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    Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

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    kvs
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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  kvs on Thu Sep 01, 2016 3:53 am

    Instead of further trials, the problems will now be sorted out by an inter-agency commission, a sure sign that the problems are serious and are not expected to be fixed any time soon. The problems stem from issues at the design bureau, which is reportedly not up to the task of designing a missile with the requirements provided by the Defense Ministry. The Fakel machine design bureau, which is developing the missiles is supposedly in relatively poor condition, using technologies and equipment left over from the Soviet period.

    Smell the dead rat in this analysis. If I recall in the case of the Bulava it was manufacturing defects that were the real problem and not
    performance of the design bureau. Yet here we are supposed to believe what amounts to proof by assertion. The only "sure sign" here
    is that we have blogger crap speculation being passed off as facts.

    Fakel is part of Almaz-Antey as of 2002. The above blogger crap is claiming that Alamaz-Antey is still using pre-1991 equipment. This
    is pure and fetid lying.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ugk3Cu5h4kA

    Oh my, so little automation. Almaz-Antey surely must be crap.

    http://soft.bashny.net/t/en/159248

    Is that new NC machinery I see....

    airstrike
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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  airstrike on Thu Sep 01, 2016 12:30 pm

    Russia to modernize its carrier-based Su-33 jets

    http://echelon-defense.com/2016/09/01/russia-to-modernize-its-carrier-based-su-33-jets/

    GarryB
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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  GarryB on Thu Sep 01, 2016 12:51 pm

    With Klub K you can put how easily 50 missiles on one cargo ship.

    Yes, you can, but the first time you use such a surprise technique then any and all potential enemy forces have a clear reason to sink any Russian or neutrally flagged shipping in their vicinity... that would be expensive.

    Experience in the falklands war showed civilian ships used as warship auxiliaries (ie cruise ships turned into troop ships, and transports in conflict areas) are at extreme risk because there is no design for battle damage and no self defence systems.

    It makes them a liability in a war zone.

    They are not meant to be use like tomahawks but they can be. I've red in the description of new exocet that they can be fired against coastal target with the gps (2nd possible role even if its primary role is antiship).

    Not likely to be used against ships in port however... more likely to be used against port infrastructure or coastal and slightly inland targets.

    Any ship can go 30 km from a military port if it's in the international waters. You can check on Google earth and see that in any big miitary port (in any country) there ar many ships. With electronic warfare instrument you can know what type of radars are there. If there just civillian radars you can attack.

    Yes, they can of course go to a position at that distance, but what happens if the enemy has radars turned on scanning for threats?

    Russian OTH radars operate all the time covering 6,000km ranges, and there will be plenty of other radars of all sorts of types looking for targets or just civilian air traffic or shipping.

    Any attempt to jam radar will raise suspicion and attract attention.

    A one off surprise attack might succeed but you can't base a missile design off such a strategy as a standard weapon. Cruise missiles in shipping crates allow a surprise attack via a large ship at sea or the potential to have an enormous attack potential at a train yard pretty much anywhere in your country... but when you sit them on the backs of your corvettes they are no longer "surprise" weapons.
    A Russian Corvette with blue shipping crates on the rear deck will be clearly perceived as the threat it is... whether it is 30km from a port or 1,000km from a port.

    Like it happened to Israel with the chinese missile. No radars ready, the attack succed.

    And do you think the Israelis will let that happen again?

    Do you think the other navies of the world will ignore what happened then and do nothing?

    The US attack was on Lybia not lybian port. So ...

    They struggled to manage 200 missiles for the air defence structure of Libya... do you think they will spare even a single missile for each rust bucket in port?

    IF there are 10 ships (5 billion$) in the port, 50 kh-35 (around 35 million$) are worth it. Can be less if you want.

    If they are worth half a billion US dollars each they probably have air defence systems that can defend themselves. Western navies are not that good at surprise attacks.

    Most of the countries the west attacks don't have a worthy enough fleet to even bother with.

    If argentinian navy had gps guided missile and did what I said before taking the falklands they would have them now.

    First of all GPS is a US system and they can turn it off in any location any time they want.

    During the Georgian invasion of South Ossetia the GPS system in the area was turned off so GPS systems would be of no use... and the chances of the Argentine navy sailing up to the UK and sinking the British fleet in port would be rather unlikely.

    No it didn't happened because their is no more conventional war these days and these missiles are new. But you can be sure Israel would use a strategy like that if it has to face a bigger navy. A succesfull attack like this can end a war before it start if the opponents are separated by sea however.

    I think you are misunderstanding the use of such weapons.

    An Exocet is an anti ship missile. Adding GPS guidance allows it to hit fixed land targets, but it is not likely to be used to allow the missile to hit ships in port.

    If you are going to use a missile to hit a ship in port in a fixed location surely it is easier to launch a Kalibr from 2,500km than to launch a Klub from 50km... both can be deployed from the same vessel but a vessel firing a Klub from 50km covers the first 2,450km at about 20knts and the last 50km at high subsonic speed, while a Kalibr covers the 2,500km range at high subsonic speed well out of air defence range of any country.



    While I'm here, is it possible to make a navalized sub lunched R-77 with a bigger warhead (65kg) and a range of 40-50 km to use in mass attack against battlegroup by a new diesel clas sub ( a little oscar II). Like 40 missiles per subarine. Mach 3-4 sea skeaming. 65*40= 2600kg of explosives. I knwo it can't destroy them (If it's one or two ship it can) but it would dammage them badly and they could be finished by torpedo.

    To be honest a sub would be better off attacking that battle group with heavy torpedoes.

    The idea of subsurface launched anti aircraft missiles is interesting.

    The Morfei, or 9M100 is a short range IIR guided missile designed to be carried internally in aircraft and launched via data link at targets it cannot see when launched.

    By definition such a missile must acquire its target after it has been launched so it is fired and then it looks for its target itself.

    Such a seeker would be very very interesting.

    Such a seeker could be used for a sub launched anti aircraft missile... so sonobouys start splashing in the water... which tells you there is an aircraft looking for you... release a pod that floats to the surface with a pack of 5 missiles... one missile with its nose exposed looking for targets... if it spots a helo or MPA or UAV it can launch the other four missiles on the platform and itself at any or all targets detected... if there is nothing it can be recovered later by the sub.

    For very long range missiles like the 300km range R-37M such a seeker would be very valuable as it is totally passive so you can launch the missile in the general direction of an enemy air field.

    As it flys at mach 5-6 it can be looking for targets all the way without emitting radar like an ARH missile would... targets spotted could be identified and information sent back to the launch platform.. priority targets can be engaged automatically... like a recon suicide drone...


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    George1
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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  George1 on Thu Sep 08, 2016 4:12 pm

    New ship-to-air missile system to be built in Russia — Almaz-Antey

    Performance specifications for construction of an air defense system for surface ships protection is currently being prepared, Almaz-Antey spokesman has announced

    Russian Navy may receive shipborne version of Tor antiaircraft missile system in 2018-2019

    KUBINKA (Moscow Region), September 8. /TASS/. Russia’s Navy is developing performance specifications for construction of a new ship-to-air missile system, a spokesman for the Almaz-Antey defense concern told journalists on Thursday at the Army-2016 forum.

    "The Research Institute of Shipbuilding and Armament of the Navy is currently preparing performance specifications for construction of an air defense system to protect surface ships, in line with an instruction from the Chief Command of the Navy," the spokesman said.

    Earlier, Almaz-Antey said the Navy is interested in an opportunity to build a naval version of the Tor air defense missile system to replace the outdated Kinzhal and Osa systems. The concern said the new modification may be ready in 2018-2019.


    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/898688


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    Isos
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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Isos on Thu Sep 08, 2016 9:52 pm

    I see what you mean GarryB and I think you understood what I meant so lets end it.


    To be honest a sub would be better off attacking that battle group with heavy torpedoes.

    The idea of subsurface launched anti aircraft missiles is interesting.

    The Morfei, or 9M100 is a short range IIR guided missile designed to be carried internally in aircraft and launched via data link at targets it cannot see when launched.

    By definition such a missile must acquire its target after it has been launched so it is fired and then it looks for its target itself.

    Such a seeker would be very very interesting.

    Such a seeker could be used for a sub launched anti aircraft missile... so sonobouys start splashing in the water... which tells you there is an aircraft looking for you... release a pod that floats to the surface with a pack of 5 missiles... one missile with its nose exposed looking for targets... if it spots a helo or MPA or UAV it can launch the other four missiles on the platform and itself at any or all targets detected... if there is nothing it can be recovered later by the sub.

    For very long range missiles like the 300km range R-37M such a seeker would be very valuable as it is totally passive so you can launch the missile in the general direction of an enemy air field.

    As it flys at mach 5-6 it can be looking for targets all the way without emitting radar like an ARH missile would... targets spotted could be identified and information sent back to the launch platform.. priority targets can be engaged automatically... like a recon suicide drone...

    I know about these missiles. Germans are doing this work to their iris-t missiles.

    But about what I said I was thinking of a smaller missile that could be used in really big mass attack with torpedos. Chinese had developed such a weapon for their subs but the navy didn't accepted it. It was 20km range and 30 kg warehead (Something liike that)the name was tl-10 IIRC. Their was someone here who said a smaller KH-35 was designed, I would like to see the picture of it if it's possible. It's far enough for intercepting and damaging ships in a battle group and make them more vulnarable to futur attacks as it would destroy some of their systems.

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  GarryB on Fri Sep 09, 2016 2:03 pm

    Earlier, Almaz-Antey said the Navy is interested in an opportunity to build a naval version of the Tor air defense missile system to replace the outdated Kinzhal and Osa systems. The concern said the new modification may be ready in 2018-2019.

    That is good news... the new TOR missiles will be cheap and relatively small so carrying them in large numbers should be easy.

    Their command guidance and manouver performance should be very good and their range should be extended like the land based equivalents.

    I know about these missiles. Germans are doing this work to their iris-t missiles.

    Kilos have had MANPADS mounts since the 1980s.

    But about what I said I was thinking of a smaller missile that could be used in really big mass attack with torpedos. Chinese had developed such a weapon for their subs but the navy didn't accepted it. It was 20km range and 30 kg warehead (Something liike that)the name was tl-10 IIRC. Their was someone here who said a smaller KH-35 was designed, I would like to see the picture of it if it's possible. It's far enough for intercepting and damaging ships in a battle group and make them more vulnarable to futur attacks as it would destroy some of their systems.

    Such a missile would be bad for use against a carrier group... a carrier group will have plenty of anti sub helos... you really don't want to have to sail within 20km of a carrier group to fire a missile... most carrier groups will at the very least have a SSN escort that would be an enormous threat to your subs closing to within 20km of the group.

    The small Kh-35 based missile was for lighter patrol ships and helos and had a 70km range and a smaller warhead than the original... I will have a look to see if I can find the photo....

    Actually the new air to ground Hermes missile would actually fit your description... it has a range of guidance options including radar, passive laser homing, GLONASS, and IIR/TV and would have a range of about 30km with a 30kg warhead.

    A bit too light to be effective against a modern ship however.


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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Isos on Fri Sep 09, 2016 2:32 pm

    Kilos have had MANPADS mounts since the 1980s.
    Is it lunched from torpedo tubes or you have to need to go to the surface to fire it ? The german missile is "lock on after lunch" type and fired submerged.
    However if it miss the heli will know its exact position. Pretty hard to use this type of weapon in general, the small speed of diesel sub doesn't help...



    Such a missile would be bad for use against a carrier group... a carrier group will have plenty of anti sub helos... you really don't want to have to sail within 20km of a carrier group to fire a missile... most carrier groups will at the very least have a SSN escort that would be an enormous threat to your subs closing to within 20km of the group.

    The small Kh-35 based missile was for lighter patrol ships and helos and had a 70km range and a smaller warhead than the original... I will have a look to see if I can find the photo....

    Actually the new air to ground Hermes missile would actually fit your description... it has a range of guidance options including radar, passive laser homing, GLONASS, and IIR/TV and would have a range of about 30km with a 30kg warhead.

    A bit too light to be effective against a modern ship however.

    It's he typical range of a torpedo too. Even the torpedo lunch will be detected. It's much safer to fire lot of small missiles with the torpedos to distract crews.
    I agree they are not effective to sink them but they can damage radars or some other systems and start big fires at many places in evry ship of the formation. The exocet in Falkland didn't explod but manage to sink a frigate. Well, in open ocean it's useless but diesel subs are not mean to go their. In shallow waters it usefull as SSN won't go their.



    Do you know how far from the cost do carrier battlgroup operate ? (in lybia, afghanistan, golf war)

    TheArmenian
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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  TheArmenian on Fri Sep 09, 2016 5:53 pm

    Very interesting video


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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Big_Gazza on Sat Sep 10, 2016 1:51 am

    TheArmenian wrote:Very interesting video


    Yes, very interesting. I suspect the footage of hits against the target ship are likely to be Soviet-era footage? The first looked to be a Bazalt P-500 class weapon, but the later hits where clearly a slower winged missile, and I suspect these may have been a Metel/SS-N-14 Silex in AShM mode?

    Its a pity the P-500 strike wasn't a direct hit. It would have been SPECTACULAR!!

    Anyone know the identity of the target hulk?

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  GarryB on Sat Sep 10, 2016 4:53 am

    Is it lunched from torpedo tubes or you have to need to go to the surface to fire it ? The german missile is "lock on after lunch" type and fired submerged.

    The Kilo class is a diesel electric that needs to surface to charge its batteries... while it is on the surface the MANPAD mount is used for air defence.

    However if it miss the heli will know its exact position. Pretty hard to use this type of weapon in general, the small speed of diesel sub doesn't help...

    If an IRS-T missile bursts out of the water the ASW forces have an idea it is not just fish there too.

    There is a potential to deploy a small rubber boat with a single diver able to swim to the surface and defend against an aircraft in an emergency... better than nothing.


    It's he typical range of a torpedo too. Even the torpedo lunch will be detected. It's much safer to fire lot of small missiles with the torpedos to distract crews.

    The Soviets used 650mm torpedos against carrier groups... with a range of 100km or so.

    I agree they are not effective to sink them but they can damage radars or some other systems and start big fires at many places in evry ship of the formation. The exocet in Falkland didn't explod but manage to sink a frigate. Well, in open ocean it's useless but diesel subs are not mean to go their. In shallow waters it usefull as SSN won't go their.

    There is a mine that has a tube with a torpedo in it that when it detects a particular class of ship it can launch that torpedo to attack that ship as it comes past. It is used in narrow passageways and channels where ships have to pass to move from one place to another.

    I suspect the best use of a small 300kg missile with a 30kg warhead and a 20-30km range would be as a mine. You could deliver a dozen with each torpedo sized load of them in the path of a carrier group steaming to an emergency... their own sonar can detect the approaching ships and pick a target direction to send the missiles on launch. I would recommend IIR seekers as ships will stand out against the sea in terms of temperature so you will get good target discrimination and all weather passive attack capability... though an antenna popping out of the sea could be detected by radar but would allow active radar emissions to be detected. After the first missiles launch the carrier group will be scanning for threats so the second wave of missiles can use anti radiation seekers to take out the radars... or deplete the ships air defences before they get to the theatre they were headed for.

    Ideally attacking the fleet during a storm or bad weather and a high sea state would likely get the best result for not much development cost.
    Of course using torpedoes means all those expensive SAM systems will have no effect defending the ships... a mix of missiles and torpedoes would be best... as it often is.


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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  GarryB on Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:07 am

    Nice video... starts out with BAL launches (ie land launched Kh-35s) and then at 14 seconds on shows Onyx in its shore based version. (export Yakhont or Brahmos). Then there is the ship launch of a large missile with two large solid rocket boosters... which means Granit or Vulkan and at 45 seconds or so the very high speed missile blows past the target with what looks like a devastating hit to the ships bridge...
    Then there is a hit in the water next to the target barge by what I suspect is a bomb. Followed by several more attacks with bombs... one of which hits and one lands in the water next to the ship at about one minute 13seconds.

    I suspect the last weapons shown are glide bombs perhaps with GLONASS guidance rather than active homing weapons.


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    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Big_Gazza on Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:28 am

    Ahhh...  managed to (provisionally) identify the class of vessel launching the heavy AShM.  It looks to be a Pr 1234 Ovod/Nanuchka class missile-boat, and the missile is a P-120 Malakhit/SS-N-9.

    Interesting that the radar for the Osa SAM (in immediate foreground) is turned to face the superstructure, presumably to shield the radar dishes from exhaust wash from the AShM launch.

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Project Canada on Tue Sep 13, 2016 7:30 pm




    In Russia, we created a new sound-absorbing coating for "Boreas" and "Ash"

    External noise absorbing coating disperses submarine sonar signal and thus provides protection against anti-enemy

    "Tehmash" Concern has launched production of a new special sound-absorbing coating for the fourth-generation submarines, said on Tuesday in the Group.

    "New industrial rubber production will ensure the release of special coatings with improved acoustic performance for modern submarine of the fourth generation of boats. Technical plates, which we launched on the basis of the Cheboksary Production Association named after Chapaev, favorably differ from Western models the ability to absorb the acoustic signals of a wide range and high performance" - are reported words of the general director Sergey Rusakov concern.



    External noise absorbing coating submarine, in particular sonar signal scatters and thus provides protection against anti enemy forces.

    Now several submarines of the fourth generation are in the Russian Navy - a nuclear submarine type "Northwind" and "Ash", as well as non-nuclear "Lada".

    https://defence.ru/issledovanie-materialov/v-rossii-sozdali-novoe-zvukopogloschayuschee-pokritie-dlya-boreev-i-yasenei/

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  GarryB on Wed Sep 14, 2016 11:51 am

    As subs get quieter opposing forces have to resort more and more on active sonar to find and to attack submarines.

    Having an effective coating that absorbs sound means even active homing torpedoes will have problems finding a sub and hitting it...


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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Project Canada on Thu Sep 15, 2016 4:27 am




    Russia to test new missiles in Syria later this year


    Aircraft based on Russia's only aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov may combat-test new X-38 missiles, as well as SVP-24 computer systems for unguided weaponry in Syria in November of this year

    The Russian air force is preparing to try out new weaponry and targeting systems, with full combat tests of the hardware to be carried out as part of missions in Syria, according to an RBTH source in the Russian military-industrial complex.

    In November 2016, the Russian aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov will be dispatched toward Syria's shores, with the deck-based Su-33 and MiG-29K/KUB fighters and Ka-52K Katran helicopters on board.

    According to the RBTH source, the carrier’s naval aircraft may test the new X-38 missiles in combat action at the end of the year.

    "We reinforce our aviation group and bring in completely new means of destruction to the region," said the RBTH source. "MiG-29K fighters will use a totally new type of missile, the X-38, to eliminate the militants."


    New targeting systems

    According to the RBTH source, Su-33 fighters, in turn, will receive the SVP-24, a new high-precision targeting system for unguided missiles.

    The system allows to increase the accuracy of air strikes several times over and avoid possible civilian casualties.

    The system adjusts the flight path based on the fighter's position and flight parameters. As a result, the deviation from the target is not more than a couple of meters. At the same time, the SVP-24 is only a couple of extra units that will be installed as part of the aircraft's avionics.

    What are the MiG-29K/KUB and Su-33?
    According to Andrei Fomin, chief editor of the Vzlyot magazine, these deck-based MiGs are some of the latest serially produced 4++ generation fighter jets.

    "Despite its resemblance to the land-based version of the MiG-29, this is a completely different aircraft," said Fomin. "This applies to its stealth technologies, a new system of in-flight refueling, folding wings and mechanisms by which the aircraft has the ability to perform short take-offs and land at low speeds."

    According to Fomin, the Su-33 was created as an aircraft to ensure air superiority, i.e. as a full-fledged fighter-interceptor.

    In turn, the MiG-29K/KUB is a multi-role aircraft, designed to provide air defense for naval forces, as well as to destroy surface and ground targets with guided high-precision weapons, day or night and in all weather conditions.

    During the Syrian campaign, naval Su-33 fighters with new targeting systems will use gravity bombs. The MiG-29K/KUB aircraft will be equipped with guided bombs and missiles, using the Glonass satellite navigation system.

    According to the RBTH source in the military-industrial complex, the operational tour may involve about 15 naval MiG-29K/KUB and Su-33 fighters, as well as 10 Ka-52K Katran, Ka-27 and Ka-31 combat helicopters.

    Deck-based Ka-52s
    Ka-52 Katran attack helicopters were designed for the two French Mistral-class amphibious assault ships ordered by Moscow but never delivered: French President Francois Hollande had to terminate the contract for the supply of the warships to Russia under pressure from France’s NATO allies after Russia’s seizure of Crimea and intervention in eastern Ukraine in 2014.

    As a result, the Mistrals were acquired by Egypt, and immediately thereafter Cairo purchased a batch of 50 Russian Katrans from Moscow.The remaining helicopters were assigned to the Admiral Kuznetsov aircraft carrier, and they will take their "baptism of fire" at the end of the year.

    As Vadim Kozyulin, a professor of the Academy of Military Sciences, noted, the land-based Ka-52 helicopters proved successful in the Syrian campaign. The new machines will also have to demonstrate their combat potential to future buyers.

    http://rbth.com/defence/2016/09/14/russia-to-test-new-missiles-in-syria-later-this-year_629957


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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  George1 on Sun Sep 18, 2016 6:33 pm

    Preliminary tests of Russia's sea-based Pantsir air defense system completed — official

    The new weapons system will be mounted on various types of warships, "from small-sized missile ships to big patrol vessels"

    TULA, September 16. /TASS/. Preliminary trials of the Patsir-M anti-aircraft cannon system have been completed successfully, Russian Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov said on Friday.

    "We have conducted preliminary tests of the sea-based Pantsir, which demonstrated positive results. Now we are to begin official tests. We hope to begin by the end of this year," he told journalists.

    He said the new weapons system will be mounted on various types of warships, "from small-sized missile ships to big patrol vessels."

    According to earlier reports, it is planned to begin tests of the sea-based Pantsir system onboard a ship at the end of 2016.

    The Pantsir-M is designed to supersede the Kortik system.


    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/900185


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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Project Canada on Mon Sep 19, 2016 12:25 pm

    on other news..,

    project 941 Very Happy









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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Isos on Sat Oct 01, 2016 7:04 pm



    22 Hellfire missile (8kg warhead) to destroy an Oliver Hazard Perry frigate ... Don't need a lot to sink them. I was suggesting a good idea with my small anti ship missile sub lunched in massive salvos by SSK.

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  GarryB on Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:46 am

    First of all I would say any frigate that actually defended itself would not be so easy to sink.

    Second of all 22 x 8kgs distributed to 22 different locations and applied one after the other would act like a cluster bomb in terms of damage and would likely promote fires on board that would accelerate the ship sinking.

    22 x 8 is about 175kg which is similar to the weight of explosive on your average light antiship missile... I think off the top of my head the Kh-335 has 145kg HE warhead but delivering it to one impact point and exploding it all at once does not make it more destructive than placing in different places in 8kg lots.

    Remember blowing up a building you use lots of small charges in specific places to destroy the integrity of the structure... in comparison to bring the building down in one explosion you need a much bigger bomb and risk a large part of the structure remaining standing.



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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  Werewolf on Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:14 am

    The point here is a atgm with only 8km range vs a ship with dozens of means to be defensive and offensive. No chance to even damage the ship with hellfires. Your helo would be detected from many miles and intercepted with Sam's.

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  VladimirSahin on Sun Oct 02, 2016 4:16 pm

    22 hellfires would be dealt with very quickly and efficiently. Long range anti ship missiles need to be fired in volleys to be effective against one ship, and those are dedicated missiles.

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  GarryB on Mon Oct 03, 2016 1:57 am

    Of course if the missile was HERMES and had a 30kg warhead and a 20km range then for very small ships with a 57mm gun or smaller and MANPADS for self defence then a helo like a Ka-52k would actually be rather dangerous... more so if you had a few Kh-25s carried too.

    the problem for the helo is that such small ships rarely operate alone and with larger ships with heavier SAMs the problem becomes rather more complicated.

    For a western sub even carrying dozens of small short range missiles like a super hellfire the act of launching the missiles will reveal your general location and even small Russian Corvettes have a UKSK launcher which can carry a mach 2.5 rocket do deliver a torpedo into the water up to 50km from the vessel.

    I would say on most normal missions a corvette would not carry a land attack missile so the 8 tubes would likely have anti sub and anti ship missiles... so when a US sub launches a dozen or so super hellfires the corvette being attacked can lob one or two anti sub missiles to where the missiles first appeared...

    A good example of such a missile might be the British Sea Skua which was carried by helos and used successfully in the Falklands war.

    Air defences have improved since that time however.


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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  George1 on Mon Oct 10, 2016 1:40 am

    The underwater missile "Predator"

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2170952.html


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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Wed Oct 12, 2016 2:20 pm

    George1 wrote:The underwater missile "Predator"

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2170952.html

    From text is looks like improved Shkval cavitating torpedo. I wonder if any control is added and range. It might be nice weapon for drones. just lay down on bottom 1km +, no sound, no movement, just listening. Until Ac group comes close..then salvo of 500km/h torpedos and the way cleared Smile

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Thu Oct 13, 2016 6:34 am

    GunshipDemocracy wrote:
    George1 wrote:The underwater missile "Predator"

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2170952.html

    From text is looks like improved Shkval cavitating torpedo. I wonder if any control is added and range. It might be nice weapon for drones. just lay down on bottom 1km +,  no sound, no movement, just listening. Until Ac group comes close..then salvo of 500km/h torpedos and the way cleared Smile

    There's another article from a different source that also talks about the ABM A-235 in relation to it, which is real puzzling.

    https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=en&tl=ru&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fvpk.name%2Fnews%2F165449_podvodnaya_raketa_hishnik.html&edit-text=&act=url

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    Re: Naval Weapon Systems & Technology

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