intent to buy. You would want at least the same number spare for training and of course to allow for down time for overhauls and updates.

    Being naval models they will likely need extra maintainence too in the form of washing off the salt.

    That leaves another ten or so perhaps for the ground forces to increase force numbers.

    Very good news.
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:47 am

    Have read that the contract for 140 helos includes other Kamov aircraft including the Ka-60 and the Ka-225, so the Ka-52 is not so big as we assumed.

    Of course it is good they are buying the other helos too and a variety of helos are needed.

    I particularly like the Ka-225 with its modular pod... it should be thunderbird 8 or something... Smile
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    Post  Cyberspec on Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:18 am

    It's 140 Ka-52 for the Airforce according to this report.

    http://www.vesti.ru/doc.html?id=558973





    So it looks like the naval Ka-52K for the Mistrals will be a separate contract
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:43 am

    Well that is good news, they were only originally going to use 30-32 Ka-52s but it is pretty clear they have found the funds to buy more.

    Wonder if this is at the cost of Mi-28Ns or in addition to.

    I remember the talk of 30-32 Ka-52s was for special forces use, but the focus since seems to have been to make the Ka-52 a scout/recon helo... which previously the Russians have been using the light Mi-2 helo in that role.

    The Mi-2 now out of favour because it is very old and not produced in Russia, but the Ka-52 is quite a different aircraft from the Mi-2.

    There are new UAVs developed that can be carried in large pods carried under wing pylons that will make the two seat Ka-52 a very useful scout helo... with the ability to send UAVs into harms way to find targets and threats without exposing the helo to any direct danger.
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:02 am

    Hope it is not because of problems with the Mi-28N...

    They appear to be working hard on upgrading the design to a Mi-28M, but that wont be ready for a while yet.

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    Post  Cyberspec on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:33 am

    I don't think so....the Mi-28 will still be the more numerous one. They've also ordered a 20 or so Mi-35M2's probably because they can get them fairly quickly
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:47 am

    The Mi-35M2 has the added advantage of using Mi-28N bits so there will be some commonality.
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    Post  medo on Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:02 pm

    I assume those 140 Ka-52 will be additional to 30 Ka-52 ordered earlier.
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    Post  Cyberspec on Mon Sep 05, 2011 11:47 pm

    I think 140 all together. Looks like they've decided to go with 1 bigger order instead of ordering them in smaller batches. Which IMO is better for both the manufacturer and the Min. of Defence
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    Post  KamovHelicopter on Sat Oct 15, 2011 1:23 am

    So what is the total number of Ka-52???

    140??

    I have information of 20 units and 30 in production. 140 sounds to much.

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    Post  Cyberspec on Sun Oct 16, 2011 6:32 am

    140 all up (in the longer term). It's unclear whether that includes already produced/ordered examples or not.

    Also, the Ka-52 simulator produced by "Dinamika" has passed state tests and will enter service

    Arrow http://vpk.name/news/59273_gosispyitaniya_trenazhera_ka52_zavershilis_v_cntu_dinamika.html

    ...

    BTW, the Mi-35M order has been increased from 22 to 30 helicopters
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    Post  GarryB on Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:33 am

    Must say I am really pleased they are buying the Hokums as well as the Havocs.

    They are different enough to be worth buying both... the Hokums will be particularly good in mountains and at altitude, while the Havocs will be cheaper to maintain and operate and offer excellent punch for the cost.
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    Post  KamovHelicopter on Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:51 pm

    History of the Kamov Ka-50 (named Black-shark or Werewolf) combat helicopter is almost 20 years old. Its development was initiated after the preliminary project was prepared by the Kamov designing office, in December 1977. The new combat aircraft was intended to become a counterweight to the USA attack machine “AH-64 Apache“ which was included in the US Army arsenal in 1976. Mr. Sergei Mikheyev, chief designer of the Kamovs designing office, took that office of the beginning of the 70s, after the Nikolai I. Kamov died, with whom he used to have a close co-operation since as early as the 60s. Typical for the predecessors of this helicopter were primarly two symmetrical coaxial rotors. In addition to the older Ka-10s, Ka-15s, and Ka-18s, as well as to Kamov Ka-26s, it was the Ka-27, Ka-29 and Ka-32 types which have been widely used especialy by marine air force. Based on the experience acquired from their operation, a project of a new helicopter designed for ground forces was originated.

    Various prototypes and pre-series versions of the Kamov Ka-50 Werewolf combat helicopter have already been existing for last years. The Kamov Ka-50 Werewolf was gradually modernised. At the beginning of 2011, its advance type identified as the Black Shark underwent challenging tests. It was demonstrated for the first time, both on a static platform and with live fire in progress, on the Maquatra desert polygon, at the world armament exhibition IDEX ’97 in Abu Dhabi, in March 1997.

    source:
    Kamov Ka-50


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    Post  KamovHelicopter on Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:53 pm

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