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    Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

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    medo
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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  medo on Tue Jan 24, 2012 4:43 pm

    You are correct, it have DIRCM balls and Arbalet radar inside nose. If I'm correct, they also have new data link system.

    TR1
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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  TR1 on Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:27 pm

    Array is much bigger than Longbow on Apache too...they are also planning AESA on it in the future...the Kamov fanboi in me is pleased indeed.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  GarryB on Wed Jan 25, 2012 12:05 am

    The AESA will likely be fitted to the naval Ka-52s for the Mistral as it will be used for air to air and air to surface looking for naval targets.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  medo on Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:37 am



    First new serial Ka-52 with Arbalet radar, MAWS and DIRCM balls entered in Russian military. I hope previous examples will also be equipped with Arbalet radars and MAWS / DIRCM systems.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  Austin on Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:22 am

    Russian Helicopters a conglomerate of all Russian chopper business has released this chart of future platforms development.

    Note worthy are 2015-2020 development period , 3 new chopper are under development Mi-383 to replace Mi-8/17 , New Universal Strike Chopper to replace the Ka-52/Mi-28 and Ka-65 to replace the Ka-28/29/31 Naval ASW.



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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  medo on Wed Mar 07, 2012 6:52 pm

    http://www.tvzvezda.ru/news/forces/content/201203071002-zvpt.htm

    New video from Torzhok, where are new Ka-52 helicopters with yellow 96, 97 and 98 bort numbers and equipped with DIRCM balls. They really look great in new gray color scheme.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  GarryB on Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:22 pm

    Interesting to see they have three weapon pylons under each wing.

    Perhaps they have more engine power?

    Likely the new pylon will add 4 or 8 Iglas for self defence from enemy aircraft...

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  TR1 on Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:03 am

    Engines are same on recent 2 and 3 pylon birds. Not sure if VK-2500 is worked out yet or not. 3 pylon is standard now though, they have been spotted in the factory like that for a while now.

    The Ka-52 fanboy in me is pleased.
    Best flight performance AND weapons payload of any attack helo out there.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  GarryB on Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:45 am

    Would like to see them equipped with full helmet mounted sights (I mean proper sights, not NVGs).

    Night optics imagery and of course flight information directly in their field of view would be awesome IMHO.

    I am really looking forward to seeing Mi-28NM to be honest too.

    I think I remember reading somewhere that Klimov will start making the VK-2500 in 2013 or 2014 for new helos like the Ka-52 and Mi-28NM...

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  TR1 on Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:59 am

    Yes, indeed, I recall that about VK-2500. Not too soon too, the extra weight needs to be offset.

    The Mi-28 seems to be behind at this point, at least on paper, so I hope they hurry with NM. After surging ahead on Production, the current serials still don't have the Launch Warning sensors mounted, even though they are identical to Ka-52/already seen on a Mi-28NE. Must be integration issues. Kamov already has radar mounted, and its placement is much less troublesome than the Mi-28s.
    No sight of President-S on Mi-28 either.

    ofc the Mil guys claim their stuff is working and doing its thing while the Kamov "show birds" spend all their time on the ground.

    http://www.vz.ru/photoreport/566703/

    Brand new pics of all 3 new girls in the sexy new scheme.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  GarryB on Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:11 am

    They need Hermes and air launched Krisantema in service... both of which will expand their performance significantly.

    That new attack helo UVK is interesting...

    It is described as a strike aircraft and with a tail pusher propeller might be the replacement for the Su-25 perhaps?

    But even if it has double the speed... 500-600km/h it will still not have the endurance and payload capacity of a jet...

    The problem with stealth on a helo is it seriously restricts payload options... internal carriage was not efficient except on large aircraft... that is why most modern pre 5th gen fighters carry their weapons externally.

    I have read that they are planning to put President-S and all the associated bits and bobs and fully working bits in the Mi-28NM.

    The Mi-35M is selling pretty well and is even being accepted by the Russian Army and is pretty much an Mi-28N without the radar.

    The Mi-28N without radar is pretty similar to AH-64A which was a capable attack helo, though the Havok has shorter ranged missiles with less armour penetration.

    With Krisantema fitted the current Mi-28N is not a bad helo, and is rather better than the in service Hind.

    The aircraft wont be complete till it has a full ESM suite and radar fitted.

    Having said that the Havok has both cm and mm wave radar for air and ground search respectively, and in terms of range performance exceeds other systems by significant margins.

    cm wave radar is a common air to air radar band so it should be able to detect aerial targets at 20km or more... 360 degrees around the aircraft. The mmw radar is supposed to be able to detect tank sized targets out to 15-16km which is almost double the range for the D model Apache.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  TR1 on Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:32 am

    http://russianplanes.net/ID69102

    fap fap

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  medo on Thu Mar 08, 2012 5:32 pm



    In this picture Ka-52 is equipped with Vikhr ATGMs. Are Vikhrs standard ATGMs for Ka-52 until Hermes or Krizanthema ATGM are available for them or they will use Ataka missiles, which are inferior to Vikhr?

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  TR1 on Thu Mar 08, 2012 8:17 pm

    Don't think Vihr is actually going to be used at all. So far I have only seen serial Ka-52s during training with that weird looking "vertical" 6 round Attacka launcher.

    Shkval/Vihr RIP.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  medo on Thu Mar 08, 2012 8:32 pm

    EO ball in Ka-52 is big and it also house laser guiding channel, so I think it could better work with laser guided Vikhr than with radio guided Ataka. I doubt Vikhr is bound only to Shkval and could be guided with other laser guiding complexes too.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  GarryB on Thu Mar 08, 2012 10:22 pm

    Vikhr is made by KBP and was probably only made in fairly small numbers for testing.

    With Hermes on the way (which is basically a Pantsir-S1 missile with a different warhead/and with terminal guidance options) I don't think they will tool up for mass production of Vikhr for the short interval till Hermes is ready.

    Hermes is a rather different missile with two stage design.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  medo on Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:41 pm

    Maybe they will not produce more Vikhr missiles, but Ka-52 could still use stocks of missiles build for Ka-50 ans Su-25TM.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  TheArmenian on Fri Mar 09, 2012 9:06 pm

    TR1 wrote:
    ofc the Mil guys claim their stuff is working and doing its thing while the Kamov "show birds" spend all their time on the ground.

    I tought the opposite was claimed. Kamovs flying all the time while Mi-28s are needing servicing.
    ????? dunno

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  TR1 on Fri Mar 09, 2012 9:42 pm

    TheArmenian wrote:
    TR1 wrote:
    ofc the Mil guys claim their stuff is working and doing its thing while the Kamov "show birds" spend all their time on the ground.

    I tought the opposite was claimed. Kamovs flying all the time while Mi-28s are needing servicing.
    ????? dunno

    Read that as well. Some claims that one of the new batches of Ka-52s has barely flown at all. Where truth is remains to be seen, both helos are working up operational tempo anyways.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  GarryB on Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:33 am

    The Su-25T didn't enter service in any numbers and I think they built about a dozen or two Ka-50s at a very low rate so I doubt stocks are significant.

    Ka-50 and Su-25T use Shkval to guide the Vikhr and the Ka-52 doesn't have Shkval.

    The Krisantema uses laser beam riding guidance in addition to MMW radar command guidance, so when both the Ka-52 and Mi-28NM are fitted for the K they should also be able to use any stocks of Vikhr that might be left but I suspect they were pretty small and probably have been used up already in tests and exercises.


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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  medo on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:04 am

    Anyone know, how much Ka-52 are now in service? I know for helicopters with bort numbers 51, 52, 53, 92, 93, 94, 95, 96, 97, 98 and 99. There would be also a squadron (12) Ka-52 in Far East, what could be 23 helicopters, so to the end of the year there could be more than 30 Ka-52.

    Now serial army Ka-52 is fully equipped, so it will be very interesting to see, what missiles it will use beside standard ATGMs (ATAKA, Vikhr and in future Hermes) and AA Igla or R-73. Ka-52 now have full ESM suite, so maybe army Ka-52 will also use Kh-31 anti radar missiles as will naval Ka-52 and it will be interesting to see which AA missiles will Arbalet radar enable to use.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  GarryB on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:45 am

    I would suspect in terms of anti radiation missiles that the Ka-52 will more likely use the 300kg Kh-25 series labelled AS-12 by NATO, its range of 40km would be more in tune with threats to a Ka-52 than the 110km range 600kg Kh-31 or the new model 250km range 700kg versions.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  medo on Sun Mar 11, 2012 12:03 pm

    True, it is more reasonable to use Kh-25 anti radar missiles for Ka-52 than Kh-31, but question is still in the right place, considering that naval Ka-52 will be integrated with Ka-31 missiles. So with the same equipment army Ka-52 could use Kh-31 too. Of course not all the time, but when they face treats like SAMP/T, NASAMS or Patriot without proper air force cower, that those Ka-52 capabilities could be very wellcome.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  TR1 on Sun Mar 11, 2012 10:38 pm

    Never seen Ka-52 with Kh-31, but early prototype was seen with Ka-25.
    http://media.photobucket.com/image/recent/Haradrim1/ka-52-1.jpg

    Not sure if it was actually trialed with them though.

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    Re: Ka-52 in Russian Air Force

    Post  GarryB on Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:02 am

    I would expect the Kh-31 would be an option, but the MMW radar sensor on the Army Hokum will not likely detect threats at more than 20-30km or so, and because it would operate low down most of the radar threats to the aircraft would be dealt with using 40km range ARMs like the Kh-25s.

    The Kh-31 could probably be carried, but its utility to a low flying aircraft would probably be quite limited.

    Regarding TR1s photo above that is the SALH Kh-25 which is known in the west as the AS-10 Karen and would be useful against targets like small bridges or bunkers where there is another platform marking the target with a laser or for the launch aircraft to mark with a laser.

    In each case the 90kg warhead of the 300-320kg missiles would be quite efficient and effective.

    For harder targets however they would have options like the Kh-29 with a 320kg HE warhead out to 40km in some models, and also the Kh-31 might be useful as well, but its warhead is about 90kgs too so effect on target is similar to the smaller Kh-25 though the range of the latter is shorter.

    For the naval Kamov of course carrying an AESA radar it will be flying at higher altitudes and higher speeds for which a Kh-31 would be of greater use.

    A mix of anti radiation and anti ship models would actually be ideal as the anti ship missile could be fired first followed by an anti radiation missile for when the targets start scanning to see where that first missile came from.

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